Most companies are using AI to cut costs. Ethan Mollick argues that the biggest mistake companies make is thinking too small.

In the first episode of Strange Loop, Wharton professor and leading AI researcher Ethan Mollick joins Sana founder and CEO Joel Hellermark for a candid and wide-ranging conversation about the rapidly changing world of AI at work.

They explore how AI is not just an efficiency tool but a turning point—one that forces a choice between incremental optimization and transformational scale. The discussion covers the roots of machine intelligence, the relevance of AGI, and what it takes to build organizations designed from the ground up for an AI-native future.

What’s in this episode

• Why most companies are underestimating what AI makes possible
• The tension between using AI for efficiency vs. scaling ambition
• How traditional org charts, built for a human-only workforce, are breaking
• The collapse of apprenticeship and its long-term implications- How prompting is becoming a foundational business skill
• Why “cheating” with AI may be the new form of learning
• The risks of using AI to optimize the past instead of inventing the future
• What it means to build truly AI-native teams and organizations

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Transcript: https://sanalabs.com/strange-loop/ethan-mollick

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About Strange Loop

Strange Loop is a podcast about how artificial intelligence is reshaping the systems we live and work in. Each episode features deep, unscripted conversations with thinkers and builders reimagining intelligence, leadership, and the architectures of progress. The goal is not just to follow AI’s trajectory, but to question the assumptions guiding it.

Subscribe for more conversations at the edge of AI and human knowledge.

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Timestamps

(00:20) Origins: AI in the early days at MIT

(01:53) Defining and testing intelligence: Beyond the Turing test

(06:35) Redesigning organizations for the AI era

(08:56) Human augmentation or replacement

(14:58) Navigating AI's jagged frontier

(17:18) The 3 ingredients for successful AI adoption

(23:31) Roles to hire for an AI-first world

(33:41) Do orgs need a Chief AI officer?

(39:45) The interface for AI and human collaboration

(43:50) Rethinking the goals of enterprise AI

(49:15) The case for abundance

(52:30) Best and worse case scenarios

(58:51) Avoiding the trap of enterprise AI KPIs

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Where to find Ethan

• Newsletter: https://www.oneusefulthing.org/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emollick/
• X: https://x.com/emollick

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Where to find Joel

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/joel-hellermark/
• X: https://x.com/joelhellermark