Codependency between humans gets a bad rap. But in nature, species often rely on each other for survival. While humans think they’re in control of relationships between other species, like dogs and even the yeast for our breads, the opposite is often true.

Host Flora Lichtman speaks with ecologist Rob Dunn, whose new book, The Call of the Honeyguide, argues that mutualisms are the story of life itself.

Read an excerpt of The Call of the Honeyguide: What Science Tells Us about How to Live Well with the Rest of Life.

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