In this podcast, Professor Cary Cooper shares his extensive experience of working to create healthier and happier workplaces. Cary shares his belief that in times of rapid social change, organizational workplaces are more important than ever as sites that can provide healthy environments that support our well-being. Cary identifies key turning points that informed his work; firstly in the 1970s  stress was for the first time identified as a big challenge, and the response was to support the individual to cope with their stress better, e.g. stress management and responses such as today's mindfulness. In the 2008 financial crash and the subsequent 'job restructuring' when organizations stripped their workforce to the minimum, Cary observed a change in workplace responses when a manager said to him that the number one challenge he had was staff retention. This began a shift whereby organizations weren't so concerned with managing individual stress but realized they had to provide workplaces that offered healthy environments where employees could flourish, in order to ensure their well-being, get the best performance from them and to retain them.

Cary identifies the line manager as perhaps the key ingredient for a healthy and productive workplace. Most line managers are chosen for their technical ability, and yet their role is vital in terms of people management skills. Reflecting on the UK's focus on growth, he points to the lack of a policy that focuses on this key area of people management; improving this he believes would be vital to increase growth.

Cary reflects on his personal journey and shares that his life from an Eastern European Jewish working-class background story continues to impact on him,  citing the constant need to 'prove himself' as the driver of his success.

This is a wonderful podcast with one of the great figures of our generation, who has contributed to organizational health and well-being. 

Enjoy the listen!

Cary L. Cooper is the 50th Anniversary Professor of Organizational Psychology and Health at the Alliance Manchester Business School, University of Manchester. He is a founding President of the British Academy of Management, Immediate Past President of the Chartered Institute of Personnel and Development (CIPD), former President of RELATE and President of the Institute of Welfare. He was the Founding Editor of the Journal of Organizational Behavior, former Editor of the scholarly journal Stress and Health and is the Editor-in-Chief of the Wiley-Blackwell Encyclopaedia of Management, now in its’ 3rd Edition.

He has been an advisor to the World Health Organisation, ILO, and EU in the field of occupational health and wellbeing, was Chair of the Global Agenda Council on Chronic Disease of the World Economic Forum (2009-2010), then served for 5 years on the Global Agenda Council for mental health of the WEF, and was Chair of the Academy of Social Sciences 2009-2015. He was Chair of the Sunningdale Institute in the Cabinet Office and National School of Government 2005-2010. Professor Cooper is currently the Chair of the National Forum for Health & Wellbeing at Work (comprising 40 global companies e.g. BP, Microsoft, NHS Executive, UK government (wellbeing lead) , Rolls Royce, John Lewis Partnership, etc.). Professor Cooper is the author/editor of over 250 books in the field of occupational health psychology, workplace wellbeing, women at work and occupational stress. He was awarded the CBE by the Queen for his contributions to occupational health; and in 2014 he was awarded a Knighthood for his contribution to the social sciences.

This podcast came about in relation to Caroline and Simon’s personal reactions to the Barbie movie and in recognition that this movie is a 'cultural event' that demands some thought.

As Caroline says, 'this movie needs psychoanalysis': Freudians would say it's all about death, desire, and sexual difference. For anyone interested in object relations, themes of play, transitional spaces, and phenomena, aggression and pain make up the substance of the plot. For Caroline, a key part of the movie's pleasure is linked to its radical owning of the patriarchy as a fact, a given of contemporary society. It's the first time she can recall having seen this depicted on film in a mainstream movie in such a bold, incontrovertible way. This, in itself, makes the movie radical, she argues, despite its unevenness in parts. Caroline talks inspiringly about how her repeat viewings of the film revealed the extent of its play with ideas, and she shares her deep and thoughtful views on why this movie is important.

Simon watched the movie once and found himself both very impressed and also very troubled: while he admires the outing of the patriarchy that Caroline mentions, this doesn't outweigh his concern about the portrayal of men as degrading, and he found the depiction of seemingly binary differences between men and women troubling. For Simon, this potentially feeds into the right-wing populist agenda that, in turn, feeds off the gender and culture wars.

Caroline sees it a little differently, suggesting there are some subtle nuances built by director Greta Gerwig, especially in her play with the distinctive absence of genitalia in Barbie and Ken dolls. She suggests that the film centers this idea, the better to open up space to explore what non-binary, trans, and more fluid ideas of gender might be like. Similarly, Caroline notes that critics sometimes describe Barbieland as a matriarchy, but Gerwig actually does something novel here. There are no mothers in Barbieland, and no children either - in fact, the film goes to great lengths to show how maternal versions of the doll such as Midge have been discontinued, and narrator, Helen Mirren, plays with the idea of smashing associations between doll play and being a mother from the very beginning. The implication is that Barbieland is not so much a matriarchy as a woman-to-woman sociality, and this has important implications for how Gloria (America Ferrera) and Sasha (Ariana Greenblatt) are able to find one another afresh and to re-navigate their complex relationship.

Simon's Substack blog on the film which led to this podcast can be read here.

Caro Bainbridge is Emeritus Professor of Psychoanalysis and Culture and a former editor of Free Associations and of the film section at the International Journal of Psychoanalysis. She co-edits a book series on psychoanalysis and popular culture for Routledge. She's a Fellow of the RSA, a Founding Scholar of the British Psychoanalytic Council, Research Associate at the Freud Museum, London, and a member of ISPSO and Opus. Caro has recently co-founded the MiNDings consultancy (www.mindings.org), where she works in the organizational processes and leadership space. She is also a member of the Eco Leadership Institute, and she practices as an executive and personal coach. Outside work, she makes the most of living close to Another Place, an art installation on a beach that evokes edges and possibilities in equal measure.

In this podcast, Yannick shares how he believes coaching can play an important role for clients with an interest in using psychedelics. LSD and other psychedelics were popular in the 1960s with Timothy Leary being the guru of the age, but disrupting the field as well. At the time, psychedelics-assisted forms of therapy were first explored. Following the Nixon administration's declaration of a "war on drugs'', psychedelics have been marginalised and all research banned until the early 2000s saw a renaissance of psychedelics in the field of mental health treatment. Yannick explains how his interest was stimulated by emerging clinical research and how he started to make relevant connections to positive psychology and coaching. In this episode, he lays out his argument of why psychedelics could be used for learning, growth and well-being, and not just as a treatment for illness, and why coaching might be an ideal partner in this endeavour. In the process, Yannick describes his journey which leads to ethical questions, social questions and also questions about coaching itself.

Enjoy this edgy edition of Edgy Ideas!

Yannick Jacob is a Coach, Trainer & Supervisor with Masters degrees in Existential Coaching and Applied Positive Psychology. He is part of the teaching faculties at Cambridge University and the International Centre for Coaching Supervision, and he’s the Course Director of the School of Positive Transformation’s Accredited Certificate in Integrative Coaching, for which he gathered many of the world’s most influential coaches. Formerly Programme Leader of the MSc Coaching Psychology at the University of East London, Yannick now presents at conferences internationally and his book, An Introduction to Existential Coaching, was published by Routledge. Committed to helping other coaches be the best coaches they can be, Yannick founded and hosts Yannick’s Coaching Lab which gives novice and seasoned coaches an opportunity to witness experienced coaches live in action, and he is the host of Animas Centre for Coaching's popular podcast Coaching Uncaged, as well as his own podcasts Talking about Coaching and Talking about Coaching and Psychedelics.

Paul shares his thoughts and experience on the power of narrative and the importance of upgrading our purpose to meet the poly-crisis and disruptive contemporary social conditions we face. Paul points out that purpose is not a fixed destination, but an emergent position that needs to be adapted to each context.  Repurposing leads to revitalising organisations and in a wide-ranging discussion Paul also reflects on the importance of collaborative advantage, drawing on his earlier book, and contrasts this to competitive advantage.  He also points to the need to widen our gaze to include the shadow, 'the wolf that lurks to pounce', as very often we are consumed with a more short-term and limited vision of what is going on.  Our discussion continues to look at the critical links between narrative and marketing, and we discuss psychotherapy's role in organisational awareness which is becoming ever more critical.  

Paul Skinner is the author of the award-winning book, The Purpose Upgrade: Change your Business to Save the World. Change the World to Save your Business, which Mike Berners-Lee, author of There Is No Planet B, described as, ‘...a necessary and enlightening call to action for businesses to re-think why they exist and the implications for everything they say, think and do'.

Paul's previous book Collaborative Advantage: How Collaboration Beats Competition as a Strategy for Success was described by Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, Co-founders of Ben and Jerry's ice cream, as, 'the perfect recipe for successful businesses that improve lives'.

Through his consulting practice the Agency of the Future, Paul helps clients to drive purpose-led change and better mobilise stakeholders for lasting success. He also founded MarketingKind, a non-profit professional membership community bringing business leaders, marketers and change-makers together to address our most pressing problems as 'marketing briefs in disguise’.

In this podcast, Chris and John share the ideas presented in their recent book, which examines how trauma and marginalization are produced and perpetuated by in-group and out-group dynamics. They turn questions upside down, making us think differently about social problems. When asked how to help the homeless, they return the question in a different way, asking how the ‘we’ of ‘housed’ in groups cause people to be psycho-socially 'unhoused', revealing how we are all implicated in the trauma of others. The hundreds of migrants who die at sea are not poor neutral victims, but those we have unhoused and displaced through wars, colonialism and neo-liberal capitalist economics.  

They invite us to make use of their "Diogenes Paradigm", drawing on the story of the ancient street philosopher to highlight questions of power and authority; they re-tell the story of how Alexander the Great asked Diogenes, who lived in a barrel with his dogs, whether he could do anything for him. Diogenes replied: “Yes, you can move as you are blocking the sunlight”. This Diogenes Paradigm allows us to explore power dynamics between systems of care and excluded out-groups, from housing policies in London or the UK prison system at the micro level to the broader issues of human mobility, the "might" of empires, and the climate disaster that threatens us all. 

Enjoy this thought-provoking podcast that asks important questions for our times. 

Chris and John have been writing and teaching together for two decades. Their recent co-authored book "Psychosocial explorations of trauma, exclusion and violence: Un-housed minds and inhospitable environments" was published by Routledge in 2022: 

https://www.routledge.com/Psycho-social-Explorations-of-Trauma-Exclusion-and-Violence-Un-housed/Scanlon-Adlam/p/book/9780367893316

Dr Chris Scanlon (DPhil) is an independent psycho-social Researcher/Consultant, Training Group Analyst at the Institute of Group Analysis (UK) and at the Irish Group Analytic Society (Dublin), associate lecturer on the Integrated Professional Doctorate (IPD) programme Tavistock Centre/University of Essex and is a founder member and board member of the Association for Psychosocial Studies (APS). He has worked for over 30 years as a practitioner and educator in NHS - including 15 years as an NHS Consultant Psychotherapist in general adult and forensic mental health and has acted as an expert advisor/consultant to a range of agencies.

John Adlam is a group psychotherapist and independent researcher and a founder member of the Association for Psychosocial Studies. He lives in Brixton in South London and works for the most part in the National Health Service, where he is Consultant Adult Forensic Psychotherapist at Bethlem Royal Hospital and Principal Adult Psychotherapist at Springfield Hospital. Previously he worked for the Henderson Hospital Democratic Therapeutic Community. He also worked for many years for the Adult Eating Disorders Service at Springfield. Apart from his book with Chris, he is also co-editor of Violent States and Creative States: From the Global to the Individual (2018); Forensic Music Therapy (2012); and The Therapeutic Milieu Under Fire: Security and Insecurity in Forensic Mental Health (2012); Chris is one of the five co-editors of this last volume - all published by Jessica Kingsley Publishers.

In this fascinating discussion, Andrés shares his expertise on economics and money and how policy and politics are created. Andrés challenges the 'taken-for-granted' assumptions that underpin economics and money, he shines the light of emotions onto the topic;  or what in psychoanalysis we call the libidinal economy i.e. the underpinning unconscious and emotional drivers that shape political and economic choices. 

 

Andrés shares his view that not only neo-liberal conservatives are attached to the status quo, and argues that many progressives and those on the political left also get caught up in these normative economic and political 'myths'. Radical political agendas are undermined by ideas like "we must stick to the fiscal rules" and "we cannot borrow our way out of this mess".  Post second world war construction of the National health service and welfare state in the UK, showed how political will can deliver change when a country is most economically challenged; the same happened in the Covid Pandemic financial crash when all the rules changed to accommodate radical financial policies to keep businesses afloat. Simon and Andrés discuss class and identity politics, the rise of populism and how we need to bring care back into our political and social way of thinking.    

In this wide-ranging discussion, we explore the interconnections between our unconscious and emotional lives, economics, politics and money. 

Enjoy this powerful podcast! 

Andrés Bernal is a lecturer in urban studies at the City University of New York and a Research Fellow with the Global Institute for Sustainable Prosperity. His focus is on the bridging of theory and practice for fostering equitable and sustainable social systems including researching and advocating for policies like the Green New Deal in the United States. He is a former policy advisor for congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio Cortez and co-host of the podcast, Funny Money.

How do we live with technology in our digital age which is fast becoming an AI and Quantum age?  

There are those who understand, design and deliver tech’ and those who specialise in understanding people –between these two groups is a huge gap.

Anni Rowland-Campbell has been trying to address this gap for over 25 years, by bringing people together from all walks of life to have ‘Brave Conversations’ about what’s happening in their world, and how technology impacts on them. Anni shares her experiences in this podcast and also her concern that we are just not taking technological change seriously enough or quickly enough. 

 

Simon and Anni discuss regulation, which is mainly coming from the EU, but perhaps more importantly needs to come via ourselves, through self-regulation and community actions that help us regulate and have more choice over how we use tech. Technology can be exciting, amazingly useful and also have many unforeseen consequences. Anni's work is to try and harness the best humanity has to use tech well in order that we live well too. 

Enjoy this thought-provoking podcast, and ask yourself: “What am I doing to take more control and to live more healthily with others, in this technologically pervasive world”. 

Anni Rowland-Campbell is a philanthropist and Web Science practitioner. She is Director of Intersticia a global charity and social enterprise which focuses on helping to develop emerging stewards for the 21st Century. 

For the past two decades, Anni has worked with Boards, Senior Leadership and Management Teams to help them become more "Digitally Savvy” as they increasingly operate online.  

In 2017 she created Brave Conversations as a way to bring the conversations of the Social Machine to the general public of all ages, stages and from all walks of life.  Since then Brave Conversations has been held all around the world both face-to-face and online.  Anni has worked in the Arts, Government and the Corporate sectors and has also led a number of research projects with the Web Science Institute investigating the topic of "Government as a Social Machine”.  Anni is President of the Digital Enlightenment Foundation, a Trustee of the Web Science Trust, a Non-Executive Director of Founders and Coders UK, the Social Change Agency and a Fellow of Goodenough College, London.  She is also a member of the Advisory Boards of MENA Alliances.

Richard brings to his work a deep sensitivity and diverse experiences, to offer us valuable insights into the world of organisational life.  Drawing on Group Relations work,  psychoanalytic theory, his experience as a psychotherapist and clinician and his coaching and consulting work, Richard makes strong connections between the body, mind and soul.

 

In this delightful conversation, Richard shares his thinking from his book The Body of the Organisation and its Health and his work connecting individual, group and social experiences in The Trilogy Event he has innovated, offers an experiential learning setting to explore how different parts of our systems, carry emotions and thoughts on behalf of other parts.

 

Enjoy this wide-ranging conversation with Richard sharing his wisdom that is much needed in today's organisations.

 

 

Richard Morgan-Jones: Group Relations, Organizational Consulting and Executive Coaching. Supervising and Training Psychoanalytic Psychotherapist with British Psychotherapy Foundation, Author. Registered member of British Psychoanalytic Council (BPC). Distinguished Honorary Member of International Society for Psychoanalytic Society of Organizations (ISPSO). Mentor and member of the AK Rice Institute (USA) and member of the Organization for Promoting the Understanding of Society (OPUS). Visiting professor at the Indian Institute of Management Ahmedabad and of the Higher School of Economics in Moscow.

Director of Work Force Health: Consulting and Research whose work is explored in consultancies, an international workshop and a book entitled: The Body of the Organisation and its Health, London: Karnac, which explores how organisations get under the skin and reveal personal and team development opportunities and organisational strategic choices. He also has written about a psychoanalytic approach to understanding Restorative Justice, the Banking crisis, the vulnerability of the nation-state and its citizens in Europe, the celebrity cult, social dreaming and the language of the group skin.

The Eco-Leadership Institute has recently entered into a partnership with the Humanitarian Leadership Academy with the purpose to re-enchant the sector. This podcast was recorded in the Save the Children London office as part of a workshop for international humanitarian staff. The aim was for Gareth to introduce Simon and his ideas on Eco-Leadership to those working in the humanitarian sector. 

In this podcast, Simon shares his personal work journey, showing how his experience shaped the project of Eco-Leadership. Gareth and Simon then discuss the challenges in the humanitarian sector and they explore how the new partnership aims to meet these challenges with some new ideas that are already having an impact. The Eco-Mutualist manifesto below summarises some of this thinking. Enjoy the listen!

Eco-Mutualism: A Manifesto for a New Age of Humanitarianism

Bio

Dr. Simon Western is the founder and CEO of the Eco-Leadership Institute, a leading academic and practitioner in coaching and leadership. He is the author of "Leadership: A Critical Text" (3rd ed., Sage 2019) and "Coaching and Mentoring: A Critical Text" (Sage 2012) plus many book chapters and journal articles.  He has also contributed to the development of a new paradigm in leadership through his work on Eco-Leadership.

Dr Western is a Past President of the International Society for the Psychoanalytic Study of Organisations, previously adjunct Professor at University College Dublin, Director of Coaching at Lancaster University Management School, and Director of Masters in Consulting and Leadership at the Tavistock Clinic.

Gareth Owen OBE is the Humanitarian Director of Save the Children UK. Over the last two decades, he has led responses to numerous emergencies all over the world including the Boxing Day Tsunami, Pakistan and Haiti earthquakes, Cyclone Nargis in Myanmar, East Africa and Niger food crises and the Somalia, Angola, Kosovo, Iraq, Afghanistan and Syria conflicts. Today, he leads a team of 190+ humanitarian professionals and in June 2013 he was awarded the OBE for ‘For services to Emergency Crisis Response Abroad’.

In this podcast, Rob Briner shares his expertise and insights on evidence-based practice. Rob became interested in evidence-based research early in his academic career when he realised how much knowledge and assumed facts lacked convincing evidence. Simon converses with Rob from the position of a sceptic, having experienced evidence-based practice in healthcare and human resources settings when poorly delivered. Rob offers a fascinating insight into how evidence-based practice can be useful if delivered in a thoughtful and rigorous way.  He shares the importance of collecting evidence from multiple sources and different perspectives. In a healthcare setting for example, this would include gathering opinions from patients and families, getting expert views from professionals, gathering data from the context such as healthcare outcomes, and finally looking at scientific data to search for the best knowledge/evidence available to apply to the situation. 

Evidence-based research can be distorted to produce ‘magical numbers’ and Rob emphasises the need to critically examine what these numbers do and do not mean, and how they are used and misused. Critical thinking is also necessary to reflect on assumptions and biases that can lead to ‘evidence-based’ findings, produced to convince people to follow a particular path that was pre-ordained. Rob also points to the need for a more ground-up approach, to really think about what the challenge or problem is, and then design an evidence-based research study,  rather than  designing a study that will produce findings desired by a particular power group.  This podcast is a must listen for all who wish to deepen their understanding of evidence-based practice.  

Rob is Professor of Organizational Psychology at Queen Mary, University of London and is co-founder and Scientific Director of the Center for Evidence-Based Management. He is also a Visiting Professor of Evidence-Based HRM at Birkbeck (University of London) and Professor at Oslo Nye Høyskole. He has held positions at the Institute for Employment Studies, London School of Economics, Kings’s College (University of London), Bath University and University of Edinburgh. His research has focused on several topics including well-being, emotions, stress, ethnicity, the psychological contract, organizational culture and climate, absence from work, motivation, work-nonwork and everyday work behaviour. Beyond academic research and teaching, Rob helps practitioners and organizations make better use of evidence, including research evidence in decision-making as well as encouraging academics to make scientific research more accessible. He has received several awards for his work in this area including the British Psychological Society Division of Occupational Psychology Academic Contribution to Practice Award in 2014, topped HR Magazine’s Most Influential Thinker list in 2016, received a Lifetime Achievement Award in 2019 and was admitted to HR Magazine’s Hall of Fame.

Contact Rob: [email protected]