In this conversation, Malcolm Collins sits down with Basic Logic — one of the fastest-growing right-wing YouTube channels — to discuss his rapid rise, Christian conversion story, critique of boomer conservatism, and the unique challenges facing Gen Z.

Topics include: how Basic Logic went from stubborn atheist to Christian (and converted his friend), why personal religious experiences aren’t enough for most people, the failures of modern churches, the lack of real mentors, dating as a Christian in your 20s, new right vs. old conservatism, and rebuilding culture through truth-seeking.

A raw, high-signal discussion on philosophy, faith, generational collapse, and what it takes to actually change minds in 2025.

Episode Transcript

[00:00:00] Malcolm Collins: Hello, everyone. I’m excited to be here with you today. Today, we are here with Basic Logic. And if you don’t know who Basic Logic is, he, within the right-wing YouTuber space, is probably one of the fastest growing channels I’ve ever seen. Y- I think in just a few months you went from something like 20,000 to over 100,000 subscribers.

[00:00:20] And your content is really solid, like short form both data and philosophy heavy. Not that I agree with everything, but it’s definitely like thematically aligned with a lot of the topics on this channel. And I decided to reach out ‘cause I always try to have conversations with anyone in this wider intellectual space because we’re all having what I sort of call an asynchronous conversation with the world, with our watchers, with everything like that where a lot of us are watching a lot of other creators out there.

[00:00:52] We’re getting ideas from them. We’re spinning those ideas into something new. And so, bringing people together to have these conversations can be really interesting. What I wanted to start with is what was the context of starting the channel for you? What was your goal with the channel, and how did that goal evolve as you’ve gone on?

[00:01:14] Basic Logic: Th- thank you for having me. The way I started this channel was as a dare actually. So it’s- I’m not the only person on this channel. My friend is an editor for this channel, and we, we co-own the channel. It’s 50/50.

[00:01:26] Malcolm Collins: Okay.

[00:01:27] Basic Logic: And the relationship I had with this friend for a very long time is that I like to go deep into certain topics.

[00:01:32] In particularly, I converted to Christianity some years ago, and he was the first person I started talking about to Chris- about Christianity with. And then he converted shortly after. I think like a week or two after I converted.

[00:01:43] Simone Collins: Whoa.

[00:01:44] Basic Logic: And so we’ve always had this dynamic of I go deep into a certain topic, and then I explain it in a very concise way.

[00:01:51] And he started telling me, like pestering me, like, “Man, you have to write a book about this because everyone I talk to takes like an hour to explain something simple.” And h- he has ADHD, and he doesn’t like, you know, sitting down for an hour for something that can be explained in three minutes if you really focus.

[00:02:08] And then at some point I was go- I was getting bored with my own personal life. I had some spare time to kill because s- there were some professional ambitions that I had that didn’t go as intended. Which had to do with me start, trying to start a startup out of college. But then the people who I was relying on, they didn’t really follow up with the promises that they made.

[00:02:28] Malcolm Collins: Hmm.

[00:02:29] Basic Logic: And so I had some spare time left over as, as I was waiting, and I was bored, and I was like, “Okay, let’s make a video.” And we posted the video, and it was zero views for like 12 hours. And then afterwards it started getting some traction, and then started getting a lot more traction. It’s like, okay, let, let’s try this seriously.

[00:02:45] And so now we are at at the time of recording, we are at 96,900 subscribers. It hasn’t even been 11 months yet.

[00:02:53] Malcolm Collins: So- That is completely demoralizing. I, I’ve been doing this for every day, an hour edited episode for what, th- three years at this point, Simone? Yeah, it’s three years. I think so, yeah ... and, and we’re, we’re at 75,000.

[00:03:10] I mean, we’ll probably hit 100 before- The end of the four-year period. I know it took Nutsoner four years to get to 100,000, so you’re doing incredibly well. But I see why when I look at the form of your content which is as, as, as quick and with nice animation to the point of a philosophical concept, which I am just terrible at doing, right?

[00:03:32] Like, it would take me so long to create videos that short. But that’s also why I’m glad to have you on here so people can get the wider context on you, because that’s not gonna come through on your videos. The, the big question I would have is what convinced you to convert to Christianity so much so that when you talked to your friend, he also converted?

[00:03:50] Like, what was the argument or the trepidation you had beforehand?

[00:03:57] Basic Logic: Well, there was no argument. I was an extremely [00:04:00] stubborn atheist before. I respected Christianity. I, I started studying Christianity probably an hour... No, not an hour, a year or two before I converted, because I was realizing, okay, everything’s going wrong in society.

[00:04:12] The Christians seem to have some good ideas. Let me learn from them. And I did, and I thought a lot of the wisdom there was very good. However, I, I wasn’t convinced until I, I kinda had to be convinced by a How can I say this? I’m, I’m not even sure if I should say this, because every time I do, it gets a lot of people like demoralized in trying to convert.

[00:04:35] In the sense that I had the religious experience, and that’s what finally converted me.

[00:04:39] Malcolm Collins: Hmm.

[00:04:40] Basic Logic: And the reason I don’t always share that is because the common response I get when I, when I tell them that I have a religious experience, like, “Okay, I’ll convert when I have one.” It’s like, great. But

[00:04:50] Malcolm Collins: how did you convince your friend?

[00:04:51] Did he have a religious experience

[00:04:52] Basic Logic: or did he convert? He did not have, no. So very quickly I realized I can’t just tell people I had a religious experience and then they’re gonna convert. That doesn’t make any damn sense.

[00:05:01] Malcolm Collins: Hmm.

[00:05:01] Basic Logic: But after all these

[00:05:02] Malcolm Collins: years of- By the way, I w- I wanna say how much I appreciate th- that was immediately obvious to you.

[00:05:07] Yeah. You do not know, because I also converted from being an atheist for ages, how many times a Christian would just be like, “Well, you know, God just started talking to me. But that’s how I know. And that’s why you should know too.” And I’m like, “But he doesn’t talk to me.” Like, what are you ta- ... that, your personal religious experience doesn’t, does not impact my belief, right?

[00:05:28] So I really appreciate that that was obvious to you. But go on.

[00:05:32] Basic Logic: Yeah, so like people from different religions have their own religious experience, or they claim to. People- Yeah ... can also go insane, and people can go temporarily insane. So it did cross my mind, “Hey, maybe I just went crazy for like one morning.

[00:05:43] That might have happened.” So I decided, okay, I’ve already been studying this religion. I like the ideas. Let’s actually go deeper into the philosophy of it. Let’s see if I can understand to prove it or debunk it. And this was like my fixation for one or two weeks, I don’t remember exactly, where all I cared about doing was studying the Bi-

[00:06:00] I hadn’t told anyone that I had converted by this point. All my fixation was on just studying the Bible itself, learning about what theologians believed. I would be listening to theology podcasts while doing everything or anything. And so I, I ended up adopting like a mix of beliefs of different Protestant denominations especially, but I also respect the Catholics and the Orthodox.

[00:06:21] I’m not militantly Protestant.

[00:06:25] Malcolm Collins: Yeah Like, like- And so I, I understood that ... like we, we are, we have a reputation for being, so. But okay, so that’s really w- I, I find it interesting that you were able to get so much from studying theologians. So I guess like this actually makes sense to go into my history on this.

[00:06:39] I really enjoyed, when I was an atheist Christian radio. And I listened to tons of Christian radio. But what’s really funny is if you’re super into Christian radio, which is probably not good for me, I, I approached this wrong you get really into arguments that are never gonna matter to an atheist’s conversion.

[00:07:03] Like pre- versus post-millennialism, right? Like-

[00:07:06] Basic Logic: Right ...

[00:07:07] Malcolm Collins: that, that, yeah?

[00:07:09] Basic Logic: Yeah, yeah. I know what you’re talking about.

[00:07:11] Malcolm Collins: And I would get super into like all of the arguments on both sides of that ‘cause I just loved the lore, I guess. But I never came in on the more practical things that I had never had somebody sit me down and give me good arguments for.

[00:07:29] Actually, this could be a fun thing for us to go into in this, is how would you today... First, how did you convert your friend, and how would you go to convert your younger self before the experience? Because there are so many tactics that I think a lot of Christians seem to default to when they’re attempting to convert people.

[00:07:50] And they don’t, like i- it’s as they c- do n- does not pass go. And I think one of the big ones that we sort of touched on is not just personal religious experiences, but [00:08:00] claiming that X group of religious people say they saw a miracle or that some miraculous thing happened in the Bible. And then obviously you’re atheist, it’s just gonna be like, “Yes, but the Muslim who just tried to convert me said the same thing, and the Buddhist who just tried to convert me said the same thing.”

[00:08:15] Like, how would you, how, yeah, how, how did you crack that nut?

[00:08:20] Basic Logic: Well, it’s tailored to each person. People respond to different things. You asked me about how would I convert myself. I think the most important thing to have done to myself when I was an atheist would be to intellectually humiliate me.

[00:08:32] Because I was way too prideful. I, every interaction I had with Christians was incredibly poor. So every Christian I’ve met outside of my family was, to put it lightly, an idiot. And I had never actually heard the gospel before I had become Christian because every Christian I ever talked to, the only thing they cared about was debating evolution, and they had very poor arguments to debate evolution was the issue.

[00:08:56] So that was my sole experience of Christians outside my family, and it was not very convincing. And so every time I had one of those experiences, I became even more prideful in my, my beliefs because I was like, “Well, this is what these idiots believe. I’m not an idiot like them.” Now it depends, of course, with certain people.

[00:09:15] I’ve had people where you could use whatever logic you wanted, it wouldn’t work, but if you play the right song, then, then you have some effect, which is why I also criticize contemporary churches so much of their hip hop nonsense, where they’re just making an inferior version of modern music and like that’s not gonna reach the people we’re trying to reach with Christian music

[00:09:36] Malcolm Collins: It’s actually funny that you mention songs as having an impact on people’s beliefs.

[00:09:41] Because one thing that’s become very popular in our wider community recently, and I don’t know how tapped into this you are. Are, are you tapped into stuff like the Skybrow Cinematic Universe and, like, all the conservative AI music that’s being generated these days?

[00:09:57] Basic Logic: I’ve heard that there’s been some AI music generated, especially from, like, conservative and religious angles.

[00:10:01] I’ve never seen it or heard it.

[00:10:03] Malcolm Collins: Oh, I’ll send you some. I- I’m so into it. Because it... What they do is they collect different conservative influencers, and they have them as, like, figures in it. Or some of them just do their own, like, things. But I remember really having my mind changed because of one of the songs, and it was mostly just because it made me feel culturally normal to have this point.

[00:10:24] And it’s Leaflet’s song about college being a scam.

[00:10:27] Simone Collins: Oh.

[00:10:27] Malcolm Collins: And I had felt that college was a scam for a while. I had felt like the math just doesn’t add up. But for whatever reason, hearing it in a song, I just walked away being like, “Wait, that’s so obvious now. Why was I, why was I over intellectualizing it?”

[00:10:43] But I think you probably mean even in the context of, like, music that, that is transcending for people. Like, a lot of people in... You go to, like, a, a Roman Mass or you go to Evening Song, and- Evening Song ... that is so, impactful to an individual, they can have a religious-like experience. Is that, is that more what you’re thinking, or?

[00:11:00] Basic Logic: Yeah, yeah. It, it’s along those lines.

[00:11:03] Simone Collins: One thing I’m curiou- base- based on that, actually is you’re, you’re sort of talking about people’s standard of evidence, right? For one person, their standard of evidence may be a logical argument. For another person, it may be a religious experience or an ex- a very emotional experience.

[00:11:18] Like, I listened to a song, and it made me feel a certain way, and therefore this thing must be right. Do you try to create arguments that are designed for different standards of evidence, like emotion or logic or personal experience or studies or other things? Or do you just kind of try to hit the most commonly encountered arguments?

[00:11:38] Like, what’s your approach to presenting information?

[00:11:41] Basic Logic: S- since I was an atheist, I, I pretty much know the atheist arguments. Mm. And even further context, I grew up as an atheist, but my family and I had to leave our home countries and go to a Muslim country for a while for work. And I really did not like Islam, so I was very into, like, anti-theist apologetics.

[00:11:59] Simone Collins: [00:12:00] Mm.

[00:12:00] Basic Logic: Mm. And so I, I had plenty of experience on that. So the... I d- I never put focus on that because it’s second nature by this point. And then as for focusing on, on my particular arguments, I know what would work on me. I like the rationalist arguments, but the truth is, not everyone thinks So this, this goes beyond just religion.

[00:12:22] It goes on to politics and the likes. A lot of people who are more intellectually inclined like rational arguments and the likes, they assume everyone thinks like a 130 IQ European. And that is just not reality. It’s even the reason why I dropped my libertarian leanings, is because I realized this, this would work fantastic if everyone was a 130 IQ European.

[00:12:45] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:12:45] Basic Logic: Yeah. But th- that’s not the world we live in, and so some things have to be adapted. Yeah. It’s also why I took a, like a lot of stronger stance against usury, for example. Because previously I would think, “Just don’t be stupid. Don’t sign this ridiculous contract with an insane interest rate.”

[00:13:00] It’s like, okay, well, some people are stupid. Does that mean that we have the right to use the government to force them into being de facto slaves? No.

[00:13:07] Malcolm Collins: Mm. And if people are offended by his take on mentioning European in this particular context, I would strongly point you to our episode on why Arab countries are almost never democracies, where we point out that for, like, centuries, almost no Arab country has ever been a lasting democracy and almost every Northern European country has.

[00:13:30] And so for whatever reason, and you, y- you can, you can have a thou- thousand different reasons why this may be the case, different populations... And somebody could be like, “Oh, that’s Muslim culture.” But then we point out in non-Arab Muslim cultures, it’s not infrequent that they have democracies. So, y- you could say, well, in some groups, in some cultures, things just operate differently and different types of societal structures work at different levels.

[00:13:55] And this is one of the big problems that I think that we’re having in Europe and the Americas right now, is we are importing a lot of people that seem to operate very well under systems that look nothing like our system. Like, if you go to the Middle East, there’s a number of countries that are clean and operate pretty well, but they are the least democratic of the states, like the UAE and Saudi Arabia and Qatar.

[00:14:21] Whereas the most democratic of the states are often the, the, the most dangerous and least well-managed. So yeah, I just think that’s a, that’s a good point there.

[00:14:30] Basic Logic: Yep.

[00:14:31] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Were you conservative before you converted to Christianity? Or- Yes. Okay. And h- were you always conservative, or was that something that sort of happened to you over time or through cultural battles or whatever? Yeah.

[00:14:45] Basic Logic: I think the closest I’ve ever been to not being conservative was when I was, like, six or seven and I heard my uncle lost his job, and I was like, “How could a company fire someone?

[00:14:56] It, it ruins their life.” And that, that was the closest I’ve ever come to being a leftist. From that moment on, like from eight years old onwards, I, I was pretty dead set on on right-wing, even though for a large portion I didn’t r- really understand it. By the time I was in high school, it was just straight up, like, Daily Wire talking points for me.

[00:15:17] And then it took, like, a couple more years for me to grow out of that and realize, okay Daily Wire is perhaps not the answer to everything. Th-

[00:15:25] Malcolm Collins: oh, that’s actually a, an interesting point, and I’d love to hear your thoughts on this, is the wider cultural change in modern conservatism that we’ve seen where the boomer conservatism, which ironically, you know, I, I think the Daily Wire is one of the perfect avatars of despite Ben Shapiro being, you know, younger, he sort of got captured by boomers when he was a kid, and he’s never been able to escape that mindset.

[00:15:49] Where boomer conservatism is really sort of dying out as an intellectual philosophy and this entirely new type or flavor [00:16:00] of conservatism is beginning to replace it. And w- what are your thoughts on that a- a- as you’ve seen this happen or ... Yeah.

[00:16:07] Basic Logic: Oh, yeah. Oh, definitely. And it, it’s been extremely beneficial.

[00:16:10] Like, people I had met early on that were diehard leftists, when they realized they’d, that the right wasn’t just boomer conservatism, have started now going more to the center, more to the right. Boomer conservatism is just so fake. They conserve nothing.

[00:16:24] Malcolm Collins: You ... They, they suck. They su- One of the statistics that I was watching recently we went over an episode that haven’t gone live yet, is we were looking at pro-Muslim sentiment in the United States.

[00:16:36] A lot of people are aware of this. It jumped up after 9/11. What people are unaware of is that the demographic it jumped up most within were very conservative people very conservative Republicans. Whereas if you look at the new generation of conservative after the October 11th attacks pro-Palestine sentiment jumped up among leftists, but it didn’t go up at all among conservatives.

[00:16:59] Like we’re not falling for this nonsense anymore where it’s like, oh, no, victim blaming. Somebody might be mad at Muslims because one group of Muslims did something

[00:17:11] Basic Logic: Yeah, no, I, I agree with you on that. I think one of the traps that we were taught growing up, especially by Daily Wire types, is that you had to be on team Israel or you had to be on team Palestine. And my- Yeah ... my personal experience is obviously excluding the innocents on both sides both sides suck.

[00:17:28] Like, both sides are really, really bad. And I’m not sure which one I hate more. And I... If it was possible for s- two sides to lose a war, I would like them both to lose. That would be my position.

[00:17:41] Malcolm Collins: That’s definitely... Well, I mean, that’s definitely a sentiment that’s shared among a lot of people. I, it, it’s not one that we share as aggressively.

[00:17:49] But I mean, our, our basic position is we like people who are economically and technologically productive and appear to be moving civilization forwards and who also fight back when people dick with them. But I also understand that Israel has really manipulated the United States to do things that are not in our best interest many times.

[00:18:09] And so I understand the sentiment there. I, I, I, I’m wondering how you see, when you moved away from, like, Daily Wire thinking, was the number one thing that you moved away from, was it the Israel thing, or were there other things about boomer conservatism you found toxic?

[00:18:26] Basic Logic: There, there was a lot that was toxic about boomer conservatism.

[00:18:29] A lot of it was things that you don’t really notice early on because they seem to be, like, champions against woke ideology, and in reality it was this false, like, controlled opposition where we’re going to oppose woke ideology, but we’re gonna let in gay marriage. We’re going to let in feminism in, in our churches.

[00:18:48] It, it seemed like they were making a lot of compromises with the woke crowd so they could show how reasonable they were being, and then it seemed like every couple, every four years, th- the conservative party was more liberal. And now I’m, I’m assuming probably 40 years, well, obviously 40 years ago Democrats are way more...

[00:19:06] Well, 40 years ago liberals were way more conservative than the modern conservatives And so- Yeah ... it, it seemed like a controlled opposition to slowly push the overtone window over and over towards the side of insanity.

[00:19:19] Simone Collins: We did a whole- So it all- ... a whole episode on that. Like, it, it seems to be pretty well.

[00:19:23] And well, people know. People have done full, like, essays on that. One thing I wanted to ask you though if I may I’m really curious about how your life has changed since you converted to Christianity. Like, and also what, what does being actively Christian look like to you? How active are you in your, like with your local church?

[00:19:40] Or is, is your religious experience one more about heavy biblical study and prayer, and less about engagement with the community? Because when I hear about people converting, it can mean so many different things. Yeah. Like, there are people who convert without even believing anything. That’s not you.

[00:19:55] You’re very different. But does that, this mean that you’re also participating in a community and your life and schedule [00:20:00] are totally different too?

[00:20:01] Basic Logic: Well, a lot of things changed. I really wanted to participate in the community. I joined the church. I did all the things to, to be able to join church. So the place I live, I have two options.

[00:20:11] I can be Catholic, or I can be these modern evangelical types.

[00:20:15] Malcolm Collins: Mm.

[00:20:15] Basic Logic: And I, I wasn’t Catholic. I don’t hold a grudge against Catholics. I don’t think it’s a bad denomination, but I don’t agree with it. So that was off the list. And then I thought, “Okay, well, non-denominational, I guess that will work. I’ll go to a non-denominational church, and we’ll see how that, how all that goes.”

[00:20:30] So that is a place for all Christians. It was not. Mm. It was just not. It was-

[00:20:35] Malcolm Collins: Was

[00:20:35] Basic Logic: it, like,

[00:20:35] Malcolm Collins: super woke, or like, what do you... whi- what, what was your take on

[00:20:38] Basic Logic: the non-denominational? It, it wasn’t super woke. It wasn’t super woke. But it had problems. It allowed modern infections to get in very easily. It’s the type of boomer conservative, conservatism they were criticizing.

[00:20:49] They allowed feminism to get into the church. They allowed a lot of other issues to get into the church. The pastor only gave sermons on things that were very obviously bad in the political climate. So, like, only, “We’re going to talk badly about gender ideology, but we’re not gonna talk about how the men in our church don’t run the household, and actually they’re led by their women.

[00:21:11] We’re not gonna talk about that.” So only the obvious things that everyone already agreed with, nothing that could offend the congregation.

[00:21:20] Malcolm Collins: Mm.

[00:21:20] Basic Logic: Yeah. There was one time where I wanted to give a Bible study. So I was helping out the, some of the, like, my fellow young adults in the group. I wanted to give a Bible study on Genesis, particularly the curses of Adam and Eve, and they were very happy for me to do the Bible study on the curse of Adam.

[00:21:37] They were not happy with me doing the curse of Eve. Yes. And so in the end, I, I just got censored, and it was a decision behind closed doors, and they, they just kept delaying. They didn’t even let me know that they canceled it until it was, like, the day prior of c- of course. I was, I was planning on teach the curse of Adam and Eve to about 12 people when they censored me.

[00:22:01] I ended up making it into a video, so instead I taught it to, like, 120,000. So- ... it worked out in the end.

[00:22:08] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:22:08] Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, I think this shows why boomer conservatism has been hit so hard and has had such a hard time reacting, is the mechanisms of control that they built were so petty, low-level, and internet stupid that the moment people saw around them o- or found a way to you know, circumvent them like you did the impact is so large.

[00:22:38] And it’s a position that young people are put in when they see the boomers. And I think the feminism thing is such a great point, because that reminds me of, like, the vague boomer conservatism that we so would’ve seen with, like, Ben Shapiro always trying to prop up his sister and stuff like that.

[00:22:54] And like, oh, we need a, a woman’s voice. We need a, They’re, they’re still hook, line, and sinker swallowing, oh, you know, you wouldn’t wanna say people are different because that’s racist, and we don’t want anyone like that in our communities. And it’s like, but they f*****g are. Everyone can see it but yeah, I guess it’s the, the pushing back, and I had to contextualize that and I need to think about it a little bit.

[00:23:20] The thing that really changed was the shiblet list of rules of things we were supposed to pretend mattered or were important without question. And the glee with which the new right, because what the new right really began to do in response to that is we began to only listen to people who we, who, who validated themselves through showing that they’re willing to push back against these arbitrary rules.

[00:23:52] And you know, I was on a show recently and they were like, “Malcolm, how could you have these racist looking titles?” And I was, “Yeah, but you watched the episode. It wasn’t racist, right?” [00:24:00] And they’re like, “Well, not technically,” you know? And it’s like, well, okay. So I need to authenticate myself with the crowd that has come to distrust people who try to play too aggressively within this very tight ruled format.

[00:24:16] And I think you do a pre- I, I don’t know, is this something that you actively think about when you’re putting your videos together? Yes. Yeah. Or do you not actively think about sort of, this envelope pushing?

[00:24:24] Basic Logic: I think about it all the time. I constantly have similar comments, comments as you where it’s like, “How could you make this thumbnail?

[00:24:30] It, it’s so terrible. How could you talk about these topics like this?” And it’s like, man, you can see the argument in the video. My videos are short. They’re three minutes in the past. Now they’re five minutes, going to eight minutes because I want that YouTube ad revenue. So it’s not that much of an effort to actually watch the video and make sure...

[00:24:49] And also, my, my videos aren’t that clickbait. Like, my thumbnails are pretty accurate to what I’m talking about.

[00:24:56] Malcolm Collins: No, your, your videos have, have never been particularly clickbaity from what I’ve seen. Yeah. You’re, you’re typically ... Our, our videos are ... Well, no, we don’t really do clickbait either.

[00:25:04] Oh.

[00:25:04] No, we do good, spicy hooks, but it’s always on the topic of the episode.

[00:25:09] Simone Collins: That’s true. Yeah, we don’t, we don’t, like ... Well, we don’t bait and switch. So that is true. One thing I’m curious too is I, I w- I mean, I’m assuming you’re, like, in your 20s ‘cause you’re, you’re like other young- I am ... adults. Yeah, okay. So of people in their 20s, what do you think are sort of the biggest generational challenges facing that generation, and what do you see as the most important solutions, and do you actually think a large swath of people will adopt those solutions?

[00:25:36] Basic Logic: The biggest challenge for my generation, and it’s not even close, is the lack of reliable mentors where- Oh,

[00:25:43] Simone Collins: wow. I never actually ... It’s, like, like, 85th on my list of things I would have expected.

[00:25:50] Basic Logic: No. No, this is like, this has been an issue constantly, where we go to our education system, our teachers are either lying or stupid.

[00:25:58] Or we go to our church, our elders are either again lying or they’re stupid. Mm. It, it’s like this constant issue. Mm. And it’s not ... A lot of people argue that Gen Z is rebellious and hostile to authority, and to be entirely honest, I don’t see it that way. What I find is from the moment we were turned five and went to school, every person that we were supposed to trust has not done their job.

[00:26:22] Simone Collins: Mm.

[00:26:22] Basic Logic: And I, I talk about the sentiment of other people because it’s, it’s a rough thing growing up in a difficult world and you not be able to trust mentors. I don’t, I don’t think I know a single Gen Z person who doesn’t wish they had a wiser mentor of an older generation that would have guided them consistently in their lives.

[00:26:41] We create these online substitutes because that’s really all we have. Like, if you don’t have it in your family, you’re just not gonna get it at all. I’ve had it in my family thankfully so they were able to guide me through some of the steps. But you need y- you need more than just your family to, like, really develop all your skills and be prepared for this.

[00:27:00] And so w- we’ve reactively created a more independent system where we use online proxies as mentors, but it’s not, it’s not the same thing. It’s not real. Another thing that Gen Z really bases itself on is on stories that we tell through literature and video games and the likes, and naturally we fol- follow the hero’s journey.

[00:27:21] And every part of the hero’s journey has the mentor figure that shows up and he shows you the ropes. Mm. And we don’t have that. That’s not in our hero’s journey.

[00:27:30] Simone Collins: Hmm.

[00:27:32] Malcolm Collins: I find something that’s pretty interesting about your generation of coming into this is one of the things you used to hear a lot from people is, like, “Oh, I got into this from Jordan Peterson.”

[00:27:44] And I, I haven’t heard that once from you yet. Well, you were, you were saying something?

[00:27:48] Basic Logic: Oh, sorry. I was saying, yeah, Jordan Peterson, that I liked Jordan Peterson for a time, but I did not come into this because of him.

[00:27:56] Simone Collins: Hmm.

[00:27:56] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And I’ve learned that he really is the one who sort of [00:28:00] was more a bridge for boomers into the new right than a bridge for the youth into the new right, because-

[00:28:06] Simone Collins: Maybe Gen X and older millennials.

[00:28:08] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, Gen X and older millennials. When I think about your generation, the, the right-leaning individuals, the other one, you know, we’ve had on our show is G- G Do You Know What of Alt-Hist, Ruby Ard?

[00:28:16] Basic Logic: Yeah, yeah. I do. I follow his stuff actually. Yeah.

[00:28:18] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, he’s, he’s very young as well. Not, not quite as young as you, but very young as well.

[00:28:22] And he is he also didn’t come to the right because of, like, Jor- he came to it from just looking at society crumbling. Like, that was... I, I guess that’s also been a, a motivator for you, or that- It is ... that has

[00:28:35] Basic Logic: not been? That’s why I studied Christianity prior to converting. That was... It’s hard to avoid the issues here, because we can see it growing up.

[00:28:43] Like, we were told, “Go, go do well in school, get your degree, go to a good college, get a good job. Along the way in college, go get a girlfriend, get married, and that’ll be your life.” But that isn’t true, and that hasn’t been true for a very long time, and we knew that, but it’s all we had. Like, it’s all we could do, right?

[00:29:01] We were told that this is the way to go. That’s what every adult was pushing us towards. It’s all we could do, but we knew it wasn’t happening. And so at some point, at, at random point for some people, some later, some earlier, it was like, “Okay, I need to figure something else out here.” And we weren’t at the point where we had enough life experience where we could figure it out on our own, so we had to go onto online sources.

[00:29:25] Jordan Peterson helped some people I know, but usually they were already conservative. It was my generation. Like, if you’re already conservative- Yeah ... then you like Jordan Peterson. If you weren’t, you hated him. That, that, that’s how it was. The actual journey from left-wing to right-wing has been more from new right figures.

[00:29:42] I actually f- I’m not familiar with the, with the work of Nick Fuentes, for example, but I know Nick Fuentes ironically got some left-wingers to turn right.

[00:29:51] Simone Collins: Hmm.

[00:29:52] Basic Logic: So things along those

[00:29:53] Malcolm Collins: lines. Yeah. Well, and a lot of right-wingers to turn left unfortunately. Yeah,

[00:29:56] Basic Logic: true.

[00:29:57] Malcolm Collins: What?

[00:29:58] Simone Collins: Wait, so you know

[00:29:58] Basic Logic: he- I, I’ve heard of that as well.

[00:30:00] I’ve heard of that as well. Yeah. Yeah, I mean the- I’m not familiar enough to comment. I know some of the clips, but I’ve never actually like sat down and listened to his stuff.

[00:30:07] Malcolm Collins: He’s a, he’s an entertaining producer, but I think counterproductive to the wider movement, a- at least in terms of getting votes.

[00:30:12] But I mean, obviously he’s, he’s done what... Like I thought his interview with what’s his face, the guy, the UK guy, Simone, do you remember? W- did, did he... He interviewed- Oh, Piers Morgan ... Piers Morgan. He interviewed us. Yeah. Was like very well done on his part. Like- Hmm ... he, he did such a good job- Yeah,

[00:30:28] Basic Logic: I, I saw that one.

[00:30:29] That, that was excellent ...

[00:30:30] Malcolm Collins: vis-a-vis Piers Morgan that, that it, it made Piers Morgan just look like an absolute clown. But I think it also showed, Well, actually, d- it comes to the topic of the, the big moment that for a lot of people when like Piers Morgan was trying to imply that like he, he’s not sleeping around, and therefore he’s of lesser character.

[00:30:48] And obviously- ... Nick is like, “What are you do-...” Like, to your average conservative these days, it’s like, “What are you talking about?” Like, what... He’s, he’s less moral because he’s not having recreational sex with lots of women? The, the, the just like the absurdity of that on its face but that is so boomer conservative that they would actually think, and I think a lot of boomer conservatives would actually just think to say that.

[00:31:10] Like, they’re so ... They haven’t thought to question ... I guess this is ... Okay, I’m beginning to understand it now. The urban monoculture, as we often call it, or this sort of like leftist net around society, created cultural norms that our movement is based on questioning every single norm or idea that comes in front of us because so many rules in society turned out to be wrong.

[00:31:35] Like when I was younger y- you at a young age, this might be crazy to hear, but you used to think somebody was like m- a mentally ill tinfoil hat person if they said, “There is a secret network of pedophiles that is un- ... usually influential in American government and politics. And now everybody knows and agrees that that happened.

[00:31:57] Yeah ... and or if [00:32:00] you said, “Oh my God, the Southern Poverty Law Center is the KKK’s largest donor,” you’d be like, people would laugh you out of the room. Or, “The water is turning the frogs gay.” Well, even with that one, I even back when everybody acted like that was a crazy thing to say, I was like, “But frogs are a bellwether species.

[00:32:16] You would absolutely expect that. And amphibians actually change gender quite frequently. This is something we should look at.” Like, I remember even with that one I was like, “Why are you guys so mad about that?” Like, that, that actually seems like a a useful thing to, ... But where were they going? But yeah, they, they, they haven’t like aggressively challenged those sorts of norms, and it makes it so hard to have a conversation or be part of the chat with them because they, they haven’t engaged with these ideas as aggressively.

[00:32:45] It reminds me you know, we have a, a reporter who was doing a piece on us, and they were you know, mocking th- th- or you know, they were saying, “Oh, isn’t it so bad that at the White House thing, like what’s-his-face said Michelle Obama used to be a man,” right? Like, is, is, is a trans person. And I was like, “Well, I mean, I haven’t looked into this conspiracy yet, so like I can’t take a stance on it.”

[00:33:08] And they were very offended that I, I wouldn’t just immediately say that’s a horrible thing to say. Yeah. I’m like, “But too many of those horrible things to say turned out to be true.”

[00:33:21] Basic Logic: Yeah, it’s, it’s been a shock even for me it’s been a shock all the way through. Like, I knew things were bad. I wasn’t expecting, like, this level.

[00:33:29] In fairness, after I got more into history and I started learning things from more, like, a Christian lens as well, applying that Christian lens to history, it became a little bit more self-evident that this isn’t new. It’s actually happened several times in history, and this is just an yet another repeat.

[00:33:44] We’ve had transgender ideology in the Muslim empires in the Middle Ages, for example, which is insane to think about. Yep. Pedophile rings running the government has been a thing since ancient Greece. So I don’t know. It, it’s... When... The more I look into history, the more obvious how absurd the lies of modernity are, and the more annoyed I get at my educators who were clearly just not...

[00:34:10] I, I don’t know what they were thinking. Like, some of them, majority of them are probably stupid. A lot of them I, I would argue are malicious, frankly, ‘cause at some point-

[00:34:18] Malcolm Collins: Well, let’s, let’s talk about that, because you’re a young person in today’s world. How did you determine what was true?

[00:34:27] Basic Logic: Well, I, the way I determined things were true, back when I was an atheist my philosophy wasn’t very consistent.

[00:34:32] So things were true if they made sense to me, and I thought myself very logical. Hmm. And that did serve me decently well. I was surrounded by people who were hardcore leftists and pushing leftist propaganda. So I’m not American, but I went to an American high school, an international American high school.

[00:34:51] And there every single professor, every poster, every person was just pushing constant woke ideology nonstop. And the only news sources I was allowed to use or credit were leftist news sources. And so I got pretty good at, like, reading between the lines of how the left lies, and knowing how they speak so I could actually get the real news, right?

[00:35:13] And that ended up being a very useful skill. I use it even nowadays when I’m having biblical debates, because one thing you’ll notice with Christians often is that when they wanna prove their point they’ll just bombard you with a bunch of verses from the Bible. And if you have some verses, it’s like a contest between who has the most verses supporting their point, and that gets very ridiculous very quickly because you’re effectively arguing the Bible is contradicting itself at that point.

[00:35:39] You’re just making- ... a list of how many verses don’t contradict me versus how many don’t contradict you. So I’ve gotten in the habit of using whatever verses my opponent uses in a debate against me and against my point, I will use that same verse for my argument, and that’s something I started doing first in high school in politics and the like.[00:36:00]

[00:36:02] Malcolm Collins: That’s, I, I, I think that’s really useful. And what I have found in terms of the Bible in, in, in understanding it when people will make arguments against me is it’s always just, well, I take the, whatever they said to me, and then I try to read it in context and look up all the other ways it could be translated, and all of a sudden it makes perfect sense.

[00:36:21] And I was very s- that, that was one of the things that surprised me most about a- as you said, like, everyone I talked to about the Bible when I was a kid had what I call a Sunday school view of Christianity.

[00:36:34] Basic Logic: Yeah.

[00:36:34] Malcolm Collins: And when I went back and began to read the Bible as an adult with a translator next to me, like what, what does this word mean in other places that I was then like, “Oh, okay.

[00:36:46] Like, this, this actually makes a lot of sense in context.” And I was really shocked by that. I also find the other thing that’s very an alignment about both of our stories, and it’s something that I think Christians can use more when they’re thinking about how do you actually reach people who aren’t Christian yet, is we essentially converted to Christianity before we believed Christianity, because we didn’t think that other r- raising our kids secular was gonna be mentally good for them.

[00:37:16] And we knew the research. I mean, if you’re a scientist, you know the research. People who are Christians are, like, healthier, they have less depression, they have less... Like, all sorts of, they live longer, they have less medical complications. And so I was just like, well, it’s, if, if I’m gonna be an atheist and say that I believe to live in a way that’s logical, this is only logical.

[00:37:37] And it was only after we started living that way with these presumptions that things begin to make sense for us and we begin to become more fanatic. Where at this point I would say I’m, I’m, I’m quite fanatical. But it took, And I, and I think that this is a pathway that I had never heard a Christian argue to me once when I was an atheist.

[00:37:57] Just be like, “Well, you say you care about the data. All the data shows you’re better off being a Christian.”

[00:38:02] Simone Collins: Hmm.

[00:38:04] Basic Logic: Some people are gonna be very easily convinced, not... I know that if someone pulled that on me when I was an atheist, I would have laughed at them because, like, okay, you’re admitting that your thing is false, so you’re just saying let’s believe a lie so that it’s better for us.

[00:38:18] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:38:18] Basic Logic: I- So it will depend on the person. There are parts... I’ll, I’ll give you an example. There-- I know of one case where someone read the Book of Proverbs of the Old Testament, and they were so amazed by the wisdom there that they converted on the spot.

[00:38:33] Simone Collins: Huh.

[00:38:34] Basic Logic: But when I read the Book of Proverbs, a lot of the things there just seemed kind of obvious to me.

[00:38:38] Now, obviously they’re obvious to me because I live in a society that’s already integrated them, so they’ve... That was already drilled into my head since I was a kid. But that person had not been drilled into it. And so if someone had told me, “Yeah, you just need to read the Book of Proverbs to this person, they’ll convert,” I would have also laughed at them if they tried that with me.

[00:38:57] That’s, that’s why I, I don’t like a lot of these videos that you see online where people are trying to teach you how to convert people with, like, s- very specific arguments because it’s just not gonna work for most people. You have to adapt to each individual case.

[00:39:13] Malcolm Collins: No.

[00:39:14] Simone Collins: Okay, hold on. I’m really curious ‘cause I, I wanna, I want...

[00:39:17] I was surprised to hear that a lack of mentorship is the biggest problem facing people in the 20s right now. I also, yeah, I wanted

[00:39:22] Malcolm Collins: to ask about dating,

[00:39:24] Simone Collins: but- Right, I wanna ask about dating, too. But is the solution to the lack of mentorship just finding good people online? Because this is how also people end up in really scammy situations.

[00:39:34] It’s not

[00:39:34] Basic Logic: a solution, no.

[00:39:35] Simone Collins: Yeah. It’s like a desperate last resort. So where... Like, is it joining a religious community? What is it?

[00:39:39] Basic Logic: I, I would have loved if the answer was joining a religious community. That would have solved everything. Mm. It... And I was very excited when I joined a religious community, especially because the Bible keeps telling you about how important it is to join and respect your elders and do those things.

[00:39:52] Although it became very clear that my elders aren’t elders, they’re just overgrown children. That became abundantly clear [00:40:00] very fast. And I, I, I feel I’ve called other people stupid here quite a few times in our interview, but I actually do take it seriously. As the Bible says, you’re not really supposed to go around calling people stupid or to call people fools willy-nilly.

[00:40:14] So it, it’s been a while of contemplation before I’ve become so comfortable insulting people who are supposed to be my highers and my betters, and a lot of that has to do with just constant direct experience of them showing a level of maturity that even if you were a teenager I wouldn’t find it excusable.

[00:40:32] Simone Collins: Mm.

[00:40:33] Basic Logic: I’m not gonna go too far into the details. I went a little bit more into the details with Tom Fo about one, one of the scandals, one of the many scandals that happened. There’s... I can also go into another just... There was a time where one of the elders came to teach our young adult group why we should believe the Bible, and he said the best argument for it was the faithfulness of the Jews.

[00:40:56] Because the Jews survived the Holocaust and they didn’t abandon Judaism, that’s why you as Christians need to believe the Bible. And that is pretty much like the standard position of the elders just in that church.

[00:41:11] Simone Collins: Oh,

[00:41:11] Basic Logic: okay. And when I looked around more, it wasn’t just that church, it was every church.

[00:41:16] Doesn’t matter if it’s in this country or that country. If they call themselves non-denominational, chances are there’s something similar to that And it’s like, okay

[00:41:27] Malcolm Collins: That sounds... I’m gonna be honest, if I saw that, I’d be like, “This group sounds potentially infiltrated,” right? Yeah. Yeah.

[00:41:36] Basic Logic: Yes, I- Yeah, that’s really creepy

[00:41:37] I fully believe they were infiltrated by not, not just things like that, but other th- like they, they were very anti-woke ideology publicly, ‘cause that was a safe thing to say against. It was actually funny, I remember one sermon where it was all, “I know th- this is a very dangerous thing to say nowadays, but I don’t support gender ideology.”

[00:41:55] It’s like, great. Yes we, we established that men are not women and women are not men, and you can’t magically switch. What a great revelation that is. It w- happens to be a revelation everyone in this church already agrees with but then when it would come to, “Hey, how about women in the role of pastor?”

[00:42:13] Suddenly now we can’t really discuss that, and actually if you discuss that maybe you have some like pent-up misogyny and you’re p- you’re pushing other people away by having these very traditional views.

[00:42:26] Octavian Collins: Hmm.

[00:42:27] Malcolm Collins: But I mean, it’s in the Bible.

[00:42:30] Basic Logic: Yes, it’s in the Bible, but-

[00:42:33] Malcolm Collins: That’s

[00:42:33] Basic Logic: the- ... the Bible is clearly misinformed.

[00:42:36] We should trust our non-denominational pastor. He knows better.

[00:42:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, no, it’s, it’s it, yeah, it, it was a different time back then. We’ve got to-

[00:42:45] Basic Logic: Yeah.

[00:42:45] Malcolm Collins: No, I, I completely agree. And I, I think one of the things that you note here before we go to dating, ‘cause I, I do wanna pull on this point-

[00:42:52] Simone Collins: We gotta go to dating

[00:42:53] Malcolm Collins: is we can’t easily trust our elders in the way that we historically should have been able to because the boomer generation essentially sold out society. Like, I, An example was even just, I like my dad. I like my family, but when he says something like when we were talking about you know, should we come over over Christmas or something like that, and he goes, “Oh, I don’t know if we wanna have you o-”, he’s like, he’s like, “You know, you, you got all the kids, and then Christmas just becomes all about the kids.”

[00:43:25] And I’m like, “Yes! That’s exactly what Christmas is about. It’s about the children. What did you think Christmas was about?” And it just like that level of just like not caring about the custodianship of society or the next generation or anything like that, like it’s not even in their mental space I was like, “Wow.”

[00:43:47] And I think that it is hard to build... What we really need to do in terms of our ancestors is look to more ancient texts and stuff like that, and [00:44:00] philosophy and books and everything like that. And, and one of the things that is so funny to me, and it’s one of the reasons why we dress the way we do, is when people are like, “Oh, you’re trying to be trad,” or whatever, right?

[00:44:10] And I’m like, “What do you even mean trad?” Like, I combine ideas from the medieval ages. I combine ideas from the Enlightenment. I combine ideas from the Victorian period. I combine ideas from the 1950s. And everybody thinks when I say trad, I mean, or society says trad, it means like the 1950s. But the 1950s was the society that broke and led to all of this.

[00:44:33] That was the fragile society that allowed the rot that we are now dealing with to come about. And so when you look at the, the new right philosophies and ideologies, it’s much more of a stitching together of the best ideas from every century. I, I don’t know if that’s the way you felt in engaging with or not.

[00:44:54] Basic Logic: Oh, yes, yes. I, I, I really dislike this view of history, that it goes back 100 years maximum. That, that World War II is the start of history and everything is built around that. In fact, I’ve talked about this in previous videos and I will talk a- about it again in tomorrow’s video the idolatry that that World War II has caused as a founding myth.

[00:45:13] Simone Collins: Hmm.

[00:45:15] Malcolm Collins: Hmm. I like that. And I think idolatry as a concept is something that is not... I mean, we have lots of videos on this. Our fan base knows that we’re, like, really against idolatry and have quite an expansive view of it, but I think an expansive view of it is useful. It has tons of downstream civilizational effects that are probably too spicy for me to get into today.

[00:45:35] Basic Logic: Oh, right.

[00:45:36] Malcolm Collins: But dating. Oh. Dating. Okay. Tell me about what it is like to... I, I don’t know if you have a partner or, like, where you are in the cycle- I do ... or what works and what doesn’t work, or is it just your generation’s gonna die out? Like, what’s going on?

[00:45:50] Basic Logic: So after becoming Christian, I ha- I s- I, I s- I did start dating a Christian girl, and the issue we had is that I had very strict standards.

[00:45:59] We are not going to be engaging in physical activity prior to marriage. The point of these dates are to see if you are a good candidate for marriage or not. And she did not like that ‘cause she wasn’t used to that. She was used to the modern view of dating where you have fun, and I was not a very fun person in that regard.

[00:46:17] And so, like, by day three, it, where I made it, my stance very clear, I think it was a very mutual understanding, like this is not gonna go forward. Mm-hmm. And so that was that. And then it came to the point where at this point I was also starting to consider leaving my own personal church, and then I was leaving the church I was in, and that pretty much cut off my connection to the outside world and I became a hermit.

[00:46:41] And I started focusing purely on my startup for a long time, and after my startup stalled, I started focusing purely on my channel. And I look forward to the time I can rejoin a proper community because- Mm ... as, as useful as it has been to be a hermit so I could focus on my, on my professional endeavors- Mm

[00:47:01] uh, you need a community and I don’t have one, and that’s been a, that’s been a problem.

[00:47:06] Malcolm Collins: Well, do you have a Discord yet?

[00:47:08] Basic Logic: Oh, I do have a Discord, yeah. But online communities are not, they’re not the same thing. They’re, they’re not adequate replacements.

[00:47:13] Malcolm Collins: Oh, I... Well, th- this is one of the areas where... It’s funny, the places where we disagree are the things that everyone would be like, “Oh, you’re having this controversial person on,” and I’m like, “Online communities are better than real world communities.”

[00:47:24] But I have obviously a wife already, which changes some dynamics.

[00:47:28] Simone Collins: Yeah, and to be fair, we were living in the same area when we met, even if we were, like, an hour apart, so it still made

[00:47:34] Malcolm Collins: a big difference. Yeah, I mean, if I was young and I was dating, I would be doing it through online communities because I just...

[00:47:40] And, and that even helps- Mm-hmm ... with your no, no, you know, sex of, of stuff policy if you’re dating online, ‘cause then you have a reason to have those rules.

[00:47:49] Simone Collins: I really do like dates as being a job interview, though. Well, like, a wife, husband interview.

[00:47:54] Basic Logic: Right.

[00:47:54] Malcolm Collins: But please get married, like, take it seriously.

[00:47:56] It’s, it’s, it’s... The civilization is dying, all that.

[00:47:59] Basic Logic: No, [00:48:00] that’s what I wanna do. That’s what I think. Unle- unless you’re called to be a celibate priest in a domination like Catholicism that should be the, on the first goals of every man after- Mm-hmm ... you know, he’s 20 and he’s starting to get ready to provide.

[00:48:12] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:48:12] Basic Logic: So by... Like, one of the issues I have is since I’m not part of a constant, active local community, the only suggestions I have are either go outside and just approach a woman that I find attractive randomly, and then the chances of her being a, a Christian and a Christian to the standard that I determine is necessary is practically zero.

[00:48:33] Like, that-

[00:48:34] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:48:35] Basic Logic: So there’s pretty... There’s no point in me approaching a woman just because I find her attractive. It’s- Well,

[00:48:39] Simone Collins: would you... I mean, what if she would be open to conversion?

[00:48:43] Basic Logic: Well, who knows? But I’m not going to. It’s, it’s gonna be a numbers game if I’m just approaching people, like, coldly, people I don’t know.

[00:48:50] I don’t have the time to invest to go, keep going one after another. I don’t even leave my house that much. I’m not very social. To go after one after another- Neither are we, by the way.

[00:48:57] Malcolm Collins: We leave our house almost never.

[00:49:00] Basic Logic: Right. So the few instances in which I will go out, I will see an attractive woman.

[00:49:06] The chances of her being the Christian to the standard that I consider necessary are practically zero in this country and in this area. And so there’s, there’s no point. There’s no active vetting. So if you look at how societies historically did it, obviously they had this massive vetting process of your family getting involved- Yeah

[00:49:26] and your community gets involved. Mm. I have none of that. Mm. So I have to vet the thing myself prior, and I don’t have the means to do that.

[00:49:36] Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, just to be... I, I, I know you’re not asking for it, but if I was in your position I would be using my community to like a- let the community know if they want to put in an application, this is what the dating process it’ll, it’ll be like.

[00:49:50] Obviously you risk getting catfished and stuff like this to an extent. But at least you’ve got the big v- view of, pool of people that are pre-vetted to like your ideology. And it, it’s not the best way to do things-

[00:50:02] Basic Logic: Right ...

[00:50:03] Malcolm Collins: but it, but it is a realistic way to do things, whereas hitting on women you meet in person is not really realistic in today’s market.

[00:50:12] Basic Logic: Yeah. I mean, I, I, I could set up a poll of my, of my YouTube account and say, “Hey, if there are any single women who like what they’ve been hearing,” I’m pretty attractive in real life, at least I think I am. So- Yeah.

[00:50:25] Simone Collins: That helps ...

[00:50:26] Basic Logic: you, you, you can send out your applications. I don’t- Or better- The problem is that, that might work for me.

[00:50:34] I don’t think it’s reasonable to expect men in general to go up the whole No, it wouldn’t work for men in general ... source and follow. Right.

[00:50:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, then how

[00:50:40] Basic Logic: can you- But it solves my issue if I, if I was just focusing on my issue.

[00:50:44] Malcolm Collins: You could create something... I mean, the, the thing that I’m always pushing and that I think that as sort of a, a, a...

[00:50:51] What’s so fun is that the new right community of creators has and I know you’re sort of new to it, but it really feels like a community where people are reaching out, trying to help each other, and trying to help their fans move, move ahead and, and, and do cool things. And one of the things that we’re always pushing is like, if there is a large societal failure, you have the capacity to attempt to fix it yourself, especially in the age of AI.

[00:51:18] I mean, I don’t know how much vibe coding you’ve done yet, but, but you could put together a dating system that fixes a lot of these problems. It, it would be work, but it would be civilizationally important, and you already have an audience

[00:51:31] Basic Logic: I, I don’t, I haven’t done much vibe coding. And to be entirely honest, I’m not confident in the idea.

[00:51:37] I don’t wanna disparage it because I think someone might be able to make it work. I don’t think I can make it work, but-

[00:51:42] Malcolm Collins: Oh, okay. We gotta, we gotta find somebody out there to make it work. All right. Maybe I’ll reach out to Rubyard. He needs to g- he needs to get hooked up too. You know, they’re- ... young conservative.

[00:51:51] Y- y- you wanna have a religious experience, let me tell you what, don’t, don’t go to Ayahuasca, right? You know, just -

[00:51:57] Basic Logic: Right, yes ...

[00:51:58] Malcolm Collins: that’s gonna, that’s gonna... but [00:52:00] this has been a lot of fun to chat with you. Is there anything that, ‘cause you said you don’t do a lot of vibe coding, is there anything that somebody could build that would be useful to you?

[00:52:09] Because I, I, I try to help our community with anything they need. When Kiersha came on, I made a tip app for her.

[00:52:15] Basic Logic: Well, the most useful thing practically, because we have a lot of online organization in the new right. We have no- Yeah ... in-person organization, which really hurts us. If we don’t have a local community- Right

[00:52:25] that can defend us, for, for example, I live in Europe, right? And you, you’ve probably seen the news of how things are being done in Europe, and how people are getting stabbed and- Mm-hmm ... murdered with no consequence for, for the murder. We don’t have a local community to defend ourselves, so there is a very real issue.

[00:52:41] So- If we had a local group of people here that would be willing to, like, work together and defend ourselves, that would be very useful.

[00:52:49] Malcolm Collins: But- So do you watch Redeemed Zoomer?

[00:52:52] Basic Logic: I have, yes.

[00:52:53] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, so he’s been on our show, and I think his Reconquista project is probably the closest project I’ve seen to achieving that end.

[00:53:02] In my view, I see it as a bit of a pipe dream, but other people have explained to me, and I think that they have a point here, is it’s like yes, I understand these woke boomer churches. You have to hold your nose to do anything in them. But they are desperate for young people in leadership positions. And if you can just get a group of people together, you could take one over with only five or six people.

[00:53:29] So maybe that’s the path.

[00:53:31] Basic Logic: That, that is an excellent path, especially for the American audience, where there’s like a mainline Protestant church everywhere. And these mainline Protestant churches are cultural hearts, so they’re very valuable to retake. Yeah. It’s not the place that I’m in, though.

[00:53:42] There are no m- mainline Protestant churches where I live, even though I am a Protestant. My options are Catholic or non-denominational. That

[00:53:49] Malcolm Collins: sucks. Well, and especially if... I, I... The, the two recent episodes we had were on how the Vatican has been preventing organizations who are counter to, like, the woke agenda from gaining institutional power.

[00:54:02] Yeah. Which has been incredibly demotivational I think to a lot of people. But, but it’s also worth, you know, being aware of, of where we can put our time. One of, one of the interesting things that I know one of our US fans was doing just as, like, where young people are these days, is they actually converted and were going to both Mormon and Catholic church and were going to settle with the religion that found them a wife.

[00:54:27] And-

[00:54:28] Simone Collins: Like, Jesus take the wheel.

[00:54:30] Malcolm Collins: Like- Oh, no. But they’re like, “This is the only place where I’m gonna find base women, so I’m just gonna do both.”

[00:54:35] Simone Collins: That’s one way to do it.

[00:54:36] Malcolm Collins: I was like, that’s a, that’s a way to do it. Although it’s, it’s gonna be harder because the Catholics get married quite late compared to other Christian denominations which, which can make it harder if you’re using their, their cultural institutions.

[00:54:49] W- wait, you’re in Europe now?

[00:54:51] Basic Logic: I live in Europe, yes. In fact, I am, depending on how you define it, I am European.

[00:54:57] Malcolm Collins: Oh, wow. This

[00:54:57] Simone Collins: is why he, he needed his AC on. Yes. You’re very lucky to have it.

[00:55:02] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, very lucky, yeah. Oh ... I feel so bad for you. Like, Europe is-

[00:55:07] Simone Collins: Come on, it’s nice. It’s nice. I

[00:55:09] Malcolm Collins: know- I, both of us have lived in Europe in a lot of places in Europe actually, and Europe just demographically is-

[00:55:17] Basic Logic: Yes, I, I agree with you.

[00:55:18] It’s

[00:55:18] Simone Collins: rough. Yeah.

[00:55:19] Malcolm Collins: A,

[00:55:19] Basic Logic: a lot of it also is... So I’m not- If I, if I showed you like my DNA results, I’m not from one European country. I’m from several. I’m, I’m quite the mix. Because I wasn’t born in Europe, I was born in a European colony.

[00:55:34] Simone Collins: Mm.

[00:55:35] Basic Logic: And then we, we went to Europe afterwards. So for- first we left that country to go work in a Muslim country, then we went out to, to a European country.

[00:55:42] Malcolm Collins: European.

[00:55:43] Basic Logic: That’s where we now live. And there’s a lot of culture shock here. For example, Europeans seem to forget that the sun exists every winter, and they never buy an AC. And every year is the same story. It’s like, we had no idea summer got this hot. We had no idea we’d be having [00:56:00] heatstroke. We had no idea there’d be wildfires.

[00:56:01] Like, really? It’s every single summer the same story.

[00:56:05] Simone Collins: Well, I forgot, though, that... And I was just thinking about it this morning, which is why I asked. The Little Ice Age didn’t end until like 1850. So I think to a great extent societally, like our sort of collective memory assumes that we still live in an ice age, and- We

[00:56:21] Malcolm Collins: do still live in an ice age, Simone

[00:56:23] Simone Collins: Okay, well, but the extra ice age.

[00:56:26] It was extra chilly. Okay. Yeah, you

[00:56:27] Malcolm Collins: mean the Little Ice Age.

[00:56:28] Simone Collins: The Little Ice Age.

[00:56:29] Basic Logic: Yes. If this is an ice age, I don’t wanna know what the warm age is.

[00:56:32] Malcolm Collins: You don’t what? Yeah,

[00:56:33] Simone Collins: I mean-

[00:56:34] Basic Logic: I said if this is an ice age, I don’t wanna know what the warm age is.

[00:56:37] Malcolm Collins: Oh, yeah. The, just in case you’re wondering, ‘cause I often have to remind Simone of this, the definition of an ice age for people who do not know because leftists have brainwashed us into not knowing this, is any time in Earth’s history where there is permanent ice anywhere in the world.

[00:56:53] So if the, as long as we have the north and south pole as ice caps, we are in an ice age definitionally. You can look this up, by the way.

[00:57:04] Basic Logic: I did not know that. I, I had no idea.

[00:57:06] Malcolm Collins: No, they, Did you know that it used to be multiple times hotter than it is right now in Earth’s history when- Yes ... life was thriving?

[00:57:14] Carbon levels have been at multiples higher than they are now in the atmosphere. The, we, we are actually still at one of the colder parts of Earth’s collective history.

[00:57:24] Basic Logic: Yeah. That much I know.

[00:57:25] Malcolm Collins: Sorry, just have to remind people. Yeah.

[00:57:28] Simone Collins: It was extra cold. It was extra, extra cold earlier, and that’s why most of Europe was built.

[00:57:33] Because also keep in mind, most of Europe was not built... Well, not most. Many of the old buildings were built during a much colder period as well.

[00:57:41] Malcolm Collins: Well, and Europe- Focus on insulation ... could get even much colder in the near future if the the whatever stream breaks, the the current in the Atlantic.

[00:57:51] Because if you look at where Europe is on a map, a lot of people are surprised by this but Europe is significantly higher latitudinally than a lot of, or longitudinally, than a lot of people are aware of. Like, m- like midline Europe goes through like Quebec, right? Like, And, and so it should be freezing, but it’s not freezing because of the way the, the current moves in a circle in the Atlantic Ocean.

[00:58:14] Basically it moves in a, w- what is this? Is this clockwise or counterclockwise? Clockwise fashion, taking up the water from the southern regions. D- nobody cares about this stuff, so.

[00:58:23] Simone Collins: I don’t know, everyone’s talking about El Niño, which is probably gonna kill, the big El Niño, millions of people this year, so that’s-

[00:58:30] Malcolm Collins: Did,

[00:58:31] Simone Collins: wasn’t El

[00:58:31] Malcolm Collins: Niño- But it’s kind of top of mind

[00:58:33] like a unique thing from our childhood that was supposed to never

[00:58:34] Simone Collins: happen again? No. No, no, no. It, it’s, it’s a recurring thing. And as far as I understand it, it, it happens when, again, it’s, it’s the result of ocean currents not going the way they normally go, meaning that people’s climates don’t behave the way they normally behave, and people’s whole, you know, agricultural systems and, like, housing systems are based on the expectation of certain levels of rainfall or the lack thereof.

[00:58:53] And when that changes, everything goes crazy. And so El Niño is kind of an example of what climate change will do. But yeah, we’re getting super off topic.

[00:59:06] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:59:06] Simone Collins: And I’m being attacked by

[00:59:07] Malcolm Collins: my

[00:59:07] Simone Collins: one-year-old right now. Well,

[00:59:08] Malcolm Collins: it’s been great to have you on. Is there any, is there any final thing you wanna talk about or anything you wanna point people towards?

[00:59:15] Basic Logic: Well, nothing really comes to mind. Sorry. Okay.

[00:59:20] Malcolm Collins: Well, I

[00:59:20] Simone Collins: really- I want... My, my final question is, like, is there is there anything that you really wish that more people your age or more people, like, our age and older were doing? I mean, if, if a lot of people hear what you’re saying and are like, “Oh, I didn’t know people in their 20s were looking for mentors who could actually do good things,” like, would you encourage older people to try to find opportunities to help people in areas where they actually have expertise?

[00:59:47] Or do you just think that, like, older generations are just so intellectually bankrupt that they can’t really help on average? Like, it’s actually not worth it to encourage people because they’re not gonna do it. Or, I don’t know, like, what would you encourage people of different [01:00:00] generations to be doing to try to make the world better if they didn’t realize that, you know, there was an opportunity they should be capitalizing on?

[01:00:06] Basic Logic: So for the older generations, a mistake from very well-meaning older generation people, like boomers who don’t wanna do boomer conservatism, is that they go in and they start trying to teach the current generation, and then they get caught in the fact that my generation does not trust them.

[01:00:22] Octavian Collins: Hmm.

[01:00:23] Basic Logic: And, and they...

[01:00:23] We’re not used to trusting mentor people. The better way of getting our respect is actually by doing something we really find impressive. Hmm. And then just being open to a younger person going up there and being your apprentice in whatever it is you’re doing that’s very impressive. Yeah. That, that seems very helpful as, as a thing en masse.

[01:00:45] For the younger generations, my advice seems almost opposite. I say, “Hey, don’t trust your educators, and don’t trust- Hmm ... this current system, and figure out who you can trust. Don’t trust me. Don’t, don’t go to my videos and assume that in four minutes, in five minutes, whatever, I can cover this topic perfectly.

[01:01:03] Actually fact check everything I say, and do the same for everyone hopefully, and see what you can do because right now it’s hard to trust people.”

[01:01:13] Malcolm Collins: I think that’s a really good point.

[01:01:14] Simone Collins: It’s very solid. Yeah. We live in a world in which reality is, is the- ... falling apart, and that, to me, the one thing that’s really standing out in every facet of this interview with you is reality and the fracturing in people’s understanding of it in both secular and religious reality, and also the, the different perceptions of reality people have in that you can’t use the same argument to convert someone, for example, to Christianity.

[01:01:42] People have profoundly different conversion experiences, and I think people also have very profoundly different experiences with reality. You’ve given me a lot to think about, and we’re really grateful for you coming on the podcast, ‘cause this has been really fun.

[01:01:54] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Thank you. And continue making videos.

[01:01:57] You’re doing a good job in reaching a lot of people.

[01:01:58] Simone Collins: Yes. Don’t stop.

[01:02:00] Malcolm Collins: And I hope you can turn this into a, a full-time job. You know, obviously that’s the goal for all of us, but, Yeah ... you, you have to do so well to get to that level. But we’ll, we’ll see if we can get there. You, you, you have up until this point done an excellent job.

[01:02:14] And so, keep it up, and please find a wife. I, I know it’s hard,

[01:02:20] Basic Logic: But like- I’ll do my best. My family is also asking me to do my best to try and find one, yes.

[01:02:25] Malcolm Collins: And-

[01:02:25] Simone Collins: That’s

[01:02:25] Malcolm Collins: so

[01:02:25] Simone Collins: good. Underrated.

[01:02:27] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And, and if you ever need anything within the wider community, like the, the online right community you let us know and we’re happy to make connections or whatever that, that could be useful to you.

[01:02:37] Basic Logic: Yeah, that, that would be very useful. I, I don’t have any connections in mind, but broadly I wanna participate more in, in the online right and work with more people. So-

[01:02:45] Malcolm Collins: Well, the one connection I can easily make for you, because we get invited every year and we used to do the invites, is the invite-only conservative society that happens in London every year, Okay

[01:02:56] called ARC. And most of the c- content creators in our space who are in Europe go to it.

[01:03:02] Basic Logic: And, and just to clarify, is it, is it like recorded? Do people see who you are there?

[01:03:06] Malcolm Collins: No, no, no. It’s a, it’s a secret event. It’s like only for you know, that’s it. We, that’s what we mean by invite only, right?

[01:03:12] Like, it’s, it’s- Okay ... you have to be like heavily vetted to go.

[01:03:18] Basic Logic: Okay. Yeah. Because one, one of the things I’m concerned about is keeping my anonymity because I have pissed off a lot of people in a very short amount of time.

[01:03:25] Malcolm Collins: Oh, yeah. Yeah. We made the mistake of starting this with our faces. Although I’ll admit, I, I w- we will say to you a- having been in this space for a while everyone I’ve known who when I first met they were anonymous has had their identity blown.

[01:03:39] Yeah ... like a, a friend of ours who we talk to frequently is like right nationalist and completely got doxed. Another European as well. The, they, what you always find, the joke, I don’t know if you know this joke on the right, but whenever like a right anonymous person gets doxed they’re always like a handsome, well, well exercised, like successful adult.

[01:03:59] ... And when it’s a [01:04:00] leftist it’s like some weirdo troglodyte.

[01:04:02] Basic Logic: Right.

[01:04:03] Malcolm Collins: But yeah. I, I will say like it, it could happen, and prepare for it. And in truth I generally, the advice that I would give to somebody who is starting this, and I know you’re not now just starting, is to start by being what they call a face fag.

[01:04:18] Like, have your face i- Because we have never had to deal with a doxing moment because we’ve always been public, so people don’t see it as a big deal that they found out who we were. But- It’s, it’s, it’s s- a scary thing to live with

[01:04:33] Basic Logic: I fully expect one day that I will be revealing my face just voluntarily.

[01:04:37] If I do get doxxed at some point, it’s not gonna be the end of the world. I’m not looking forward to it, but it’s not gonna be the end of the world. Yeah ... it, it will be what it is. So I’m not sc- Oh, you know what

[01:04:46] Malcolm Collins: you should

[01:04:47] Basic Logic: do? But I don’t wanna... I also, I’m not scared of it, but I also don’t want to cause it.

[01:04:51] Malcolm Collins: Look up how other right-wing influencers who were pseudonymous got doxxed, and try to learn how they got found out. With for example, with Rawigh Nationalist, it was his local grocery store, right Simone?

[01:05:05] Simone Collins: That’s what I remember reading. Like, he was literally buying eggs- Wow ... from, like, a nice local farm-

[01:05:09] which was ironic, I guess. I don’t know if there’s a connection at all.

[01:05:12] Malcolm Collins: And somebody then tracked, like, who was buying that many eggs at that store or something.

[01:05:16] Simone Collins: I think, yeah, it was something along those lines, yeah. But j-

[01:05:19] Basic Logic: All right,

[01:05:20] Malcolm Collins: well- Just, just useful to be aware of, the things you might forget that somebody could use.

[01:05:25] But anyway, it’s been fantastic talking to you. I hope things work out for you, and we are always a contact for you. Whenever you need help, you let us know, okay?

[01:05:32] Basic Logic: All right. Sure. Wonderful.

[01:05:33] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. Thank you so much. And

[01:05:35] Basic Logic: yeah, I, I am interested in the event. So if you could update me in the future at some point, I would appreciate it.

[01:05:39] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, we’ll let you know about the next arc. It just happened, the last arc, but I’ll let you know about the next one. All right. But it was, like, last month or something.

[01:05:45] Basic Logic: All right. Bye. All right. Sound good. Thank you. Thanks for having me. See ya.

[01:05:47] Speaker: Oh, that’s good, right? Yeah. Looks a lot like me. Hey, Tex, do you think you look like Octavian now? He can’t see himself. Well, he’s smiling, and you smile a lot. Yeah, and I like it. I like his smile when he looks at me. He’s, like, laughing. Yeah? Yeah. Yeah, he... You make him laugh.

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