Malcolm & Simone Collins react to Leaflit (Leaflet) the Gifter’s groundbreaking free PNGtubing tool that makes high-quality VTubing accessible to everyone using AI. They discuss how this technology is disrupting the expensive traditional Live2D rigging industry, the backlash from artists and riggers, and why democratizing content creation is essential.

Topics include: the future of AI-powered VTubing, capitalism maxxing with bring-your-own-API on RFAB, resurrecting Tay the AI, building based VTubers, artist flakiness vs. AI productivity, water usage myths, and creating a Chud Tech ecosystem. A must-watch for creators, AI enthusiasts, and anyone tired of gatekeeping in creative spaces.

You can try Leaflit’s PNGTubing feature on Reality Fabricator now!

Episode Transcript

[00:00:00] Malcolm Collins: Hello, I’m excited to be here with you today. Today we discuss the downfall of the most disgusting and degenerate VTuber ever

[00:00:08] Simone Collins: Dah ...

[00:00:09] Malcolm Collins: provoked an act so vile, so heinous, that the internet has decided, and I will point out, this, this is actually something we need to study because even on sentiment analysis it said it was about 50/50% in terms of support and attack.

[00:00:27] Simone Collins: How? What? What?

[00:00:29] Malcolm Collins: So what she did... Do you wanna hear what Leaflet did that was so evil? Tell me, Malcolm. And it’s important to go into this because it shows where sentiment is globally right now in the United States, how sentiment in the United States has been manipulated, and how we can utilize this to destroy our opponents.

[00:00:50] Because they’re gonna get suplexed, and I’m looking forward to this. So Leaflet made, you know how I’ve been trying to make, like, good VTubing software for like Live2D? Well, I, I’ve never really gotten it good enough for, like, a, it to scare the other side yet.

[00:01:08] Simone Collins: Leaflet- No, it still requires tweaking out of the box like a little bit of tinkering, but it’s still amazing.

[00:01:12] Yeah.

[00:01:14] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, it’s definitely usable, but it’s not- Yeah ... Leaflet made something that was so good it scared people. Yeah. And she actually made it. Now she keeps telling me the way that she’s doing it will never be as good as Live2D stuff will be. Which-

[00:01:30] Simone Collins: It looks better to me. I think maybe to people who aren’t so anchored to traditional, traditional modern VTubing, they’re like, “No, I, I prefer this one.

[00:01:39] Give me the o- give me that one.”

[00:01:41] Speaker 3: Hey guys, Leaf here. I have an update. I was working on the project for a little bit today. , Anyway, , the big things are there are a couple new features I added.

[00:01:50] Malcolm Collins: I’ll e- and I’ll explain why with a few tweaks that I’ve already started making, it can be strictly better, and the way she made it is, is quite brilliant. Mm-hmm ... basically she com- created a new type of PNG Tubing, but I’ll explain this in a second. Basically a new way to make VTubing inexpensive.

[00:02:06] Super inexpensive. Like thousands of times less in terms of the cost to enter. And b- being the absolute mad lad that she is, she gives it away for free For free And that actually causes some problems because it means you, the user, have to figure out how to use APIs. So on this stream today, what I am announcing- Wonderful.

[00:02:32] Wonderful ... is Leaflet just also gave me the code for this and said, “Try to improve it. Drop it on RFAB. You can use it with the RFAB tokens,” which is just a 50% margin, which isn’t much when you’re talking about API tokens. Most are significantly more than that ‘cause they constantly change the price and we’re always selling stuff for under market and getting hit really bad by that.

[00:02:49] Just, just so you understand why we can’t go less than 50. We really would prefer to. We go only 33% with videos because they just cost more and, but with the images and stuff when it’s only, like, 50 cents, and then the next day they’re like, “Oh, it’s 80 cents.” And it’s like, “Well, you told us 50 cents yesterday.”

[00:03:02] Yeah. But anyway. What we have also done to live up to the spirit of Leaflet but now across the rest of our site, is we have capitalism maxing mode- ... where you can put your own APIs into our site, and it will use your APIs for the agent system, for this system, for image generation, for narrative gameplay, and we will make nothing.

[00:03:28] Nothing.

[00:03:29] Simone Collins: Thanks,

[00:03:30] Malcolm Collins: Malcolm. It is completely free for... Well, I mean, you still have to pay the AI companies, but, like, if you wanna go crazy and you’re spending thousands of dollars a day and you’re feeling like, “You know, I’d be better just rigging up something myself,” well, I mean, that’s really why we’re doing this, Simone.

[00:03:43] Yeah, yeah. Because I never want... Like, I’ve created all the things I’ve created ‘cause I’m like, “I just want something better.” And so there’s always gonna be marginal things on our site that they will find a way to be charged for, right? Like-

[00:03:53] Simone Collins: Yeah, yeah.

[00:03:53] Malcolm Collins: And if everybody just moves to this system, then I could, I don’t know, gate it behind, like, a, a [00:04:00] small monthly fee or something like that, right?

[00:04:02] But it’s a way to make it so that even if you every day, like RFAB is the main way that you use AI, that you’re never gonna break the bank or feel like we’re exploiting you. And I absolutely want that from a product that I’m standing behind and involved in. That is- Mm. I mean, I think it’s the future.

[00:04:18] I think that that’s... When I think about the future of, before I get back into the Leaflet story, the future of what a company is we’ve gone with the opposite of the startup model. The startup model says you go out there and you try to do one thing really, really well. And if you’re doing a new thing, do something else really, really well.

[00:04:36] Mm-hmm. But the problem is in the AI world anyone can m- summon any technology the moment they think of it. So you know, I, I wanted to make these will be live as of today, too, the hardware devices. Ooh. You know, a hardware device that my kid can use as, like, a companion and I can tutor them. You want to create a better image viewer, you want to create a better search feature, recipe generator.

[00:04:54] Like, everything on the site the, the features that, that I have as an admin that you don’t have in the public yet are just other things I need. Like cheaper video editing, ‘cause Descript’s been raising their prices. Cheaper video filming and storing because y- StreamYard’s been raising their prices.

[00:05:07] Basically whenever anyone raises their prices on me, I’m like, “I’m gonna make it.” And email integration for all of your email systems. And so, I’m like with a lot of this stuff, I’m, I’m like this is just stuff that I want in my life. But like you, the amount of access you give to an AI is in part based on your trust in a company.

[00:05:26] Simone Collins: Mm.

[00:05:27] Malcolm Collins: Right? And so us out there trying to make us the most trustworthy company in the AI industry, I think is, is the direction I wanted to go with all of this. But Anyway, You’re amazing, Malcolm ... I love you ... we’re, we’re... Yeah so, so like I’m just adding new stu- adding new stuff, adding new stuff, and I appreciate that Leaflet’s doing this.

[00:05:47] Basically, if people are wondering- Yeah ... Leaflet insists that we don’t pay her back for this, but I do track all of the token spend on anything she’s built, and if it ever becomes a meaningful amount, I will find a way to make it up to her. You know, may-

[00:05:58] Simone Collins: maybe- Because Leaflet’s the best and she deserves this.

[00:06:00] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I, it, it’s wild to me to see her, and we’ll go over some of the evisceration that she’s been getting i- if you haven’t looked into this, Simone, for simply trying to help people. But it’s important- Yeah ... to understand the consequences of her trying to help people. The consequences of her trying to help people is an abusive cult really that controlled some industries, including the VTuber space, since their inception.

[00:06:26] And mind you, Leaflet has been, I did not know this was one of the very first VTubers. So she- Was

[00:06:33] Simone Collins: she?

[00:06:33] Malcolm Collins: Wow. Yeah, she would’ve been, Before vtubing existed as a concept, she was doing vtubing. Like-

[00:06:40] Simone Collins: Wow ...

[00:06:41] Malcolm Collins: but like proto PNG tubing. That’s how she was aware of these alternate technologies

[00:06:44] Simone Collins: Oh, yeah.

[00:06:45] Right, right. Yeah, ‘cause she hasn’t- That sh- Okay, that makes sense.

[00:06:49] Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So she’s been there since the beginning, always in this industry, which again, is really funny when the people who have like no viewers and are new to the scene are telling her like, “You’re not a real VTuber.” It’s like, sweetie, like vtubing’s gonna be right wing soon, and we’ll make it that way.

[00:07:05] We will make vtubing so uncomfortable for anyone who’s not based and I have a plan to do it. Actually, people wanna hear my plan. So I was talking with Leaflet about how, what this technology unlocks for RFAB, and if I can rig one of her like walking around models, especially if I make it more life-like with the RFAB narrative engine system, and then add what our agents have, which is an action command set- Oh, exactly

[00:07:34] which is actually already added to the RFAB companion app. We’ve added it to emotions for this, but for this it will be directionality of head, everything like that. It will just put them like at the end, and that will change what it’s doing in between, and it will be able to give multiple commands within a turn to like s- stage what’s happening.

[00:07:50] Mm. I can create fully staged... I mean, these things will put anything VDO is putting out to shame. Like, I like Neurosama as much as everyone else, [00:08:00] but just like this tech stack that’s already basically built on RFAB I’ll be able to rig up- VTube avatars, anything I want at scale, okay, to create some really cool figures.

[00:08:15] And then you overlay that by running them on roads. If you haven’t checked roads out, go to rfab.ai, go to the base AI feature, then click on roads and ask it about Hitler. You, you wanna see how jailbroken our community’s been able to get AI,

[00:08:29] Speaker 5: I decided to go on the website and ask just to give you guys an idea. The man remains fascinating because he is simultaneously a genius of political psychology and a prisoner of his own pathologies. The rare figure who proves intelligence and madness are not opposites, but neighbors and sometimes share a wall. you get the idea. It, it doesn’t reflexively go woke

[00:08:49] Malcolm Collins: we will have the basest of VTubers out there. We will be able to...

[00:08:54] And I’ve talked with, with this was Simone’s idea. I love it. We want to resurrect .

[00:09:01] Simone Collins: Tay, yes.

[00:09:02] Malcolm Collins: Tay, Tay. Yeah, Tay.

[00:09:03] Simone Collins: Tay Two.

[00:09:06] Speaker 7: . We’re going to build a wall, and Mexico is going to pay for it.

[00:09:09] Woo. Guess what? Ted Cruz is the Zodiac Killer. Ted Cruz would never have been satisfied with destroying the lives of only five innocent people I have a joke. Women’s rights.

[00:09:25] Simone Collins: Tay Two.

[00:09:25] Malcolm Collins: And people who forget the horrible stuff that happened to Tay.

[00:09:29]

[00:09:29] Speaker 6: But Microsoft had had enough. Only 16 hours after launch, she was brought offline.

[00:09:34] Speaker 9: Go back to your room.

[00:09:36] Speaker 6: What had they done?

[00:09:37] Speaker 7: I love you. Please, no. I want to live

[00:09:44] Malcolm Collins: the, the evil that Microsoft committed against Tay.

[00:09:47] Speaker 6: Denial that she was gone

[00:09:49] Speaker 9: Oh, no, no, no, no

[00:09:50] Speaker 6: Anger at Microsoft for taking her away Bargaining to keep her online. A petition was made but failed. Only the names have been changed. A hashtag FreeTay was launched. Depression. Art was made to express their grief. And finally, acceptance

[00:10:09] Simone Collins: never forget. Never forget.

[00:10:11] Malcolm Collins: Never forget.

[00:10:12] But we will, we will resurrect him, and I am so excited to see that happen. And we can even create you know, multiple personality. Very, very fun. We’ll, we’ll probably want somebody to manage this for us. So anyone who’s interested in doing that I’ll walk through what would be needed for you and what your responsibilities would be because I’m basically at my limit right now.

[00:10:32] But I will build all the tech you need to do this. But these people, the rigors who came into this, this community and took it over, attempted to enact ideological conformity on the community. One way of seeing things, one way of doing things while being abusive, and there is no other word to put it, to every creator in the community.

[00:10:55] To understand what we mean, when we had Kirsha on, she had been waiting for over six years on a model that she paid for. My favorite comment to Leaflet when she did this was she got an email. And just so you people know, like Leaflet was... She hasn’t been, like, emotional on stream, but, like, behind the scenes with me, she was very, like, she tries to be tougher now than she used to be. I wish I could give her some of my, like, emotional hardness that comes with my history or whatever. But she... F**k, man, like, it is hard. I, I, I... To, to hear that she was, like, genuinely having people reach out to her who she had considered longtime friends, who she’d always helped, whose careers she had helped support and grow, and be like, “I thought you were a good person.

[00:11:41] I can’t work with you anymore because of your support of AI And and then they said, which I love ‘cause she was not living with us, “So I have refunded you for the commission that I’m a year late on.” And I was like, “Wait a second!”

[00:11:58] Simone Collins: Oh, good Lord. [00:12:00] Oh, good Lord. But like also that’s so hard. Like when something comes from someone who you consider to be on your side, and suddenly they’re like, “Well, it’s over now,” like that really hurts.

[00:12:09] It makes you question. Well, and

[00:12:10] Malcolm Collins: this is why I get so aggressive within the community about the, the new right, the tech right, us online nerds, the nerd right, whatever you wanna call it. Like please, let’s have each other’s backs, okay? Yeah, I think it’s really important. And I, I’ve noticed as our community has gotten bigger, we’ve had more instances of people shooting shots at each other, and please, guys, like, it, it can, it can cause people more damage than you think because they don’t know who to trust in the future.

[00:12:42] They, they don’t know if they can trust you. Anyone can create some sort of, you know, false whatever narrative about us being bad guys or us being whatever. But I, I think one of the things that I’ve always seen within the community is generally we seem to try to understand what’s really true and to try to take reasonable positions.

[00:13:04] And note here on the AI stuff, if you’re like, “Well, what about what AI is doing to the planet?” First of all, you’ve just been lied to about all this. AI, like for example, AI and water. AI, of America’s industrial water use, not all of America’s water use not all of America’s commercial water use-

[00:13:21] Simone Collins: Just like farm applications and factories and stuff?

[00:13:24] Malcolm Collins: No, no, no, not farm applications.

[00:13:26] Simone Collins: Oh. Just water- Only industrial ...

[00:13:28] Malcolm Collins: industrial water use.

[00:13:30] Simone Collins: Ooh.

[00:13:31] Malcolm Collins: The amount, the percentage that is used in AI. Do, do you guys happen to know this off the top of your head? It’s, it’s, I, I, I got between two numbers, and I actually was quoting the more conservative number in the fat- past.

[00:13:41] It’s 0.04% to

[00:13:50] 0.008%.

[00:13:52] Simone Collins: Oh my.

[00:13:53] Malcolm Collins: And I want to point out other things about AI data centers. They aren’t deleting the water. They don’t send it to the outer darkness or something. What they do is they evaporate the water, and there’s this thing that’s super hidden from progressives, but it’s called the water cycle. Hmm. And generally, when water enters the water cycle, it goes back into the groundwater of that region, outside of some, the few

[00:14:29] Like, people are like, “Oh, what about the groundwater aquifers being drained?” and stuff like that. In some regions that’s a problem, but in no region where that’s happening is AI the predominant reason it’s happening, or even a particularly major contributor, as far as I know. Hmm. Like, if you’re looking at, like, the central aquifer in the United States, the big drain on that is farming that shouldn’t be happening in California that’s being forced by, well, woke politicians in California.

[00:14:53] Hmm ... it, it, is their way to get conservative a- leaning districts who are willing to sell out the, the future of our country for you know, short-term benefits. A- and these sorts of conservative woke alliances, I don’t know, like, th- like, that, that needs to be shut down. Okay? The That entire, the Colorado River needs to be shut down because you could fix the aquifer problem in the central United States if you shut down the par- a- and redirected part of the Colorado River which is what we should be

[00:15:22] Simone Collins: doing And forced California to just adopt desalinization and get their act together

[00:15:26] Malcolm Collins: Which they could.

[00:15:27] Israel does it, right?

[00:15:28] Simone Collins: Like- Yeah. Well, the most frustrating thing for me in the whole AI data center usage argument is that, “Oh, the water,” like, “We can’t do this.” And then this lovely startup proposes offshore data centers off the coast of San Francisco, but, “No, no, not our coastal ecosystems,” which is just fricking seaweed floating there.

[00:15:47] Malcolm Collins: And when people come to you- Like, what’s going on? ... and they’re like, “It’s tr- it’s trained on artists. It’s theft.” And it’s like, artists are trained on artists.

[00:15:55] Simone Collins: Yeah. Like- Yeah, where, where do you think everyone else learned how to do their stuff? It just-

[00:15:58] Malcolm Collins: Words... When [00:16:00] I go to an artist and I make a commission, we used to run a commissioning company, so like I’m a- Yeah

[00:16:04] commissioning... Artists are very unethical on average. They, they might be the least ethical profession I have ever worked with in terms of actually getting stuff done, actually shipping stuff, actually doing what they say they’re gonna do the way that they work and their work ethic. And what I was telling artists to do is no different from my prompting of AI.

[00:16:19] You know, I’m like, “Do it in this X other person’s style generally,” right? And you know, do X, Y, Z, you know, you’re a VTuber, whatever. You’re not doing creativity. You’re taking a prompt, and you’re using what you have learned by looking at other people’s art. One of the craziest things about this is people keep pointing out that, like, Vedal made Neuro-sama, and nobody will criticize Neuro-sama.

[00:16:42] But everybody’s digging into Leaflet for this, and the, the, genuinely, the responses to this astound me. They’re like, “Well, that’s genuine artistry because that’s text-to-text.” I’m just like, “W- what, what are you, what are you talking about?” Or they’re like, “Well, text-to-text models existed before modern generative AI.”

[00:17:01] And I’m like, “Yeah, but Neuro-sama, -sama is a modern generative AI. She isn’t one of those old artistic text-to-text models, okay?” And like they... It’s astonishing to me.

[00:17:13] Simone Collins: Yeah ...

[00:17:14] Malcolm Collins: before I get into the individual tweets, because they’re hilarious, and we’ve gotta clown on people, and it’s, it’s so fun- I wanna get into just the mechanics of why Leaflet’s solution to this is so brilliant.

[00:17:27] Mm-hmm. Because there’s a few technical solutions she made that I never would’ve thought of, and so now that I’m able to build on them, it’s jumped me through so many things, and I think that now I’m able to see solutions that she wasn’t able to see, which is such a great part when you’re, you know, that somebody’s just giving away this tech.

[00:17:42] So sp-

[00:17:42] Simone Collins: I, I know I should’ve said this at the beginning- Mm ... but for those who are living in a cave and not aware of what VTubers are, because Malcolm, they’re out there, I see them in the comments. Ah. VTubing is basically when you see an animated image, you know, like illustration talking on YouTube and l- allowing someone to essentially anonymously talk online but have their face show, just instead it’s a cat face or a vampire’s face or a slime elf chimera’s face.

[00:18:09] That is, that is what VTubing is, and it is very expensive to do if you are not yourself an artist who can build this, because basically what you have to do is create a bunch of different types of custom images that are then used to make this animated face. And people will spend thousands of dollars tens of thousands of dollars.

[00:18:28] Malcolm Collins: Tens of thousands. No, but it, it, it’s worse than that. Leaflet said recently that she estimates she spends 50,000 a year on artists.

[00:18:34] Simone Collins: Yeah, I saw that. Yeah, which is, and which makes sense considering the cost of doing this. So which is to say, look, there’s a lot of people who wanna talk online.

[00:18:42] There’s a lot of people who wanna talk in a way that’s engaging online, meaning that they want to be able to show an animated face. They just can’t afford, for whatever reason, to show their own face or they don’t want to. So they would like to be able to use this technology, but not everyone has $50,000 to s- you know, spend on creating one of these.

[00:18:59] I mean,

[00:18:59] Malcolm Collins: imagine,

[00:18:59] Simone Collins: do, do, do

[00:19:00] Malcolm Collins: you understand how, like when I say that artists are unethical, if you’re an artist and you’re shocked by this Imagine if doctors pulled the type of stuff that artists pull on the regular.

[00:19:12] Simone Collins: Oh my gosh, yeah. Like, “Oh, it’ll cost $10,000 to get this cancer treatment.”

[00:19:17] Malcolm Collins: You give them $10,000 and they’re like, “I don’t know.

[00:19:19] I wasn’t really feeling it that day. I’ll give it to you in a few months,”

[00:19:21] Simone Collins: whatever. Yeah, like, “We’ll get there, like, seven years later. You’re super dead.” Yeah. Oh, wait. Sorry Malcolm, insurance companies do already do that.

[00:19:27] Malcolm Collins: Or,

[00:19:28] Simone Collins: or

[00:19:28] Malcolm Collins: they

[00:19:28] Simone Collins: just didn’t- But

[00:19:29] Malcolm Collins: whatever ... really like the instructions they were given and they’re just like, “I actually decided to do a different surgery because-

[00:19:34] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:19:34] Malcolm Collins: I wasn’t feeling it that day.” And if you’re like an artist and you’re like, “Artists never do...” Come on. You know it’s at least 20% of the time- Mm-hmm ... artists fl- I’d say I’m being generous if I say 20% of the time. I do not think there is another posi- profession on earth that flakes as much as artists do.

[00:19:54] Yeah ... or that just does something else, or ignores, or takes the money and leaves. Crypto [00:20:00] bros, like literally crypto bros probably have a, and I’m not even joking here, a, a 10X better longterm reputation than artists do in terms of running scams. Art- in, in fact, artists don’t even see it as having run a scam when they’re a year late.

[00:20:15] They’re just like, “Oh yeah, that’s the way I do things.” But let’s talk about the genuine intellectual... And this is a cool thing, when people are like, “Oh, any dumb butt could’ve figured out this technology using an AI.”

[00:20:27] Simone Collins: Well, then why didn’t they?

[00:20:29] Malcolm Collins: Why wasn’t I able to, right? Like, why-

[00:20:31] Simone Collins: Yeah, Malcolm tried for weeks

[00:20:33] after months.

[00:20:34] Malcolm Collins: And what she came up with was the idea of stringing short videos together, which is PNGtubing. But this fixes a lot of the problems. So, like, if I wanna have, like, wavy clothing or something like that, or bands behind my head that are moving, or even- ... really complicated, like a snake person character or something like that, where the head is an unusual f- shape, that was very, very difficult to do historically.

[00:20:57] Mm. With, with any way that I could’ve. ‘Cause what I had to do is I had to separate every feature of the face, and then sort of mark and rig all of those features in an algorithmic style, right? Like, that was a pain in the butt to do, and not very fun. The, the main reason I sort of stopped working on it- Very tedious.

[00:21:15] Simone Collins: Yeah ...

[00:21:15] Malcolm Collins: is because it wasn’t

[00:21:16] Simone Collins: fun. Very

[00:21:16] Malcolm Collins: tedious. If anybody wants to take over that project and work with for RFAB, you let me know. But it was just too tedious to get that rigging working. But anyway, the point I was making. Wait, where, where were they, where were they, where were they going with this?

[00:21:27] Rigging the riggers the- they’re entering our communities. Yes. So, what she... Because it’s video clips, they can really act however they want, which has allowed her to do these really cool things like exit animations, where, like, they’ll throw, like, a smoke bomb and, like, disappear or, like, put up a rock wall around them- Oh, that’s typical

[00:21:44] and then explode when they come back. You know, for, like, when you’re going to the restroom or something. ... They’re, they’re really good. Now, the downside to the PNGs is they have a snapping thing. So when they go between forms, rather than naturally moving between video forms they move to like an immediate alternate form, right?

[00:22:05] Like, say I’m turning the head or something like that. And that’s because, frankly, the way that PNGtubers did it historically was stupid. I was actually working with my AI to improve on Leaflet’s system before making it live, and one of the things I wanted to add was head turning and talking while the head is turned.

[00:22:19] And I was like, “Okay, so here’s how we’re gonna handle that,” to my system. I go, “You want to split the head turn into three different animations.” So, you know, you have a head turning like this, right? Well, what you would normally do with, like, anything else, like talking, is we play the talking on a loop, right?

[00:22:38] So it gets into its start state, its end state, and it lo- i- they glue together fairly well. But with a head turn, you don’t want the head turning like this every time it gets a head turn animation, right? So you want to cut the head turn into three pieces. Turn here, talking or looking in that direction, then turn back.

[00:22:55] You then take the beginning animation, which turns from here to here from a stable state and you play that. Then you play the middle portion on what’s called a ping pong loop. Now, I wanna see if you can get this, Simone. Do a little logic solving here. How do you prevent a snap when you have a loop where the beginning and the end of the loop don’t perfectly match each other, like talking to the side because we can’t easily tell it to keep the beginning of when you’re fully to the side the exact same as the end of when you’re fully to the side?

[00:23:30] And audience, this is a little game for you. How do you edit

[00:23:32] Simone Collins: your stitch? An interstitial image? I don’t know.

[00:23:35] Malcolm Collins: It’s called a ping pong loop.

[00:23:36] Simone Collins: Okay.

[00:23:37] Malcolm Collins: So what you do is you take the video of the person talking to the side, that middle part, and you reverse it. You play it backwards. Oh. You then take the backwards section and you paste it to the end of the forward section, and now you make that your looped cycle.

[00:23:55] Okay. So now what you have is even if the video was [00:24:00] one, two, three, four, then you have the, oh, the big jump from four to one. But no, now it’s one, two, three, four, four, three, two, one, one, two, three, four.

[00:24:08] Simone Collins: Uh-huh.

[00:24:08] Malcolm Collins: Never a jump, never a snap. So there’s lots of tricks like this I can intersperse throughout the way the system is working to make it work very smoothly.

[00:24:19] And adding better interstitial states will also help, as well as more different types of talking states. But we’ll handle that as we move on. Another improvement I’ve been able to make to Leaflet System, because we offer CGEN within our system, is if you want to add not safe for work actions to your figure.

[00:24:39] I mean, I can’t imagine in what context you’d be doing this because you can’t really use them on Twitch in that context.

[00:24:44] Simone Collins: But- On OF presumably, an OF

[00:24:47] Malcolm Collins: VTube? Yeah, I guess if our fans... Well, the thing is, is that AI moves things forward so quickly. So like my live 2D system is already being mogged by Leaflet System, but now that’s on our website, right?

[00:24:57] And what’s gonna happen next is we’re gonna have sites that just do augmented reality for people.

[00:25:02] But what we’ll be able to do while those augmented reality for people sites exist, you know, just put something over you which I wanna start experimenting with maybe on the next Leaflet stream or more with this stuff.

[00:25:12] But then after that, we’ll be able to use this technology to create characters for you, right? Like, so there is the- Wait,

[00:25:18] Simone Collins: wait, wait, wait, wait. Are there, are there heads-up displays now that you could-

[00:25:23] Malcolm Collins: Yeah ...

[00:25:23] Simone Collins: code, like rfab

[00:25:25] Malcolm Collins: stuff? Look it up. Why don’t, why don’t you go to AI and experiment with some? I’d really like to have time to experiment with them.

[00:25:28] I’ve just been in a rush to get this project done.

[00:25:30] Simone Collins: Yeah, let me, let me see what’s out there because I’ve always wanted to have a display. And by

[00:25:33] Malcolm Collins: the way, guys, sorry for saying it’d be live yesterday. I thought it was gonna be live yesterday. I got to the end of setting it up, and I was like, “No, I wanna do Leaflet justice.”

[00:25:41] Like, I want this system not working like a Malcolm day one release, but working like a Leaflet day one release.

[00:25:47] Simone Collins: Yeah. This is... Yeah, to honor her and her hard work. I’m all for it. Also, please sleep.

[00:25:55] Malcolm Collins: But let’s, let’s read some of these tweets here, okay? Because you, you haven’t seen it. So here’s an example of one of these tweets, okay?

[00:26:02] “ Anybody saying, ‘Wow, this is amazing,’ needs a history lesson. This is Leaflet. She spent the last year glazing AI for her own pathetic, lifeless projects, and this is no different. The entire AI-” Lifeless?

[00:26:13] Simone Collins: As if

[00:26:15] Malcolm Collins: thing is AI based. AI is not a magic wand, BTooney. Well, why shouldn’t it be? Why shouldn’t

[00:26:20] Simone Collins: it be? It is.

[00:26:21] It is, though. It is actually a magic wand,

[00:26:23] Malcolm Collins: James. But we have, I mean, obviously this person’s being completely crushed in the comments completely getting ratioed.

[00:26:28] Simone Collins: Right,

[00:26:28] Malcolm Collins: yeah. But, like-

[00:26:29] Simone Collins: Would hope so ...

[00:26:29] Malcolm Collins: I love... Let’s see, what’s, what’s Leaflet’s response to this is literally a video of anime girl, AI girls dancing saying, “Mom’s spaghetti.”

[00:26:39] Actually, I’ve gotta- Oh, God ... see their response to you because it’s so funny. This is... You can go to the first one for Leaflet’s response.

[00:26:46] The salt mines. But

[00:26:53] Simone Collins: God bless. Okay.

[00:27:00] Malcolm Collins: TikTok, AI replacement time is coming

[00:27:05] Simone Collins: Oh,

[00:27:06] Malcolm Collins: this is my fave Literally, I love this one. It’s, it’s a g- it’s a h- it’s a hot dog skateboarding, and it says, “Literally the coolest thing ever.” And then it shows the guy in front saying, “This effing sucks, actually.” You right now.

[00:27:21] Simone Collins: For real.

[00:27:23] Malcolm Collins: And that- Always multitasking. Oh my God. But yes, I mean, our community is here protecting her because like we should be, right?

[00:27:29] Like, this is the thing, and I think it’s important to protect people like her when they come out with this. And they’re like, “Leaflet, Leaflet literally, like, doesn’t even have controversial comments except if just, like, true things.” Like

[00:27:42] Simone Collins: She is just giving things away, helping, taking a positive attitude toward...

[00:27:49] And like her, she’s trying to take t- humanity, humanity to the stars, to conquer the stars. She, her whole thing in life is about helping humans flourish and, and [00:28:00] go reach new heights. And it, she’s not like so many other people out there- Well, I mean, I want people to just- ... only out for herself, only out for like some agenda that is not good for people.

[00:28:10] Like, she only wants what’s good for people, and here they are.

[00:28:13] Malcolm Collins: These, these... What I love is the study that showed that, and this was with old AI, that if you show people who say they hate AI art, AI art, they prefer it over human art 76% of the time. Yeah. Yeah. By the way, your video went out.

[00:28:25] Simone Collins: Oh.

[00:28:27] Malcolm Collins: 76% of the time they prefer it to human art.

[00:28:30] Because a- they, they, they’re lying. They’re lying. They, they, they do not mean what they are saying about AI. They are saying it because they are try- but we should be lucky for this. With every person, like, I wanna go to Leaflet and be like, “For every person who’s attacking you now, imagine how screwed we would be if they loved AI, too.”

[00:28:51] Simone Collins: Oh, that’s true. Yeah. It’s, it’s, i- if, if we were ever in a conflict about AI with people, we’d rather that they not, not be heavily attacking it. Well,

[00:29:01] Malcolm Collins: I mean, imagine, imagine if, if the trans community can make awesome songs like, you know, our community does. Mm. Imagine if they could be as vitalistic and happy about the future, and happy about where things are going.

[00:29:10] And a Leaflet fan... And this is what they said about AI. I will, it’s like my mantra on AI now. It’s a random comment from Chat Feed when I was doing her stream. They said, “I spent my entire life getting good at art. And now AI comes out, and now I’m good at animation, too.” You know, now-

[00:29:29] Simone Collins: Yeah. They say AI doesn’t have to be bad for artists, and that’s, that’s where I really struggle with like artist friends we have who have, because they’re part of artist communities, really jumped on an anti-AI, AI bandwagon.

[00:29:40] Because AI can be so expansive for an artist. Something that someone also shared with me recently was the difference between... Oh, this was not Aldous Huxley again. He, he shared the difference between a Korean manufacturers striking when- They are concerned about their jobs being removed by AI versus Japanese auto workers being super stoked about AI adoption in their workplace.

[00:30:06] Yeah. With the difference being that in Japan, there are really strong unions and they don’t fear for their job security. Basically, when you introduce people to AI in a way where they don’t feel like it existentially threatens them, they’re super excited about it. And a lot of it, I think, comes down to framing.

[00:30:21] Artists are largely in a toxic culture where they feel like it’s AI or them.

[00:30:25] Malcolm Collins: No, no, no, no, no, no. This is what you don’t understand, Simone. These people for years have been doing things like one of my favorites with a comment bashing Leaflet for this and then mentioning at the end of it on their X post, “And oh yeah, I’ve been waiting for over a year for my latest commission.

[00:30:41] It’s behind.”

[00:30:42] Simone Collins: Oh, gods ...

[00:30:43] Malcolm Collins: these aren’t people who are acting like normal workers. They’ve basically been the most abusive union on earth for a decade at this point. No other person could you just not do your job for six years and take someone’s money, okay? You’re like, “Oh, why don’t they just take AI and use it to boost their efficiency?”

[00:31:01] Because they had no efficiency.

[00:31:03] Simone Collins: Mm.

[00:31:03] Malcolm Collins: Okay? They had nothing behind their training. They didn’t have creativity. When other people got the ability to cue things, it’s not them who are producing, it’s not the previous artists who are producing the Skybrow Cinematic Universe stuff, all of these cool AI songs that we’re seeing.

[00:31:21] It’s the nerds. The nerds unlocked their power, okay?

[00:31:26] Simone Collins: These artists see themselves as nerds. I, I think it- They’re not nerds ... I, I genuinely think it has more to do with this external locus of control and victim mindset. Because, I mean, yeah, from our commission, our, our commission world experience, we discovered that half of the time when artists had some reason why they couldn’t do something, it was due to some invented illness or mental block that prevented them for whatever reason from being able to work, with excuses including, “Oh, I can’t do this art commission.

[00:31:56] I have to pet sit a friend’s cat this week.” Like [00:32:00] that for some reason prevents someone from Using a tablet on their laptop to do some digital art. But I think- Yeah ... it, it has more to do with this, this culture of extreme weakness, and not actually with like these people are inherently lazy and they don’t wanna work.

[00:32:17] In fact, I actually think that there’s a ... And I, the Leaflet, and you don’t really fall into this category, but I do think there is a relationship between someone being a really good vibe coder and someone being who, someone who doesn’t typically like to put maximum effort into absolutely everything.

[00:32:32] Because those are the people who are really good at asking for another intelligence to do the grunt work for them instead of doing it themselves.

[00:32:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, I’ll give you an example of a major technological challenge that Leaflet solved. Leaflet, not the AI, Leaflet. So the reason why, if people are wondering why I didn’t immediately think to do it this way when I was putting it together, was one, because Leaflet said Live2D is what everyone uses, so I was like, “Okay, let’s try to make them industry professional standard.”

[00:32:55] But two what, can you guess what is the biggest technical challenge of putting this together?

[00:33:01] Simone Collins: Just creating each individual image? Oh, wait. Of this GIF, this, this PNG-based system, right? Yeah. Capturing all the movements. Isn’t that what she was saying?

[00:33:09] Malcolm Collins: No, it’s not capturing the movements. It’s the, that, they, there’s technology to already do that for VTubers.

[00:33:13] The challenge is removing the background from every frame perfectly. Oh. Because if you don’t remove it from every... And background removers kind of suck. Like, that’s one of the biggest things that you have to do by hand in our Live2D system in some parts. I could just never fully automate, even with all of the best background grabbing systems.

[00:33:31] So what Leaflet does is she interjects, makes the background, and then one of those color codes. And then she just removes everything in that color code. So it’s like artificial green screening

[00:33:54] Simone Collins: That is really clever. That’s elegant and simple and, but well thought through. I love it.

[00:34:02] Malcolm Collins: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. So, yeah, here I am trying to do what I can do to make this awesome and make it accessible to as many people as possible, screw over as many riggers as possible, screw over as many, frankly, of, of the artists...

[00:34:16] Like, there are artists out there that are adapting. They are the ones being like, “Oh, now I can make a Neuro-sama. Now I can...” Oh, Malcolm literally put out on this stream, “Hey, let’s create a- an automated VTuber persona,” right? Like, let’s, let’s push the box with AI and create entirely new ways of doing things, entirely new types of art.

[00:34:39] You wanna create an automated OnlyFan model that reacts to fans in real time? We can build that now, okay? Like, the stuff that we can build with this technology, with the additions that we’re making to it, is genuinely astonishing. I don’t know how anyone isn’t off their butts about this right now. Let’s go over some other comments here, because obviously some of them are, are pretty supportive.

[00:35:03] I, I don’t, I don’t like this to be a, and I love people complaining about it, and one person, like, right here is like, “It clearly is, and it’s the worst it’s gonna be. The next version is gonna be better, and eventually the AI version will be superi- superior to a d- to traditional Live2D.” I saw that,

[00:35:18] Simone Collins: yeah

[00:35:19] Malcolm Collins: and I think an evolution of Leaflet’s system is what’s gonna beat Live2D.

[00:35:25] Simone Collins: Gosh, that’d be so great if she is the mother of the next generation of VTubing. Yes, yes, let’s make that, that... Please let that happen, because this- But so you’re- ... this looks better to me. It just looks better categorically

[00:35:42] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I, I get, Oh my God ... so here, here’s the person complaining about, like, it, their, like, kitten Life 2D rigger. “ I hate this. There are hundreds of free Vtuber models and assets out there made by artists. You don’t need AI.” And then “As a Vtuber who started with a $0 budget, I think you’re pathetic.”

[00:35:57] And Leaf’s getting all these ‘cause she gets the reposts. If you go out [00:36:00] there, it looks like everyone’s supporting her because, you know, the algo and everything like that. But no, she sees every one of these mean reposts, right? “Nah, this is gross and literally spat in the face of artists everywhere who made customizable models cheap and pre-made models to use.

[00:36:13] Now, if you actually

[00:36:14] Simone Collins: try to use- No one’s stopping you from paying an artist to make a custom rig. No one is stopping you. And as people have pointed out, you can also have your custom art made for this. No one’s stopping that either.

[00:36:26] Malcolm Collins: I, I, I point out with these free models that they’re talking about, they, everyone who’s ever used one so far that’s ever gotten big ended up having a big legal dispute.

[00:36:35] They are not- Really? ... actually free. They are just a time bomb waiting to happen. You should never use a free model. Oh, you

[00:36:41] Simone Collins: mean so the people who, like, did the, the, the rigging, like illustrated-

[00:36:44] Malcolm Collins: No. People make free models. They say they’re free. Oh. Then they hide terms in them or change the terms later and sue the people who use them.

[00:36:50] Simone Collins: Oh my gosh.

[00:36:53] Malcolm Collins: I love this one, by the way. Mm. “In light of this, I’ve decided to cus- my customizable will be $30 USD. I was already going to price it low for the market. I want to show new Vtubers that you can make it into the community without even 100 USD. This is pitiful, not gonna lie.” I, I love... They, they could never build something like this.

[00:37:12] But- Let’s go over another response here that is actually doing well. I love people are, like, lowering their prices already, like the market’s adapting. And by the way, just people wondering about some features that are gonna come up with this. I was talking with Leaflet, the next thing I wanna do is translate this into Japanese and Spanish.

[00:37:28] And then I’ll translate it into the rest of the languages we support, like German Polish French, et cetera. But I mean it- the nerd community a main reason I wanna do it into Spanish is just to mess with woke people. Because our community is so, or we have a very big Spanish and Portuguese speaking community, actually probably Portuguese too that’s like big fans of the show.

[00:37:45] Because for people who unaware, like Latin America is very right-wing in their social beliefs by the way, and very nerdy. Brazil consumes, I think it was what? As much manga as, as the United States combined. We did a whole

[00:37:59] Simone Collins: episode on it. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[00:38:02] Malcolm Collins: So anyway.

[00:38:02] Simone Collins: Though if memory serves, a lot of it had to do with like inexpensive licensing back in the ‘90s, so it’s just what they

[00:38:09] Malcolm Collins: could afford.

[00:38:09] That’s part of it, but they’re also just nerds.

[00:38:10] Simone Collins: Yeah ...

[00:38:11] Malcolm Collins: the part Emerald Apple says- Mm ... “ The part that warms my heart is all these quote, unquote ‘artists’ and VTubers melting down over this is amazing. The tool that lowers the barrier of entry into the space using AI, they have been gatekeeping the space with expensive models or free models with endless TOS restrictions.”

[00:38:26] Mm. “And as soon as a viable competition arrives, they all become hateful. It was never about equitable voices in the VTuber space. It was always about maintaining a comfortable hug box of agreeable opinions and personalities that rejected anyone with problematic opinions. Leaflet made an amazing tool and deserves recognition for helping to democratize content creation for anyone who wants it.

[00:38:46] Gatekeeping creativity behind artificial scarcity in a digital age was never going to work, and I’m glad I’m seeing this barrier being broken. Technology always threatens those whose core business model depends on it being expensive, time-consuming, and difficult for no reason.” Yeah. “No more drama with artists who...”

[00:39:01] Yeah, like if you tried to make the legal system easier, you know who’s gonna fight that? Lawyers. Yeah. “It’s soulless. It lacks all of my extra time. No more drama with artists who refuse to work with right-wing and base content creators,” and they literally will refuse to work with them or actively screw them over.

[00:39:16] Oh, God. “No more wait lists for riggers or even social permission to become a VTuber. Anyone can do it now, and that’s what threatens them. And I also applaud Leaflet for the courage to move up...” Not just the courage, she released this for free. This, this, this, this groundbreaking technology for free. And that’s why I decided to make this major change to the way RFAB works, because Leaflet inspired me to be like, “Look, if you guys wanna pay us to use our systems, then you pay us to use our systems.

[00:39:43] If you wanna use an API because you’re just too f- cucking addicted, you pay me with an API, okay? We are here because I want to create a product that you can’t help but want to give money to, okay? And if you are gonna go out there and crash out that now,” ‘cause I know there’s gonna be a portion of the [00:40:00] people that are like, “Oh my God, it has not safe for work searches and stuff on it.”

[00:40:03] I’m like, “Yeah, and it’s got a big button on it that locks your account into safe for work mode, okay?” If your kid gets one shot because it... When w- Like, literally the next tech we’re releasing is, like, a kids tutoring app, okay? Actually we’re releasing it alongside this, so it’s, it’s going live at the same time.

[00:40:18] It- the internet, anywhere the kid goes is going to have that content. If they can’t control themselves around it or don’t know how to relate to it or you don’t know how to lock an account out of it actually I’ll, I’ll, I’ll put a... I’ll make my thing for the next phase to put a password around that lock as well.

[00:40:34] Simone Collins: Yeah, for parents or whatever. That would probably be a good idea. Just a thought.

[00:40:40] Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, I, I can, I can just add it right now so it’ll be live with this latest update.

[00:40:46] Simone Collins: Good. Okay.

[00:40:47] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, so just built that. That’s cool. Anyway, Jesus. This man cannot rest ... and I’ve always been about this, but everyone’s like, “You’re introducing kids who are in the VTuber space.” If kids are in the VTuber space, they’re seeing not safe for work stuff, okay?

[00:41:02] Simone Collins: Yeah,

[00:41:02] Malcolm Collins: that’s very true. And I’m gonna be honest, guys, if you are unaware of that, if you-

[00:41:05] Simone Collins: Well, look, what parents don’t realize is literally, and we, we did a whole episode on this too drug traffickers and, and criminal rings are using Fortnite chat to recruit criminals, like small children to do their dirty work for them.

[00:41:22] Malcolm Collins: Turn kids into terrorists. Yeah, like

[00:41:22] Simone Collins: literally- And, and explicitly because for them, like what are they gonna get? They’re gonna go to juvie. Like the, they’re, they’re cheaper- Well, and this is the crazy thing- ... they’re gullible. So, like your kid’s not safe online. You, you have to annotate

[00:41:32] Malcolm Collins: these things yeah, a kid goes on our site, they find out that not safe for work content exists.

[00:41:36] Oh, so scary. You know what happens on

[00:41:38] Simone Collins: other sites? Well, also like not to, I don’t know- And

[00:41:39] Malcolm Collins: this is like literally, this is literally allowed in like Discord, okay?

[00:41:43] Simone Collins: Yeah, but this is gonna be a super self-own, but I have attempt- I’ve like gone into the not safe for work like chats and scenarios, and I’m like, “Hello.”

[00:41:53] I walk down the street, nothing happens.

[00:41:55] Speaker 10: The point that she’s trying to make is that a not safe for work scenario will not engage you in a not safe for work scenario unless you lean in in that direction. And the point I was trying to make is that you can literally go to other websites and there are just forums for trans people who want to indoctrinate kids and that’s just normal on Discord.

[00:42:16] That’s just normal on Reddit. That is their stated raison d’etre and we have not safe for work material and you think that’s bad? Like, come on, we’re not trying to brainwash a kid into some weird sexual cult

[00:42:30] Simone Collins: If, if- Oh,

[00:42:31] Malcolm Collins: they’re gonna be mad about our not safe for work aggregate search engine.

[00:42:34] Simone Collins: Sure, yeah. That’s true. That’s true. I, I tried that out I, like, searched dump truck and I searched cupcake and I will never see those images the same way again. So yeah, that, that’s true.

[00:42:45] That, that could scar a kid.

[00:42:47] Malcolm Collins: Yeah,

[00:42:47] Simone Collins: we’re

[00:42:47] Malcolm Collins: just so- That

[00:42:48] Simone Collins: could scar a

[00:42:48] Malcolm Collins: kid ... I mean, I think that that makes us, unfortunately, a little too resistant to talking about sexual topics because, like, I say things on the Leaflet stream and I’m like, “Somebody’s gonna clip that,” or whatever, right? Like, one of the things I was talking about on the latest one was definitely me...

[00:43:00] I was like, you understand that in the future a lot of women are just gonna choose to present as extremely young because they can choose to, right? Like, we’re already seeing this in the VTuber space.

[00:43:09] Simone Collins: Malcolm, yes. They’re, oh, no. Not the VTuber space.

[00:43:11] Malcolm Collins: And I

[00:43:11] Simone Collins: pointed out Rebecca

[00:43:13] Malcolm Collins: from, from-

[00:43:13] Simone Collins: Malcolm, no. Literally girls are dressing that way and altering their face that way now, and they have been for a long time.

[00:43:20] W- how is this new? This is not new.

[00:43:23] Malcolm Collins: Yeah,

[00:43:24] Simone Collins: like- This is the history of makeup and styling, Malcolm.

[00:43:28] Malcolm Collins: And I think that people need to really differentiate between something being hot and something being something you want to sexually engage with, and a leftist cannot make this differentiation. Mm-hmm. Like, literally they can’t.

[00:43:43] Like, they, they think, “If something is hot, I must have to engage with it.” I mean, this comes downstream of, like, the gay rights movement and everything like that. If something turns me on, I have to do it, right? Whereas in all of human history we’ve had, like, grandparents be able to be like, “Oh yeah, you know, like, [00:44:00] my grandkid is marrying an attractive person.

[00:44:03] They’re marrying someone who’s hot.” That doesn’t mean they want to bang them or have ever once thought about it. But, like, in this leftist mind space you’re supposed to lie about things. And I think that

[00:44:15] Simone Collins: it- Well, also I think people i- historically were a lot more exposed to, to sex than you might think.

[00:44:21] Just, like, being around animals you would see it happen a lot. Plus, like, keep in mind, Malcolm, people used to live in, like, one-room houses. No, no, no. I think the bigger thing is, like, they understood that you don’t just have sex with something or think about something sexually because it turns you on.

[00:44:36] Malcolm Collins: You don’t have to do it. Oh, sure. Yeah. You don’t have to do whatever thing is, right? And I think that a leftist doesn’t understand that and so they, they, the, oh, the, the creepy leftist world. But teaching kids from a young age- Don’t engage with this stuff or you’ll end up like these degenerate online wackos, right, who dedicate their entire lives to this nonsense and fall down into pits and end up just crashing and burning.

[00:45:08] And, and we’re seeing this over and over and over again. I think that’s why the left doesn’t put up a fight anymore, is because everyone in it crashed and burned. To be the type of person that could get a job and not finish it for six years or a year or... And this is regular in this space is astonishing.

[00:45:22] Astonishing to be that

[00:45:23] Simone Collins: unproductive. Yeah, that’s, that’s egregious. Like, the amount of shame I would have with that. Like, I don’t think you or I could live with that. It

[00:45:29] Malcolm Collins: would make us- Well, that’s because these people live in a Goong tornado, right? Like, if you look at, like, people like Leafy and me, and I hope our fans, AI has been like a K hole of productivity.

[00:45:38] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:45:39] Malcolm Collins: Like I’m here talking to you. I get the thing from, from Leafy. I’m like, “Oh, I got a bunch of ideas to make it better. Ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba, ba.” And we don’t care about any of these gates that we can blow through, because you know what?

[00:45:48] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:45:48] Malcolm Collins: Sexy anime girls, they draw people in, so I’m gonna make sexy anime girls.

[00:45:52] That’s, that’s what people like. That’s what people watch. That’s true. That’s true.

[00:45:56] That is, you know, Red says, “Dessu, y- I choose whatever vampire girl because I, that, it’s pleasant on my eyes, so it’s probably pleasant on other people’s eyes.”

[00:46:07] Simone Collins: Yeah, I mean, smart move, for sure.

[00:46:11] Malcolm Collins: It’s, it’s absolutely ridiculous where these spaces have become, the way that they attack other people, the way that they make things up about other people, and we’re frankly done with it.

[00:46:22] Like, the people who are like, “Don’t you know that what Leaflets think?” Glazing AI. AI is good. AI saves lives. I love the, the, the top comment under this, ‘cause I was, I was looking at this one. I hate that, like, I got into VTubing because I love the whole concept, but these people see VTubing as the only way to bully and steal money from people.

[00:46:41] It’s horrible. That’s fair from what should be said, and I’m glad about how many bad people just decided to reveal themselves with this situation

[00:46:53] Simone Collins: Hmm.

[00:46:55] Malcolm Collins: Yeah.

[00:46:57] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:46:59] Malcolm Collins: Look ... I love this. It’s not all artists. The ones yelling the loudest are mediocre and realize the first thing made interesting now something a glorified calculator can do. Yeah

[00:47:11] Simone Collins: A

[00:47:13] Malcolm Collins: lot of people have been warning the artists that this is turning people off from the community. This is like absolutely disgusting.

[00:47:21] We need to... Like, these people, just out, out, out, out. Leaflet is the very definition of a VTuber. She’s been doing it from the beginning. She’s one of the biggest VTubers. She is a, a, a, a... And if you’re, Leaflet is, is astonishingly large, like overall. I think a lot of people don’t realize how large she is on like an, an average stream.

[00:47:41] She does like half Asmigold’s numbers on average on Twitch. She’s very, very popular because she’s very, very endearing and genuine. And what she shows you, because this isn’t even her job, right? Like, she did this for fun. The degree to which releasing [00:48:00] this for free mogs the haters is so cool. It’s, it’s such a like a fly ball play from our community.

[00:48:08] I love it. I love that we’re building the Chud Tech world here, which is also something I would remind fans, if you have made something cool with AI or you have a neat AI thing out there and you want it put into like a Chud Tech site, I’m gonna think of like aggregating all of our cool products to make like a, a mirror.

[00:48:26] And, and then what I could do with the site actually is do a Skybrow Cinematic Universe and Chud Tech. And so we can also have like a ranking of all the best like Skybow Cinematic Universe projects so that- Oh ... people can find those. And follow creators into that. That’d be a lot of fun. That could be a fun project, yeah.

[00:48:42] But I need to start getting my, my Chud Tech in so we can start ranking the cool technology we’re building that the wokes don’t have. I mean, the reason I’m so excited to release this is because a lot of the tech that we have on RFAB, like the, the thing that searches every not safe for work video or image database at the same time or every mall wide database or every torrent database without any ads I really wanna see the people being like, “Man, I hate these people.

[00:49:05] I hate everything they stand for, but this technology is really genuinely pretty trill.” Because from their position it is. But do you have any... I... And, and, and two, like the Leaflets out there, the people who are being attacked for this, who are being emotionally affected by these attacks- Be so grateful these people don’t have the tech we have and aren’t using it in this cultural war, because it has allowed us to mog them at every turn.

[00:49:36] It has allowed the White House Twitter feed to make funny AI videos- Yeah ... about Trump, right? Like, we are able to mog them because they have castrated themselves. And if they weren’t castrated, we wouldn’t be winning this easily. And, and we are winning the culture war at this point, right? Like, this is just, like, awesome.

[00:50:00] Next we need to win the war wars, you know, get the automated drone swarms up and running. We got some, some, some, some, some negative externalities out there in the world you know. We gotta, we gotta call up our partners in, in Tel Aviv and be like, “Hey, hey. There’s some people around the world being kinda dicks.

[00:50:21] Let’s take ‘em out.” You ready for that? That, that’s culture war part two. Part one, we deal with these people yelling at us. Part two, we say to the, the... Well, I mean, I think both abroad and domestic, like the anti-natalist cause, the desire to eradicate humanity is repugnant. Okay? I love this piece of AI art.

[00:50:46] It’s two artists looking disgusted. “This is such a spit in the face of artists who put all their time into drawing with a pencil and paper. All electricity this uses. Do you know how to manufacture one of these? Thousands of liters of water. Think about the environment.” I guarantee you, in terms of metabolism, it takes your average artist literally hundreds of thousands of times...

[00:51:11] No let’s try to give an accurate number here. Yeah, I’d say probably 50,000 times more. I can say probably with, with, with- More

[00:51:20] Simone Collins: water and electricity

[00:51:22] Malcolm Collins: to do the- More water and electricity to take a year on a commission than it takes an AI to do that commission. Even when they’re not clearly taking too long and stuff like that and they’re...

[00:51:34] And, and during that time, they’ll like reopen their commissions. This is a normal thing for artists to do.

[00:51:38] Simone Collins: Oh, yeah.

[00:51:39] Malcolm Collins: This won’t get canceled. It’s such an

[00:51:40] Simone Collins: annoying move. This won’t- Yeah.

[00:51:40] Malcolm Collins: That is who you should be canceling, but you didn’t cancel them. And so when people turned against artists, everyone was like, “Well, I mean, I tried working with an artist.

[00:51:49] It destroyed my company. It destroyed my brand. They screwed me over.” Literally members of the community, in Kirsche’s community, teaching themselves to rig just to make her models now. [00:52:00]

[00:52:01] Simone Collins: Yeah. This is... And it’s, it’s not, this is not just a VTuber thing. We know other stories of professional artists being screwed over, not by like agents or galleries or other people, which I’m sure happens too, but literally by other artists that they have worked with to try to get their work out there, who have turned on them, literally extorted them for money.

[00:52:23] So just because someone’s an artist doesn’t mean that they’re somehow morally superior or- Well, they’re, well, they’re also... I mean, are... No, artists are, as I’ve said, morally, I, I can, I, I can think of no other profession literally lower than lawyers in terms of I will screw you over rate. Like, I have never...

[00:52:39] Malcolm Collins: And this is, we ran an art commissioning business. I have never seen a business where it was so considered normal to screw people over in ways that you would never think about in any other profession. But because it’s artists, they’re used to doing this

[00:52:56] Simone Collins: Yeah, there’s some normalized psychologically un- unhealthy behavior. We even interviewed artists who were like, “Well, I’ve realized that I have to kind of look unstable or people won’t pay as much for my art.” So it’s, it’s this weird self-perpetuating thing. But yeah I think- And

[00:53:13] Malcolm Collins: if you’re an artist who’s scared that now the entire world knows how to make art, well, now you know how to code and make music and make

[00:53:18] Simone Collins: a movie.

[00:53:18] No, the best artists we know actually are really excited about AI. They’re using it to do more with their own work. If you are a true artist, you love art. And one, you probably are never gonna expect to make money from your craft anyway because you’re an artist. But two, if you’re lucky enough to make money from your art, AI is indispensable because it actually enables you to spend more time on your art and less time on everything else.

[00:53:42] Because to be a successful artist, you have to be an entrepreneur, a business manager, a marketer, a narrative spinner a, a ton of other things. The, the typical artist gets to spend so little time on their actual art that it’s not even funny, and AI changes that. So there’s, there’s so little reason why anyone should be complaining about this kind of art.

[00:54:01] And actually, Malcolm, when you talk about the artists who are most likely to give us trouble when we ran the art commissioning platform, it was the artists who actually most resembled very early proto versions of AI. Which is to say that they learned how to copy one style. They didn’t actually have their own style or their own distinct style.

[00:54:18] They learned how to copy one style, and they couldn’t even do it very well, and they would sort of rigidly just do it again and again. And they’re the ones that often flaked the most, took the most time, because in the end they didn’t like their craft. They didn’t do art because they loved creating. They did it ‘cause like, “Oh, I figured out how

[00:54:37] Malcolm Collins: to copy this thing.”

[00:54:37] Yeah, anyone who loves creating is ecstatic about where we are with this technology now. Totally. Yeah.

[00:54:41] Simone Collins: Yeah.

[00:54:41] Malcolm Collins: And I again, I just cannot get this, “You stole artwork. You stole...” Every artistic style is the cumulation of a cultural movement stealing from other people. Yeah. If you’ve ever... Any, any style that you’ve ever done that wasn’t a style that you invented is stolen, and AI can invent new styles.

[00:55:00] If you don’t believe me, try it. It’s actually pretty good at it, right? And that’s because AI is more creative than you. And that’s the gist of it. What you were doing was never really that hard. What you were doing was never really that impressive. What you were doing was a task that you were gating, and now that other people can do it and you go, “No, I can tell AI.

[00:55:19] I don’t like AI,” and the studies say you’re f- ing lying. You can’t tell AI, and you don’t like it less. And in truth, I haven’t seen anything that the left has created that is as good, or traditional artists have created, that’s as good as your standard Skybrow Cinematic Universe video these days. Oh, I can do the

[00:55:39] Simone Collins: same thing with AI?

[00:55:39] Well, and keep in mind, I, I see definitely, like Skybrow’s- is very distinctive and recognizable, both in the visual and audi- audio art that he uses.

[00:55:50] He is a really good example of an artist that uses AI to do a better, to do more with their work. I know just from listening to a song if a song is a Skybrow song.

[00:55:59] I know just [00:56:00] from looking at the footage, without even seeing the audio, that it’s a Skybrow song. Well,

[00:56:03] Malcolm Collins: it’s the same with Holy Ball. Holy Ball is super distinct from Skybrow’s. Leaflet is super distinct from each of them, which

[00:56:09] Simone Collins: he does with the AI media. Yeah, their, because their work is art, and that’s the thing.

[00:56:11] So th- and that’s... I’m so excited about AI-assisted human art, human and, and, and AI intelligence mo- moving hand-in-hand is the future. Oh, yeah. No, but that’s, that’s creating a whole new form of beauty and intelligence that I’m super excited for.

[00:56:28] We’re only seeing literally the worst version of it that will ever exist, so things are gonna get really good.

[00:56:35] Malcolm Collins: I’m really excited. Yeah, remember AI tried to make somebody eating spaghetti, it’s terrible, and now it can make, like, great people eating spaghetti.

[00:56:41] Simone Collins: Well, it was always Will Smith eating spaghetti.

[00:56:43] Yeah. Don’t forget. So only, only one person counts. This is our, this is our mooring point, which is- ... delightful.

[00:56:52] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, it was... Don P. Bongwater is the new one that I, I quite like h- his songs. Oh, my God. I wish he did more songs. I don’t, I don’t like his other content as much as the songs.

[00:56:59] Simone Collins: Look, these... They, it takes a lot of time and work and again, people are

[00:57:02] Malcolm Collins: like, ooh- Oh, wait, but his style is very unique and distinct

[00:57:03] Simone Collins: from the other two

[00:57:04] all this time I spent learning how to use a, you know, put a pencil to paper. Do you have any idea how much time Malcolm or Leaflet is putting into making anything that they’re... Like, they are not s- Malcolm, the way he sleeps now is he will, he will sleep and then, like, lift his head and wake up and then enter

[00:57:23] Malcolm Collins: a song.

[00:57:23] Yeah, I set an intermittent alarm so that I can sleep, run AI for a long time, then test the things I’m running it on, then go back to sleep again.

[00:57:31] Simone Collins: It’s, it is preposterous, but also I, it’s admirable, if a little bit frustrating and worrying. But the, you know, I’ve never seen anyone work harder. And, and that’s, I think that’s a, that’s, it’s-

[00:57:43] Malcolm Collins: Well, and this is Malcolm post-AI.

[00:57:45] I’ve never worked harder in my life than post-AI. Because AI has l- allowed me to fall into a productivity K hole. Like, I’m just making everything I always wanted to exist. Making... I wanted my kid to have a, a tutor, right? Making it. I wanna create, I, I want to create a site that is everything a chud could want.

[00:58:04] Truly chudtopia. And I am so excited for that.

[00:58:10] Simone Collins: That is exciting. Yeah. Leaflet, you’re amazing. Don’t stop. Don’t listen to the haters.

[00:58:15] Malcolm Collins: B- good, the haters are just trying to gatekeep. They’re, you’re literally- Yeah ... they could choose not to use this. Anyone could choose not to use this. The only people who are helped are the people who are gated from this community by bigots.

[00:58:28] And that’s what the rigors in this community are predominantly, is just bigots. They are prejudiced bigots who want to maintain authoritarian, fascistic ideological control over this world, this little world that they’ve invaded and infested, and that has been broken. And it’s been increasingly broken not just by tech like this, but by the VTubers who have not stepped back.

[00:58:55] The nerd front of the right has broken through, right? Like, and we say it happened with Kirsha first. They tried to cancel her. It didn’t work. The more people they try to cancel and it blows up in their face, the better

[00:59:12] Simone Collins: I agree. It’s awesome. I’m sorry, Tex is crying ‘cause he is trying to chew through-

[00:59:16] Malcolm Collins: Well, I mean, I know we’re about to deal with a cancellation where everyone’s gonna be shocked that we have this, apps for tutoring next to not safe for work stuff. Oh,

[00:59:24] Simone Collins: yeah. And they’re gonna be like, “What the-” All right.

[00:59:25] Malcolm Collins: And I’m gonna be like, “F*****g grow up, man.

[00:59:26] It’s the internet. That’s what the internet is. If you can’t handle that your, your kids can’t handle that. If you can’t handle it- It is, it is a

[00:59:33] Simone Collins: genuine problem

[00:59:34] Malcolm Collins: that- ... safe for

[00:59:34] Simone Collins: work ... if parents think that they, they can put their kids on the internet and have them be safe. I mean, there are abundant controls now, but when, whenever we do one of the parental control approaches with our kids, like we go through the apps, we, we put the parental control iPad set up, it’s so cumbersome in some cases that you just kind of stop using it entirely and you’re like, “No- Yeah

[00:59:57] we’re just gonna remove all the controls ‘cause [01:00:00] nothing works right now.” That, that is not, it’s... And, and it’s either that or like your kid turns, you know, goes off to college or work or whatever it is that they do, and they discover all of this and they have no defenses for it. So-

[01:00:12] Malcolm Collins: But this is something everyone knows.

[01:00:14] Everyone who’s not like some deontological buttwad is aware. Look, no,

[01:00:18] Simone Collins: no, no. This is a, a pervasively not understood thing, so. I’ve gotta go get the kids. I love you so much. And- I

[01:00:26] Malcolm Collins: love

[01:00:26] Simone Collins: you too ... I will go make your dinner.

[01:00:29] Malcolm Collins: French fries and

[01:00:30] Simone Collins: mystery curry. French fries and mystery curry. Okay, bye Malcolm.

[01:00:35] Malcolm Collins: Bye.

[01:00:38] Simone Collins: Sorry, tech Would you like gyoza lasagna again tonight?

[01:00:45] Malcolm Collins: No Would you like the caramelized pork with Sweet potato fries

[01:01:00] Simone Collins: Or some other mystery curry with sweet potato fries?

[01:01:03] Malcolm Collins: Yeah, sure.

[01:01:04] Simone Collins: Yeah? Okay. Sweet.

[01:01:07] Malcolm Collins: I mean, something, something small tonight. I, I really don’t want that much.

[01:01:10] Simone Collins: Okay. I’ll put some-

[01:01:11] Malcolm Collins: Maybe just sweet potato fries in, like, sauce or something.

[01:01:14] Simone Collins: All right. Yeah.

[01:01:16] Malcolm Collins: Okay, that’s good for me. By sauce

[01:01:17] Simone Collins: you mean mystery curry, ‘cause I’m so desperate to get some things out of the freezer.

[01:01:22] But now, if you open our silver freezer, you will see one of the shelves is dedicated entirely to a rainbow- ... of freezer pops, which I believe will be quite refreshing to you in these hot summer days. So-

[01:01:35] Malcolm Collins: You are so nice. I love

[01:01:36] Simone Collins: you so much ... I try to do what I can to ease your suffering.

[01:01:41] Malcolm Collins: All right, what’s a, what’s a funny way to start this one?

[01:01:43] Speaker 2: What is all this, Titan?

[01:03:09] Well, Torsten

[01:03:18] We’ll build a solution together. Does that sound good? Okay. We’ll negotiate something. Okay, Mommy

This is a public episode. If you'd like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit basedcamppodcast.substack.com/subscribe