The John Batchelor Show

The Fragility of the Union and the Dismantling of the Republic. Guests in Londinium, 92 AD: Gaius and Germanicus. Reflecting on the anniversary of Gettysburg, the speakers suggest that the "sacred" unity and mission established by Lincoln and later reinforced by D-Day are being abandoned. The current leadership is depicted as "whipsawed" between a desire to be a "peace president" and the political risk of appearing defeated on the world stage. The "imperial court" in Washington is described as oblivious to the citizenry, continuing foreign adventures despite widespread domestic opposition. Ultimately, Gaius and Germanicus posit that the United States is an arbitrary construct now in the process of being "dismantled" by endless political warfare and a growing disconnect between the leadership and the people.
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The Nation in Arms and the Decline into the Imperial Model. Guests in Londinium, 92 AD: Gaius and Germanicus.The speakers contrast the historical "American way of war" with its modern imperial iteration. From the Civil Warthrough World War II, war was a "religious crusading war" requiring total national mobilization and immense sacrifice, as seen in the 600,000 dead during the Civil War—"missionary moments" intended to redeem humanity. Following the Vietnam War, Germanicus argues, the United States transitioned to an all-volunteer force effectively "owned" by the executive branch, with modern wars becoming "detached from American participation" and functioning as "performative" or elective surgeries based on the whim of the "emperor." The bond between the citizenry and the sacrifice of war, once sacred, has been severed.
1819

The Drone Contest and the Existential War in the East. Guests in Londinium, 92 AD: Gaius and Germanicus. The speakers examine the significant shift in modern warfare embodied by the "drone contest" between Russia and Ukraine. This new form of engagement has produced a fuel crisis in Russia, with reports of diesel rationing and shortages in Crimea following Ukrainian drone strikes on refineries and storage facilities. Despite these disruptions, the front lines remain relatively static, as mass drone attacks have prevented major Russian breakthroughs. Germanicus frames the conflict as an existential engagement for the Kremlin, which believes it is waging a total national effort against NATOsurrogates who supply the funding, equipment, and operational data sustaining the war.
1890 BRUSSELS

Mortality and the RAGE OF ACHILLES. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The conclusion of the Iliad explores the resolution of Achilles' rage following the death of Hector. Initially, Achilles attempts to prolong Hector's humiliation by dragging his body behind a chariot and refusing to allow a proper burial. However, the funeral games for Patroclus mark a shift toward maturity, as Achilles provides a space for competition that does not end in death. He even shows a degree of grace—or perhaps a subtle insult—by awarding Agamemnon a prize without a contest. The poem finishes with a humanitarian pause that allows the Trojans to bury Hector, bookending the story with funerals. The final voices are those of mourning women, emphasizing the shared human experience of grief and the inevitable suffering that follows war. Wilson concludes that the Iliad is fundamentally about the struggle to accept mortality, a theme that has provided comfort and insight to readers for over 2,700 years. 8

The Fall of Patroclus and the Killing Machine. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The turning point of the epic occurs when Patroclus enters the battle wearing Achilles' armor to deceive the Trojans and save the Greek ships. Ignoring Achilles' warning to return quickly, Patroclus is driven by a desire for honor and continues his assault until he is stripped of his armor by Apollo and killed by Hector. This loss transforms Achilles into a terrifying "killing machine" who returns to the field for vengeance. Before re-entering the fray, his mother Thetis secures new magical armor from Hephaestus, the "tech god" of fire who works with robotic assistants. Achilles' subsequent rampage is so brutal that he violates human norms by killing unarmed suppliants and clogging the river Xanthus with so many corpses that the river god himself rises in protest. The narrative reaches its climax as Hector faces Achilles alone outside the city walls. The poem suggests that without proper burial, a spirit or psyche is doomed to wander, as seen when the spirit of Patroclus visits Achilles to plead for his funeral rites. 7
1890

The Gore of Battle and the Sanctity of the Dead. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The Iliad features vivid and gory battle scenes that Wilson rendered by consulting with combat veterans to understand the visceral nature of death. Homeremphasizes the specific details of how each man dies, often juxtaposing the brutality of a spear through an eyeball with beautiful similes from the natural world. A major theme is the treatment of the dead; the poem views the corpse as the person, requiring those who loved the warrior to wash, wrap, and lament him. Entire books are dedicated to the struggle of reclaiming a fallen comrade's body, as desecrating a corpse is seen as the ultimate victory over an enemy. Stripping the armor from a victim serves as both an economic prize and a symbol of total dominance. While the gods like Poseidon and Hera intervene to support the Greeks, they also remain distinct from mortals by "bleeding" a substance called ichor. These divine and human elements culminate in the pivotal death of Patroclus, which shifts the direction of the entire war. 6

The Plot Begins: Rage and Divine Bargains. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The plot of the Iliad is ignited by a clash of egos between Agamemnon and Achilles. When Agamemnon is forced to return his own war prize to appease Apollo, he seizes Achilles' enslaved woman, Briseis, to recoup his lost face. This action causes Achilles to withdraw from the fighting, perversely restoring his honor by demonstrating how much the Greeks suffer without him. This human conflict is mirrored by divine bargaining; for instance, Hera is so intent on destroying Troy that she offers to let Zeus destroy three of her own beloved cities, including Sparta, in exchange for his cooperation. The Greek audience would have recognized the historical weight of these fallen cities. Wilson interprets Agamemnon not as a simple villain, but as a weak and struggling leader who often blames his poor decisions on divine delusion rather than taking personal responsibility. Despite his flaws, the poem illustrates the immense difficulty of maintaining power and making decisions under the influence of manipulative gods. 5

Goddesses, Trophies, and the Bond of Achilles. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The gods in the Iliad often represent extreme human instincts, such as Aphrodite representing lust and Ares representing aggression. These deities are sometimes depicted as ridiculous because they flee the battlefield when wounded, whereas mortals must face their pain heroically. Within the Greek camp, the social structure is built around honor and "trophies," specifically enslaved women like Briseis, who are parceled out after military victories. While Briseis has a limited voice, she is shown to have a kind relationship with Patroclus, who is described as a multi-faceted character capable of both great kindness and brutal violence. Patroclus is not a "beta male" but a skilled warrior who mocks his victims as he kills them. The bond between Achilles and Patroclus is the most intimate and emotionally vulnerable relationship in the poem. Achilles' awareness of his own impending death and the violation of his honor by Agamemnon creates a deep-seated rage that drives the central plot. 4
1919

Character Pairings and the Pressure of Honor. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The Iliad features vivid character relationships that function with the depth of a novel. Helen is portrayed as an ironic thinker and a storyteller who weaves the sufferings of the war into her textiles, much like the poet himself. She possesses a unique perspective on her own fate and the limited power mortals have against the whims of gods like Aphrodite. In contrast, Hector and Andromacheform a tragic pairing; Andromache's heartbreaking pleas for her husband to stay within the city walls are met with Hector's refusal, driven by the intense fear of shame and the pursuit of kleos, or undying glory. The royal couple Priamand Hecuba represent different facets of leadership and loss, with Hecuba displaying a maternal rage so fierce she wishes to eat her enemies raw. Divine figures like Thetis, Achilles' mother, add a layer of sympathy as she bargains with Zeus to grant her son glory, knowing his life will be short. However, these divine interventions often result in further horror for the mortals involved. 3
1789

The Homeric Question and Epic Tradition. Guest: Professor Emily Wilson. The identity of Homer remains a subject of intense scholarly debate, as the Iliad emerged from a long oral tradition that existed before the return of literacy to Greece in the 8th century BCE. For centuries, performing poets developed stories of heroes like Achilles and Agamemnon, using dactylic hexameter to aid memory and performance. The Iliad is a monumental written poem that takes a sophisticated approach to these familiar tales, often subverting expectations. Interestingly, it omits many "famous hits" like the Trojan Horse, the judgment of Paris, and the actual fall of Troy. Instead, it focuses on a mere month and a half of the ten-year war, centering on internal Greek conflict rather than just a battle against Trojans. Wilson notes that while she translates the work into iambic pentameter to capture its drive, the poem itself possesses the narrative complexity of a modern novel, utilizing techniques like shifting perspectives and narrator omniscience. She also mentions lost epic poems like the Cypria, which provided more backstory on Zeus's plan to reduce the human population through war. 2