Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

What’s the real purpose behind the Japanese management practices integral to lean management —like kata, obeya, and A3 reports?

These methods are often misunderstood as mere templates or formats, without recognizing the deeper purpose and intention that drive their impact.

In this episode, we’re picking up on my conversation with Tim Wolput, Japanologist, Toyota Way management expert, and former World Aikido Champion, in Part 2 of this masterclass on Japanese culture and leadership. 

Tim brings a unique perspective on the connection between martial arts and leadership—exploring how practices like kata, obeya, and omotenashi (the spirit of hospitality) can be applied to transformational leadership in your organization.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• What it means to flip the pyramid, highlighting the difference between servant leadership and traditional top-down leadership
• What the tea ceremony teaches us in looking beyond transactional thinking
• The essence of obeya in being more than a space to display information and manage initiatives, but process for people development and collaboration
• The importance of holding precious what it means to be human in leadership 
• The concept of “ichigo ichie” and embracing the uniqueness of the present moment

In episode 42, we explored how Samurai and rice farming shaped Japanese leadership and how it differs from Western management. If you missed it, hit pause and listen now before continuing this episode!

ABOUT MY GUEST:

Tim Wolput is a Japanologist and Toyota Way Management expert passionate about helping people transform themselves, their organizations, and the world for the better. Since 2023 Tim has been my in-country partner for my immersive Japan Leadership Experiences. Originally from Belgium, Tim has lived in Japan since 1999 where he attended Tokyo University Graduate School where he studied the history of traditional Japanese mathematics. He is also the 2005 World Champion in Aikido. Tim is a certified Toyota Way Management System instructor and consultant to global organizations on Lean, Agile, and Toyota Production System (TPS).

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/43
• Listen to Part 1 with Tim Wolput: ChainfOfLearning.com/42
• Connect with Tim Wolput: linkedin.com/in/timwolput
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson
• Learn about my Japan Leadership Experience program: kbjanderson.com/JapanTrip
• Watch Tim's video on Obeya: The essence of Obeya - more than a visual management tool

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:

01:54 The meaning of Aikido

06:20 What it means to flip the pyramid and how it relates to supportive leadership

09:37 Importance of kata in Japanese culture

17:24 The beauty of the tea ceremony and how it relates to business

21:05 Disadvantages of replacing humans with machines to get things done

22:40 The concept of obeya and people development

25:30 The importance of being people focused rather than tools and processes to reach goals

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

How much of the Toyota Way is dependent on Japanese culture?

And how much of it all comes down to… being human?

There are questions I’ve explored with 130+ global leaders who’ve joined my Japan Leadership Experience programs. 

To help you answer this question, I’ve invited Tim Wolput – Japanologist and Toyota Way Management expert, to Chain of Learning.

Together, we take a deep (and fun!) dive into the differences between classical Japanese and Western management and explore the cultural and historical roots of real lean leadership.

In this episode, we travel through Japanese history—from Confucius’ teachings to samurai and rice farming traditions, and Deming’s influence on Japanese management. 

If you’ve ever wanted a masterclass on Japanese management and Toyota Way principles—and how you can apply these lessons to create a culture of excellence—these two episodes are a must-listen.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• Misconceptions about the Toyota Way management practices and applying the principles across cultures
• Deming’s influence on Japan and the development of the Toyota Production System and Toyota Way
• The way of the samurai: Focus on the process, not just the outcome
• Shu-ha-ri: The process towards mastery and turning knowledge into wisdom by learning through doing 
• The power of leading through influence and “doing the right thing”: true leadership inspires growth, not just results

Subscribe so you don’t miss Part 2, where we continue along this path of learning to explore the nuances of Japanese concepts like kata and obeya and their relationship to lean management practices today.

ABOUT MY GUEST:

Tim Wolput is a Japanologist and Toyota Way Management expert passionate about helping people transform themselves, their organizations, and the world for the better. Since 2023 Tim has been my in-country partner for my immersive Japan Leadership Experiences. Originally from Belgium, Tim has lived in Japan since 1999 where he attended Tokyo University Graduate School and studied traditional Japanese mathematics. Tim is a certified Toyota Way Management System instructor and consultant to global organizations on Lean, Agile, and Toyota Production System (TPS).

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Listen to Our Masterclass on Japanese Management Part 2 with Tim Wolput
• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/42
• Connect with Tim Wolput: linkedin.com/in/timwolput
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson 
• Learn about my Japan Leadership Experience program: kbjanderson.com/JapanTrip 

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:

03:53 Biggest misconceptions about Toyota Way management practices
05:10 Katie’s perspective Japan versus the west
08:46 The meaning of Shu Ha Ri and the traditional way of learning
10:23 Deming’s influence on Japan and The Toyota Way
13:05 Why Japan embraced PDCA
15:45 Difference in mindset between Asia and the west

17:28 The working culture in Japan and how work together in the community
22:17 Power of the supplier relationship
23:40 Japanese leadership style
29:15 Concept of doing the right thing

30:56 How to focus on processes as the way to get results

34:13 Powerful words of wisdom about the way of the samurai

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

You’re doing great work….yet you know you could have a greater influence.

You have a vision for more. More strategic work. More influence.

Only question—how do you get there?

The issue isn’t your talent or skills. It’s how you are positioned—how your clients or organization see (and value) your role.

In this episode, I’m joined by Betsy Jordyn—former Disney OD consultant turned brand positioning strategist—to help you reshape how others perceive your value and become the one leaders turn to when it comes to making significant changes to their leadership and culture.

Besty shares actionable ways to communicate your value so you can land the roles and work you truly deserve. And we both share insights we've learned from evolving the framing of our own positioning over time.

Whether you’re an internal change leader tired of being stuck in execution mode or a consultant struggling to land strategic engagements, this conversation is your road map to stop playing small.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• What positioning actually is—and why it matters
• How to spot the signs your positioning isn’t landing the way you want
• The 3 levels of positioning every leader and consultant should master
• Real examples from our own careers on how we’ve evolved our positioning
• A simple process to clearly articulate your value and stand out in your market

ABOUT MY GUEST:

Betsy Jordyn is a Brand Positioning Strategist who helps consultants and coaches clarify their message, amplify their influence, and monetize their strengths. Drawing on her experience as a former Disney OD consultant and leader of an external practice serving brands like Wyndham and AAA, she empowers clients to make a bigger impact through authentic thought leadership.

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/41
• Watch the Bonus Video – Elevate Your Positioning to Lead Transformational Change: https://youtu.be/O0W9dq3jYnw 
• Connect with Betsy Jordyn: linkedin.com/in/betsy-jordyn
• Betsy’s Meeting Discovery Script: betsyjordyn.com
• Betsy’s Podcast, Consulting Matters: betsyjordyn.com/podcasts/consulting-matters
• My website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson
• My Japan Leadership Experience program: kbjanderson.com/JapanTrip
• FREE KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:

03:26 What positioning is and why it matters

06:48 Why your brand is your reputation
07:54 Signs your brand positioning is off

10:38 Betsy’s personal story in understanding the importance of positioning

18:28 How Betsy helped Katie improve her positioning

25:37 Changing the name from Japan Study Trip to Japan Leadership Experience

28:42 Clarity - the highest level of positioning
32:25 Second level of positioning that happens a client approaches you with a request
35:25 How to clarify the strategic frame and position yourself against that

42:15 Third level of positioning in positioning yourself as a strategic partner

46:12 How to position yourself when working with a new client
48:44 The opportunity of stepping out of the box and become a thinking partner
50:06 One key learning to reposition your own work

54:07 The strategic framework to pivot your messaging

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

Do you ever feel overwhelmed that you are responsible for doing too much?

Maybe you’re frustrated that your team relies on you for answers instead of developing their own solutions.

Or you’re disappointed that improvements fall apart as soon as you step away.

The problem: You’re likely stuck in the Doer Trap—and it’s holding you (and your team) back from the results you want. 

The good news? There’s a way out.

In this episode, I dive into three simple shifts that will instantly help you break free from the Doer Trap and into true transformational leadership.

Your power and influence doesn’t come from doing it all.

Whether you are an executive manager, internal change leader, or lean consultant, your ability to create lasting impact lies in knowing the outcomes you want and your role in getting there.

Are you ready to break free from the Doer Trap and lead with real impact? 

YOU’LL LEARN:

• What the Doer Trap is—and why it’s so easy to fall into
• 5 Doer Trap roles (and which ones you might be stuck in)
• 3 simple shifts to instantly break free of the Doer Trap and make immediate impact
• How to gain clarity on your role and step into true leadership by modeling the way
• A simple way to frame a contracting conversation to clarify roles and expectations

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/40
• Read my IndustryWeek Article "The Doer Trap: How Leaders Get Stuck and How to Break Free"
• Check out my website for resources and to learn more about my trusted advisor, coaching, and learning experiences KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson
• Download my FREE KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst 

TIMSTAMPS:
03:14 What the doer trap is—and why we fall into it

04:55 Mode 1: The Hero – Not everything needs your rescue

05:48 Mode 2: The Rescuer – Why you need to let others struggle

06:52 Mode 3: The Magician – Doing it all behind the scenes
07:43 Mode 4: Pair of Hands – When you default to doing

09:53 3 simple shifts to break free from the trap
10:06 Shift 1: Clarity – Know your role and who owns what
14:14 Why so many operational leaders feel overwhelmed
15:12 The power of a purposeful pause
17:10 Shift 2: Contracting – Align on roles and expectations

23:03 How to frame a clear contracting conversation
27:58 Shift 3: Model the way and label your intent
28:19 Two ways to reflect and invite real feedback
31:49 A real-life example of how one leader found freedom
33:42 Questions to reflect if you’re falling into one of the doer traps

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

Ever feel like your to-do list never ends? 

Running from meeting to meeting with no time to think—let alone lead or create? 

You’re not alone.

The problem isn’t you – that you’re not working hard enough. 

You’re probably stuck in the complexity trap—buried in endless demands, inefficiencies, and busywork that keep you (and your team) from doing what truly matters.

To help you simplify and focus on meaningful work, I sat down with Lisa Bodell, CEO of FutureThink and bestselling author of Why Simple Wins and Kill the Company. 

Lisa has a clear message:

💡 The problem isn’t the people—it’s the process of the work.

In this episode, we dive into the biggest barriers to your effectiveness—what you can do to cut through the noise and create space for work that actually matters. If you’re ready to escape the complexity trap and start simplifying to make a real impact, this episode is a must-listen.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• How meetings and emails are blocking real improvement
• What defines truly meaningful work—including time to think
• The connection between innovation and simplification—and how to stay ahead of the curve
• The biggest mistakes that make simplification harder (and how to avoid them)
• The first step to simplifying your work and life

ABOUT MY GUEST:

Lisa Bodell, CEO of FutureThink and bestselling author of Kill the Company and Why Simple Wins, inspires leaders to transform work to unlock true potential and find deeper fulfillment. With her bold, no-nonsense approach to simplification, Lisa delivers radical insights and actionable tools to fuel extraordinary success.

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/39
• Connect with Lisa Bodell: linkedin.com/in/lisa-bodell-futurethink
• Read more about Lisa and her company, FutureThink: futurethink.com 
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:

02:09 Why leaders feel overwhelmed—and how to fix it

03:51 The illusion of control and why organizing isn’t the same as simplifying

04:28 Why doing less can make you more valuable
05:09 The daring act of simplifying and not adding to our workload
07:26 The cost of valuing others’ time more than your own
08:27 Reframing your mindset of deep thinking time
09:31 Why we don’t do our best thinking at work
09:45 Two ways to start simplifying a chaotic workday

11:36 Why meetings with no agenda can be a time waster
12:43 How to shift your day so you’re not constantly checking emails
14:03 The definition of meaningful work
17:02 The link between innovation and simplification
18:08 3 Common pitfalls to successfully simplifying one’s work
21:19 Why one of the biggest barriers in transformation is leadership
24:08 Simplicity as it relates to tools, training, and messaging
24:45 How to apply the tool: Kill a stupid rule
28:55 Contributing meaningfully and effectively to improve your value
29:20 The future of work and how to improve work and life
32:14 The best place to start to start simplifying your life

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

What have we really learned after four decades of lean? 

Is lean thinking still relevant today?

And importantly — what needs to change to ensure its future success?

In the previous episode, I sat down with James Womack, founder of the Lean Enterprise Institute, to look back on 40 years of lean thinking and management since the publication of The Machine That Changed the World. 

In this episode, we look ahead to the future of lean and dig into big questions, including those submitted by listeners:

• Is there a better term than “lean”? 
• What would Jim do differently if he could reintroduce lean to the world?
• How do AI and new technologies fit with the application of lean principles?
• What’s Jim’s greatest surprise over the past 45 years?

Jim doesn’t hold back in this discussion  — and provides his advice as he passes the baton to the next generation of lean leaders. 

YOU’LL LEARN:

• Why lean principles still apply even as technology evolves and takes over tasks once done by people
• What’s stopping organizations from fully embracing lean principles and practices
• Why lean must be leader-led—not outsourced to consultants or internal operational excellence teams 
• How developing people’s capabilities for problem-solving at all levels is critical to success
• The true role and purpose of management

If you are passionate about the potential of lean’s impact now and in the future, this is an episode you won’t want to miss. 

ABOUT MY GUEST:

James P. Womack, PhD, is the former research director of MIT’s International Motor Vehicle Program who led the team that coined the term “lean production” to describe the Toyota Production System. Along with Daniel Jones, he co-authored “The Machine That Changed the World”, “Lean Thinking”, and “Lean Solutions”. Jim is the founder of Lean Enterprise Institute where he continues to serve as a senior advisor. 

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/38
• Listen to Part 1 where lean has failed and succeeded: ChainOfLearning.com/37
• Connect with James Womack: linkedin.com/in/womack-james-52763b212
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson 
• Learn about my Japan Study Trip program: kbjanderson.com/JapanTrip 

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:

01:48 Two things Jim would do differently in introducing lean 

03:92 Why consultant-driven Kaizen falls short

05:29 The origin of the word “lean”

08:29 The alternative label instead of the term "lean"
10:26 How lean intersects with emerging and established technologies
14:43 Analyzing AI’s effectiveness through the value stream
16:02 Jim’s greatest surprise of the 40 + years of lean

19:10 Changes at Toyota’s Operations Management Development Division
22:27 Why problem-solving skills matter at every level
23:34 Jim’s parting advice for the next generation of lean leaders

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

“Lean has failed.”

That’s the bold statement James Womack—founder of the Lean Enterprise Institute and MIT researcher whose team introduced the term “lean” to the world—made at a conference where we both recently spoke.

That really stuck with me.

Has lean really failed? 

If so, what can we do to course correct?

To explore this, I invited him to share his reflections and experiences over the past 40 years—where his vision for lean management has fallen short, where it’s succeeded, and what we can learn for the future.

In this episode, we take a hard look at lean’s evolution, from James’ original vision following the publication of “The Machine that Changed the World” nearly 4 decades ago to its real-world impact today.

Tune in for powerful stories and insights from one of the founders of the lean movement, a chance to rethink what’s next for lean leadership, and how you can adjust your approach towards organizational transformation.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• The 5 critical interlocking elements of successful lean enterprise transformations — and what’s missing
• How to build systems and practices to sustain a lean culture that truly supports frontline teams
• Why most companies get their approach to operational excellence backwards and the challenge of getting leaders to see lean principles as the key to getting results
• Why off-shoring and out-sourcing aren’t long-term solutions
• The biggest challenges leaders face with lean transformation

Don't miss Part 2 of this conversation where we explore lean’s future, its relevance for today’s global lean community, and James’ advice for the next generation of leaders.

ABOUT MY GUEST:

James P. Womack, PhD, is the former research director of MIT’s International Motor Vehicle Program who led the team that coined the term “lean production” to describe the Toyota Production System. Along with Daniel Jones, he co-authored “The Machine That Changed the World”, “Lean Thinking”, and “Lean Solutions”. James is the founder of Lean Enterprise Institute where he continues to serve as a senior advisor.

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/37
• Connect with James Womack: linkedin.com/in/womack-james-52763b212
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson 

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 

02:41 James’ vision of what lean’s impact would be today

07:25 Five interlocking pieces of lean transformation and what’s been missed

07:49 Misconception of Kaizen

14:27 Challenges in sustaining lean practices

19:00 Lean leadership if implemented the right way

21:58 Impact of offshoring and outsourcing

24:29 Barriers to senior management buy-in

26:42 Challenges in the frontline healthcare system

30:27 The importance of daily management and Kaizen

37:46 Contributions to GE Appliance’s success

39:28 The meaning of constancy of purpose

41:04 Importance of knowing your north star

41:55 The creation of Hoshin planning and why it fails the first year

43:54 How we get out of the short-term approach

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

How often do you pause to get a clearer view of your purpose and learn how your life experiences influence your leadership impact?

Whether it’s in the moment to reflect on a recent situation or zooming out at a major milestone to see the bigger picture, reflection can be incredibly powerful.

I’m hitting pause myself this week as I turn the big 5-0! I share two concepts that have helped me understand what it means to live a life of intention and purpose.

First, the metaphor of warp and weft—a powerful way to understand the interconnection of the known and discovered elements of your life and see the patterns that emerge in your life’s fabric.

Second, the deeper meaning of my guiding word—Intention. I explore how I’ve come to see that Intention = Heart + Direction® and the energetic vitality that uncovering your deeper purpose can have in both your personal life and leadership.

If you are looking for ways to understand your purpose, reflect, to make more intentional choices, this episode is for you.

Let’s explore how you too can lead with intention and can weave purpose into everything you do.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• The importance of reflection to learn and adjust and to understand your purpose
• How the weaving metaphor of warp and weft enhances self-discovery
• Why Intention = Heart + Direction® and how to set powerful intentions to align your daily actions with your heart
• The Japanese word Kokorozashi (志) and how its deep meaning can be applied to leadership impact

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources referenced in today’s show: ChainOfLearning.com/36
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson
• For additional inspiration and guidance around understanding your own warp and weft, read my book "Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn," along with the companion workbook: LearningToLeadLeadingToLearn.com

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 

00:40 Reflecting and celebrating turning 50
02:50 The history of the warp and weft metaphor

05:32 The difference between the warp and weft threads, the known and the discovered
06:27 Questions to ask yourself to apply the warp and weft metaphor in your life
09:32 The importance of “zooming out” to see to examine your own fabric of life
11:01 Questions to ask yourself to reflect on your your past life experiences
11:53 The relationship between the warp and weft metaphor with setting intention
12:24 Discovering the richer meaning of Intention = Heart + Direction®
13:36 The meaning of the two Japanese kanji symbols for intention
14:58 How to apply the concept of Kokorozashi to find your leadership purpose
16:54 Questions to ask yourself to embody your Kokorozashi to make a bigger impact
17:21 The importance of reflection at the micro level
18:35 Leveraging Kokorozashi to help take actions that are aligned with your purpose

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

What do you do when you’re stuck between two conflicting options? 

• Deliver short-term results or take a long-term view?
• Focus on business outcomes or people development?
• Help by being the expert with the answer or a coach asking questions?

For most of us, these competing choices are a source of conflict. We deal with uncertainty by asserting certainty that there are two distinct options to choose between.

But what if there’s a way to embrace both?

That’s why I invited Wendy Smith – award-winning psychologist and co-author of “Both/And Thinking” – to share her insights on how to make more creative, flexible, and impactful decisions in a world of competing demands.

The most successful leaders and change agents have learned the power of navigating paradoxical tradeoffs and reframing problems to discover expansive solutions that didn’t initially seem possible. 

Tune in to learn how to shift from that “either/or” mindset and embrace a “both/and” approach to tackle tough decisions, unlock new possibilities, and lead with greater impact.

YOU’LL LEARN:

• Can you really have it all? – The difference between an and/and vs both/and mindset
• A three step process to overcome dilemmas to create a more sustainable outcome
• How to reframe a problem when faced with a seemingly paradoxical choice
• Three different patterns of risk when you’re not able to shift from the either/or to the both/and thinking
• The benefits of being comfortable with the discomfort of learning something new

ABOUT MY GUEST:

Wendy Smith is the co-author of “Both/And Thinking: Embracing Creative Tensions to Solve Your Toughest Problems,” an award-winning psychologist and professor at the Lerner College of Business and Economics at the University of Delaware. She’s spent her career studying paradoxes in leadership and on a mission to help individuals and organizations turn problems into possibilities. Wendy's passion lies in helping leaders tackle the complex challenges of interpersonal dynamics, team performance, organizational change, and innovation to transform their organizations and the world.

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/35
• Connect with Wendy Smith: linkedin.com/in/wendykimsmith
• Wendy’s book: bothandthinking.net
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson

  
  

  
  

TIMESTAMPS: 

02:12 Misconception of both/and meaning

02:44 And/and vs. both/and

06:49 Balancing the roles of expert and coach 

07:03 Balancing long-term innovation with immediate business needs

08:06 3-step process of dealing with dilemma

09:50 Expanding on and/and vs both/and

12:03 How to approach paradoxical choices

15:23 3 patterns of risk when you don’t shift to both/and thinking

20:15 Getting comfortable with discomfort

22:03 Embracing both/and mindset creates growth mindset

24:36 Bringing both/and thinking to your personal life

25:50 Both/and thinking at the organizational level

27:44 Integrating technical process improvement with people development

29:35 Enabling both/and thinking at the organizational level

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/ 

Why do 70-90% of change initiatives fail?

That’s a staggering statistic. 

In many cases, new leadership comes in, economic pressures rise, or the next "flavor of the month" initiative takes over. 

What’s happening and what can you do to counteract this trend?

And if you are a change leader, lean practitioner, or continuous improvement coach, how do you avoid this becoming a career limiting move?

To help us answer this, I invited Michael Bungay Stanier, leadership expert and bestselling author of six books, including The Coaching Habit and How to Work with (Almost) Anyone, to share his insights on leading personal and organizational change. 

Success in leading change comes not only from making structural shifts, but also from fostering curiosity and building strong human relationships.

It’s time to shift the failure rate to a success rate for your vision. 

Focus your energy on amplifying your influence and getting the buy-in needed from key people to create meaningful transformation.

YOU’LL LEARN:

•  How to reverse the trend of failed change initiatives
• What to do when others don’t align with your vision for change
• How to create agency in the people you want to influence
• Tips on how to stay curious longer to make a strong impact
• The importance of linking process improvement and people for lasting change

ABOUT MY GUEST:

Michael Bungay Stanier is at the forefront of shaping how organizations and leaders around the world succeed through focusing on curiosity and human relationships. He’s the author of six books, which between them have sold more than a million copies, and is best known for The Coaching Habit, the best-selling coaching book of this century.

IMPORTANT LINKS:

• Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/34
• Connect with Michael Bungay Stanier: linkedin.com/in/michaelbungaystanier 
• Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com
• Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson
• Sign up for Michael’s newsletter and podcasts: MBS.works
• Download my FREE KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment : kbjanderson.com/katalyst 

TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE: 

01:04 Reasons why change initiatives fail
04:56 Two foundational challenges for leading change

07:38 The link between process improvement and integrating the people component

13:23 Two strategies to stay curious longer and create lasting impact

16:26 Tips to reverse the trend of failed change initiatives 

20:20 Steps to embrace your influence and create the impact you want when leading change 

22:31 Defining A and B list relationships

24:04 Improving the quality of working relationships

24:45 How to build BPR (best possible relationships) and keystone conversations to discuss how to best work together before diving into the work

26:13 Addressing challenging conversations to clarify roles and expectations upfront

29:55 One way to increase influence and build human connection for impactful conversations

31:11 Michael’s new project in launching a new podcast

Apply for the Nov 2025 Japan Leadership Experience - early registration rate now through May 31st! 
https://kbjanderson.com/japantrip/