Our Uncertainty in Medicine series launches next week, and to set the stage, we’re sharing one of our favorite episodes from the archives - a heartfelt conversation with New York Times columnist Ross Douthat about his journey through the healthcare system while living with chronic Lyme disease.

Medicine likes certainty - diseases we can see and test for and treat. But what do we do when we can't see? When we can't help? Do we keep searching? Or do we look away?

In this episode, Emily speaks with New York Times columnist Ross Douthat about his book The Deep Places, which tells the harrowing story of his experience with Lyme disease, and what it's like to navigate a chronic illness that mainstream medicine hasn’t yet fully explained.

Find show notes, transcript, and more at thenocturnists.org.

The Nocturnists is made possible by the California Medical Association and donations from listeners like you.