What's the value?

Ginny is a certified Somatic Life Coach who is focused on helping people address the root cause of behaviors that hold them back. It is not about teaching people how to cope, it is about teaching people how to fix their issues. Ginny explains her work as complete self forgiveness, taking ownership over your perspective, rewiring your nervous system, getting comfortable with the unknown, healing self sabotaging behaviors, and becoming the adult you want to be. This is a very bold and grandiose aspiration, as there are many people who spend their whole life struggling and never achieve any of these things. It would be very easy to dismiss this type of work as fluffy or "woo woo" or unrealistic (I know I have in the past), however I think it is Ginny's value that starts to make this feel real and possible.

For her, "self-honesty" is the name of the game. She fully acknowledges she is shooting for the moon with her work, which is why a "quick fix" cannot be the answer. It takes deep, ego eliminating, self reflection to be truly honest with yourself and address your root issues. There is no magic here, no "woo woo" and that's actually that's what I loved most of about this conversation. There was a thread throughout that balanced the logical with the intuitive, the mind with the body, the right brain with the left brain. 

We hit a lot of interesting topics but maybe the most interesting was the self-love, inner child work. A major hurdle in being honest with yourself is the fear that you might uncover you're a bad person. Cognitive dissonance kicks in and makes it really hard for us to acknowledge our own issues. But the way Ginny tries to address this is to accept the idea that it is not your fault. The programming and conditioning we subconsciously developed through our early childhood years is the root of a lot of our issues. Therefore the idea is that you are not responsible for the way that programming impacted your life up to this point, you are only responsible going forward now that you are aware of it. There is so much to unpack in that, so we did our best to explore as much as we could.

Steven is a co-author (with his dad) of the book "Milestone to Manhood: A Christian Rite of Passage to Help Your 13-Year-Old Son Make the Leap from Boyhood to Manhood." In the book he shares his firsthand experience of his "Rite of Passage" weekend, how it shaped him into the man that he is today, and the tools needed to organize a Rite of Passage for your own son. There was so much in this I found interesting to discuss, along with how it related to his most important value of "getting his children into heaven."

Obviously there is a heavy faith based component to Steven's beliefs, so we discussed up front what led him to such a deep belief in God and some of the assumptions he might be making. But we quickly segued to the discussion of "being a man." Steven shared what his rite of passage meant for him and how his life changed when his father, grandfather, and uncles told him he was officially a man. It was really interesting to hear what the experience was all about, particularly how much emphasis they put on having open discussions about the "full spectrum" of being a man. It is not just about being a protector or feeling strong, sometimes being a man is about asking for help or dealing with pain or sadness.

We also talked a lot about the negative connotation "being a man" can have in today's world. As we know, there are many that believe the patriarchy and other attributes of "traditional" men have caused a lot of the suffering throughout human history. There are others that don't believe the term "man" or "woman" is even applicable to who we are as individuals. I really appreciated Steven being willing to swim around in these topics and being open to considering other views, while also sharing his personal beliefs. One of the things that stuck out with me most was when we asked the very direct question, "what does it mean to be a man?" and his response was, at it's core it is someone who is willing to self-sacrifice and live for other people not just himself. I thought that was a really beautiful way to put it and, in many ways, it describes what it means to just be a decent human. 

Amanda is an author (Divine. Messy. Human. A Spiritual Guide to Prioritising Internal Truth over External Influence), Kinesiologist, Mentor, Archetypal Life Coach, Mother and more. She describes herself as a recovering people-pleaser and self-flagellator, who walks the path straddling the Divine and Messy daily. Amanda stated "self mastery" as her most important value because she views always growing, developing and learning new ways of being as the best way to, hopefully, one day leave the Earth better than she found it.

There is a very pragmatic and practical thread to Amanda's value. In simple terms, if you can "master" yourself then you are better equipped to do whatever it is you set out to accomplish in the world. The better you know your values, triggers, insecurities, passion, trauma, and the rest of all the stuff that makes us, us, then the more efficiently you can move through the world. Although the value is about "self", Amanda views it as one of the most generous things you can do, because once you master yourself you can better interact and serve those around you.

As with many of the discussion we have on this show, you won't get much of an argument from me on that concept, however it does become a question of how do we make it real for us in every day life? What does it mean to "master" ourselves, how do we go about doing it, what role should external input play into the process, and is it true that our ultimate mission is to serve others (just to name a few)? Amanda was totally game and was able to talk about her past experiences struggling with her own identity as a real life use case to explain how this can all work. 

What I found really interesting is that at the root of this approach to life is a deep faith in humanity. The belief is that if we trust each individual to figure out who they are and what works for them (no matter what that might be) the world will be better off. If we embrace self love and acceptance rather than external validation and conditioning, there will be a lot more love in the world. I'd be lying if I said I had that same level of faith in humanity, but maybe that is just reflective of the work I still have to do on myself.

Peace. What a concept. There is so much to unpack in that word. When I hear it I get a visceral reaction to it. It's as if my mind and body are deeply conditioned to appreciate it. I don't know how to explain it other than it feels good. It feels like where we are meant to be. Yet for so many of us, it also feels like something so elusive. We spend so much of our lives searching, fighting, and yearning for peace--what a paradox. That is why I was so happy to talk to my guest today, Erica, who stated peace as her most important value. 

As way of background, Erica is an author and the founder of Disrupter University, a community of scholars who support educators and administrators through cultural awareness training, equity-based climate coaching, and community programs. That paradox shows up again when you consider the work Erica does around equity and inclusion. There is so much tension and conflict in this work, it doesn't seem like there would be a lot of peace to be had in it. However, Erica articulated so beautifully how she thinks about this paradox. Peace is not about everything working out the way you hoped or some utopian destination we will ever reach. The world is far too complicated and at times ugly for that to be definition. For Erica, peace is rooted in hope that things can change and confidence that you've done the best you can do. That sounds simple, but it is a messy, pain-staking journey to try to find this peace. 

We didn't only reflect on this in an abstract, philosophical way though. Erica and I spoke about her experiences as a child, as a college basketball player, and as an educator that molded her into the person she is today. We also spoke about how these topics play out in the equity work she does, dealing with issues like racism and police brutality. And, maybe my favorite part of the discussion, we spent time talking about how finding peace has allowed her to become a much more effective and empathetic educator. Erica has a perspective and self-awareness that is extremely rare, so it was truly a pleasure to have this conversation with her.

Richard is a licensed psychologist, author (The Zero Method), and podcast host (Richard Listens), who spent time working with community leaders and the Los Angeles Police Department on Skid Row to save hundreds of lives on the brink of suicide. He now works with men, women, athletes, teens, and trauma victims in his private practice. Through all of these experiences, Richard has identified connectivity with other people as the most important value in his life. He believes that human connection allows us to experience life in a much deeper, fuller way. There is a trust and emotional alignment that comes with true connection that allows you to be more free and open.

As often happens on this show, I spent a good bit of the episode playing the cynic. I actually do believe (although it took me a while to get there in my own life) that human connection does significantly improve our lives, but it then begs the question why don't we do more of it? We know all the surface level reasons, technology, busy lives, pressure to achieve; but if human connection really is as valuable as we say it is, why is it so hard for us to do it? Are we too self involved, too lazy, or too jaded on life? We worked through all these ideas and Richard had some intriguing insights for each of them.

Towards the end of the conversation, we landed on this concept of acceptance. We talked about how important it is to accept the, at times inconvenient, reality of life which is that we have to be somewhat selfish. We may aspire to connect more and help others more, but the truth is there is a limit. It takes a lot of energy, vulnerability, and humility to truly connect with people. As much as we'd all love to be amazing people who find the time to do it as much as possible, we can't. We have to accept the fact that our own selfish needs require us to stop worrying about other people and just focus on ourselves sometimes. Big thanks to Richard for being on and sharing his experience and insight.

Chancellor is an author ("'14 Days in Beijing', an unforgettable tale of my experience being locked up abroad in China"), an educator, coach, and former collegiate football player. He is a believer that teaching people to think critically is necessary for their growth and allowing them to achieve their purpose in life. No where is it more important to think critically than about yourself. Chancellor chose "knowing yourself" as his most important value because without it is too easy to get lost in life (lost in the sauce, as he would put it). If you don't know who you are, where you came from, and what you are meant to be doing; then this whole thing is a big guessing game.

What I thought was really insightful from this discussion with Chancellor was how he explained what it takes to truly know yourself. He referenced Nipsey Hussle and the "marathon" of life, the idea that knowing yourself is a life long journey, filled with mistakes, and requires extreme resiliency to actually achieve it. Maybe the most distinguishing quality of people like Nipsey, who do get there, is just that they never quit. There is something about that concept that can be both deeply comforting and encouraging but at the same time terrifying and discouraging. We just need to keep moving forward and keep striving to be the best version of ourselves, if we do that we will "make it." But moving forward, picking ourselves back up after we mess up, and never quitting very well might be the hardest thing we ever have to do in our lives. It can be terrifying to realize that is what is required of us, but that is what makes it so powerful. 

Chancellor is one of those people who pairs having lived through a ton of really interesting and challenging experiences in his life, with a really self-reflective, philosophical mindset. It makes sense he is a coach and educator, because those are the types of people who can truly understand, firsthand, what it looks like to overcome adversity. It was super insightful to kick around topics like God, free will, hate, and the meaning of life with him. Big thanks to Chancellor for being on and sharing his perspective.

Hami is a husband, father, CEO/founder, & best selling author. He started his company 6AMRun.com to improve the physical abilities of his members by helping them have motion and stay in motion. They've created a really supportive community that helps drive that mission and helps their members be their best selves. As you might imagine, "physical fitness" is pretty important to Hami and is ultimately the value that he thinks drives everything he's been able to do in his life.

I think understanding the role physical fitness plays, not just in our health, but in our mental well being, confidence, motivation, and overall quality of life is fascinating. As Hami articulated in the conversation physical fitness can become this "north star", objective measure to determine what we are capable of in our lives. Obviously family, happiness, honesty, and all of the other potential values are really important as well, but being able to commit to your own physical fitness first builds the discipline, confidence, and motivation to thrive in other areas of your life. 

I think that "objective" point is a really important one too. It is so easy for our minds to spin stories and justify our action (or inaction), but when it comes to physical fitness it is kind of as close to objective as we get. We know we need to be healthy to live long lives, so the benefit is clear. But beyond that, if you set a goal to run 5 miles, or do 100 push ups, or get a yoga session in-- you either did it or you didn't. You reached your target or you missed. And that objective measure is really useful to build the muscle of being honest with ourselves.

What I also really appreciated about this discussion with Hami was that we explored the counter argument to all of this. We acknowledged that being so dedicated to your physical fitness can be a burden and can come at a cost. He used some stories from his own life, including with his daughter, to illustrate the challenge of balancing between the discipline required to embody this value, with the joy and creativity that comes from being free and unburdened. This was a really insightful, authentic conversation so big thanks to Hami for being on and sharing his perspective.

Tyler is an accomplished film and stage performer and has appeared in productions including Freddy Vs Jason, Door to Door, Carrie, and the musical Ragtime. One if his biggest passions is helping others confidently take the stage and impact an audience with their stories, which he talks about in his best-selling book "The Power to Speak Naked." As I looked into Tyler and learned more about him from this conversation, it became apparent very quickly he is a hard worker and is involved in a lot things. I think that is why his value of "integrity" is so important to him. 

As Tyler explained it, integrity is about staying true to your word and doing the things you committed to doing. That is an unbelievably simple concept, but as we talked about during the show it can be extremely difficult to actually do. For Tyler though, it is the only way. There is so much complexity in our lives, competing priorities, and limited time/resources; so the only way to navigate it all is to hold yourself accountable to your word. 

One of the aspects of this conversation I really enjoyed was the mathematical logic Tyler used to explain his value and approach to life. We talked about the intricate "if, then, or" statements our minds are constantly running to try to determine the best decisions for us. We use this logic to identify our biases, assumptions, and blind spots to gain the most clarity we can. If that sounds exhausting and burdensome--it is. This isn't necessarily easy work to do, but the pay off is the peace and freedom to know that at the minimum, even if everything goes wrong, you were being thoughtful and in line with your stated values.

My favorite part of the discussion was when we used ourselves as a case study to test this "logical computation" of integrity. I unfortunately had to postpone our original recording date because of a family issue and this ran head first into the integrity conversation we were having. In theory, we are supposed to stick to our word and do the things we committed to do. So rather than do the polite thing and shy away from this topic, Tyler and I dove head first into it and had an authentic discussion about how he felt about me cancelling. 

Reverend Celeste is an ordained Religious Science minister, an author of books ("Divine Work Play" and “In Spirit, In Love”), articles, and screenplays, a podcast host, and a speaker. Celeste started the episode by stating Love as her most important value. I write it as big "L" Love because her definition of love is kind of all encompassing. It is God, our spirit, our life force, our joy, our motivations-- all of it. As she put it, "Love has no opposite, it is the absolute power." It is our desire to give and to receive, it is what makes nature and the universe function. 

I found these words beautiful and moving, but at the start of the conversation I struggled to understand them in logical, practical terms. As we acknowledged during the show, part of that struggle was because I was trying to understand a deeply spiritual topic in a very logical, mechanical way. And sometimes words just can't do these concepts justice. But I don't think that was the full disconnect. This was just one of those episodes where it took some time to really understand Celeste's perspective. At some points there might have even seemed to be a bit of frustration as I was trying to probe and prod to find the logical thread of the value of "Love" and its real world implications.

But as Celeste continued to work through it all with me, I think we came to an understanding at the end.  At times, Celeste spoke of this "utopia" that would exist if we all embraced Love the way she was suggesting. I wanted to understand what that looked like and exactly how Love can create a perfect world. I wanted to know the practical application in our daily lives so that we can achieve the highest level of living. It took me a while to get there, but eventually I heard her as she stated (maybe ironically) this utopia is actually not perfect. It is still full of conflict, pain, and struggle. What makes it a utopia is that when we do get it wrong and suffering is caused; we have the ability to access that Love, recognize our mistake, and try to be better. 

As I often say, I really hope she is right in that view. That would be a beautiful world. There is a part of me that fears there is still too much subjectivity in "right vs wrong" and "better and worse" that will never allow us to reach that utopia, but I sincerely hope I am wrong.

My guest, Michelle, caught my attention right away with her bio/description: "I build high-value men who get what they want. I coach men to achieve their goals by helping them gain greater self-awareness."  I found myself wondering, what is a high value man? How do you coach men to build self-awareness? Why is Michelle focused on only coaching men? And why is she so confident she knows how to help them get what they want? So naturally I had to reach out to see if I could learn more about her, how she thinks, and what she values.

Michelle stated living into her purpose as the most important value, but interestingly she started off by explaining that our purpose isn't necessarily fixed. She covered this during the show as she explained the journey she has been on from doing project management in the aerospace industry, starting her own contracting business, starting her own blog, and to now becoming an author (Man Up: A Basic Bro’s Guide to Self-Awareness) and life coach. She did most of this as a single mom to two boys after a difficult divorce from her husband. Throughout all of this she built a ton of self awareness about herself and was able to figure out what lit her up. She realized if you are unafraid to live into your purpose that is the key to happiness above all else.

We spent a good bit of time talking about purpose and how you identify it, but also talked a lot about being parents. We asked some hard but important questions like is your purpose more important than your kids? And, what is the difference between being a selfish, bad parent and a parent who lives into their purpose to make a better life for their kids? We of course got into the "high value men" piece too. Michelle explained how her experience working in male dominated industries and trying to find love again after her divorce gave her some deep insights into men. So we dug into that as well to better understand her insights and how true they were.