Prof. Leo Panitch, Jacobin writer Meagan Day, and Historian Gerald Horne join Paul Jay to analyze the Presidential debate and the underlying reasons why the U.S. political system is in disarray. They discuss how the people's movement will respond to a possible Trump coup if he loses the election.

Prof. Leo Panitch, Jacobin writer Meagan Day, and Historian Gerald Horne join Paul Jay to analyze the Presidential debate and the underlying reasons why the U.S. political system is in disarray. They discuss how the people's movement will respond to a possible Trump coup if he loses the election.

Greg Wilpert talks to sociology Professor William I. Robinson about his just-released book, The Global Police State, in which he outlines the confluence of interests between transnational capital, 21st-century fascism, and the general policing of society.

Greg Wilpert talks to sociology Professor William I. Robinson about his just-released book, The Global Police State, in which he outlines the confluence of interests between transnational capital, 21st-century fascism, and the general policing of society.

Greg WilpertWelcome to theAnalysis.news podcast. I'm your guest host, Greg Wilpert. I'm recording this podcastepisode a few days after a new wave of Black Lives Matter protests following a decision not to chargethe police officers who killed Breonna Taylor. Of course, as usual, there was plenty of repression againstthe protests which took place across the United States. What the protests and the police repressionhighlight is the extent to which inequality, and resistance to inequality and injustice, and the repressionagainst the resistance fit together.One sociologist who has argued that this is part of a worldwide trend is William I. Robinson. As ithappens, he just released a book on this topic called "The Global Police State," published this month byPluto Press. Will Robinson joins me today to discuss his book. He's a professor of sociology at theUniversity of California, Santa Barbara, and is the author of numerous books on the topic ofglobalization. Thanks for joining me today, Bill.

William RobinsonPleasure to be with you.

Greg WilpertSo your book actually covers a lot of ground, including your larger theory of globalization and globalcapitalism. But let's start with the issue at hand, the global police state. Why has it become a globalphenomenon at this point, and how does it express itself?

William RobinsonYes, well, the starting point for any discussion of the global police state has to be the crisis of globalcapitalism. Of course, I finished this book in October of 2019 so I could not see the pandemic coming,but the system was already in an acute crisis, and I'm going to suggest really the most acute crisis of its500 years, that is world capitalism well before the pandemic. And the only thing the pandemic did is toaggravate this crisis and aggravate everything, pushing us towards an intensification of global policestate.And certainly, the crisis that we're in is multidimensional. There is the ecological dimension, whichmakes it an existential crisis. And then there's the social dimension of the crisis in the sense that billionsof people around the world cannot survive. But that only becomes a crisis, the social dimension, untiland unless these billions of people rise up, and that's taking place now. But I think we need to focus ontwo other dimensions of the crisis. One is what we call the structural dimension, and that is that theglobal economy has been increasingly stagnant.And in the face of that stagnation, the building up of a global police state is a way of continuing to throwfirewood on the dying embers and stagnant embers of a global economy, and I'll get into this in a littlemore detail in a little while. But this structural dimension of the crisis is driving global police state, and

then global capitalism is facing a deep political crisis of legitimacy and of hegemony. And global policestate is a response to this multidimensional crisis of global capitalism.I would say that we're in a moment of inflection, an extremely dangerous moment. We are slipping intothe threat of fascism. But also, this moment opens up tremendous opportunities for emancipatoryprojects. The capitalist states have been unable to cope with the crisis and with the pandemic, which hasexposed them as instruments of wealth and of corruption. And it has pushed these states, since thepandemic got underway, to intensify global police state.

Greg Wilpert talks to sociology Professor William I. Robinson about his just-released book, The Global Police State, in which he outlines the confluence of interests between transnational capital, 21st-century fascism, and the general policing of society.

Greg Wilpert talks to sociology Professor William I. Robinson about his just-released book, The Global Police State, in which he outlines the confluence of interests between transnational capital, 21st-century fascism, and the general policing of society.

A viewer writes: should Paul Jay's critique of Biden wait till after the election? Jay says we need to defeat Trump, but without creating illusions about Biden. We have to build a non-sectarian, broad people's movement with a class conscious core. Lucas Alden interviews Paul Jay (Pt2) on theAnalysis.news podcast.

A viewer writes: should Paul Jay's critique of Biden wait till after the election? Jay says we need to defeat Trump, but without creating illusions about Biden. We have to build a non-sectarian, broad people's movement with a class conscious core. Lucas Alden interviews Paul Jay (Pt2) on theAnalysis.news podcast.

Transcript

Paul Jay

Hi, I'm Paul Jay. Welcome to theAnalysis.news podcast. And for those of you that like the Analysis, and are listening and not donating, now is a good time to go find the donate button. We're about to play a little music. Maybe while the music's playing you can find the donate button, because if people don't donate, we can't do this.

So today, the guess is again, me, and Lucas Alden, who interviewed me for part one of this, and you might want to go listen to part one if you haven't. We're going to switch hats here, and Luke's going to be the host, and I'm going to be the guest. Luke is an educator who teaches school in Rome, Italy. He's a political activist who's worked on many campaigns dealing with issues of war, and peace, and military spending, climate, and U.S. Israeli aggression in Palestine, and other things.

And here we go. So over to you.

Lucas Alden

Well, regarding the theme, you know, not only interpreting but changing the world, what do you see as the alternative media's role in not only informing the working population but, you know, in popular left movements itself? You know, do you believe alternative media should be an ally for mass movements, but not actually part of them? How do you see that dynamic?

Paul Jay

Well, both is the answer. There should be media, and is, which is an outgrowth of the advocacy. And there should be media, which is journalism, which will go where the facts lie and damn the consequences, you know, because the movement needs both.

I've been mostly positioning myself in the journalism realm. I would say with theAnalysis a little more overt, I mean, I was never shy about saying what I thought, but it wasn't front and center. With the Analysis I feel a little less restricted, partly because I feel like I know a little more than I used to, I actually feel like I have more to say. But I am still a little frustrated with the role of media, period. That, you know, in some ways, if I was in the right place, I almost wouldn't mind being directly involved in one of these progressive political campaigns, you know, somebody running for office. I mean, I have this weird dual citizenship so I can play that role in the US or Canada.

But I find these progressive candidates, you know, AOC and the others that are happening, a lot's going on in New York, but elsewhere. I think it's encouraging; I think it's very important, I don't think it's everything.

I think the more important thing, and I hope the Analysis maybe becomes a platform for helping create this, but I think in the US, and Canada, and probably every country, we need a broad popular front that has as its core, you know, a very class conscious core, non-sectarian, and willing to unite with like every section of society that's willing to fight against fascism, and to save the world vis-a-vis climate against war.

And you must add to that the danger of nuclear war.

And, you know, the broad fronts that were anti-imperialist, anti-fascist fronts of the 1930s and, you know,

A viewer writes: should Paul Jay's critique of Biden wait till after the election? Jay says we need to defeat Trump, but without creating illusions about Biden. We have to build a non-sectarian, broad people's movement with a class conscious core. Lucas Alden interviews Paul Jay (Pt2) on theAnalysis.news podcast.

A viewer writes: should Paul Jay's critique of Biden wait till after the election? Jay says we need to defeat Trump, but without creating illusions about Biden. We have to build a non-sectarian, broad people's movement with a class conscious core. Lucas Alden interviews Paul Jay (Pt2) on theAnalysis.news podcast.