2 Pastors and a Mic

For generations, many of us have been taught that God's wrath is His anger directed toward sinful people. But what if we've misunderstood it?

In this final message of the Reframe series, Cory explores one of the most misunderstood themes in Scripture and asks a simple but profound question: If Jesus is the perfect revelation of the Father, what does that mean for how we understand God's wrath?

Looking through the lens of Jesus, this message challenges the idea of an angry, punitive God and presents a different picture—one where God's wrath is His relentless love confronting everything that distorts, enslaves, and dehumanizes us. Rather than destroying people, God's passion is aimed at destroying the lies that keep us from knowing who we've always been.

Together, we explore:
• What the Bible actually means by "wrath"
• Why Romans 1 says God "gave them over"
• How Jesus redefined God's character
• Why the cross reveals reconciliation, not divine retaliation
• The difference between fear-driven religion and love-driven transformation
• How God's consuming fire purifies instead of punishes

00:00 - Introduction & Why We're Revisiting Reframe
02:35 - My Journey of Unlearning and Relearning
06:20 - Week 5: Reframing God's Wrath
09:28 - From Fear-Driven Thinking to Peace-Filled Living
12:25 - What If Wrath Isn't God's Anger?
15:35 - The Church's View of Wrath Changed
16:19 - God Is Love, God Is Light
17:52 - The Meaning of "Wrath" in Scripture
19:10 - Romans: Wrath as Natural Consequences
21:32 - Jerusalem, 70 AD & Rejecting Love
24:00 - God's Fire Purifies, Not Punishes
25:11 - Jesus Corrects the Old View of Wrath
29:01 - The Cross Reveals God's True Heart
32:04 - The Old Lens vs. The New Lens
33:29 - Living From Love Instead of Fear
38:09 - Closing Prayer & Final Encouragement

In this message from our Reframe series, we tackle one of the most foundational beliefs many Christians have never questioned: Were you actually born with a sinful nature?

For many of us, the Christian story began in Genesis 3—with sin, shame, and separation. But what if the biblical story actually begins in Genesis 1—with blessing, identity, and belovedness?

Together, we explore the history of the doctrine of original sin, the biblical case for original blessing, what the Greek word hamartia (sin) really means, and why your understanding of your identity shapes the way you experience God, yourself, and others.

This conversation isn't about minimizing sin. It's about asking whether we've misunderstood its origin, its purpose, and ultimately the good news of the Gospel.

In this episode we discuss:
- Why the biblical story begins with blessing before brokenness
- Original blessing vs. original sin
- What hamartia actually means in the Greek
- Did Adam pass down a sinful nature—or a distorted story?
- Why Romans should be read as one complete argument
- The difference between "flesh" and "sin nature"
- How identity, not shame, becomes the starting point for transformation
- Why Jesus came to reveal who you've always been

00:00 – Welcome & Introducing the Reframe Series
02:26 – You've Always Been in Union
04:29 – Why This Series Is Challenging
06:08 – Learning to Think, Not What to Think
08:31 – The Purpose of Reframe
10:35 – You Were Not Born Sinful
12:28 – Does the Bible Begin with Sin or Blessing?
14:06 – Original Blessing vs. Original Sin
16:35 – What Does "Sin" Actually Mean?
20:03 – Adam Didn't Pass Down a Sin Nature
22:28 – Understanding Romans Correctly
27:47 – Adam's Story vs. Jesus' Story
28:38 – What Does "Flesh" Really Mean?
30:03 – Scriptures Supporting Original Blessing
35:27 – Living from Blessing Instead of Shame
39:15 – Prayer & Final Encouragement
40:10 – The Ministry of Reconciliation
41:44 – Church Announcements & Closing

What if God's judgment has never been about condemning you—but restoring you?

For many of us, the word judgment immediately triggers fear. We picture a courtroom, a guilty verdict, and a God waiting to punish our failures. But what if that's not the picture Jesus revealed?

In this message from our Reframe series, Cory challenges one of the most deeply held assumptions in modern Christianity by exploring what Scripture actually says about God's judgment. Looking through the lens of Jesus, he asks whether judgment is primarily retributive or restorative, and how that answer changes everything about the way we relate to God.

Along the way, you'll discover:
- Why fear has become such a common motivator in Christianity.
- How church history shaped our understanding of judgment.
- The difference between a courtroom and a family room.
- Why Henry's adoption story became a powerful picture of God's judgment.
- A fresh look at passages like 2 Corinthians 5, John 3, John 5, and Revelation.
- How Jesus reveals a God whose judgment restores identity instead of destroying people.

00:00 - Introduction & Reframe Series
05:03 - Why This Series Matters
07:31 - Reframing Judgment
09:26 - The Goal: From Fear to Freedom
10:50 - Review: The Battlefield, the Devil & Death
15:04 - God's Judgment Is Restorative
16:03 - Henry's Adoption Changed Everything
19:30 - The Gavel That Changed My Theology
21:00 - Three Church Splits That Shaped Christianity
24:30 - Courtroom or Family Room?
26:33 - Jesus Reveals God's Judgment
28:14 - What About the Great White Throne?
29:17 - Rethinking 2 Corinthians 5
32:22 - The Ministry of Reconciliation
34:27 - Stop Trying to Earn God's Favor
36:01 - Ambassadors, Not Soldiers
37:16 - Judgment Reveals Your True Identity
39:50 - The Sound of the Gavel
41:02 - You Are More Beloved Than You Think
43:15 - This Week's Challenge
45:25 - Closing Prayer
46:14 - Final Encouragement & Next Week's Preview

For generations, many Christians have been taught to fear the devil, demons, and spiritual warfare. But what if we've been asking the wrong questions? What if many of the assumptions we've inherited deserve a fresh look through the lens of Jesus?

In this episode of Two Pastors and a Mic, we continue our Reframe series by exploring one of the most misunderstood subjects in Christianity. Instead of approaching spiritual warfare through fear, we examine what Scripture actually says about Satan, the devil, demons, accusation, ego, and the finished work of Christ.

Together we discuss:
• Why so much of modern spiritual warfare teaching creates fear instead of freedom
• What the words "Satan" and "devil" actually mean in Scripture
• The difference between external evil and the internal voice of accusation
• Why the battlefield is often our thinking, not our surroundings
• How Jesus completely defeated the power of accusation through the cross
• What it means to live from victory instead of constantly fighting for it

00:00 - Introduction & The Reframe Series
02:33 - Our God Reigns
04:20 - Why We Need to Reframe Spiritual Warfare
09:29 - The Battlefield Is the Mind
10:56 - Reframing the Devil
13:37 - Why This Conversation Matters
16:25 - What the Bible Really Says About Demons
20:18 - What Does "Satan" Actually Mean?
25:05 - How the Devil Operates Today
28:23 - Ego, Trauma & Law-Based Thinking
34:18 - Influence vs. Possession
36:44 - Christ Defeated Every Accusation
39:01 - Stand in the Finished Work of Jesus
40:16 - Living Free From Fear
42:19 - Closing Challenge & Final Encouragement

In Part 1 of our summer sermon series highlight, Cory begins the Reframe series by asking one of the biggest questions many Christians have never considered:

What if the spiritual battle we've been taught to fight isn't what the New Testament is actually describing?

For generations, many believers have viewed the Christian life through the lens of spiritual warfare, fear, and unseen enemies. But what if Jesus accomplished more than we've realized? What if the New Testament is inviting us to live from victory instead of constantly fighting for it?

In this first message, Cory walks through Scripture to challenge common assumptions about spiritual warfare, the Armor of God, strongholds, principalities and powers, and what Paul was actually communicating in Ephesians 6. Rather than encouraging believers to live in fear of an ongoing cosmic battle, he presents a Christ-centered perspective that emphasizes identity, peace, healing, and the finished work of Jesus.

Whether you agree with every conclusion or not, this message is designed to provoke thoughtful conversation and encourage you to examine Scripture through the lens of Christ.

00:00 - Introduction & Summer Reframe Series
02:34 - Welcome to Hill City & Pastor Appreciation
04:36 - Christ in You & Hearing God's Voice
06:21 - Why This Series Will Challenge You
08:23 - The Purpose Behind Reframe
10:00 - From Fear-Driven Thinking to Peace-Filled Living
12:13 - Fix Your Eyes on Jesus
13:21 - Reframing the Battlefield
15:19 - The Problem with Spiritual Warfare Thinking
19:52 - Good & Evil or Functional & Dysfunctional?
21:31 - What Strongholds Really Are
22:01 - Understanding Ephesians 6 in Context
24:26 - The Armor of God Is About Identity
26:05 - Principalities, Powers & Human Systems
29:09 - What Does "Satan" Actually Mean?
31:55 - The Armor of God Revisited
35:22 - You're an Ambassador, Not a Soldier
36:19 - Fear-Based Living vs Faith-Based Living
37:42 - Christ Has Already Won the Victory
39:06 - The Law, Sin & Standing Firm
40:14 - Christ Disarmed Every Power
41:15 - Leaving Law Behind for Grace
43:19 - Living from Victory Instead of Warfare
45:35 - Preview: Reframing Demons & Final Encouragement

What if the greatest authority you carry isn't found in what you say, but in the alignment of your heart?

In this powerful message from the CIM Conference, Bill Vanderbush continues unpacking themes from his book The Sound of Your Blood. Through stories, Scripture, and profound insight, Bill explores the hidden years of Jesus, the illusion of separation, the authority of silence, and the transformative power of living in union with God.

This conversation challenges many of the assumptions we've inherited about faith, authority, confession, and spiritual growth. Instead of striving to get God to act, what if the invitation is to align with what God has already accomplished? What if righteousness, peace, and joy are not distant goals, but present realities flowing from your union with Christ?

00:00 - Introduction & Bill Vanderbush Series
02:21 - Jesus Enjoyed Being Human
03:41 - The Hidden Years of Jesus
05:10 - Christ Lives Fully in You
06:22 - The Illusion of Separation
07:50 - Learning to Love One Another
08:49 - The Power of Words and Sound
09:11 - The Hurricane Story and True Faith
11:18 - The Sound of Your Spirit
11:48 - Adam, Eve, and the Transfer of Authority
13:32 - Jesus Reclaims All Authority
14:59 - Authority Through Alignment
16:31 - The Words That Make You Clean
17:48 - Isaiah’s Unclean Lips
19:25 - Purity, Grace, and the Finished Work
20:20 - Confession as Alignment
21:41 - What It Really Means to Believe
23:26 - Discovering Your True Identity
24:23 - Filled with the Fullness of Joy
27:38 - Speaking So You Won’t Stumble
28:19 - Grace, Consequences, and Wisdom
30:07 - Freedom Guided by Love
31:33 - Peace in the Midst of Trouble
32:27 - Equipped for Every Obstacle
33:09 - Righteousness, Peace, and Joy
33:42 - The Kingdom Frequency Within You

In this special episode of Two Pastors and a Mic, we're continuing our series featuring highlights from Bill Vanderbush's message at the CIM Conference.

What if healing isn't something you're trying to get from God, but something you're becoming aware of? What if spiritual authority looks more like confidence in Christ's victory than striving against darkness? And what if the greatest key to seeing God's power flow through your life is simply learning to let yourself be loved?

In this message, Bill shares powerful stories of healing, explores the victory of Christ over fear and darkness, and unpacks a beautiful vision of union with God rooted in the early church fathers. Along the way, he challenges achievement-based spirituality and invites us into a life of rest, wholeness, and awareness of God's presence.

00:00 - Introduction to Bill Vanderbush
02:21 - Healing Begins with Wholeness
04:24 - St. Anthony and Spiritual Authority
08:13 - Stories of Extraordinary Healing
11:40 - The Healing Service That Needed No Sermon
15:48 - The Secret of Unhindered Power
17:45 - Nine Months Without a Miracle
19:40 - Get Your Eyes Off the Problem
21:36 - When They Forgot About the Sick
23:48 - The Sound and Frequency of God
25:37 - Why God Speaks
26:48 - Chasing the Wind and Finding Rest
27:25 - The Heartbeat of God
29:30 - Creator Becomes Creation
30:03 - Athanasius vs. Arius
33:27 - Grace vs. Achievement
34:17 - The Problem with Distance Theology
35:45 - Christ in You, Union Within
37:05 - Inviting God In vs. Living in Union
38:05 - Falling Into Grace

What if your words carry more power than you realize?

In Part 2 of this powerful message from the CIM Conference, Bill Vanderbush explores a fascinating theme that runs throughout Scripture: the "sound of your blood." Beginning with Abel's blood crying out from the ground and culminating with Jesus' blood speaking a better word, Bill unpacks how creation responds to the words, beliefs, and declarations of those made in the image of God.

This conversation challenges us to rethink the power of our speech, the responsibility of stewarding our words, and the impact our perspective has on the world around us. Along the way, Bill explores Romans 8, the glory of God, our identity as the dwelling place of the Holy Spirit, and the radical revelation that God is not distant but intimately present as Father.

You'll hear inspiring stories, thought-provoking insights, and a fresh invitation to embrace the goodness of God, walk in your true identity, and release life rather than judgment into the world around you.

00:00 - Introduction & Bill Vanderbush Conference Series
02:20 - The Voice of Abel’s Blood
03:06 - Adam’s Authority Still Exists Today
04:06 - What Is the Sound of Your Blood?
06:18 - Romans 8 and Creation’s Response
08:23 - Why Human Beings Are So Powerful
10:07 - The Atmosphere We Create With Our Words
11:30 - Creation Awaits the Glory of God’s Children
12:20 - The Glory of God Is His Goodness on Display
13:26 - Challenging Religious Views of God’s Goodness
14:06 - You Are the Temple of the Holy Spirit
15:10 - Letting Go of Separation and Depravity
16:09 - If Paul Visited the Modern Church
17:36 - Jesus’ Blood Speaks a Better Word
18:35 - Abel, Judgment, and the Earth’s Response
22:34 - Learning to Speak What Heaven Is Saying
23:20 - Testimonies of Blessing the Land
26:32 - Deleting Negativity and Seeing Change
28:08 - A Child Raised From Death
30:06 - Jesus’ Better Word: “Father, Forgive Them”
32:20 - The Greatest Revelation: God as Father
35:28 - The Gospel Is About a Person, Not a Place
35:43 - A Good Father Wants His Children Home
37:01 - Religion’s Lie About the Father
38:19 - Remembering What We’ve Forgotten
39:18 - The New Commandment: Love Like Jesus
39:57 - Closing Prayer & Final Thoughts

What if some of the things we've believed about ourselves were never true to begin with?

In Part 1 of this special message from the CIM Conference, Bill Vanderbush explores identity, belonging, grace, and the Father's heart through the lens of Scripture and personal story. From the challenges of stigma and church culture to the beauty of God's original design for humanity, Bill reminds us that our deepest questions have never been about earning God's love—they've always been about discovering who we've been all along.

This conversation dives into themes of identity, the voice we listen to, the power of our words, and the invitation to live from the reality of God's presence rather than from fear, shame, or lack. Along the way, Bill unpacks Genesis, the story of Cain and Abel, the nature of grace, and the radical truth that God has always known and loved you.

Whether you're wrestling with questions about faith, deconstruction, identity, or simply wanting a deeper understanding of the Father's heart, this message offers encouragement, challenge, and hope.

In this episode:
• Walking through stigma and seasons of uncertainty
• Why God's presence often feels strongest when idols fall
• The Father's heart and the beauty of grace
• Recovering forgotten truths from church history
• Discovering your true identity
• The power of words and human creativity
• The lie of lack and the birth of religion
• What Cain and Abel reveal about human nature
• Living from God's presence instead of fear

00:00 - Introduction & Bill Vanderbush Series
02:22 - A Historically Significant Moment
03:38 - Finding God Beyond the Brand
06:31 - When Idols Come Down
08:02 - Grace, Heresy, and a Better Gospel
09:15 - AI, Church History, and Recovering Ancient Truth
12:03 - Becoming a Grandfather & Seeing the Father's Heart
13:29 - The Sound of Your Blood
15:06 - Transformation Through Renewed Thinking
17:13 - Carrying Divine Wholeness
18:26 - Following the Sound of His Voice
19:14 - Discovering Your True Identity
20:20 - Genesis and Humanity's Original Design
23:06 - How Others Shape Our Identity
25:03 - God's Creative Power Through Words
26:46 - Created in the Image of God
29:00 - Divine Breath and New Creation
30:30 - The Face of a Loving Father
32:39 - The Power to Assign Identity
34:29 - The Lie of Lack and the Birth of Religion
37:01 - Cain, Abel, and the Voice of Blood
38:18 - Rethinking Sin Nature
40:03 - Freedom, Responsibility, and Redemption
42:25 - Attention, Affection, and God's Presence
44:15 - A God Who Wants Friendship
45:08 - Cain, Abel, and the First Church Conflict
45:40 - The Voice of Your Brother's Blood

In this episode of Two Pastors and a Mic, we sit down with our friend Bill Vanderbush for one of the most honest, thought-provoking, and hope-filled conversations we’ve had on the podcast.

We talk about union with Christ, the finished work of Jesus, the roots of ancient Christianity, and why so many people are rediscovering the goodness of God in a fresh way. Bill shares powerful insights from his newest books, opens up about the current state of the Church, and challenges fear-based theology with a Gospel centered on love, identity, and belonging.

This conversation explores:
• The ancient roots of union theology
• Why the Gospel became more about what we do than what Jesus has done
• The Council of Nicaea, church history, and modern Christianity
• Fear, punishment, and the goodness of God
• Why people are deconstructing unhealthy theology
• Identity, sonship, and knowing God as Father
• The difference between religion and authentic relationship with Jesus
• Why “God is better than you think” changes everything

Whether you’re deconstructing old beliefs, rediscovering your faith, or simply hungry for deeper conversations about Jesus, this episode is packed with wisdom, grace, and hope.

00:42 - Bill’s Influence on the Podcast
02:44 - Writing for Future Generations
03:41 - The Sound of Your Blood Explained
05:13 - Reaching Deconstructed & New Age Audiences
06:00 - Union Begins in Genesis
07:42 - Identity, Union & Knowing Who You Are
09:25 - Ancient Christianity & Church History
11:23 - How Christianity Became Complicated
13:25 - Salvation, Belief & the Finished Work
15:33 - Ancient Creeds vs Modern Theology
17:23 - Living From Union With Christ
18:29 - Simplifying the Gospel Like Jesus
19:46 - Are We Headed Toward Another Church Council?
21:06 - Returning to a Christ-Centered Gospel
22:30 - Fear-Based Theology & Punishment
24:11 - Honoring Past Generations While Growing
26:16 - The Problem With “Heresy Hunting”
27:22 - God Is Better Than You Think
28:12 - Asking Jesus Directly
29:54 - Rediscovering Wonder & Childlike Faith
32:40 - Healing Orphan Thinking & Family Wounds
33:41 - Where to Find Bill Vanderbush
34:35 - Final Thoughts on God’s Goodness
35:42 - “You’re Loved & There’s Nothing You Can Do About It”