80,000 Hours Podcast

#46 Classic episode - Hilary Greaves on moral cluelessness & tackling crucial questions in academia


Listen Later

Rebroadcast: this episode was originally released in October 2018.

The barista gives you your coffee and change, and you walk away from the busy line. But you suddenly realise she gave you $1 less than she should have. Do you brush your way past the people now waiting, or just accept this as a dollar you’re never getting back? According to philosophy Professor Hilary Greaves - Director of Oxford University's Global Priorities Institute, which is hiring - this simple decision will completely change the long-term future by altering the identities of almost all future generations.

How? Because by rushing back to the counter, you slightly change the timing of everything else people in line do during that day - including changing the timing of the interactions they have with everyone else. Eventually these causal links will reach someone who was going to conceive a child.

By causing a child to be conceived a few fractions of a second earlier or later, you change the sperm that fertilizes their egg, resulting in a totally different person. So asking for that $1 has now made the difference between all the things that this actual child will do in their life, and all the things that the merely possible child - who didn't exist because of what you did - would have done if you decided not to worry about it.

As that child's actions ripple out to everyone else who conceives down the generations, ultimately the entire human population will become different, all for the sake of your dollar. Will your choice cause a future Hitler to be born, or not to be born? Probably both!

• Links to learn more, summary and full transcript.

Some find this concerning. The actual long term effects of your decisions are so unpredictable, it looks like you’re totally clueless about what's going to lead to the best outcomes. It might lead to decision paralysis - you won’t be able to take any action at all.

Prof Greaves doesn’t share this concern for most real life decisions. If there’s no reasonable way to assign probabilities to far-future outcomes, then the possibility that you might make things better in completely unpredictable ways is more or less canceled out by equally likely opposite possibility.

But, if instead we’re talking about a decision that involves highly-structured, systematic reasons for thinking there might be a general tendency of your action to make things better or worse -- for example if we increase economic growth -- Prof Greaves says that we don’t get to just ignore the unforeseeable effects.

When there are complex arguments on both sides, it's unclear what probabilities you should assign to this or that claim. Yet, given its importance, whether you should take the action in question actually does depend on figuring out these numbers. So, what do we do?

Today’s episode blends philosophy with an exploration of the mission and research agenda of the Global Priorities Institute: to develop the effective altruism movement within academia. We cover:

• How controversial is the multiverse interpretation of quantum physics?
• Given moral uncertainty, how should population ethics affect our real life decisions?
• What are the consequences of cluelessness for those who based their donation advice on GiveWell style recommendations?
• How could reducing extinction risk be a good cause for risk-averse people?

Get this episode by subscribing: type '80,000 Hours' into your podcasting app.

The 80,000 Hours Podcast is produced by Keiran Harris.

...more
View all episodesView all episodes
Download on the App Store

80,000 Hours PodcastBy Rob, Luisa, and the 80,000 Hours team

  • 4.7
  • 4.7
  • 4.7
  • 4.7
  • 4.7

4.7

293 ratings


More shows like 80,000 Hours Podcast

View all
EconTalk by Russ Roberts

EconTalk

4,225 Listeners

Conversations with Tyler by Mercatus Center at George Mason University

Conversations with Tyler

2,384 Listeners

The TWIML AI Podcast (formerly This Week in Machine Learning & Artificial Intelligence) by Sam Charrington

The TWIML AI Podcast (formerly This Week in Machine Learning & Artificial Intelligence)

444 Listeners

ManifoldOne by Steve Hsu

ManifoldOne

87 Listeners

Google DeepMind: The Podcast by Hannah Fry

Google DeepMind: The Podcast

197 Listeners

Machine Learning Street Talk (MLST) by Machine Learning Street Talk (MLST)

Machine Learning Street Talk (MLST)

87 Listeners

Dwarkesh Podcast by Dwarkesh Patel

Dwarkesh Podcast

373 Listeners

Clearer Thinking with Spencer Greenberg by Spencer Greenberg

Clearer Thinking with Spencer Greenberg

127 Listeners

"Moment of Zen" by Erik Torenberg, Dan Romero, Antonio Garcia Martinez

"Moment of Zen"

90 Listeners

No Priors: Artificial Intelligence | Technology | Startups by Conviction

No Priors: Artificial Intelligence | Technology | Startups

122 Listeners

Unsupervised Learning by by Redpoint Ventures

Unsupervised Learning

39 Listeners

Latent Space: The AI Engineer Podcast by swyx + Alessio

Latent Space: The AI Engineer Podcast

77 Listeners

"Upstream" with Erik Torenberg by Erik Torenberg

"Upstream" with Erik Torenberg

62 Listeners

"Econ 102" with Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg by Turpentine

"Econ 102" with Noah Smith and Erik Torenberg

143 Listeners

Complex Systems with Patrick McKenzie (patio11) by Patrick McKenzie

Complex Systems with Patrick McKenzie (patio11)

114 Listeners