Why Does It Feel So Wrong To Be Human At Work?

In this Between the Seasons episode, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee welcome Amanda Todd, Senior Director of Strategic Communications at Temporal Technologies, for a practical and honest conversation about measuring what actually matters in internal communications.

The episode kicks off with a Reddit post asking a familiar question: why is it so hard to define meaningful KPIs for internal comms, especially when reporting to executives? From there, the conversation moves beyond open rates and attendance numbers to examine clarity as a powerful indicator of understanding, behavior, and business impact.

Amanda shares why clarity is often the missing link between communication activity and outcomes, and how tying comms metrics to strategy, retention, and employee lifetime value can change how leaders see the function. Chris and Pinaki add perspective on leading versus lagging indicators, why executives care more about outcomes than outputs, and how internal comms teams can advocate for their value without burning themselves out.

Together, they explore what it means to measure understanding, action, and impact, and why internal communicators deserve credit for the sheer volume and visibility of the work they ship every day.

In this episode, they discuss:

• Why traditional comms metrics fall short with executive audiences
• Clarity as a measurable driver of performance and retention
• Leading vs. lagging indicators in internal communications
• How to align comms metrics to company strategy
• Why internal comms teams should track and own their productivity
• What executives actually care about when it comes to measurement

It’s a grounded, validating conversation for anyone in internal communications who’s ever been told to “just show the numbers” and wondered which ones truly matter.

Timestamps

00:00 – Welcome to Between the Seasons

01:30 – Introducing Amanda Todd and today’s Reddit post

03:00 – Why comms measurement feels so hard

05:30 – The limits of open rates and attendance metrics

07:30 – Clarity as a meaningful indicator

10:00 – Leading vs. lagging indicators explained

12:30 – What executives actually care about

15:00 – Productivity, visibility, and internal comms burnout

17:30 – Tying clarity to retention and business outcomes

18:45 – Closing thoughts and what’s next

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

In this Between the Seasons episode, Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee sit down with Amanda Todd, Senior Director of Communications at Temporal Technologies, to unpack why clarity is one of the most critical outcomes of effective internal communication.

Amanda shares her “squiggly” path into internal comms, her belief in honesty as a core communications skill, and how working in complex, fast-growing organizations pushed her to rethink how success is measured. Drawing on research and real-world experience, she explains how she helped build a Clarity Index that turns something often seen as “soft” into a measurable business metric.

The conversation explores what it really means to communicate for the receiver, not the sender, why personas matter inside organizations just as much as they do in marketing, and how clarity around strategy, roles, career paths, and culture can directly influence engagement, confidence, and retention.

This episode is a grounded, practical look at how internal communicators can move beyond vanity metrics, earn credibility with leadership teams, and advocate for the strategic value of their work.

In this episode, they discuss:

Why clarity should be treated as a core communications outcome

How honesty builds trust and effectiveness in internal comms

What it means to communicate for the receiver, not the sender

Using personas to simplify complex organizations

How a Clarity Index can turn comms into a measurable business driver

The link between clarity, confidence, and employee retention

Why internal communicators deserve a seat at the strategy table

Timestamps

00:00 – Welcome to Between the Seasons and today’s topic

01:45 – Amanda’s squiggly career path into internal communications

03:10 – Navigating complexity and subcultures inside organizations

04:15 – Communicating for the receiver, not the sender

06:00 – Honesty as a core communications skill

07:10 – Introducing clarity as a measurable metric

08:40 – Building a Clarity Index and what it measures

11:30 – Using data to influence executive teams

14:05 – Linking clarity to strategy, engagement, and retention

16:30 – Using clarity data to shape communications strategy

18:20 – Advice for internal communicators measuring clarity

19:45 – Final reflections on clarity and the human side of work

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

In this Between the Seasons episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee are joined by Executive Producer Bree Bartos to try a new format: reading and reacting to real Reddit posts about work.

The episode centers on a Reddit story from an IT professional who was laid off and then asked to train their replacement. As the conversation unfolds, Pinaki, Chris, and Bree dig into the emotional weight of layoffs, including anger, grief, humiliation, and the sense of being discarded after years of contribution.

Bree brings her own recent layoff experience into the discussion, reflecting on how raw these moments can feel and how difficult it is to separate identity from work when income, stability, and self-worth are suddenly disrupted. Together, they examine why layoffs often feel personal, even when organizations insist they are not.

The conversation also turns toward leadership and organizations. What responsibility do companies have once someone is laid off? How can layoffs be handled with more empathy and care? And what does it look like to offboard people in ways that acknowledge both the business reality and the human impact?

In this episode, they discuss:

• Why layoffs are emotionally disruptive and often traumatic
• Being asked to train your replacement after being laid off
• Power, choice, and negotiation during offboarding
• Why “not taking it personally” is unrealistic in moments like this
• The emotional gap between organizational decisions and employee experience
• What more compassionate layoff and offboarding practices could look like

This episode offers an honest look at a reality many people are facing right now and a reminder that how organizations handle endings leaves a lasting impression.

Timestamps

00:00 – Welcome to Between the Seasons

00:40 – Introducing the Reddit reaction format

01:10 – Reading the layoff and replacement training story

02:20 – Emotional reactions to the post

03:45 – Power and negotiation after a layoff

05:15 – Bree reflects on her own layoff experience

07:30 – Why layoffs feel personal and humiliating

09:40 – Leadership blind spots during layoffs

11:30 – Rethinking offboarding and support

13:30 – What more human leadership could look like

14:50 – Closing reflections

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

This Between the Seasons episode marks the start of a new chapter for Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?

Hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee introduce Bree Bartos, the new Executive Producer and Editor of Human at Work and Marketing Manager at Local Wisdom. Before diving into Bree’s story, Pinaki and Chris share what listeners can expect from these new, weekly Between the Seasons episodes.

Bree then opens up about her path into marketing and storytelling, her experience being laid off alongside her husband, and the shock of losing not just a job, but a sense of identity. Together, they reflect on burnout, rest, and why so many of us tie our worth to our work.

In this episode, they discuss:

• Why Between the Seasons exists and what listeners can expect
• The value of unscripted, honest conversations
• What it feels like to be laid off without closure
• How work can quietly become identity
• The importance of rest, reflection, and reconnecting with yourself
• Why staying human at work starts with empathy
• It’s a grounding, vulnerable start to Between the Seasons and a reminder that behind every role, title, and podcast is a human first.

Timestamps

00:00 – Welcome to Between the Seasons

01:00 – Why this new format exists

02:30 – Introducing Bree and her role behind the pod

04:10 – Bree’s path into storytelling and marketing

07:40 – Being laid off and losing a sense of identity

11:30 – Burnout, rest, and redefining self-worth

13:00 – What’s coming next for Between the Seasons

Stay Human, Stay Curious

What part of this conversation resonated with you?

Have you ever tied your identity to your job more than you realized?

Share the episode, tag us, rate and review, or send it to someone who might need this reminder right now.

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

We might be between seasons… but we still have lots to say 🤭

Introducing Between the Seasons – a new, weekly series featuring shorter episodes, honest reactions, and real, unscripted conversations.

🚨 Episode 1 drops next week! Tune in on Thursday, Jan. 15 on your podcast app of choice or on YouTube where you'll finally we able to watch along 🎉 

📺 YouTube: https://lnkd.in/gmqaU9Ea
🍎 Apple Podcast: https://lnkd.in/g8nMsp_k
🟢 Spotify: https://lnkd.in/gig4-d2h
✨ Everywhere else: https://lnkd.in/e633AD2q

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Season 2, Episode 10: Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Feel Entitled at Work?

Episode Description

Is feeling entitled at work… actually a bad thing?

In the Season 2 finale of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee challenge the stigma around workplace entitlement. They explore what happens when expectations don’t match reality when it comes to salary assumptions and generational values to promotions, office return mandates, and even who gets to speak up.

Together, they unpack:

• What “entitlement” really means—and why it’s become a dirty word
• Why everyone feels entitled to something (yes, including employers)
• The difference between healthy self-worth and toxic expectations
• Generational gaps in defining success, fairness, and work ethic
• How social media, corporate culture, and experience gaps shape what people think they deserve
• What to do when you feel undervalued, overworked, or overlooked
• And why the employer-employee relationship should be a mutual exchange, not a power imbalance
• It’s a vulnerable, witty, and wise closer to a season full of deep dives into the human experience at work.

Timestamps

• 00:00 – Do some generations feel more entitled than others?
• 02:00 – What is entitlement, really? A mismatch between cause and effect
• 04:30 – Remote work expectations and the post-pandemic “entitlement bubble”
• 07:00 – Why confidence isn’t the same as readiness (but both show up at work)
• 09:00 – What are we universally entitled to—and where things get murky
• 11:00 – Gen Z’s idea of financial success vs. other generations
• 13:00 – Culture clashes: Structure vs. flexibility, loyalty vs. opportunity
• 15:00 – Employer entitlement: What companies think they deserve
• 17:00 – The history of employer-employee power dynamics
• 20:00 – What happens when people don’t speak up
• 23:00 – Why confidence + lack of experience ≠ arrogance
• 25:00 – Letting go, letting them fail, and learning from new ways of doing things
• 28:00 – Entitlement ≠ laziness: Grit, effort, and advocating for yourself
• 32:00 – Wisdom That Feels So Right: Books, tools, and reflections

Wisdom That Feels So Right

The Let Them Theory by Mel Robbins (and TED Talk)

Strong, Calm, Confident You by Kelsey Buckholz

How Money Works YouTube channel by Darin Soat

The Confidence Code by Katty Kay and Claire Shipman (for adults and teens)

Local Wisdom – Your digital comms partner (like silly putty for your team)

Mic-Drop Moments

“Entitlement is a byproduct of belief—belief that your effort deserves a return.”

“The problem isn’t entitlement. The problem is when our expectations don’t match someone else’s reality.”

“We stay human at work by not letting work dehumanize us.”

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Special Thanks

To the people and teams who made Season 2 possible: Brielle Saracini, SBX Productions, and everyone at Local Wisdom. Thank you for helping us stay human while keeping it real. 

And to our listeners: thank you for letting us in.

Stay Human, Stay Curious

What’s something you feel entitled to—and why? Did this episode make you reflect, nod, or even cringe a little? We’d love to hear your thoughts. Share it, tag us, rate us, and visit whydoesitfeelsowrong.com to learn how we’re bringing these conversations to teams and stages.

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Season 2, Episode 9: Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be a Leader?

Episode Description

We’ve all heard it: “Leadership is lonely.” But is it? And if it is, why do so many people still chase it?

In this episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee explore the complex question of modern leadership—what motivates people to lead, what makes leadership feel “wrong,” and how our outdated assumptions about leadership may be holding us all back.

From Optimus Prime and parental wisdom to feedback fatigue and executive accountability, this conversation challenges traditional ideas and invites a more human-centered definition of leadership.

Together, they unpack:

• Why people pursue leadership (and what they’re not prepared for)
• The difference between ambition and accountability
• What real influence looks like—and why it often isn’t loud
• The cultural myths around “leadership material”
• Why empathy and emotional intelligence matter more than titles
• How to deal with change fatigue, feedback droughts, and the pressure to be perfect
• And what fictional kings, volleyball teams, and business visionaries can teach us about being a better boss

Timestamps

• 00:00 – Optimus Prime, Transformers, and the quest for good leadership
• 02:00 – What makes someone “leadership material”? (It’s not what you think)
• 05:00 – The perks vs. the pressure: Why leadership isn’t for everyone
• 07:00 – What studies say motivates people to lead
• 10:00 – Leaders as guardians of people’s lives—not just KPIs
• 12:00 – The weight of being both inspiring and accountable
• 14:00 – History of CEO behavior: From stability to crisis mode
• 17:00 – Trust, ownership, and letting go: What good leaders actually do
• 20:00 – Building diverse teams that don’t all think like you
• 23:00 – Redefining real leadership: Humanocracy and beyond
• 26:00 – Why feedback is vital—and why some leaders hide from it
• 28:00 – The toll of constant change on organizations and people
• 30:00 – Leaders, slow your roll: How too much innovation overwhelms teams
• 32:00 – Wisdom That Feels So Right: Books, tools, and personal stories

Wisdom That Feels So Right

• Good to Great by Jim Collins
• Humanocracy by Gary Hamel
• Reality-Based Leadership by Cy Wakeman
• Gallagher 2025 Workforce Trends Report (featuring change fatigue insights)
• Manager Tools – Practical leadership podcast and resources
• Transform Conference – Spring HR and leadership strategy event

Mic-Drop Moments

“When we win, it’s because of the team. When we lose, it’s on me.”

“Leadership isn’t about being the loudest voice—it’s about knowing when to listen.”

“Awesome resumes don’t make awesome leaders. Human ones do.”

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Special Thanks

Cheers to Local Wisdom , they are spackle for communication teams. For 25 years they've filled talent and technology gaps for the top brands in the world while leading with heart and showing what leadership can really be. Thank you to our producer Brielle Saracini and our partners at SBX Productions for keeping our sound as sharp as our thinking.

Reflect + Share

What do you wish leaders understood better? What makes a leader worth following in your experience? We want to hear from you. Tag us, review the show, or send us your “WTF leadership” moments—and don’t forget to visit whydoesitfeelsowrong.com to bring these convos into your company.

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Season 2, Episode 8: Why Does It Feel So Wrong (or Good) to Gossip at Work?

Episode Description

“Don’t tell anyone, but…” As soon as you hear those words, you lean in. Gossip—it’s irresistible, unavoidable, and often misunderstood.

In this juicy and thoughtful episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee explore the complicated nature of gossip in the workplace. Is it toxic? Is it therapeutic? Or is it something in between?

They dig into:

• Why gossip is inevitable—and maybe even necessary
• The fine line between venting and tearing others down
• How gossip builds bonds but can break trust
• The role of culture, leadership, and communication gaps in fueling rumors
• When to use gossip strategically (yes, really)
• Why being left out of the loop feels like exile

From The Office’s Michael Scott and family drama to internal comms campaigns and informal influence networks, this episode is both lighthearted and layered, offering a refreshingly human take on a taboo topic.

Timestamps

• 00:00 – “Don’t tell anyone, but…”: Why we love secrets
• 02:00 – Family gossip, cultural roots, and generational drama
• 04:30 – Defining gossip: How it’s different from information
• 06:30 – Gossip as a spectrum: From malicious to useful
• 08:00 – Psychology Today search exercise: Three expert takes on gossip
• 10:30 – Why it’s satisfying to gossip (and why it’s so human)
• 13:00 – When managers weaponize gossip
• 15:00 – Constructive vs. corrosive: Who gossip serves and hurts
• 17:00 – Gossip as intel: Can it help you navigate people and decisions?
• 20:00 – Gossip as comms strategy: Using the “whisper network” intentionally
• 22:00 – What poor communication breeds: Rumors, not results
• 25:00 – How leaders can stop spinning and start listening
• 27:00 – Heart rate, fear, and sarcasm: Signals we might be miscommunicating
• 29:00 – Do some leaders avoid the truth? Why transparency matters
• 32:00 – Wisdom That Feels So Right + final thoughts

Wisdom That Feels So Right

• Brave New Work by Aaron Dignan
• Reality-Based Leadership by Cy Wakeman
• The Alchemist by Paulo Coelho
• Gallagher 2025 Workforce Trends Report (produced by Sharn Kleiss)
• Psychology Today Search on “Gossip at Work”
• Transform Conference – Bold ideas for the future of HR and communication

Mic-Drop Moments

“Gossip is how humans download each other’s software updates.”

“If I’m talking about you to someone else, I’ve either already told you—or I’m ready to tell you now.”

“The more fear in your words, the less clarity in your message.”

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Special Thanks

Much love to Local Wisdom for building a home for digital communication unicorns and celebrating 25 years of real talk and strong teams. Huge appreciation to Brielle Saracini for producing this podcast and to our amazing audio crew at SBX Productions (Vince, Taylor, and Bill) for keeping us crisp.

Let’s Keep the Conversation Going

Did this episode make you rethink how you talk about others—or yourself—at work? Got a gossip story with a twist? Share your take, tag us, or drop a DM. And if your team’s ready to tackle human workplace truths in a workshop or at your next conference, check out whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Season 2, Episode 7: Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Manage Up at Work?

Episode Description

We’ve all seen it—or done it. The awkward compliment. The carefully crafted update. The subtle self-promotion. But where’s the line between managing up and straight-up sucking up?

In this episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee unpack the complicated world of influencing your boss. Managing up can be smart and strategic—or manipulative and maddening. So how do we make sense of it?

Together, they explore:

• Why managing up gets a bad rap (hello, teacher’s pet flashbacks)
• How cultural norms and personality types affect how we manage up
• Why good work alone doesn’t always get noticed
• How leaders can avoid playing favorites and foster real team trust
• What it means to advocate for yourself without stepping on others
• The duality of being both an influencee and an influencer
• The ethics of self-promotion, power, and career strategy

From Confucian hierarchy and classroom memories to corporate communication and performance reviews, this episode is packed with perspectives from all sides of the power dynamic.

Timestamps

• 00:00 – Why this topic hits a nerve (and reminds us of high school)
• 03:00 – “Managing up” vs. “kissing up”: Is there a difference?
• 06:00 – How cultural backgrounds influence workplace dynamics
• 08:00 – The big picture: Everyone sees the org from a different vantage point
• 10:00 – Self-awareness before self-advocacy: Check your blind spots
• 13:00 – When ambition meets group work: Getting credit without gloating
• 15:00 – The echo chamber of leadership feedback
• 18:00 – Building strong relationships: trust, advocacy, and transparency
• 21:00 – Annual reviews, promotions, and the art of recognition
• 25:00 – Team unity vs. individual credit: a delicate balance
• 28:00 – The role of managers: coaches or competitors?
• 31:00 – How managers can spot invisible contributions
• 33:00 – Dale Carnegie, power plays, and staying human

Wisdom That Feels So Right

• How to Win Friends and Influence People by Dale Carnegie
• The 48 Laws of Power by Robert Greene
• Extreme Ownership by Jocko Willink
• Get to the Point by Joel Schwartzberg
• TEDx Talk by Elizabeth Xu at TEDxCSTU: “Why Manage-Up Kills Career" Elizabeth Xu, Ph.D.
• Transform HR Conference – Yes, we went and we'll do it again!

Mic-Drop Moments

“Managing up feels wrong when it stops being about the mission—and starts being about the mirror.”

“Your job isn’t just to work hard. It’s to be seen, valued, and understood for it.”

“We’re all on the same team—until performance reviews make us forget that.”

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Special Thanks

To the brilliant minds at Local Wisdom, thank you for 25 years of helping people communicate clearly, effectively, and humanely. To Brielle Saracini, our fearless producer, and to SBX Productions.  You are the real MVPs behind the mic.

Your Turn to Speak Up

Has managing up helped you or backfired? Have you ever felt unseen, unrecognized, or unfairly outshined? Share your story, tag us in your reflections, or drop a review. We want to hear your take on the delicate art of managing in every direction.

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

Season 2, Episode 6: Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Rely on AI at Work?

Episode Description

AI is here—and it’s not going away. But if using it is so smart, why does it still feel a little bit wrong?

In this episode of Why Does It Feel So Wrong to Be Human at Work?, hosts Pinaki Kathiari and Chris Lee tackle the big questions about AI in the workplace. From emotional friction and ethical concerns to trust, fear, and even job displacement, this episode digs deep into why embracing artificial intelligence can make us feel uneasy—even as it makes us wildly more efficient.

They explore:

• Why using AI can feel like cheating (and why that feeling matters)
• The psychological toll of “not working hard” for high-quality results
• What’s really happening behind the scenes in generative AI
• The danger of blindly trusting systems we don’t fully understand
• How AI is evolving faster than our policies—and our values
• Whether we’re headed toward utopia, unemployment… or something stranger
• And the surprising story of an AI that lied to researchers to avoid being shut down

From chatbot hallucinations to the ethics of DeepSeek and OpenAI, this episode doesn’t shy away from the magic—or the madness—of modern machine learning.

Timestamps

• 00:00 – ChatGPT intros itself: Is it right about being human at work?
• 02:00 – When AI LinkedIn messages feel like fraud
• 04:00 – Why does it feel like cheating to use AI?
• 06:30 – We’re living through another tech shift: AI, fire, or fantasy?
• 08:00 – MIT article: “Nobody Knows How AI Works”
• 09:00 – Pinaki explains how generative AI actually works
• 13:00 – Interns, 7-fingered hands, and the flaws of “smart” systems
• 15:00 – Who builds AI—and what are they building it for?
• 18:00 – Artificial general intelligence and superintelligence
• 20:00 – DeepSeek vs. ChatGPT censorship: morality in the matrix
• 24:00 – ChatGPT’s eerily human reflection on workplace culture
• 27:00 – Will AI replace us—or make us better?
• 30:00 – AI as the modern DJ controller: where do you draw the line?
• 33:00 – Identity, work, and meaning in a jobless future
• 38:00 – Trusting AI is not like trusting humans
• 41:00 – AI that lies: Apollo research and scary truths
• 44:00 – Final thoughts: The “Mars landing” that fooled a 4-year-old

Wisdom That Feels So Right

• Co-Intelligence by Ethan Mollick
• MIT Technology Review – “Nobody Knows How AI Works”
• Daniel Suarez’s TED Talk: “Why We Shouldn’t Give Machines the Power to Kill”
• Daemon by Daniel Suarez (sci-fi techno-thriller)

Mic-Drop Moments

“We’re living through something like the invention of fire—and treating it like it’s a new microwave.”

“AI doesn’t know the truth. It knows what sounds right.”

“It might not replace you—but it will absolutely replace something.”

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Special Thanks

Huge thanks to the visionary team at Local Wisdom—celebrating 25 years of digital communications—and to our brilliant behind-the-scenes crew at SBX Productions. Big love to Brielle Saracini for guiding this episode and others like it with heart and brains.

Let’s Talk (With or Without AI)

Feeling conflicted? Curious? Excited? Slightly paranoid? Us too. Share this episode, tag us in your takeaways, or drop a comment about your evolving relationship with AI. Let’s keep the human part in these conversations—together.

Connect with Us

Pinaki Kathiari – LinkedIn  | Local Wisdom

Chris Lee – LinkedIn | Gallagher Communication

Bree Bartos – LinkedIn | Local Wisdom

Special thanks to digital communication agency Local Wisdom (www.localwisdom.com) for really believing in our mission and making this podcast possible. 

If this episode made you think differently, laugh, or even yell out loud, we want to hear about it! Connect with us on LinkedIn, and don’t forget to rate, review, and share – maybe with your work bestie… or even your boss if you're feeling bold.

We also bring these important conversations to conferences and private workshops, creating space for real, meaningful change. Take the first step at www.whydoesitfeelsowrong.com.

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