The SAF Podcast

Welcome to 2024 and we are beginning the year by taking a look back at the big developments and news from 2023 with the SAF Investor team: Al Whyte, Oscar Henderson and Fayaz Hussain.

We discuss our favourite news items from the past year like United Airline's appointment of Oscar the Grouch as Chief Trash Officer, the policy announcement from Europe with ReFuelEU and the transatlantic flights by Virgin Atlantic and Gulfstream. We also look back at some of our disappointments form the last year and highlight that although there is so much positive news coming out of the industry, there have been some very big challenges and the mountain the industry is trying to climb looms ever larger.

We talk about  the regions and pathways  to watch for 2024, our favourite offtake agreements from the past year and what we are looking forward to in 2024...the answer may or may not surprise people.

We also reference some of the fantastic conversations we have had in the last year. If you are working in the Sustainable Aviation Fuel industry and would like to be on an upcoming episode of the podcast in 2024, email us at [email protected].

SAF investor's conference is going to be running in London on the 27-28 February and if you would like to find out some more about the conference you can do so here: https://www.safinvestor.com/event/142346/saf-investor-london/

Hosts: AL Whyte, Oscar Henderson & Fayaz Hussain
Producer: Oscar Henderson

The latest episode of The SAF Podcast is this week with, Jim Lockheed, Investment Principal, JetBlue Ventures. Jim gives us an insider's perspective on the intersection of aerospace, entrepreneurship, and venture capital. From his time in the Air Force to his stint at Boeing and his foray into the world of drones, Jim's unique journey is one you wouldn't want to miss. Plus, he shares his optimism about the future of drones and VTOLs, and reveals how JetBlue Ventures scouts for groundbreaking technologies and startups in the aviation sector.

Ever wondered about the hurdles and opportunities that come with investing in sustainable technologies? We delve deep into this topic, discussing the financing gap between early-stage and project financing, the critical role of techno-economic analysis, the importance of scalability and how critical the relationship with the airline JetBlue is in making investment decisions. We also shed light on the potential of sustainable aviation fuel (SAF) to revolutionize the aviation industry and offer practical advice to scientists and entrepreneurs seeking funding for their SAF processes. We also discuss there first SAF investment, The Air Company, and what makes them special.

How do we strike a balance between financial returns and sustainability impact? Jim Lockheed shares his views on this and explains how strategic funds and partnerships can help us achieve our decarbonisation goals.

Find out more about Jim and JetBlue Ventures here: https://www.jetblueventures.com/

You can listen to our recent episode with Daniel Bloch, IATA, here: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2202964/13989712

SAF Investor London

This conference serves as a nexus for innovators, customers, financiers, regulators, suppliers, and advisors, forging partnerships that will drive change. SAF Investor London 2024 isn't a conference for debating the merits of SAF; it's about convening the dealmakers who can effect real transformation.

Join over 200 leaders in the SAF Industry for two days of stimulating debates, discussions and plenty of networking.

You can find out more about SAF Investor and our conference in London here: https://www.safinvestor.com/

Host: Al Whyte, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

 On this week's episode of The SAF Podcast  we chat with James Hygate, CEO of Firefly Green Fuels. James unveils the fascinating world of hydrothermal liquefaction technology and how it can transform sewage into bio crude and biochar, opening the gateway to a new era of sustainable aviation fuel (SAF) production.

As we navigate through the conversation, James sheds light on his background in Biofuels, including making his own refinery in his house when he was younger, Firefly's  business model that involves converting sewage sludge currently provided by  three  water utility facilities into bio crude. He also provides a sneak peek into their commercialisation timeline and the looming challenges in aligning sustainability with commercial viability.

But what good is technology and business acumen without sound policy and abundant feedstock? In our final segment, we delve into the role of policy frameworks and feedstock in the biofuels arena. From the abundance of sewage sludge and its potential as a resource, to the frustrations with policy discussions, James gives us a comprehensive view. We then switch gears to India as we discuss securing investments and offtake agreements for SAF production in this fast-growing economy. So, tune in and gear up for a deep dive into the future of SAF production.

Find out more about Firefly Green Fuels here: https://flyfirefly.uk/

Find out more about SAF Investor and our upcoming London conference in February 2024 here: https://www.safinvestor.com/event/142346/saf-investor-london/

If you enjoy this episode catch our recent discussion with Steven Fance, Cultiv8 Hemp Solutions where the benefits of Hemp as a feedstock are discussed: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2202964/13842745

Hosted and produced by: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

On the latest episode of The SAF Podcast, our editor Fayaz chats with Daniel Bloch, a SAF specialist from the International Air Transport Association (IATA).

Daniel is here to connect the dots between the crucial role of Sustainable Aviation Fuel (SAF) in achieving these targets and how his role at IATA aligns with the ambitious net-zero 2050 aspirations. In a world where the climate crisis needs immediate attention, understanding the regulatory landscape and the progress towards net-zero targets is paramount. Daniel walks us through the complexities of these long-term goals, highlighting the importance of distilling them into manageable targets and timelines.

With Daniel, we dissect how the choice of feedstock in SAF production can dramatically impact commercial dynamics, sustainability criteria, and carbon reduction numbers. We also project into the future, examining SAF production estimates for the next decade and the pivotal role of policy in spurring the transition towards sustainable aviation fuel. It's not just about today; it's about laying the groundwork for optimising carbon abatement and scaling up the SAF supply beyond 2030. Don't miss this opportunity to gain critical insights into the future of sustainable aviation!

You can find out more about IATA here: https://www.iata.org/

If you enjoyed this, check out our recent discussion with John May, Hamilton Clark here: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2202964/13335688

SAF Investor London

This conference serves as a nexus for innovators, customers, financiers, regulators, suppliers, and advisors, forging partnerships that will drive change. SAF Investor London 2024 isn't a conference for debating the merits of SAF; it's about convening the dealmakers who can effect real transformation.

Join over 200 leaders in the SAF Industry for two days of stimulating debates, discussions and plenty of networking.

You can find out more about SAF Investor and our conference in London here: https://www.safinvestor.com/

Host: Fayaz Hussain, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

Who knew that a career in retail could lead you to combatting climate change? We're joined by Andreea Moyes, Global Head of Sustainability at Air bp, who shares how she's now spearheading the charge towards sustainable aviation fuel (SAF). Listen in as she shares the industry's perspective on Co-Processing, eFuels, power to liquid technology, why Air bp has not signed any offtake agreements yet and how important strategic partnerships and policy clarity are in scaling up SAF.

Are we ready for a cleaner, greener future of aviation? Andrea gives us an insight into the complexities of SAF production and use, helping us understand how corporate partnerships and favourable policies can make SAF more affordable and accessible. She also discusses the potential of HEFA, alcohol-to-jet, for the future of SAF, the significance of goal posts and roadmaps in this endeavour, and her frustrations in the workplace. The future is here, and it's time to buckle up as we journey towards net-zero goals by 2050.

Find out more about Air bp here: https://www.bp.com/en/global/air-bp/aviation-fuel/sustainable-aviation-fuel.html

Find out more about SAF Investor and our conference in London on the 27th-28th February here: https://www.safinvestor.com/

If you like this episode, catch our recent discussion with Chris Brown, KPMG Ireland, on the realistic chance SAF has on making its targets, here: https://www.buzzsprout.com/2202964/13376452

Host: Alasdair Whyte, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

This week we pivot back to the airline and customer side of the Sustainable Aviation Fuel (SAF) with Jonathan Pardoe, Fuel Specialist with Star Alliance, the oldest global airline alliance starting back in 1997. Jonathan has a wealth of experience and knowledge about the fuelling challenges for airlines.

Topics discussed include:

00.48 - Background and how SAF adoption affects airline operations
06.25 - What can airlines do to mitigate the supply and demand imbalance to meet 2030 emissions targets.
10.42 - The biggest challenges for airlines accessing SAF
15.33 - the steps to narrowing the Jet A1 and SAF prices.
21.50 - Do customers have to foot the bill for SAF?
28.00 - The role of Asia in SAF supply.
32.10 - The market mis-match between the US and Europe and the Asian and Gulf markets.
36.40 - Could increased operating costs due to SAF put pressure on the small carriers?
41.10 - Can airlines streamline operations to mitigate increased SAF costs.

Make sure you catch this conversation about some of the most intriguing challenges that airlines face in the quest to decarbonise operations. SAF can only be the decarbonisation solution everyone believes it can be if the economics behind it don't put excessive strain on operating costs. 

Find out more about Star Alliance here: https://www.staralliance.com/en/home

Find out more about SAF Investor here: https://www.safinvestor.com/

Host: Fayaz Hussain, SAF investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

The SAF Podcast had the pleasure of speaking to one of the 'Grandfathers' of the Sustainable Aviation Fuel industry, the president and CEO of World Energy, Gene Gebolys.

World Energy was the world's first producer of SAF and has been leading the industry in the renewable fuel space for 25 years. It has set the ambitious challenge of producing 1 billion gallons of SAF by 2050.

Al and Gene have a fantastic discussion from the origins of World Energy to the importance of the book and claim system to truly unleash the economic power of SAF. Gene highlights that integrity on the buy side of the market is critical, and that the industry only has one chance to get this right.

Some topics discussed in the episode:

00.52 - The origins of World Energy
09.35 - Book and Claim - decoupling the SAF service form the SAF molecule
13.40 - The deals with Microsoft and DHL
15.10 - The importance of getting it right
21.10 - The EU and Book and Claim
24.40 - Biodiesel for ground transport and shifting to SAF production
28.00 - A commercialisation business not a technology business
31.20 - Where does the capital come from
39.06 - Keeping the drive on attacking the status quo

This is an amazing conversation and really highlights the SAF industry's need for efficiency if it is to achieve all of its targets. 

Find out more about World Energy here: https://www.worldenergy.net/

Find out more about SAF investor, including our conference in London. 27th-28th February 2024., here: https://www.safinvestor.com/

If you like this episode, catch our recent discussion with Matteo Mirolo, Transport and Environment, where he gives a an equally interesting discussion on the requirement for Book and Claim integrity, from a European perspective. Watch here.

Host: Alasdair Whyte, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

The SAF Podcast turns back to producers this week with Steven Fance , CEO and CTO, Cultiv8 Hemp Solutions, who has a great conversation with SAF Investor editor, Fayaz Hussain. Hemp is already being used across various industries from textile, construction and the automotive industry and have a great potential to play a key role in global decarbonisation efforts. 

Culti8 Hemp Solutions are using it as a Sustainable Aviation Fuel (SAF) feedstock and for Direct Air Capture (DAC) as Hemp bricks. They currently have a small scale project in Lake Charles, Louisiana and are confident that Hemp is a "superior feedstock" to other biomass solutions.

Some of the things discussed in this episode include:

01.00 - Steven's background and founding Cultiv8 Hemp Solutions.
05.00 - Operations and technological readiness of Cultiv8
07.03 - How much SAF demand can hemp fulfil?
12.00 - Where is the Hemp grown for production
14.07 - How much will SAF made from Hemp cost?
16.20 - Modular refinery approach
18.20 - The benefits of a virtual powerplant
21.15 - Planned expansion into Europe

It is exciting to see where SAF produced from Hemp can go and its potential to add another string the the SAF bow as production pathways and commercialisation develop.

Find out more about Cultiv8 Hemp Solutions here.

Found out more about SAF Investor here.

Host: Fayaz Hussain, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

In our latest episode of The SAF Podcast Al sits down with Jonathon Counsell, group head of sustainability, International Airlines Group (IAG), the parent company of British Airways, Iberia, Vueling and Aer Lingus. Jonathon is one of the longest serving airline sustainability heads globally and he shares his thoughts on the role airlines play in signalling demand to investors and how he is firm in the belief that everything (pathways and feedstocks) is needed to meet SAF demand. 

Some of the topics discussed are: 

1:03 How Jonathon ended up at IAG

5:24 Sustainability was a lonely place to be post the financial crisis

7:10 Will the environment be taken off the agenda again?

11:00 How is the SAF industry of 2002 different to today?

16:46 Are agreements securing supply or helping projects get off the ground?

19:40 IAG SAF investments to date

23:50 Fuel buyers watching margins versus SAF prices

26:40 Price tapping mechanisms

28:40 Dealing with politicians

34:00 Confidence in meeting IAG SAF targets

35:30 Hitting 2050 targets: In sector versus out of sector

37:00 Do customers care about SAF?

This is a great episode showing what leading global airlines are doing to meet their sustainability obligations and why Jonathon thinks this is a very rewarding sector and would recommend it to anyone.

You can find out more about IAG here.

Find out more about SAF Investor here.

If you like this episode catch our previous episode with Patrick Edmond, Altair Advisory here.

Host: Alasdair Whyte, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor

This weeks The SAF Podcast episode sees Al sit down with Pablo Fexer, Managing Director, 360 Jet Fuel.

Pablo has a really interesting background, first encountering Sustainable Aviation Fuel during his time at OMV. Now at 360 Jet Fuel he advises business jet operators and airlines on SAF, including a couple of airline equity investments. Pablo discusses many critical issues including:

1.20 - Background to 360 Jet Fuel
5.50 - What do offtake agreements look like?
11.20 - Will there be a cost of carbon?
15.20 - Why do some producers give 100% of a project's production to one airline?
17.40 - Will SAF be commoditised?
22.00 - Are smaller and regional airlines at risk of being marginalised from supply?
25.00 - What questions should investors ask about offtake agreements
28.05 - Would  SAF Futures help stabilise market costs?
32.00 - Advice to producers trying to find an offtake agreement
33.00 - Are agreements outstripping demand?

If you would like to find out more about 360 Jet Fuel you can here: https://www.360jetfuel.com/

Find out more about SAF Investor and the SAF Investor London conference here: https://www.safinvestor.com/

If you enjoyed this episode catch our previous discussion with Patrick Edmond, Altair Advisory here.

Host: Alasdair Whyte, SAF Investor
Producer: Oscar Henderson, SAF Investor