The Interpreter Foundation Podcast

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When we discuss the witnesses of the Book of Mormon, we often overlook the first witness of the plates: Joseph Smith himself. What were his experiences with the plates?

This is the twenty-fourth in a series compiled from the many interviews conducted during the course of the Witnesses film project. This series of mini-films is being released each Saturday at 7pm MDT. These additional resources are hosted by Camrey Bagley Fox, who played Emma Smith in Witnesses, as she introduces and visits with a variety of experts. These individuals answer questions or address accusations against the witnesses, also helping viewers understand the context of the times in which the witnesses lived. This week we feature Daniel C. Peterson, President of the Interpreter Foundation and Executive Producer of Witnesses. For more information,

Review of Michael R. Ash, Rethinking Revelation and the Human Element in Scripture: The Prophet’s Role as Creative Co-Author (Redding, CA: FAIRLatterDaySaints.org, 2021). 770 pages. $34.95 (paperback).

Abstract: A new book by Mike Ash examines to what degree the human mind is involved in receiving revelation. Ash sums up his view by saying, “prophets have a special calling, but not a special brain.” He then spends 700+ pages describing what that means and how it works. In essence, prophets do not go into a trance-like state, put a pen in their hand, and engage in a process of automatic writing only to wake from the trance and read what has been given. Instead, Ash helps us see how God uses the brains and personality of any particular prophet to bring His word forth. God does not bypass the prophet’s humanness; rather, He relies on it to contextualize His words for a particular people in a particular time.

One might think that an author as prolific as Michael Ash might have run out of things to say by now. After all, he has produced ten books, over 160 articles in such periodicals as the Ensign, Sunstone, the FARMS Review, and Dialogue: A Journal of Mormon Thought. He has also been featured on almost 100 podcast episodes and in 30 videos. And yet his latest work, Rethinking Revelation and the Human Element in Scripture: The Prophet’s Role as Creative Co-Author, weighs in at a whopping 750+ pages. It is an impressive (and heavy) tome.

Ash’s thesis is deceptively simple: God and the prophet work together to produce scripture. He uses that thesis to thread the very tiny needle of understanding how humans have a place in God’s revelatory work without asserting that they alone create the reality. In a phone interview [Page 140]Ash was quick to say that his thesis is not to be taken as supporting the position that says, “Joseph Smith made up the Book of Mormon,” but it’s also not to be taken in support of the idea that a prophet acts like a human dictation machine either.

Why Is This Book Important?

In some ways, Ash’s book is the more academic version of his earlier work, Shaken Faith Syndrome,1 and he references that book frequently. But where Shaken Faith Syndrome attempts to catalog all the difficult issues that cause members to leave the church or investigators to be wary, this book specifically addresses those concerns that come about where human will meets God’s agenda. Ash is seeking to help believers and skeptics embrace the intersection of inspiration and intellect.

Scholars in many other parts of the Christian world have been playing with this idea for decades, but it’s a particularly tricky idea for many Latter-day Saints. It might be fine to think of the Bible as having an element of “creativity” in it because Latter-day Saints already hold some suspicion toward the Bible — it is only worthwhile as it is translated correctly. Ash demonstrates that there are two extremes which should be avoided. One is believing that since the Prophets had a role in creation of scripture that it is therefore all fiction. But the other is believing that Prophets go into some trance-like state and practice some kind of automatic writing where they channel the mind of God without those thoughts needing to be processed through their own brain and language. So, when Ash says that the Prophet has a role in co-creating scripture, he is using the word “create” to mean, “to bring into existence,” and not to mean “creative writing,” a form of fiction writing.

Literalists, Mythicalists, and Extensibilists

Ash observes that faithful members of the Church generally...

Abstract In an earlier paper, I concluded that Lehi and Nephi were highly trained Josephite scribes and were associated with an official Jerusalem scribal school that preserved ancient Manassite traditions. There they acquired advanced writing skills and classical Hebrew and Egyptian, which would become the scriptural languages of the Nephite peoples. These they maintained in the new promised land and passed on from generation to generation through the entire thousand-year Nephite dispensation, even though the Nephite language itself would naturally evolve. Evidence of how they did this surfaces repeatedly throughout the Book of Mormon. The following paper documents how both Mormon and his son Moroni abridged and concluded the religious, military, and political records of Book of Mormon peoples, thus preserving key elements of the vast Nephite records collection for a later dispensation. That scribal process parallels the roles and schools of other cultures of the ancient Near East.

The picture of Moroni. the last Nephite prophet, and his activities after the final battle which seems to prevail with contemporary readers of the Book of Mormon is both simple and straightforward. Still a relatively young man, Moroni is usually described as being completely alone, hiding from still vengeful Lamanites while working to complete his father’s abridgement of the Nephite records, which he would then hide up in the same hill where the great battle had occurred. But the ongoing accumulation of relevant scholarly discoveries about ancient scribalism and more careful readings of Moroni’s own account now invite the construction of a significantly revised and enriched description of Moroni’s last days.

As it turns out, the occasional references to the Nephite records in Mormon’s abridgement and in Nephi’s Small Plates do constitute a complete record of the transmission of the Nephite records from [Page 96]one generation to another. When we read these accounts from the perspective of ancient Near Eastern (hereafter ANE) history and record keeping, it becomes obvious that the Nephites from Nephi to Mormon maintained an official scribal school that kept detailed records of the people, the prophecies and revelations given to the prophets, and the wars and contentions with the Lamanites.

Nephite society may have been tiny in comparison to the great empires of Assyria, Hatti, Egypt, and Babylon. Consequentially, its small governing elite seemed to share the leadership responsibilities of the government administration, the military, the priesthood, and the educational and record-keeping functions of scribes that would have belonged to more specialized peoples in those great ANE empires. In Nephite society, the scribal responsibilities passed back and forth among kings, judges, prophets, and military leaders, suggesting that they were also trained scribes (as will be discussed below). The scribal responsibility always centered in the same charge: to maintain and preserve the same sets of records and other sacred objects and to educate successor generations in high literacy and in the classic languages (Egyptian and Hebrew) of the Brass Plates, their “holy scriptures.” The Nephite experience with scribal training most likely followed the documented pattern of earlier ANE societies, in that students dropped out at different training levels. Many more students achieved minimal or functional literacy than persevered to the highest levels.

The larger scribal charge was always understood in the context of the same prophecy that had been given to Nephi, Lehi, and even to Abraham. These prophets had seen in vision that in the last days the records of the Nephites would become the key tool by which the descendants of Lehi, the Gentiles, and the house of Israel would be gathered in by the Lord as they received the knowledge of the gospel originally revealed to the first Nephite prophets and tau...

David Calabro explores what he describes as the “divine handclasp” in the Hebrew Bible. The term refers to a handclasp between God and his human servant that had a place in ancient Israelite temple worship. Calabro indicates it was a ritual gesture that was part of temple rite performance with a priest acting as proxy for God in close interaction with mankind. While other scholars have suggested the gesture was indicative of deity transporting mankind to “glory,” Calabro’s research proposes the clasping of right hands while facing one another was ritually indicative of God granting access to His chosen rather than transporting him.

Presented at:

The 2012 Temple on Mount Zion ConferenceSaturday, September 22, 2012https://interpreterfoundation.org/conferences/2012-the-temple-on-mount-zion-conference/

Article Reprint:

“The Divine Handclasp in the Hebrew Bible and in Ancient Near Eastern Iconography” Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship 45 (2021): 37-52https://journal.interpreterfoundation.org/the-divine-handclasp-in-the-hebrew-bible-and-in-near-eastern-iconography/

Conference Proceedings:

Temple Insights at https://interpreterfoundation.org/books/temple-insights/

Listen to an audio recording of this talk:

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Between March 7th and October 17th in 1954, Hugh Nibley delivered a series of 30 weekly lectures on KSL Radio that were also published as pamphlets. The series called “Time Vindicates the Prophets” was given in answer to those who were challenging the right of members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints to call themselves Christians.

This lecture is a discussion of what martyrdom is and how Joseph Smith’s relates to those found throughout history.

All 30 recordings are available immediately in the Complete Bibliography for Hugh Nibley (CBHN) at https://interpreterfoundation.org/bibliographies/hugh-w-nibley/lectures/

 

This is an Interpreter Radio Roundtable for Come, Follow Me Old Testament Lesson 41, “The Redeemer Shall Come to Zion” on Isaiah 58–66. The panelists for this roundtable were Steve Densley, Mark Johnson and Matthew Bowen. This roundtable was extracted from the August 28th broadcast of Interpreter Radio. The complete show may be heard at https://interpreterfoundation.org/interpreter-radio-show-August-28-2022/. The Interpreter Radio Show can be heard Sunday evenings from 7 to 9 PM (MDT), on K-TALK, AM 1640, or you can listen live on the Internet at ktalkmedia.com. Call in to 801-254-1640 with your questions and comments during the live show.

The Interpreter Radio Show is a weekly discussion of matters of interest to the hosts, guests, and callers of the show. The views expressed on the Interpreter Radio Show are those of the individuals involved and do not necessarily reflect the views of the Interpreter Foundation, nor should statements made on the show be construed as official doctrinal statements of the Church.

 

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Martin Harris was away from the church for many years before finally returning. Critics have tried to use the fact that he joined other denominations as something that invalidates his testimony of The Book of Mormon. What’s the real story here?

This is the twenty-third in a series compiled from the many interviews conducted during the course of the Witnesses film project. This series of mini-films is being released each Saturday at 7pm MDT. These additional resources are hosted by Camrey Bagley Fox, who played Emma Smith in Witnesses, as she introduces and visits with a variety of experts. These individuals answer questions or address accusations against the witnesses, also helping viewers understand the context of the times in which the witnesses lived. This week we feature Daniel C. Peterson, President of the Interpreter Foundation and Executive Producer of Witnesses. For more information,

Review of Saints: The Story of the Church of Jesus Christ in the Latter Days: Volume 3: Boldly, Nobly, and Independent: 1893–1955 (Salt Lake City: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, 2022). 757 pages. $6.90 (paperback).

Abstract: Volume 3 of Saints is a readable and engaging narrative discussing a dynamic and transitional period of the history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. As with the previous volumes in the series, it is approachable and enjoyable for almost all reading audiences.

The Saints series has undertaken what, at face value, appears to be an almost impossible job — to tell the story of the restoration of the Gospel of Jesus Christ in a readable and engaging narrative. With each volume it naturally gets more difficult to achieve that goal because of the expanse of the unfolding chronicle.

Saints: The Story of the Church of Jesus Christ in the Latter Days: Volume 3: Boldly, Nobly, and Independent: 1893–1955 takes a number of disparate stories and deftly and delicately interweaves them into a smooth narrative discussing the history of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints in a dynamic and transitional period. The result is a beautifully interwoven fabric that includes not only corporate and elite history but also inspiring stories of common, everyday members of the church.

Among the numerous stories that help set the scene and move the history forward are those of Wilford Woodruff, Lorenzo Snow, Joseph F. Smith, Heber J. Grant, John and Leah Widtsoe, Susa Young Gates, Amy Brown Lyman, Clarissa Williams, and Zina Young. Of the common, everyday members of the church whose interesting stories also move the narrative along are Paul and Connie Bang of Cincinnati, Ohio; [Page 92]Helga Birth of Germany; Jeanne Charrier of Valence, France; the Daniels family of South Africa; Len and Mary Hope, African-American Saints in Alabama; Anna Kullick and other German expatriates residing in Argentina; Rafael Monroy of San Marcos, Mexico; the Maori Whaanga family of New Zealand and Utah; Toshiko and Tokichi Yanagida of Nagoya, Japan; and a host of others. Furthermore, as women and people of various races and ethnicities have played an important role in church history, they also play an important role in this volume.

For the most part, this volume of Saints doesn’t shy away from potentially difficult and uncomfortable topics. For example, the book discusses post-Manifesto plural marriages and the confusion this caused among some members (83–86, 106–108, 113–14); the forced resignations of apostles Matthias Cowley and John W. Taylor due to political pressure during the Reed Smoot hearings (115–16); Mexico’s Third Convention movement and estrangement from church leadership (369–70, 373, 485–88); the excommunication of Helmuth Hübener in Germany before he was executed by the Nazis (439); and George Albert Smith’s continued problems with anxiety and depression (517–19).

Despite the refreshing willingness to discuss difficult historical information, the authors still shied away from some topics. For instance, no mention is made of Fawn McKay Brodie, a niece of David O. McKay, at that time a counselor in the First Presidency, and her controversial book, No Man Knows My History.1 Despite flaws and questionable analysis, Brodie’s book is considered ground-breaking and caused a resurgence in researching and writing about Joseph Smith. Indeed, there are some who suggest her book encouraged a new approach that produced the new Latter-day Saint history which has had significant influence on historical research in the church.

Furthermore, while Richard R.

Abstract: Nephi’s writings exhibit a distinctive focus on “good” and divine “goodness,” reflecting the meaning of Nephi’s Egyptian name (derived from nfr) meaning “good,” “goodly,” “fine,” or “fair.” Beyond the inclusio playing on his own name in terms of “good” and “goodness” (1 Nephi 1:1; 2 Nephi 33:3–4, 10, 12), he uses a similar inclusio (2 Nephi 5:30–31; 25:7–8) to frame and demarcate a smaller portion of his personal record in which he incorporated a substantial portion of the prophecies of Isaiah (2 Nephi 6–24). This smaller inclusio frames the Isaianic material as having been incorporated into Nephi’s “good” writings on the small plates with an express purpose: the present and future “good” of his and his brothers’ descendants down to the latter days.

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The terms “good”1 (or “goodly”)2 and “goodness”3 recur with sufficient frequency within Nephi’s writings as to constitute a key term therein. While admittedly not all these instances bear the same thematic weight, some have clear, specific contextual connections to Nephi himself, his people, his writings, or to all three. Of these, several appear to have special significance because of their placement within the structure of Nephi’s writings.

The two books of Nephi on Nephi’s small plates begin and end with wordplay on the name Nephi4 (Egyptian nfr5 = “good, fine, goodly” in addition to “beautiful, fair”)6 in terms of “good” and God’s “goodness.” See 1 Nephi 1:1, which contains the terms “goodly” and “goodness,” and 2 Nephi 33:4, 10, 12, which contain the terms “good” and “goodness.” This onomastic wordplay creates an inclusio — a bracketing or ...

In this essay John Gee draws a connection between the Egyptian “Book of the Temple” and the book of Exodus, both in structure and topic, describing the temple from the inside out. Gee concludes that both probably go back to a common source older than either of them.

Presented at:

The 2012 Temple on Mount Zion ConferenceSaturday, September 22, 2012https://interpreterfoundation.org/conferences/2012-the-temple-on-mount-zion-conference/

Article Reprint:

“Edfu and Exodus” Interpreter: A Journal of Latter-day Saint Faith and Scholarship 44 (2021): 271-286https://journal.interpreterfoundation.org/edfu-and-exodus/

Conference Proceedings:

Temple Insights at https://interpreterfoundation.org/books/temple-insights/

Listen to an audio recording of this talk:

Download PDF

  Download audio recording