The Fifth Estate

Sally Warhaft, Peter Cronau and Scott Ludlam in conversation on stage at Bendigo Writers Festival.

Why is WikiLeaks so important? What is there to be learned from the documents released? According to the writers in A Secret Australia, the leaking of hidden government documents yielded knowledge that is essential for journalists and institutions to analyse the consequences of covert and unaccountable state power. “We open governments” is WikiLeaks’ motto, yet its crusade for transparent, accountable government has led to criminal charges being laid against its founder, Julian Assange, and whistleblower Chelsea Manning. Assange now faces espionage and hacking-related charges from the US government.

A Secret Australia’s co-editor Peter Cronau and contributor and former Greens Senator Scott Ludlam joined Sally Warhaft at Bendigo Writers Festival earlier this year for a discussion about what is kept from public view and why. What are the limits of journalism when reporting on state apparatuses, and what is a publisher’s responsibility when dealing with state secrets?

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Presented in partnership with Bendigo Writers Festival

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Sally Warhaft and George Megalogenis

Remember March 2020? When Australian borders closed, when we saw the first round of social restrictions? When the disturbing and surreal realities of COVID-19 finally hit home across Australia? March! We were so young.

Back then, Sally Warhaft caught up with George Megalogenis for a Fifth Estate conversation about political leadership during the pandemic, and about its historic and economic precedents.

So much has happened since. Six months on, the pair catch up again to take stock of the shifting situation and look to the future. How will the decisions made by Scott Morrison, his government, and the national cabinet affect us for decades to come? What are the long-term economic implications of closed borders? What will happen to global markets and local jobs? What will we rebuild in the post-recession economy and what can we create anew?

The Fifth Estate will take a break for the remainder of 2020, but the series will return fortnightly in 2021 with Sally Warhaft bringing you more live news, current affairs, politics and analysis. In the meantime, keep your eyes peeled for an exciting announcement about a new project from Warhaft and the Wheeler Centre, starting later this month.

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What might the economic and social upheavals of 2020 mean for climate policy in Australia? For this Fifth Estate conversation, host Sally Warhaft brings together Judith Brett and Marian Wilkinson – two writers who have undertaken in-depth research into the resource economy and Australian climate scepticism.

Brett's recent Quarterly Essay, 'The Coal Curse', traces the history of Australia's resource dependence and its impact on our political culture. Wilkinson's book, The Carbon Club, explores the loose but powerful alliance of Australian media, mining and political figures whose scepticism has hindered meaningful climate policy development for decades.

There are signs, though, that the stalemate might be starting to shift. Amid widespread criticism during the bushfires earlier this year, Scott Morrison began to soften his climate rhetoric, speaking of ‘adaptation’ and ‘resilience’. James Murdoch spoke out against News Corp’s climate scepticism in January and, more recently, dramatically resigned from the board. Will the seismic impacts of Covid-19 set us back into our entrenched economic habits, or could 2020 mark a turning point? #TWCFifthEstate

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Sally Warhaft and Kevin Rudd, live via video-link

What are the origins of COVID-19? How could the pandemic’s spread have been better contained? These are fraught and complex questions – and finding the right forum to ask them is a diplomatic minefield. How will Australia's call for a World Health Assembly investigation affect our relationship with China and other major global players? And how is the world's diplomatic and economic order being reshaped in the midst of the crisis – and of governments' widely varying responses?

Kevin Rudd joins Sally Warhaft for a live-streamed Fifth Estate discussion of these questions and more. As president of the Asia Society Policy Institute in New York, a former Australian diplomat in China, and, of course, our former Prime Minister and Foreign Minister, Rudd shares his reflections on diplomacy and governance, his insights into how the pandemic is likely to alter international relations, and his thoughts on how Australia can continue to manage the far-reaching economic and political impacts of COVID-19.

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Sally Warhaft speaks with Tom Porteous, who joined us live from Paris

Tom Porteous is a former journalist for the Guardian and the BBC, and an expert on global conflict management and resolution. Now deputy program director at Human Rights Watch, he joined Sally Warhaft live from Paris to discuss human rights and COVID-19.

The pair talk through the existing tensions and inequities the pandemic has brought into sharp relief. They discuss, too, the immediate human rights challenges – from healthcare access and healthcare workers’ labor rights to family violence, education access and prisoners’ rights, to increasing incidents of racism.

Porteous also discusses post-pandemic life and the reasons for caution and optimism. What challenges can we anticipate, and mitigate, in terms of vaccine access? And could the post-COVID moment prompt a rethinking of social contracts, and an era of major public policy innovation?

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Sally Warhaft, left, and Joshua Wong

Joshua Wong was still a teenager when he rose to international prominence as a leader in Hong Kong’s 2014 Umbrella Movement, protesting increased Chinese Communist Party intervention in the city’s electoral system.

‘That’s the transformation of Hong Kongers … Before last summer, nobody could imagine more than 2 million people taking to the streets. […] But we did it. Almost one-fourth of the population [stood] up against the regime of Beijing.’

A lot has happened since. Wong has served two prison terms and been nominated for the Nobel Peace Prize. He's co-founded a new political party, Demosistō, and written a book, Unfree Speech. All the while, the protest movement in Hong Kong has simmered on, boiling over last year into extraordinary mass protests and brutal police confrontations.

With Sally Warhaft, Wong talks about the evolution of Hong Kong’s democracy movement and the impact of COVID-19. Assembly restrictions enforced due to the pandemic have hampered demonstrations and possibly cleared the path for more authoritarian rule in the city. In mid-April, more than a dozen high-profile pro-democracy activists were arrested.

How does Wong expect these arrests to impact Hong Kong's legislative elections in September? What effect might a weakened United States and an emboldened China have on the One Country, Two Systems principle that grants Hong Kong special autonomy?

Wong reflects on these questions and more.

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See also The Fifth Estate: Joshua Wong: Unfree Speech / Activism

With Joshua Wong and Sally Warhaft

The Fifth Estate: The World’s Largest Party: China / Australian politics What’s That Sound? Activism Today / Activism

With Tess Lawley, Gary Foley, Amelia Telford and 2 others

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Sally Warhaft interviews Malcolm Turnbull – in his home – from the Wheeler Centre in Melbourne

In 2015, when Malcolm Turnbull returned to the Liberal Party leadership and assumed the Australian Prime Ministership, he brought with him a passion for free enterprise, a touch of style and a vision for an ‘agile Australia’.

But Turnbull's view of the Liberal Party – a progressive party of the ‘sensible centre’, with individual freedom and aspiration at its core – put him at odds with the Liberals’ conservative wing. He clashed with them throughout most of his political career.

Sally Warhaft, left, and Malcolm Turnbull

His rocky ride in the Australian Parliament was defined by moments such as the carbon emissions debate and the historic same-sex marriage survey. These form just part of his new memoir, A Bigger Picture, which also recounts Turnbull’s rise to prominence as a successful lawyer, businessman and leader of Australia's Republican movement.

With Sally Warhaft, Turnbull discusses his life and the trajectory of his extraordinary career. The pair talk, too, about the current state of Australian politics, his notable encounters during his time in public office, and the pressures that permeate a Prime Ministership.

It’s an uncertain moment for the arts, for writers and for everybody. If you’re in a position to support our efforts to bring you books, writing and ideas from a safe distance, you can make a contribution here. Thank you for your generosity.

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Sally Warhaft, left, and George Megalogenis

There is little doubt now that the COVID-19 coronavirus will drastically alter our lives, communities and societies for some time to come. Amid confusing, contradictory or misleading information about how we should respond – and how we should protect ourselves and each other – the pandemic has already tested our social fabric. How the crisis will affect our healthcare, economic and political systems is yet to be understood, but we appear to be approaching a major reckoning.

‘The funny thing about this is it’s Spanish Flu, the Great Depression and the Second World War all wrapped into one.’

So, how can we make sense of it all? What kinds of measured, long-term perspectives can we bring to the constant, rapidly-shifting flow of news updates and band-aid measures?

In a special live-streamed edition of The Fifth Estate, journalist George Megalogenis joins host Sally Warhaft for a careful analysis of our precarious present and the future that may follow. Drawing on lessons from the past – including the 2008 Global Financial Crisis, post-World War II unemployment and more – they consider what the compounding challenges of the coronavirus will mean for our national character, for different workers and citizens, and for our political era. How will we be changed?

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It’s an uncertain moment for the arts, for writers and for everybody. If you’re in a position to support our efforts to bring you books, writing and ideas from a safe distance, you can make a contribution here. Thank you for your generosity.

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Bob Brown

The bushfires that raged across the country this summer have caused environmental and economic damage that will be felt for years to come. In Canberra, they have ignited a frenzy of finger-pointing in every direction.

In this Fifth Estate discussion, Sally Warhaft talks with environmentalist and former Greens leader Bob Brown about the ecological, political and economic implications of this urgent and ongoing national issue.

Having served for 16 years in the Australian Senate, does Brown believe a lasting shift in public mood and policy is now possible? What are the short-term and long-term priorities in the federal bushfire response?

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For the final Fifth Estate of 2019, George Megalogenis returns to reflect with host Sally Warhaft on the year in Australian politics.

Sally Warhaft and George Megalogenis

They discuss the early manoeuvres of Scott Morrison and Anthony Albanese, and the 46th federal parliament. They talk, too, about the stories that made domestic headlines – as well as how major international news events were felt here in Australia. What do these stories and controversies reveal about our country and our culture?

It’s been a wild ride of a decade in Australian politics, with seven prime ministers in 10 years. What does the next year – and the next decade – hold in store?

This is our final episode of The Fifth Estate for 2019; we'll be back early in 2020 with a new slate of conversations. Stay tuned!

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