John Watkins  is Co-Director with Jal Mehta & Alisa Berger, of the Deeper Learning Dozen, creating a community of practice for superintendents who are committed to the transformation of their districts. He has over thirty years experience in consulting, coaching, designing, facilitating, researching, and evaluating in school and school district improvement efforts. Jessica Forbes is a teacher at Oakland High School in the Public Health Academy, one of Oakland's oldest and most diverse comprehensive high schools. The two together bring an amazing perspective on the education system from the classroom to the highest levels of district administration. Highlights from their conversation include: what it was like re-acclimating to classroom teaching during the pandemic; how COVID continues to magnify issues that already existed in our school systems and how this moment should be used to really tackle those realities head on; why we should emphasize play and being a little "messy" in the classroom; how to better center students in the learning experience; what is needed from a district level to allow teachers the flexibility to be innovative and break from institutionalized curriculums; how to find inspiration when faced with self-doubt; a wonderful introspective on racial identity; and the valuable lessons that can be learned from a long, taxing hike! 

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