The decisions by the governments of Sweden and Finland to apply to join NATO mark a major departure from both countries' longstanding policies of nonalignment. But how, specifically, will it affect these countries’ defense capabilities—and those of NATO? How much needs to be done to achieve interoperability? And most fundamentally, while Russia’s invasion of Ukraine clearly triggered these decisions, why did both countries make this major decision at this particular moment? To unpack those questions and many more, John Amble is joined on this episode by Rasmus Hindren, the head of international relations at the European Center of Excellence for Countering Hybrid Threats, a senior nonresident fellow at the Atlantic Council, and an experienced defense policy practitionerin his home country of Finland.