This week I sat down with the brilliant Ella de Beer co-founder of Electric Mayonnaise and one of those hospitality people whose career reminds you just how brilliantly unpredictable this industry can be.

From waitressing at 14 in South Africa (while telling everyone she was 16… obviously), to opening restaurants, running pubs, building multi-site businesses, leading people functions at brands like Ottolenghi & MJMK and now helping shape the next generation of hospitality leaders, Ella’s story is packed with graft, curiosity, and a healthy dose of “why not give that a go?”

Along the way there are some absolute hospitality gems… including the moment she handed Leonardo DiCaprio chicken on a stick, worked 3am Soho finishes fuelled by “Chinese tea” and helped open a 300 cover restaurant just as the financial crash hit. Ideal timing.

But underneath the brilliant stories is something deeper, a conversation about the power of hospitality as a career, the importance of learning by doing, and why developing people might just be the most important job our industry has.

In this episode, Ella and I get into…

• Starting in hospitality at 14 and discovering confidence through people

• Moving from South Africa to the Netherlands (and learning Dutch while running a restaurant)

• The chaos, glamour and 600-cover Saturdays of Soho hospitality in the early 2000s

• Why big volume restaurants teach you lessons you never forget

• The moment a 300-seat opening met the global financial crash

• What London operators learn the hard way when they buy countryside pubs

• Building "Sourced Market" at St Pancras and what happens when 1,500 small suppliers meet train station footfall

• Moving from operations into people leadership, and why ops experience changes everything

• The unique magic (and slightly chaotic brilliance) of working at Ottolenghi

• Why hospitality might be the best industry in the world for social mobility

• How Electric Mayonnaise is rethinking hospitality education through apprenticeships

• And why learning in hospitality should always be practical, human, and immediately useful

Some cracking quote-ables from Ella

“Hospitality is where I found my confidence”

“You could stand behind the till at St Pancras for eight hours and never stop serving”

“Hospitality has to be taught by people who’ve actually done it”

“We’re just teaching the way we all learned, by doing the job”

“Our responsibility is to show young people this industry can be a real career”

Why this episode is worth your ears

If you’ve ever started in hospitality with no real plan… and somehow found yourself building a career along the way, this episode will feel very familiar.

Ella’s story is a brilliant reminder that hospitality isn’t just about service or restaurants.

It’s about confidence, opportunity, learning on the job, and giving people a chance to grow into something bigger than they thought possible.

And if that doesn’t make you proud to be in hospitality…

You might be in the wrong trade

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

Still Building

Born in a hotel, thrown out of university

Built the UK’s biggest hospitality recruitment business, Lost control of it, Lost his driving licence, Broke his back.

You'd think this was a lesson in how not to do it?

But far from it!

This week on Hospitality Meets, I sit down with Roddy Watt, recruitment pioneer, hotel strategist, owner of one almighty black book and living proof that setbacks are not full stops, they’re commas.

In This Episode

1. Why most careers start by accident
2. “Aim at nothing and you’ll hit it” (a dartboard life lesson)
3. Building a 200 person recruitment empire
4. What happens when venture capital meets optimism
5. The week that tested everything
6. Why attitude beats experience
7. Why high performers don’t get a free pass
8. Relaunching again… because why not?

Built. Lost. Still Building

Roddy helped shape hospitality recruitment in the UK.

15 offices.

Hundreds of consultants.

Market leader.

Then came the flotation.

The numbers.

The pressure.

The reality check.

And a particularly memorable week involving:

• Losing his company

• Losing his driving licence

• Falling off a horse and breaking his back

His summary?

“That was a week.”

No violin music. Just perspective.

And learning that sometimes your worst week becomes the beginning of your next chapter.

This episode is funny, honest, slightly outrageous in places, and packed with lessons you only get from someone who’s been around the block a few times

🎧 Listen now: https://linktr.ee/Hospmeetspod

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

From Baptism of Fire to Michelin Leadership

This week on Hospitality Meets, Phil sits down with Douglas Balish - Executive Chef and Director at Grove of Narberth, Hotel Chef of the Year, and a man shaped by some of the toughest kitchens in the business.

From washing dishes in Ayrshire…

To getting “pans thrown at his head”

To learning to run in kitchens where nobody walked…

To leading his own Michelin starred brigade

And all of the lessons that come with that

This is a candid episode about pressure, humility, growth — and the fine line between breaking someone and building them.

In This Episode

1. Starting out as a 15 year old dishwasher in Scotland
2. Walking away from university to chase kitchens instead
3. The brutal reality of early Michelin kitchens
4. Why some pressure builds you, and some destroys you
5. Taking demotions to grow faster
6. Working at Bohemia and being completely out of his depth
7. The intensity of Whatley Manor
8. Moving to Australia to work at Quay
9. Why leadership is not one size fits all
10. Creating dishes when nobody’s ever let you create before

Baptism of Fire

Douglas doesn’t sugarcoat it. His early Michelin experience was brutal.

80-hour weeks.

Staff accommodation from hell.

Being told he was useless.

Working until nothing fazed him.

And yet, he doesn’t look back with bitterness.

He looks back with perspective.

Because for him, that pressure didn’t break him.

It sharpened him.

Not because bullying is good (Obviously) but because understanding why something is happening matters

The Psychology of Kitchens

There’s a fascinating thread in this episode. Douglas nearly studied psychology. Instead, he learned it in kitchens.

He talks openly about:

1. Realising he wasn’t as good as he thought
2. Being publicly humbled
3. Being dropped down the ranks
4. Taking ownership instead of walking away

And most importantly, how that shaped the leader he is today.

He’s clear:

Management isn’t one-size-fits-all.

Some chefs need an arm around them.

Some need structure.

Some need challenge.

The job is knowing the difference.

From Scotland to Sydney

His journey takes him through:

1. Jersey
2. The Cotswolds
3. Australia
4. Back to the UK to run his own restaurant

At Quay, he experienced world stage dining, huge covers, relentless precision, global recognition.

At smaller, creative restaurants, he discovered something else:

The kitchen has to suit the chef.

Because even talent struggles in the wrong environment.

Leadership Now

Today, at Grove of Narberth, Douglas does things differently.

Yes, standards are high.

Yes, precision matters.

But:

1. Young chefs are encouraged to create
2. Ideas are tested safely
3. Feedback is constructive
4. Growth is intentional

Because he remembers what it felt like to be thrown in without support.

And he’s determined to build strength, not just resilience.

Stand-Out Reflection

“At some point you’ve got to become head chef”

"And when you do — you’d better know who you are"

This episode is honest, Unfiltered, and full of insight for anyone leading teams under pressure

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

Building a Regenerative Farm Stay

This week on Hospitality Meets, Phil sits down with Caitlin Owens, Managing Director and co-owner of Fowlescombe Farm, a luxury farm stay in Devon built on regenerative farming principles.

What started as a family meat farm became a pub

What started as a consulting career became a hospitality adventure.

What started as “how hard can it be?” became… chlorine spraying out of beer lines.

This episode is about naivety, chaos, regenerative farming, and why hospitality might just be the most beautifully human industry of them all.

In This Episode

1. Quitting consultancy during lockdown to learn hospitality in Switzerland
2. Running a pub during the wild summer of 2021
3. The science (and danger) of cleaning beer lines
4. Why hospitality operates permanently on the edge of chaos
5. What consulting really taught her (hint: it’s not insurance maths)
6. Bringing regenerative farming into luxury hospitality
7. Why “low choice, high quality” beats endless options
8. The rise of the farm stay experience
9. Describing humanity to a Martian (yes, really)

From Farm to Fork, For Real

Fowlscombe isn’t just “farm to table” as a marketing line

The farm is regenerative

The soil health is measured

Animals fertilise the land naturally

Monoculture is avoided

The hospitality exists because of the land, not the other way around

Chaos, Sheep & Beer Showers

Running the family pub (The Millbrook) during post-lockdown mania meant:

1. Chlorine explosions in the cellar
2. Smelling permanently of ale
3. A sheep on a lead turning up for the village nativity
4. A horse tied to the drainpipe while the chef fed it carrots

Skills from “Outside” Hospitality

Caitlin didn’t climb the traditional hospitality ladder.

Her background in consultancy gave her:

1. Structured thinking
2. Clear communication
3. Confidence with tech providers
4. The ability to not be messed around by suppliers

A reminder that hospitality doesn’t need to be a closed shop.

Different backgrounds make stronger teams.

Regenerative Hospitality

For Caitlin, sustainability isn’t just environmental.

It’s about:

1. Less waste
2. Fewer food miles
3. Lower choice, higher quality
4. Doing less, but doing it exceptionally well

You won’t find 24-hour room service and 200 menu options.

You’ll find five carefully chosen cocktails.

One menu per day.

Ingredients picked from the garden.

Intentional. Grounded. Memorable.

Standout Line

“Hospitality operates on the edge of chaos. The critical success factor is staying on the right side of it”

This is an episode about:

Taking risks.

Backing instinct.

Building something rooted in the land.

And discovering that sometimes, the best leadership inspiration comes from Ted Lasso.

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

Why Understanding Drives Performance

This week on Hospitality Meets, Phil is joined by Will Fraser, co-founder of Pineapple, founder of 100 & First, and former professional rugby player.

What begins as a conversation about people data quickly becomes something deeper, a clear eyed look at why teams struggle, why talent alone isn’t enough, and why most performance problems come down to misunderstanding, not ability.

This is a calm, thoughtful episode about clarity, context, and why better conversations beat better strategies.

In This Episode

1. Why performance is a by-product, not something you can force
2. The difference between thinking you know something and actually knowing it
3. Why misunderstanding (not laziness) drives most workplace issues
4. What elite sport gets right about teams that business often gets wrong
5. The hidden cost of constant change and short term thinking
6. Why stability can be a genuine competitive advantage
7. How people data should start conversations, not end them

From Elite Sport to Hospitality

Will’s thinking was shaped during his time at Saracens, where a strong focus on people and culture transformed performance under pressure.

After injury ended his playing career, Will began applying those lessons in business, and quickly noticed a gap between how elite teams operate and how most organisations try to drive results.

The biggest difference?

Shared understanding

What the Data Shows

Through Pineapple, Will now works with hospitality businesses to understand patterns around:

1. Attrition
2. Internal progression
3. Team stability

One consistent insight stands out:

Greater stability and internal progression = lower turnover.

Simple. Powerful. Rarely acted on.

The Talent Myth

Will challenges the idea that great performers can simply be “moved” and expected to thrive.

Drawing on examples from football, including Brighton & Hove Albion and Brentford, he explains why performance is often owned by the system, not just the individual.

Change the context, and performance usually dips.

Stand-Out Thoughts

1. “Most performance problems aren’t competence problems — they’re understanding problems”
2. “If you think something rather than know it, you haven’t had the conversation”
3. “Stability, not constant change, is often the real advantage”

Why Listen

This episode is for anyone who has:

1. Seen good people struggle in new roles
2. Felt pressure to change something without clarity on what
3. Wondered why common sense is so rarely common practice

It’s a reminder that teams don’t fail because they don’t care, they fail because they don’t understand.

And understanding only comes from time, clarity, and conversation.

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

Prepare. To. Be. Happy.

Returning to Hospitality Meets, Klaudia Mitura - work psychologist, L&D leader at the Science Museum Group, host of The Happiness Challenge podcast, author of The Alphabet of Happiness, and an actual Certified Chief Happiness Officer (yes, really) delivers one of the most uplifting, honest, and quietly powerful conversations we’ve ever recorded.

This episode is not about toxic positivity, pretending everything’s fine, or slapping a smile on life’s messier moments.

It’s about science backed happiness, micro habits, curiosity, resilience, and learning how to live with the noise in your head - not silence it.

It’s warm.

It’s funny.

It’s deeply human.

And it might just change how you think about happiness altogether.

In This Episode

1. Klaudia’s return to the podcast nearly four years on, and how life has unfolded since
2. Losing a job, being separated from family, rescheduling a wedding four times, a family cancer diagnosis… and why happiness still mattered
3. Why Klaudia decided to treat her life like a scientific experiment
4. What the science of happiness actually tells us
5. Why happiness isn’t a destination - it’s a starting point
6. The power of micro-habits and why 1% changes beat life overhauls
7. Why happiness fuels kindness, generosity, optimism and impact
8. The danger of “I’ll be happy when…” thinking
9. Why curiosity might be the most underrated life skill of all

Happiness, But Not the Cringey Kind

Klaudia is very clear on one thing:

This is not about toxic positivity.

It’s not about ignoring grief, stress, uncertainty, or the very real challenges of life and work.

It’s about acknowledging them and giving yourself the tools to cope, recover, and move forward.

As Klaudia explains, happiness:

1. Helps us regulate our nervous system
2. Makes us more resilient under pressure
3. Increases kindness, generosity and problem solving
4. Gives us the energy to face hard things, not avoid them

Or put simply:

Happiness doesn’t deny reality.

It helps you deal with it.

Stand-Out Quotes

“Happiness is not a destination. It’s a starting point”

“We regret not allowing ourselves to be happier”

“You can be going through something hard and still experience joy”

“Happiness fuels kindness. Without it, we can’t change anything”

“You don’t need a life overhaul - you need small habits, done consistently”

Why Listen

This episode is for you if:

1. You’re tired of overcomplicating happiness
2. You want practical tools, not platitudes
3. You lead people and want them to thrive, not just survive
4. You’re curious about how your brain actually works
5. You want permission to feel joy without guilt

It’s a reminder that happiness is not selfish.

It’s not fluffy.

And it’s definitely not accidental.

As Klaudia dares us all to do:

👉 Be 1% happier. That’s enough.

Get her book here - https://amzn.eu/d/gDRfFyd

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

This week on Hospitality Meets, Phil sits down with Dulcie Swanston, bestselling author, executive coach, leadership trainer, neuroscience and psychology “magpie,” and one of the clearest thinkers you’ll ever meet in hospitality.

Dulcie’s career spans 23 years at Bass PLC / Mitchells & Butlers, senior HR leadership, graduate programme design, global executive coaching, and now running multiple businesses that all share one simple mission:

Make complicated things simple, and usable now!

From accidentally falling into hospitality after realising acting wasn’t for her… to becoming one of the most trusted leadership thinkers in the industry… this episode is packed with stories, insight, Yorkshire humour, and a lot of truth.

In This Episode

1. Why Dulcie believes “it’s not bloody rocket science” and why simplicity is a leadership superpower
2. Accidentally landing a graduate role at Bass PLC because it was the only application deadline still open, and why that changed everything
3. Turning up on day one… only to be told the marketing department no longer existed
4. Becoming the company’s first ever “commercial graduate” a role nobody could quite define
5. Working across finance, property, operations, HR and brand, and why that breadth became a gift
6. Managing O’Neill’s pubs taking £50–60k a week and winning global performance awards
7. Recruiting and developing women into leadership roles when talent was hidden in plain sight
8. Finding her true calling in HR in her mid 30s and realising leadership is about helping others be great at their jobs
9. The difference between leaders whose teams perform only when they’re present… and leaders whose teams thrive when they’re not
10. Why great leaders (and great coaches) aim to make themselves redundant

Imposter “Syndrome”? Not Here.

One of the standout sections of the episode is Dulcie’s reframing of imposter syndrome which she refuses to call a syndrome at all.

Instead, she calls it:

Well, tune in to find out

Her take?

“If you think you’re finished as a leader or coach — you’re finished.”

She shares powerful imagery about the two voices on our shoulders, why our brains constantly lie to protect us, and how learning to notice those lies without shame is the key to growth.

Stand-Out Quotes

“Happy people make more money.” Dulcie Swanston

“The brain isn’t a video recorder — it’s an editing machine.” Dulcie Swanston

“Great leaders get their teams to perform brilliantly when they’re not there.” Dulcie Swanston

“If you think you’re done learning — move aside.” Dulcie Swanston

“Comfort with ambiguity is one of the greatest leadership strengths there is.” Dulcie Swanston

Why Listen

This episode is a goldmine for anyone who:

1. Leads people in fast-paced, operational environments
2. Feels overwhelmed by complexity and wants clarity
3. Wants to understand why great leaders work, not just what they do
4. Is curious about coaching, self-awareness, and better thinking
5. Loves practical wisdom delivered with warmth and humour

It’s a conversation about leadership without ego, growth without jargon, and thinking better so work doesn’t feel like work.

As Dulcie puts it perfectly:

“When work doesn’t feel like work — that’s when you know you’re in the right place.”

Enjoy!

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

This week on Hospitality Meets, Phil sits down with Matt McCabe, Founder of Subu Connect - a platform created to bridge the gap between food and beverage suppliers and global buyers across airlines, foodservice and hospitality.

Matt’s story is one of curiosity, courage, accidental brilliance, and a lot of beautifully human learning along the way. From a 19-year-old Irish hotel management student taking a leap into a German kitchen… to buying food for prisons, parliaments and planes… to building his own tech platform from scratch - this is a masterclass in connection, leadership, humility and trust.

It also includes one of the greatest stories ever told on the podcast involving… mayonnaise.

In This Episode

1. How a leap of faith took Matt from hotel school in Ireland to cooking in Germany, Switzerland and London — including a stint at The Dorchester with 120 chefs in the kitchen
2. The moment Matt realised chefs don’t buy food and how that insight led him into procurement and supply chain leadership
3. Why asking for help (and admitting you don’t know something) is one of the most powerful leadership skills you can develop
4. What running food supply for UK prisons, the House of Lords, and then Emirates Airline Catering taught him about scale, systems and humanity
5. The emotional and cultural challenge of moving his family to Dubai - and what that transition really felt like
6. How a chance LinkedIn event invitation on holiday led to the creation of Subu Connect almost overnight
7. The reality of becoming a founder: self-belief, risk, financial uncertainty, and emotional investment
8. Why Matt believes “Every Connection Matters” - and how relationships compound over time

Stand-Out Quotes

“I never really believed in myself. I was waiting for the lightbulb moment — and I used that as an excuse not to start”

“Every connection matters. No conversation is ever wasted”

“I physically feel it when the company struggles — like you would with a child or a loved one”

“We’re not the stars — the suppliers are. We’re just the stage”

“People didn’t invest in the platform. They invested in me and what I stand for”

Why Listen

This episode is a beautiful exploration of:

1. Career reinvention and courage
2. The hidden emotional side of entrepreneurship
3. Leadership through vulnerability and trust
4. The power of curiosity and asking better questions
5. Why hospitality skills translate into almost every other industry
6. How values shape sustainable businesses

It’s a reminder that success is rarely linear, confidence often arrives late, and the most meaningful careers are built through people, not plans.

A joyful, human, wise and quietly powerful conversation.

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

This week, Phil sits down with Chetan Bhanot, Group General Manager of The Mandeville Hotel in Marylebone and Pendley Manor in Hertfordshire - two stunning properties he leads with equal parts humility, humour and impressive calm.

Chetan’s story spans 32 years in hospitality, from hotel school in India, to Hilton and InterContinental, to JW Marriott Mumbai’s first-ever opening, to London’s NH Hotels, Harrington Hall, and now a dual-property leadership role he’s held for nearly a decade. It’s a journey filled with learning, pressure, kindness - and the occasional guest who forgets where they left their car.

This episode is rich with leadership lessons, humanity, and proper belly laughs.

In This Episode

1. Finding hospitality through a school friend in India, discovering the power of people and team sports, and starting a career that now spans over 30 years Chetan Bhanot
2. The power of environment — why even the most talented people struggle in broken systems, and how the team–self–ownership triangle must align for success
3. Hotel school → Hilton → InterContinental → JW Marriott — the early years that shaped his entire leadership philosophy
4. Moving to the UK and rising through NH Hotels to Director of Hotels UK, with senior leaders who “held the ladder” so others could climb
5. COVID chaos: losing full kitchen teams, reopening four times in two years, housekeeping stepping in to help the kitchen, and how the team “kept smiling through it all” Chetan Bhanot
6. The 2011 London riots — the scariest moment of his career, locking down the hotel, protecting guests, and hotels banding together to keep each other safe
7. Work-life balance vs. balance — and why hospitality now can offer both
8. Paying it forward — why leaders must give others the same opportunities they were given, and why career growth comes when you stop chasing titles and start enjoying the work
9. Huge expansion plans at both The Mandeville and Pendley Manor, from new bedrooms to new ballrooms to full refurbishments

And the Funny Story You Have to Hear…

A guest storms into reception convinced his car has been stolen from the hotel.

Police nearly called.

Panic everywhere.

Then CCTV...

I'll let you tune in to hear

Stand-Out Quotes

“You’re not what happens to you — you are how you choose to rebuild”

“During COVID, we didn’t open once — we opened four times. And every time, the team stood together”

“Failure is a negative word. Replace it with ‘learning’ — it changes everything”

“A team works when ego and job titles are left at the door”

“People held the ladder for me. Now it’s my turn to hold it for others”

Why Listen

This episode is a masterclass in:

1. Building and leading high-performing teams
2. The real emotional cost of COVID and how hospitality survived it
3. Dealing with pressure, failure, and adversity
4. Why kindness, support and opportunity matter more than titles
5. How hotels come together in crisis
6. What great service really looks like

Chetan’s story is proof that leadership isn’t taught — it’s lived, experienced, and shaped through humanity, humour and hard days.

A proper hospitality heart-warmer.

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

To watch this episode, head to https://youtu.be/tMghGC2VZMo

This week, we’re in one of the stunning bedrooms at Corinthia London, talking to a man whose story genuinely feels like a film.

Simon Casson, now CEO of Corinthia Hotels and former President EMEA at Four Seasons, was once told at 15 that he was a failure, that his education was over, and that he should “learn to fix cars or join the army”

He went home devastated. His mum came back from a bar shift, wrapped her arms around him and said:

“Simon, you’re special. You’re going to be a leader of men. You’re going to achieve great wealth and success. And I believe in you”

From washing dishes and sleeping in a room above a local restaurant… to becoming the youngest GM in Four Seasons… to running 45 hotels and 17,000 people… to now leading Corinthia’s push to “challenge luxury’s usual suspects” - this is a story of belief, graft, failure, and a very people first kind of success.

In This Episode

1. “You’re a failure” at 15 – the careers officer, the crushing conversation, and the one sentence from his mum that changed everything
2. Dishes, cheap digs & cheap labour – washing up, living above the restaurant, then a “management training scheme” that was really just doing every job in the hotel (and secretly the best education imaginable)
3. Castles, chefs & the Four Seasons bug – being spotted by Kit Chapman at The Castle at Taunton, working alongside a young Gary Rhodes, and being introduced to Four Seasons as “the greatest hotel company in the world”
4. From managing to leading – the early disaster as Room Service Manager at Four Seasons London and the moment it all changed
5. Washington, Doha, Dubai & beyond – Clinton era D.C., meeting heads of state and celebrities, becoming the youngest Four Seasons GM in Doha, opening hotels in the Middle East and Africa, and eventually becoming President for Europe, Middle East & Africa
6. Sacrifice, anxiety & imposter syndrome – missing chunks of his kids’ childhood, hiding the fact he had no degree, and learning that pressure, doubt and growth often live in the same room
7. The “second mountain” – stepping away after 35 years at Four Seasons, retreating to a farm in Croatia, and then being courted by global brands before choosing Corinthia as the place to write his next chapter
8. Corinthia’s new chapter – why London was transformational, how New York became “the star of the Met Gala”, and what it really means to be a “true contender” in global luxury

Stand-Out Quotes

“When the whole world’s saying, ‘No, you can’t,’ you really just need one person to say, ‘Yes, I believe in you. You can.’”

“We’re all masters of our own destinies. We all have to polish our own diamond.”

“Leadership has to be rooted in humanity. It has to be rooted in kindness. It has to be anchored in really caring about people’s stories.”

“The absence of criticism is not the same as the provision of support.”

“You’re refined in that fire of defeat and failure and self doubt. Or you’re not. Or you fail”

“It’s about getting comfortable with the imbalance, that work is life and life is work”

Why Listen

This isn’t just a “big job” CV walk through.

It’s:

1. A proper origin story about how one conversation can change a life
2. A masterclass in leadership, learned the hard way through walk outs, self doubt and getting it wrong first
3. A peek behind the curtain of Four Seasons in its golden era and Corinthia in its challenger era
4. A very honest take on success, sacrifice, mental health, ambition and reinvention

If you’ve ever felt “not academic enough”, worried you’re an imposter, or wondered how people at the very top actually think about leadership and life… this one is for you.

Frankly, there's something for everyone in here.

Show Partners

A big shout out to the first of today’s show partner, RotaCloud, the people management platform for shift-based teams.

RotaCloud lets managers create and share rotas, record attendance, and manage annual leave in minutes — all from a single, web-based app.

It makes work simple for your team, too, allowing them to check their rotas, request holiday, and even pick up extra shifts straight from their phones.

Try RotaCloud’s time-saving tools today by heading to https://rotacloud.com/phil

Also, a massive shout out to our new show partners Apron

Running a hospitality business means juggling endless payments - from suppliers to staff - all while keeping cash flow in check. That’s where Apron helps.

With Apron Bill Pay, you can manage every supplier payment in one place, approve and schedule bills, and sync automatically with Xero or QuickBooks.

And with the Apron Card, your team can spend easily while you stay in control - and earn rewards on every purchase.

Learn more at getapron.com.