What role does forgiveness play in the hard, often painful work of building peace? In this episode of The UpWords Podcast, host Jean Geran sits down with her longtime friend Todd Deatherage, co-founder of Telos, a nonprofit helping leaders navigate conflict and work toward reconciliation in some of the world’s most challenging places.

Drawing from decades of experience in the Middle East, Northern Ireland, South Africa, and the American South, Todd shares why forgiveness can’t be forced — but why, when it does happen, it has the power to break open even the most entrenched cycles of hurt. From the story of Mama Callie Greer in Montgomery, Alabama, to the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in post-apartheid South Africa, this conversation is for anyone wrestling with what it means to pursue peace without sacrificing justice.

What You Will Learn

• Why forgiveness is essential to peacemaking — but can never be required or rushed
• The six principles of peacemaking that guide Telos’s work around the world
• The difference between inner transformation and systemic justice — and why both matter
• The story of Callie Greer: how one woman’s act of forgiveness launched a lifetime of advocacy
• What the Truth and Reconciliation Commission in South Africa teaches us about truth, forgiveness, and communal healing
• Why forgiveness across communal lines creates space for the offender to be transformed — not just the victim
• How restorative justice works, and why the American criminal legal system leaves so little room for repair
• The meaning of shalom — and why “peace” is a pale translation
• Communal responsibility, historical injustice, and what it means to say “I’m not responsible”
• Why “hurt people hurt people” — and why healed people have the power to bring healing to the world

Guest Bio

Todd Deatherage spent ten years on Capitol Hill and six years at the U.S. State Department working on human rights and international religious freedom — where he and Jean first became friends and colleagues. In 2009, he co-founded Telos, a nonprofit that helps leaders better understand conflict and equips them to pursue reconciliation and peace in some of the world’s most difficult contexts. Telos has created experiential learning journeys in the Middle East, Northern Ireland, South Africa, and the American South (Restory Us). Todd’s work is deeply rooted in his Christian faith and his conviction that justice, peacemaking, and forgiveness are inseparable.

Resources & Links

• Telos: telosgroup.org
• Restory Us (experiential learning in the American South): telosgroup.org
• One Day After Peace — documentary referenced in this episode
• Poor People’s Campaign (Rev. William Barber): poorpeoplescampaign.org
• Previous UpWords Podcast episode with Dr. Robert Enright on forgiveness: slbf.org/studio
• Listen and view other podcasts in the Forgivness Series: https://slbf.org/questions-of-faith-podcast-episodes

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This episode was created by the SLBF STUDIO at Upper House.

Produced by Daniel Johnson and Dave Conour

Edited by Dave Conour