In this episode of Home Care Hindsight, host David Knack sits down with Lucas Carroll, CEO of The Business of Senior Care. Lucas specializes in guiding home care startups, change of ownerships, and expansions through the complex world of state licensing and compliance.

He shares his unexpected journey from law school dropout to becoming a key resource in the home care industry. Lucas dives into a significant opportunity for agencies: diversifying into private duty nursing to retain clients, offer premium services, and increase revenue.

He also emphasizes the profound value of building relationships, even with competitors, and the importance of seeking mentorship from those just a few years ahead in their journey.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Explore Private Duty Nursing: There's a growing niche between non-medical home care and full home health. Offering services like medication setup, injections, or wound care privately can be a significant revenue driver and client retention tool.

2. Your Network is a Lifeline: Actively build relationships with other agency owners. They can be collaborators, not just competitors, providing support when you're short-staffed or need advice.

3. Leverage Your Experience: Don't overlook starting a business in the industry you know best. Your existing knowledge and network are invaluable assets.

4. Delegate to Accelerate: The biggest bottleneck for many owners is trying to do everything themselves. Identify the highest and best use of your time (often sales and marketing) and delegate or outsource the rest.

5. Learn from Those Ahead: Find mentors who are 2-3 years ahead of you. Their recent mistakes and lessons learned are a shortcut to avoiding frustration and saving time and energy.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Welcome to Home Care Hindsight

02:12 - Introduction to Lucas Carroll and The Business of Senior Care

02:41 - Diversifying service lines and payer sources

03:59 - The opportunity in private duty nursing

07:40 - Lucas on being a middle child and his personality

09:22 - The big mistake: Not leveraging his home care experience sooner

12:14 - The moment the idea clicked: A call from the health department

14:59 - The emotional journey of a new home care owner

17:08 - The entrepreneur's constant doubt: "Have I made a mistake?"

18:46 - The most underrated thing in home care: Relationship building

22:53 - A small mistake with big impact: Trying to do everything yourself

26:28 - A recent win: Helping agencies expand into private duty nursing

Quotes:

Lucas Carroll: "If you can talk to somebody who's two to three years ahead of where you want to be... they usually are like, man, I made so many mistakes. I would do this... and you just save yourself frustration, time, energy."

Lucas Carroll: "Why can't I leverage the experience and expertise and the mentors and the knowledge that I gained throughout this home care journey?"

Lucas Carroll: "The true value [is] in relationship building in the industry... developing relationships with other home care agencies who could be considered competitors."

David Knack: "Home care does not attract people who are looking to delegate by virtue of who they are as people... The buck stops with me. I'm gonna take care of it."

Resources:

1. The Business of Senior Care: https://thebusinessofseniorcare.com/

2. The Business of Senior Care on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/the-business-of-senior-care/

3. Lucas Carroll on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lucascarroll/

4. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

5. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

6. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

7. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

In this episode of Home Care Hindsight, host David Knack welcomes Chuck Bailey, founder and CEO of True North Holdings, to discuss the realities of being a small business owner in the home care industry. 

With decades of experience as a corporate executive, franchisee, franchisor, and now a service provider to franchisees, Chuck shares invaluable insights on the challenges of entrepreneurship, the importance of financial discipline, and the two critical roles every business owner must master: driving revenue and building a team.

He also reflects on his biggest mistake: trying to control everything, and how learning to delegate and trust his team transformed his business.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. The Two Core Responsibilities of an Owner: Focus on driving revenue and building your team. Everything else can be delegated or outsourced.

2. Avoid Overcontrol: Holding onto tasks too tightly limits growth. Delegate early and trust your team to execute, even if their methods differ from yours.

3. Financial Cadence is Key: Regularly review your finances, regardless of whether you’re struggling or thriving. Consistency in financial oversight prevents surprises and fuels growth.

4. Hire for Vision Alignment: Prioritize hiring bright, adaptable people who understand and embody your mission, rather than just industry experience.

5. AI as a Tool, Not a Miracle: While AI can enhance consistency and efficiency, it requires training and alignment with your business’s core values to be effective.

Timestamps:

02:24 - The challenges of being a small business owner in home care

07:25 - Chuck’s biggest mistake: Trying to control everything

12:44 - The importance of mission and vision in team building

19:18 - Financial cadence: Why it’s critical for business success

24:41 - Overrated in home care: Exotic marketing solutions

29:50 - The role of AI in home care and maintaining message consistency

34:31 - A small mistake with big consequences: Delegating sales too soon

40:41 - Chuck’s win of the week: Launching My Franchise Bookkeeper

Quotes:

Chuck Bailey: "The two jobs of a business owner are to drive revenue and build the team. Everything else can be outsourced."

David Knack: "The rub of leadership is holding the vision tightly but the execution loosely."

Chuck Bailey: "People buy from people who care. That’s the foundation of home care."

Chuck Bailey: "80% of AI is crap. The 20% that works can change your business—if you train it right."

Resources:

1. Chuck Bailey on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/charlesbailey/

2. True North Holdings on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/true-north-holdings/

3. True North Holdings website: https://www.true-north-holdings.com/

4. My Franchise Bookkeeper: https://www.linkedin.com/company/myfranchisebookkeeper/

5. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

6. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

7. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

8. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

In this episode of Home Care Hindsight, host David Knack sits down with Emily Isbell, founder of EI and Company, to discuss her impressive journey from caregiver at 19 to a successful home care consultant and bestselling author.

They talk about Emily's early career, the evolution of her business, and the release of her book, 'The 24/7 Solution.' Emily shares valuable insights on correcting mistakes, the importance of consistently executing strategies, and the necessity of looking for talent within your existing workforce. They also explore the challenges of maintaining emotional maturity in a high-stakes industry like home care.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. When mistakes happen, own them, apologize, and work to make things right rather than focusing on defending your actions.

2. Stick to your systems and execute consistently, even when challenges arise. This is essential for long-term success.

3. Look for leadership potential in your caregivers. With the right mentorship, they can become powerful contributors to your business.

4. Base your decisions on hard data, not emotional reactions, to ensure sustainable growth and success.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Introduction to Emily Isbell and her home care journey

04:29 - Emily’s "What if?" career: Owning a gym for competitive gymnastics

07:34 - The cigarette mistake: A cringe-worthy moment from Emily’s caregiving days

13:00 - Emily’s key takeaway: "It’s about making right, not being right"

16:37 - The importance of consistent execution in the home care industry

25:00 - Promoting from within: Emily’s philosophy on caregiver development

34:31 - Big vs. small mistakes: Thinking like an owner, not a manager

40:41 - Emily’s win of the week: Growing client businesses by 60% in six months

Quotes:

Emily Isbell: "It’s not about being right; it’s about making right. That’s how you build trust in this industry."

David Knack: "An urgent problem in home care is also an important one, which makes it crucial to respond with emotional maturity."

Emily Isbell: "I would not be here today if someone hadn’t believed in promoting caregivers from within."

Emily Isbell: "Data over dopamine—that’s how we keep the business growing without being reactive to every little challenge."

Resources:

1. Emily Isbell on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emilyisbellcofounder/

2. Emily's Book: The 24/7 Solution: Proven Strategies for Home Care Business Leaders: https://www.amazon.com/24-Solution-Strategies-Business-Leaders/dp/B0D35QD7HT

3. EI and Company: https://emilyisbellco.com/

4. EI and Company on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/emilyisbellco/about/

5. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

6. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

7. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

8. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

In this episode of Home Care Hindsight, host David Knack welcomes Guy Tommasi, a seasoned leader in the home care industry with over 25 years of experience. Guy shares his journey from hospital care to pioneering innovative, data-driven strategies in non-medical home care.

He takes us to a discussion of the importance of differentiating your agency by aligning with stakeholders' needs, leveraging data to demonstrate outcomes, and the pitfalls of overemphasizing "scaling" as a measure of success.

Guy also highlights the transformative power of collaboration, both within teams and with clinical partners, and why home care agencies should seize opportunities in higher-acuity care.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Success is Defined by You: Don’t let external benchmarks like "scaling" dictate your agency’s success. Focus on what aligns with your goals and values.

2. Speak Your Stakeholders’ Language: To stand out in a competitive market, translate your services into outcomes that matter to referral sources, such as reduced hospital readmissions and improved patient satisfaction.

3. Empower Your Team: Leadership isn’t about making all the decisions—it’s about involving your team, fostering ownership, and trusting them to drive innovation.

4. Don’t Assume Clinical Programs Aren’t for You: Non-medical home care agencies can play a critical role in value-based care and hospital-at-home programs. Challenge assumptions and explore new revenue streams.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Welcome to Home Care Hindsight

02:10 - The competitive landscape of Connecticut’s home care market

04:35 - How data became a differentiator for Guy’s agency

08:28 - The power of speaking stakeholders’ language

12:19 - Overcoming the "private pay" objection with referral sources

16:39 - Guy’s "Neuralizer" moment: The 2004 Yankees-Red Sox World Series

19:48 - The big mistake: Trying to lead alone instead of empowering the team

25:00 - A team success story: How a supervisor transformed their data program

29:47 - Why "scaling" is overrated in home care

33:25 - The problem with calling caregivers "unskilled"

36:24 - The mistake of leaving clinical opportunities on the table

42:10 - Guy’s proudest moment: Helping an agency join a hospital-at-home program

45:00 - Final plug: Home care’s strategic role in the future of healthcare

Quotes:

Guy Tommasi: "Success is what you feel it is. Don’t let the word ‘scale’ intimidate you or dictate whether you’re successful or not."

David Knack: "An urgent problem in home care is also an important one, which makes it crucial to respond with emotional maturity."

Guy Tommasi: "Don’t assume because something is ‘clinical’ that it’s not for you. 80% of health outcomes are non-medical—that’s our space."

Guy Tommasi: "Leadership isn’t about dragging people along—it’s about directing their energy and letting them own the results."

Resources:

1. Guy Tommasi on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/guy-tommasi-a0a4bb18/

2. Corcoran Consulting Group LLC: https://www.corcoranconsultants.com/

3. Corcoran Consulting Group LLC on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/corcoranconsultinggroup-llc/

4. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

5. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

6. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

7. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

Randy Platt and Rodney Burris, co-founders of Care Partners, reveal how blind optimism and over-reliance on culture nearly derailed their home care startup, and the pivotal shifts that turned their $0M mistake into 40% growth.

In this transparent conversation, the duo unpacks their early missteps: from chasing unrealistic budgets to hiring for "culture fit" over performance. Discover how they transformed their partnership through radical transparency ("no barnacles"), why EQ now trumps IQ in their hiring, and the surprising metric that proves their team’s resilience.

From solving healthcare fragmentation to measuring the unmeasurable (like caregiver impact on family stress), Randy and Rodney share hard-won lessons on building a company where love, empathy, and execution coexist.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

1. The $0M mistake: How Rodney’s blind optimism burned 30 months of runway (and the team hack that fixed it).

2. Culture vs. performance: Why Randy’s "over-architected" hiring approach backfired—and the balance that works now.

3. The "no barnacles" rule: How radical partnership transparency prevents startup collapse.

4. EQ > IQ: Why they hire passionate novices over jaded experts.

50 The unmeasurable win: How caregivers reduce family anxiety (and why it’s their secret sauce).

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Optimism needs guardrails: Involve your team in budgeting to spot blind spots.

2. Culture isn’t enough: Pair empathy with clear performance expectations.

3. Partnerships thrive on vulnerability: Know everything about your co-founder’s weaknesses.

4. Hire for grit, not just fit: Passionate learners outperform experienced skeptics.

5. Human connection > tech: AI can’t replace the caregiver’s role as "the thread through a patient’s life."

Timestamps:

00:00 - Welcome to Home Care Hindsight

01:48 - Meet Randy & Rodney: Care Partners’ origin story

03:26 - Their big vision: Reducing healthcare fragmentation

06:06 - Rodney’s mistake: Blind optimism in budgeting

10:00 - The windshield moment: Overestimating referral timelines

13:57 - Randy’s mistake: Over-indexing on culture in hiring

16:58 - Why EQ beats IQ in team building

20:00 - The "no barnacles" partnership strategy

25:10 - Measuring caregiver impact beyond metrics

30:06 - Little mistakes: Cash reserves & peer mentorship

35:20 - Proudest win: Team-led expansion & Inc. 5000 recognition

38:12 - How to connect with Care Partners

Quotes:

"Blind optimism is like driving 100mph without seeing the windshields coming." — Rodney Burris

"Human connection is the lifeblood of home care—no bot can replace it." — Randy Platt

"90% of 50/50 partnerships fail. ‘No barnacles’ saved ours." — Rodney Burris

"Cash is king. Add 20% to your budget—you’ll need it." — Randy Platt

"CEOs are the loneliest people. Find a peer mentor." — Randy Platt

Resources:

1. Randy Platt on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/randyplatt/

2. Rodney Burris on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rodney-burris-bba75491/

3. Care Partners Website: https://carepartners.us/

4. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

5. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

6. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

7. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

In this episode of Home Care Hindsight, host David Knack interviews Rachel Gartner, founder and CEO of Carework. They discuss Rachel's life in rural South Georgia as an Army wife and mother, her passion for hiring military spouses, and the unique challenges in the home care recruitment industry.

Rachel shares insights on building effective systems for employee recognition, managing rapid company growth, and the importance of maintaining a caregiver-first mindset. They explore the difficulties of balancing recruitment intentions with execution and the significance of analyzing recruitment metrics.

The episode concludes with Rachel's thoughts on overrated and underrated recruitment strategies, the benefits of a strong referral program, and simplifying the hiring process.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Scaling employee recognition requires both intention and properly built systems to ensure no one falls through the cracks.

2. Having a defined and consistent recruiting process is more effective than constantly chasing flashy new recruiting strategies.

3. Owners and leaders need to be mindful of their language and attitudes about caregivers, as it sets the tone for the entire organization.

4. Referral programs are a highly effective yet often underutilized source of quality candidates and should be funded appropriately based on cost-per-hire metrics.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Welcome to Home Care Hindsight

01:03 - Introduction to Rachel Gartner’s mission as a military spouse through Carework

07:21 - A lesson from Rachel’s dad and her big mistake realized after reading employee feedback

14:00 - Discussing how Rachel built a system to acknowledge every caregiver’s hard work and spotting company problems through surveys

23:00 - Overrated vs. Underrated: Rachel’s take about how to improve recruiting strategies

29:08 - How complaining about caregivers influence a whole team and Carework’s newest case study

35:13 - Home Care Hot Take: Rachel’s valuable knowledge about hiring caregiver candidates

Quotes:

Rachel Gartner: "When I do fail or make a big mistake, I go, well, you know what? At least I know I'm trying really hard."

David Knack: "Our best caregivers never get to hear from us because we know we can rely on them and they're out of sight, out of mind."

Rachel Gartner: "I will challenge people on bad practices. But there's so much doom and gloom out there that actually is really not helpful for agencies that want to grow. That I try to be very clear of like, it is possible and it can work and it can be really fun and rewarding."

Resources:

1. Carework on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/careworkus

2. Sign in to Carework: https://www.careworkus.com/

3. Case Study about a 25% Cut of Caregiver Turnover: https://www.careworkus.com/post/case-study-how-home-helpers-of-lansdale-cut-caregiver-turnover-by-25

4. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

5. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

6. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

7. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

John Soltys, founder of Project Senior Care, shares his hard-won lessons from wasting two years (and resources) on an overcomplicated tech vision—and how a pivot to caregiver training and mentorship unlocked explosive growth.

In this raw conversation, John reveals how his "big idea" mentality almost sank the business, why 96% of seniors fall into an unaffordable care gap, and the partnerships now helping agencies serve everyone—regardless of income.

From rebuilding trust with his team to rethinking caregiver recruitment (hint: stop recycling the same hires), John breaks down the "no one left behind" approach that’s transforming referrals, discharge planning, and even veteran care access.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

1. The $2M mistake: Why John ignored expert advice (and how it burned his runway).

2. The "middle 96%" problem: Solving care for seniors who aren’t poor enough for Medicaid or rich enough for private pay.

3. How Project Senior Care’s mentor program turns stagnant leads into high-conversion clients.

4. Why caregiver academies should target new talent pools (not just industry veterans).

5. The nonprofit partnerships that now let agencies say: "We can help anyone."

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Focus beats complexity: Start with one "gear" of your vision, then scale.

2. Farm, don’t just hunt: Invest in long-term relationships, not just crisis-mode referrals.

3. Reputation is more valuable than revenue: Agencies that help all families (even non-paying ones) build unstoppable trust.

4. Recruit for passion, not experience: Train caregivers who see this as a career—not a side gig.

5. Listen to your team (and experts): Emotional detachment saves startups from "ugly baby" blind spots.

Timestamps:

00:00 - Welcome to Home Care Hindsight

01:15 - John’s entrepreneurial journey & Project Senior Care’s mission

03:00 - The "middle 96%" crisis: Seniors who can’t afford care

06:10 - John’s $2M mistake: Overbuilding tech instead of focusing

09:55 - The pivot that saved the business: Caregiver academy & mentor programs

13:30 - Why most agencies recycle caregivers (and how to find new talent)

16:45 - The problem with traditional referral sources

20:00 - "No one left behind": Partnering with nonprofits to serve all families

25:10 - How the mentor program transforms stagnant leads

28:40 - Little mistakes that sink agencies (and how to fix them)

32:50 - John’s proudest win: Expanding resources for veterans and low-income seniors

35:20 - How to join Project Senior Care’s mentor program

Quotes:

"I wasted two years of runway because I thought I was the smartest guy in the room." — John Soltys

"96% of seniors aren’t poor enough for Medicaid or rich enough for private pay. That’s our sweet spot." — John Soltys

"Stop hiring the same caregivers working for five agencies. Find people who see this as a career." — John Soltys

"Farm, don’t just hunt. If you’re not planting, you’re stuck on a treadmill." — John Soltys

"The power of saying, ‘Send me everyone—not just the ones who can pay.’" — John Soltys

Resources:

1. John Soltys on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/johnasoltys/

2. Project Senior Care: https://www.projectseniorcare.org/

3. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

4. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

5. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

6. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

Fady Sahhar, a disability advocate and home care strategist with decades of experience, unveils how Medicare Advantage is reshaping home care—and why agencies must rethink caregiver training to thrive.

In this eye-opening conversation with host David Knack, Fady shares:

• Why 750+ Medicare Advantage plans now cover home care (and how to tap into this growing market).
• The "lifetime value" mindset shift that turns clients into long-term partners.
• How peer coaching solves EVV resistance and caregiver retention challenges.
• Fady also reveals common cultural blindspots when expanding into new markets, the underrated power of back-office customer service, and why "nothing about us without us" should guide every disability interaction.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

• Medicare Advantage 101: Reimbursement rates, local plan strategies, and why home care beats home health for post-discharge recovery.
• The "Wheelchair Lesson": How to interact with clients with disabilities (hint: sit down first).
• Rural vs. Urban Care: Why training must adapt to community rhythms—not just policies.
• Peer Coaching Magic: How top caregivers can train teams better than supervisors.
• Data = Negotiation Power: What payers really want from home care agencies in value-based contracts.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Medicare Advantage is a gateway. Reimbursement sits between Medicaid and private pay—but the real value is in lead generation and proving outcomes.
2. Train caregivers as local experts. Your processes stay consistent, but training must reflect community needs.
3. Peer coaches over policy manuals. Let star caregivers demonstrate EVV or crisis response—it’s 10x more effective.
4. Track client health like a CRM. Preventing UTIs or hospitalizations is your leverage with payers.
5. "Nothing about us without us." Involve clients with disabilities in designing their care.

Timestamps:

00:00 – Welcome to Home Care Hindsight

01:50 – Fady’s intro: Wheelchair user, quadri-lingual, and advocate

03:10 – How to interact with clients with disabilities (the "pull up a chair" rule)

05:25 – Medicare Advantage’s home care boom: 750+ plans and counting

08:30 – Why home care beats home health for post-discharge recovery

12:15 – Fady’s biggest mistake: Treating all clients as homogeneous

16:40 – Rural vs. urban care: Why training must adapt to local culture

20:50 – Peer coaching: How star caregivers can train teams (EVV success story)

25:30 – Underrated #1: Back-office customer service as a differentiator

29:45 – Underrated #2: Proving outcomes to payers (data = $$$)

33:20 – Little mistake: Ignoring client lifetime value (and how to fix it)

36:00 – Fady’s proudest win: Agencies embracing value-based care

38:10 – Final thoughts: Plugging The VBP Blog and Dual Eligible HQ

Quotes:

1. "If you’re standing next to someone in a wheelchair, pull up a chair. Talk to them—not their companion." — Fady Sahhar

2. "Medicare Advantage plans don’t need a nurse to help someone get dressed. They need a caregiver at half the cost." — Fady Sahhar

3. "Peer coaches make EVV adoption feel like help—not surveillance." — Fady Sahhar

4. "Your caregivers are your eyes and ears. Train them to spot UTIs before ER visits happen." — Fady Sahhar

Resources:

1. Connect with Fady Sahhar on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/fadysahhar/

2. ProVantaCare Website: https://provantacare.com/

3. The Value-Based Payment Blog: www.theVBPblog.com

4. Dual Eligible HQ: www.DualEligibleHQ.com

5. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

6. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

7. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

8. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

Bruce Vanderlaan, seasoned investment banker and home care M&A expert, reveals how control-freak tendencies can sabotage agency growth, and why letting go is the key to unlocking real value. 

In this candid conversation with host David Knack, Bruce shares hard-won lessons from decades of guiding home care owners through exits, including:

• The financial metrics buyers actually care about (and why "too profitable" can be a red flag).
• How over-control devalues your agency—and how to fix it.
• The surprising role of culture in maximizing your sale price.
• Bruce also dives into common mistakes owners make when preparing to sell, the underrated power of industry conferences, and why "hiring people to leave" might be the best culture strategy you’ve never tried.

In This Episode, You’ll Discover:

• The "sweet spot" for profitability—why 15% EBITDA is ideal (and why 25% scares buyers).
• Control vs. value—how micromanaging tanks your agency’s sale price.
• The 4-6 month exit roadmap—what to organize now to avoid last-minute chaos.
• Culture as a financial asset—why buyers pay more for teams that thrive without the owner.
• Little mistakes with big consequences—like skipping conferences or neglecting sales pipelines.

Lesson Takeaways:

• Your agency’s value hinges on independence. If it can’t run without you, buyers will pay less.
• Mindfulness over micromanagement. Train yourself to delegate like you’d train for a marathon.
• "Too profitable" is a warning sign. Sustainable systems beat heroics every time.
• Conferences are cheat codes. Relationships and knowledge there accelerate growth.
• Start exit prep early. Bank statements, compliance docs, and org charts matter now.

Timestamps: 00:00 – Welcome to Home Care Hindsight 01:15 – Bruce’s unconventional intro: “Lawyer, teacher, teamster, farmhand” 02:45 – Why buyers care about how you grew (not just revenue) 05:04 – The golden financial benchmarks: 50% gross margin, 15% EBITDA 07:30 – Bruce’s biggest mistake: “I was a control freak—here’s how it backfired” 10:40 – How to delegate like a pro (even if it feels impossible) 14:15 – “The business thrived when I got out of the way” – real-client story 17:00 – Underrated #1: Culture that encourages employees to leave (but they stay) 19:25 – Underrated #2: Sales pipelines (why “sales cures all ills”) 22:10 – Little mistake #1: Skipping conferences (and how to fix it) 24:50 – Little mistake #2: Disorganized exits (the 4-6 month reality check) 28:30 – Blind spots in exit prep: Financials, compliance, and “recreated” legal docs 33:45 – Bruce’s proudest win: Guiding agencies through crises to successful exits 35:15 – Final thoughts: Plugging the mission of home care

Quotes:

1. “If it’s all you, the value is much lower. Buyers pay for replicable systems.” — Bruce Vanderlaan
2. “Sales cures all ills—but you have to staff the growth.” — Bruce Vanderlaan
3. “The best culture I’ve seen? Hire people expecting them to leave… then they stay.” — Bruce Vanderlaan
4. “Agency owners: You’re not just building a business. You’re building an asset.” — Bruce Vanderlaan

Resources:

1. Bruce Vanderlaan on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bruce-vanderlaan-35974861/
2. Mertz Taggart: https://www.mertztaggart.com/
3. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/
4. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/
5. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/
6. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage

Jensen Jones, CEO of Home Care CEO, opens up about the surprising mindset shift that reshaped his entire business model from an “exclusive” high-revenue think tank to a values-driven, mission-aligned community. In this candid conversation, Jensen and host David Knack explore how aligning personal values with business decisions can radically improve culture, retention, and growth.

Jensen reflects on how his father's illness helped define his core values and how he now helps agencies scale without losing their humanity. He reveals the dangers of over-customizing roles, why playbooks prevent burnout, and why culture, not revenue, is the most accurate measure of success.

In this episode, you’ll discover:

1. How exclusivity undermined his mission and what he did to fix it.

2. The “playbook” system that makes tribal knowledge scalable.

3. Why caregivers should be your biggest fans (and how to make it happen).

4. How defining roles instead of people avoids disaster.

5. Why agencies growing on paper might actually be stuck.

Lesson Takeaways:

1. Define your culture first and then align everything else.

2. Exclusivity creates silos; accessibility builds connection.

3. You can’t scale around unicorns. Build roles, not people.

4. Retention isn’t just a strategy. It’s a reflection of values lived daily.

5. Revenue without culture is just noise. Growth starts from within.

Timestamps:

00:00 – Welcome to Home Care Hindsight 01:25 – Meet Jensen Jones & his core values 05:25 – The story of his father’s illness & realignment 07:22 – Why exclusivity clashed with his mission 10:40 – Scaling relationships across revenue groups 14:52 – Turning members into the face of Home Care CEO 15:15 – How peer groups amplify values and ideas 18:02 – Culture that makes you want to work there 17:30 – Caregiver-first culture in action (with a flat tire) 22:07 – Screening for values during hiring 23:26 – Why top-line revenue is overrated 26:30 – Defining scalable roles, not just people 29:46 – Don’t punish your producers—manage bandwidth 31:34 – The value of team-created playbooks 32:24 – Playbooks as culture and training tools 36:33 – Using the org chart to plan your future team 37:36 – Hiring for the agency you want, not just the one you have 38:01 – Recent wins: Member growth, new groups, and impact 39:55 – Final thoughts & how to connect with Jensen

Quotes:

1. “I don’t want to be the face of Home Care CEO. Our members are the face. Let’s amplify their voices.” — Jensen Jones

2. “Culture isn't on the wall—it’s what people repeat, live, and use to make decisions.” — Jensen Jones

3. “We’re not scaling unicorns—we’re scaling systems.” — Jensen Jones

4. “Revenue’s up, but census is flat? That’s not growth. That’s inflation.” — Jensen Jones

Resources:

1. Jensen Jones on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jensenjones/

2. Home Care CEO’s website: https://www.homecareceo.com/about-us/

3. HOMECAREceo Forum Community: https://www.linkedin.com/groups/3273154/

4. Connect with David Knack on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/david-knack/

5. Connect with Zingage on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/zingage/

6. Powered by Zingage: https://zingage.com/

7. Watch Episode on Zingage’s YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@Zingage