Leadership expert Chris Pearse used an analogy in his Forbes article in 2018 on "Leadership in Crisis" This analogy made us think about leadership. It brought to light the mistake we often make in leadership today. Although not in exact words, he said if you want to grow a pumpkin, you need four elements, earth, water, sun, and a seed. While growing that pumpkin, your focus is on those elements, not the pumpkin. With the right focus, result will be a great pumpkin. In leadership, most of the time, the focus is on the results like share prices and profit, not on the elements that create them. Unfortunately, this end focus distracts us from the aspects of good leadership, resulting in a challenge. How do we promote good leadership in this profit-oriented world? How do we encourage good leadership practices, and how do we recognize talent when we see it? Our guest in this show has taken a good look at leadership dynamics and how to recognize the attributes of exemplary leadership