In this episode, Professor Tim Willasey-Wilsey, Visiting Professor at the Department of War Studies, joins Dr Huw Dylan, Reader in Intelligence Studies and International Security, to delve into Tim’s new book, The Spy and the Devil: The Untold Story of the MI6 Agent Who Penetrated Hitler’s Inner Circle. They discuss the remarkable story of Baron William de Ropp—MI6’s key source inside Nazi Germany in the 1930s.

Tim shares how de Ropp, a little-known Baltic German aristocrat, became responsible for over 70% of British intelligence reporting on Nazi Germany before World War II. Fluent in four languages and able to move through elite German circles undetected, de Ropp developed close ties with senior Nazis like Alfred Rosenberg—and even secured face time with Adolf Hitler himself.

Tim and Huw explore how de Ropp’s intelligence work marked a turning point for MI6, transforming it from a low-level, tactical service into a strategic intelligence agency. They also explore the risks of improvisational espionage, the moral ambiguities of cultivating Nazi contacts, and how the agency learned—often painfully—how to run a new kind of agent.