On the Gist, the McCloskeys in Missouri.

In the first part of this two-part interview, John McWhorter is here to dig into definitions with Mike. They discuss how the meanings of racism and white supremacy have changed over the years, and what that says about the ways culture is shifting. McWhorter is the host of Lexicon Valley, and his latest piece is "The Dictionary Definition of Racism Has to Change," in the Atlantic.

In the spiel, a professional bullshit artist.

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Podcast production by Daniel Schroeder and Margaret Kelley.

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