WHERE DO GAYS RETIRE PODCAST

Show Notes

The Frying Pan Is Now the Fire —

Where Do We Go From Here?

Hosted by Mark Goldstein| Solo Episode |April 2026

Sequel to: "Out of the Frying Pan Into the Fire" (July 2025)

When Mark recorded "Out of the Frying Pan Into the Fire" last July, he was mostly thinking about political instability in other countries. He wasn't quite expecting the frying pan itself to turn up the heat this dramatically right here at home.

In this solo follow-up episode, Mark takes a calm, clear-eyed look at where things actually stand in the United States right now for LGBTQ+ retirees — and more importantly, what your real options are. This is not a political commentary. It is not about panic. It is exactly what this podcast has always been: practical, honest information to help you make informed decisions about where to spend your golden years, openly, safely, and fabulously.

In This Episode

• What NSPM-7 actually says — and what it doesn't say — about our community
• Why listener numbers are growing, and what that tells us about where our community is right now
• The case for staying: U.S. states with the strongest constitutional and legal protections
• The case for going: why more LGBTQ+ retirees are seriously looking abroad
• The honest complications of international living — Medicare, visas, family distance
• Five questions to help you figure out where you stand
• Mark's personal story — Fort Collins, Peter, and the 1982 Málaga plane crash
• Resources to stay informed and take action

U.S. States With Strong LGBTQ+ Legal Protections — Featured in This Episode

Mark highlights states where same-sex marriage rights are protected at the state constitutional level or through strong statutory protections — states where your rights would remain intact even if the federal picture changes.

Constitutional protection states:

• New York — equal protection enshrined in state constitution (2024); marriage equality since 2011
• California — right to marry enshrined as a fundamental right in state constitution (2024)
• Colorado — constitutional ban removed by voters (2024) + inclusive statutory definition enacted (2025)
• New Mexico — state Supreme Court ruled marriage equality required under state constitution (2013); codified by unanimous legislative vote (2019)
• Nevada — marriage equality positively enshrined in state constitution (2020) — no episode yet, but worth watching!

Strong statutory protection states are also mentioned:

• Massachusetts — first state to legalize same-sex marriage (2004); no ban
• Vermont — civil unions pioneer (2000); no ban
• Rhode Island, Washington State, New Jersey, Maryland, Illinois, Oregon — all with no dormant bans

International Destinations Mentioned in This Episode

• Spain — Torremolinos, Sitges, Malaga, Costa del Sol
• Portugal — Algarve, Cascais
• Mexico — Ajijic, Puerto Vallarta, Mexico City, Queretaro
• France, Netherlands, Costa Rica

For our full archive of international destination episodes, see the Episode Resource Guide linked in the show notes for this episode.

LGBTQ+ Retirement Communities Mentioned

• Living Out — Palm Springs, California | livingout.com
• Fountain Grove Lodge — Santa Rosa, California

Referenced Episode

"Out of the Frying Pan Into the Fire — Why the Political Climate Matters for LGBTQ+ Retirees"

Originally aired July 2, 2025. Available in the podcast archive at wheredogaysretire.com.

Resources Mentioned in This Episode

U.S. Legal & Advocacy:

• ACLU — aclu.org
• Lambda Legal — lambdalegal.org
• Freedom for All Americans — freedomforallamericans.org
• Movement Advancement Project (state-by-state tracker) — lgbtmap.org

International Research:

• ILGA World — global LGBTQ+ rights by country — ilga.org
• International Living — Global Retirement Index — internationalliving.com
• Social Security abroad — ssa.gov/international

Episode Resource Guide

Download the companion Episode Resource Guide for this episode — a curated list of our top international destination episodes and our top U.S. protective state episodes, organized and ranked by downloads.

Available at wheredogaysretire.com/fryingpan2

Connect With Mark & the Community

• Facebook: Where Do Gays Retire — facebook.com/groups/wheredogaysretire
• Facebook: Gay Men 60 and Better (27,700+ members) — facebook.com/groups/gaymen60andbetter
• Email Mark — [email protected]
• Schedule a call with Mark — savvycal.com/Markscalendar
• Full episode archive — wheredogaysretire.com

Support the Podcast

If you enjoy the Where Do Gays Retire podcast, please subscribe, leave a review, and share this episode with someone who needs it. You can also support the show by buying Mark a coffee at wheredogaysretire.com — each $5 coffee helps keep the podcast going.

"Retirement is not just about warm weather.

It is about living openly, safely, and fabulously,

wherever in the world that may be for you."

— Mark Goldstein, Where Do Gays Retire

Episode Resource Guide: Where to Retire — International & U.S. Destinations

Companion resource to: "The Frying Pan Is Now the Fire — Where Do We Go From Here?"

Whether you are thinking about staying in the United States or exploring a life abroad, this guide brings together the most-listened-to episodes from the Where Do Gays Retire podcast archive. U.S. episodes are curated to include only states where LGBTQ+ legal protections are strong and where same-sex marriage would remain protected even in the absence of a federal ruling. All episodes are available wherever you listen to podcasts, or at wheredogaysretire.com.

PART 1: Top International Destination Episodes

These are the international episodes your fellow listeners have returned to most. Spain leads by a wide margin, appearing seven times in the top fifteen.

1. Exploring Retirement in Spain: Valencia vs. Malaga for LGBTQ Expats with Dave Piccolo, Jesus Bartoli and Steve Aronberg
2. Ajijic, Mexico: A Vibrant LGBTQ+ Haven Revisited with Steve Cross and Harold Watts
3. Sitges vs. Torremolinos, Spain With Richard Jasicki and Leo Boni
4. Malta, with Eric Tenin and Michael Salone
5. Retire in Style: Why Nice, France is the Ultimate LGBTQ Destination With Jameson Farn
6. Two Countries, One Community: LGBTQ+ Retirement Insights from Spain and Portugal with Bruce Joffe and Russ Warren
7. Athens, Greece with Steve Gantzos and Ken Cook
8. Nerja, Spain: A Mediterranean Hideaway with Richard Carnaby
9. Amsterdam, The Netherlands with Jeremy Bierbach
10. Oloron Sainte-Marie, France with Mykle Flatley
11. Don't Just Visit — Live! Americans Moving To Spain with Christopher Hughey
12. Madrid, Spain with Renato Padilla
13. From the Heart of Gran Canaria — Raquel Rojas on LGBTQ+ Life and Island Living
14. Embracing Retirement: Waldron McGinnis's Journey to Courtown, Ireland
15. Weather, Wine, and Wonder: Retirement Life in Madeira With Paul Corning and Kevin McKay

Key destinations in the archive: Spain (Valencia, Malaga, Sitges, Torremolinos, Nerja, Madrid, Gran Canaria) • Mexico (Ajijic, Puerto Vallarta, Mexico City, Oaxaca, San Miguel de Allende) • France (Nice, Oloron Sainte-Marie, Paris, Dordogne) • Portugal (Lisbon, Cascais, Algarve, Braga, Tavira, Porto, Ericeira, Madeira) • Greece, Netherlands, Malta, Ireland, Germany, Argentina, Colombia, Costa Rica, Thailand, Ecuador, Uruguay

PART 2: U.S. Episodes — States with Strong LGBTQ+ Legal Protections

These episodes cover states where same-sex marriage rights are protected at the constitutional level or through strong statutory protections — states where your rights would remain intact even if the federal picture changes.

⭐ Note: Nevada has the strongest constitutional protection of any state — marriage equality is positively enshrined in its state constitution. A Nevada episode is not yet in the archive!

———

CONSTITUTIONAL PROTECTION STATES

California — Right to marry enshrined as a fundamental right in the state constitution (2024)

• Inside Living Out: The LGBTQ Community That Feels Like Family — With Loren Ostrow
• Finding Your Gay Retirement Paradise: Fountain Grove Lodge with Chuck Finch & Ed Cambron
• Palm Springs, CA with Robyn Meltzer and Susan Brennan
• Cathedral City, California With Keith Coleman
• Sacramento, California with Greg Wine
• San Diego With Stephen Keiley

New Mexico — State constitution requires marriage equality (Griego v. Oliver, 2013); codified by unanimous legislative vote (2019)

• Albuquerque, New Mexico with Pamm Meyers
• Choosing Your Desert Oasis: Albuquerque, NM vs. Tucson, AZ for LGBTQ+ Retirees with Pamm Meyers and Jeff Schuchart
• Las Cruces, New Mexico with Michael Stracener
• Santa Fe, New Mexico With Perry MacKrill

New York — Equal protection enshrined in state constitution (2024); marriage equality since 2011

• Ithaca, New York with Kurt Becker
• Syracuse, New York With Scott Hier

Colorado — Constitutional ban removed by voters (2024); inclusive statutory definition enacted (2025)

• Fort Collins Snapshot: A Vibrant Life for LGBTQ+ Retirees — City Snapshot Series with Mark Goldstein
• Finding Home in Fort Collins: LGBTQ+ Retirement with Patty and Pat

Hawaii — Constitutional ban removed by voters (2024)

• Hilo, Hawaii with Richard Ostreicher and Bob Sleasman

———

STRONG STATUTORY PROTECTION STATES

No dormant ban — strong protections through legislation or court ruling

Washington State

• Discover Why Vancouver, WA is a Top Retirement Spot for LGBTQ+ Community — With Gary Beagle
• Seattle, Washington with Steven Chapman

Rhode Island

• Tim McCormick's Guide to Living Your Best Life in Providence, Rhode Island

New Jersey

• Asbury Park, New Jersey With Brent Winborn
• Lambertville, NJ and New Hope PA with Mark McNease

Maryland / DC

• Salisbury, Maryland with Mark DeLancey
• National Capital Region — DC, Maryland, Virginia with Jim Hansen

Illinois

• Chicago, Illinois With Marc Goldberg

Massachusetts — First state to legalize same-sex marriage (2004)

• Provincetown, Massachusetts With Elizabeth G. Brooke
• Falmouth, Massachusetts With Tom von Zabern

Vermont — Civil unions pioneer (2000)

• Brattleboro, Vermont With Scott Heller

Oregon

• Portland, Oregon with Paul Iarrobino

PART 3: Essential Topic Episodes

1. Living the Dream: Inside Friendship Village's LGBTQ-Friendly Community With Joe Connelly and Terry Pochert
2. Is Marriage Equality in Peril? Evan Wolfson Explains
3. Out of the Frying Pan and Into the Fire — Why the Political Climate Matters for LGBTQ+ Retirees
4. The Great Walkability Debate — Can You Retire Without a Car?
5. Where to Find Your Retirement Joy: 10 Questions to Ask! with Mark Goldstein & Michael AI

PART 4: Resources

U.S. Legal & Advocacy

• ACLU — aclu.org
• Lambda Legal — lambdalegal.org
• Freedom for All Americans — freedomforallamericans.org
• Movement Advancement Project (state-by-state tracker) — mapresearch.org

International Research

• ILGA World (global LGBTQ+ rights by country) — ilga.org
• International Living (Global Retirement Index) — internationalliving.com
• Social Security abroad — ssa.gov/international

Connect With Mark & the Community

• Facebook: Where Do Gays Retire
• Facebook: Gay Men 60 and Better (27,700+ members)
• Email: [email protected]
• Schedule a call: savvycal.com/Markscalendar
• Full episode archive: wheredogaysretire.com

"Retirement is not just about warm weather. It is about living openly, safely, and fabulously, wherever in the world that may be for you."

— Mark Goldstein, Where Do Gays Retire