Since his bestselling novel On Earth We’re Briefly Gorgeous debuted in 2019, Ocean Vuong has become one of the most beloved writers of his generation. He first sat with Sam in 2021 amid the pandemic.

Today, Vuong returns to discuss the personal history within his latest novel, The Emperor of Gladness—a piece of fiction that draws from the contours of his own coming-of-age in East Hartford, Connecticut (5:43). We begin with the class dynamics at the heart of the book (9:27), the surrogate family he found working at Boston Market (21:22), and his formative college years in New York City (28:18).

On the back half, we walk through how Ocean’s work continues to honor the memory of his late mother (36:48), the devastating impact of the opioid crisis (41:40), and his own journey to sobriety (45:03). To close, Vuong reflects on the childlike wonder behind his poem “Dear Sara” from Time Is a Mother (1:04:52), why he still loves teaching creative writing (1:18:30), and how all of these experiences deliver him back to the page, each and every day (1:26:00).

Watch our conversation on YouTube. Thoughts or future guest ideas? Email us at [email protected].

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