Today on the show, we’re talking about loneliness. Now, before you switch off this episode and head off to what you might consider greener pastures, let me reframe loneliness for you: it can actually have an upside. Today’s guest Charlotte Donlon writes, in her book The Great Belonging: How Loneliness Leads Us to Each Other, “Everyone knows loneliness. Some may experience it more often. Some may find relief from it more quickly. Some may deny or avoid it. But I don’t think any of us escapes its company entirely, and I’m no longer sure we should.” She adds in the book that “Being human requires a touch of loneliness.” Loneliness has reached epidemic proportions since the pandemic, and, as many of you will relate to, you can be lonely even if you are surrounded by people. On the other side of loneliness is belonging, and that’s what Charlotte’s book centers around. She writes “We can deny our loneliness, or we can embrace it and step into the great belonging.” What is the great belonging? Well, take a listen to our conversation and read Charlotte’s book to find out. Charlotte is fantastic, and was actually introduced to me by Carla Jean Whitley, a dear friend of the podcast and of mine. In her book, Charlotte asks “What if loneliness is a necessary part of the human condition? What if it is a current that leads us deeper into belonging—to ourselves, to each other, and to God?” Now, I have self-disclosed many times that I am a Christian on the show; we talk about faith, specifically our shared Christian faith, in this episode, but this book and this conversation is for all faiths, including those of you who may not have one. In this book, Charlotte encourages us to, instead of turning away from the waters of loneliness for fear they will engulf us, wade in and see what we find there. In the book, Charlotte offers tools, resources, and practices for transforming loneliness into true belonging, and I can’t wait for you to hear from her.

The Great Belonging: How Loneliness Leads Us to Each Other by Charlotte Donlon

Charlotte’s Five Good Things Substack

One of my personal favorite subjects to study is First Ladies—I am completely compelled by these women, regardless of party affiliation, and I’ve read just about every book on them as a group, as well as many individual biographies of these dynamic women. Today on the show I have with me Katie Rogers, White House correspondent for The New York Times, to discuss her first book, the fantastic American Woman: The Transformation of the Modern First Lady, from Hillary Clinton to Jill Biden, which is out February 27. In the book, Katie delves into the transformation of the modern First Lady. The role of First Lady has definitely changed from Martha Washington to Dr. Jill Biden, but even more granularly, it has changed so much from the 1990s and Barbara Bush and Hillary Clinton to the present day, in particular Dr. Biden’s refusal to give up her role as an educator in favor of being First Lady full-time, as all of her predecessors have done. In the book and in our conversation today, Katie gets into how we ask so much of our First Ladies yet give them no proper blueprint on how to do their job. (We also don’t pay them, and there’s no barometer of what a successful First Lady is or does.) We talk about what will happen when the U.S. finally elects a female president, and what the role of First Gentleman, if that is what he is called, will look like. There is so much depth to this conversation—I can all but promise you that you won’t look at the role of the First Lady the same ever again. Katie has worked at The Times since 2014 and has been a White House correspondent since 2018, covering two presidential administrations and writing extensively about domestic policy, foreign policy, and, perhaps most interestingly to me, the complicated dynamics of First Families. Before writing for The Times, Katie was a reporter at The Guardian and The Washington Post. I am excited for you to meet her and learn from her in this episode.

American Woman: The Transformation of the Modern First Lady, from Hillary Clinton to Jill Biden by Katie Rogers

We’ve got yet another first on the show today—our very first cookbook author! Yes, this is a cookbook, filled with delicious recipes and mouthwatering food photos, but this is a cookbook with a twist. It is part cookbook and part memoir of its author, renowned chef Missy Robbins. It really is as much about self discovery as it is about food, and that’s what makes it extra compelling. Missy actually has two books, Breakfast, Lunch, Dinner…Life: Recipes and Adventures from My Home Kitchen, and Pasta: The Spirit and Craft of Italy’s Greatest Food, both of which are out now (and are linked below). In this episode, we specifically talk about Breakfast, Lunch, Dinner…Life, and in our conversation Missy and I talk about The Bear, which is a show I totally binged—and you should too if you haven’t yet. Missy introduced me to the term “kitchen culture” and said that, probably very much for the best, the type of kitchen culture on display in The Bear would not be acceptable at her restaurants. Speaking of, Missy has two restaurants, Lilia, which opened in 2016, and Misi, which opened in 2018. She takes us into the busy and nonstop life of a chef, gives us her best cooking tips, and gives us a peek behind the curtain of the restaurant industry, including winning a Michelin star, which Missy has done at two different restaurants, actually. She is actually only one of 10 women to have a Michelin star, which of course is incredibly imbalanced. Missy’s specialty is Italian food, and both Lilia and Misi are of that food genre. Missy also introduced me through this book to the concept of being a food tourist, which is something I’m adopting immediately. In addition to being a Michelin star chef, Missy appeared on season four of Top Chef Masters, and has worked at many restaurants you’ve heard of, including Spiaggia in Chicago, where she frequently cooked for Barack and Michelle Obama. No pressure, right? She then became executive chef at A Voce, changing the menu completely with the exception of two dishes, and oversaw the opening of its second location. In addition to all of this, she is in such a balanced, healthy place in her life, and I know you’ll enjoy getting to know her through our conversation.

Breakfast, Lunch, Dinner…Life: Recipes and Adventures from My Home Kitchen by Missy Robbins

Pasta: The Spirit and Craft of Italy’s Greatest Food by Missy Robbins

Everyone Who Can Forgive Me Is Dead by Jenny Hollander, the February pick of Marie Claire’s book club—some of the best fiction I’ve read lately!

Yet another pinch me moment this week—today on the show we have Audrey Hepburn’s son, Luca Dotti, and Meghan Friedlander, who together wrote the beautiful and compelling book Audrey Hepburn in Paris. Meghan is the curator of the popular Audrey fan site Rare Audrey Hepburn, and Luca? Well, he knew Audrey better than almost any human being can say. I am a huge Audrey Hepburn fan, so the thought of spending time with one of her two sons is unbelievable to me. The book also includes a foreward by Giambattista Valli, and the book explores and celebrates Audrey’s lifelong connection to Paris, featuring all of the places in the City of Light she loved the most and telling her story there. The book has never-before-published anecdotes and photographs and digs into her family, friendships, films, photoshoots, and fashions, especially her soul mate relationship with friend and fashion designer Hubert de Givenchy. You will be left breathless and speechless, both by the book itself and the stories and photos within it, and by this conversation. In this book we get a glimpse of the iconic actress’ beautiful life there, and each chapter of the book focuses on a different aspect of Paris that made it so precious to Audrey. Audrey never actually lived in Paris, but she was an honorary Parisienne. Towards the end of the book, it reads that “She would form some of her happiest memories in the life-altering city.” It was endlessly enjoyable reading about them. Plus, stick around to hear about what writers I’d love to invite to my dinner party or interview, but won’t be able to, at least not on this side of heaven. Imagine: Nora Ephron. Maya Angelou. Dominick Dunne. Julia Reed. And little old me. I may not ever be able to have them on the show (they’ve all left us for a better place), but I can at least have the honor of talking to you about them.

Audrey Hepburn in Paris by Luca Dotti and Meghan Friedlander

Surprise! Today is a special fiction pick day, and I have one of the most popular writers of fiction on the market today: New York Times bestselling author Katharine McGee, author of the wildly beloved American Royals series. The four-part series debuted in 2019 and wrapped in 2023, and asks the compelling question “What if America had a royal family? What if, instead of becoming president, George Washington became king instead?” As a royals editor, royal podcast co-host, and general royal obsessive, I couldn’t get enough of this series. (Katharine is also the author of the popular Thousandth Floor trilogy, but today we’re talking about American Royals.) In addition to talking about the royals (come on, we had to!), we also talk about Katharine’s process in writing fiction and what we can expect from her in 2024.

All by Katharine McGee:

American Royals

Majesty

Rivals

Reign

Katherine’s fiction picks to keep you satisfied until our next fiction episode:

His Dark Materials by Philip Pullman

The Buccaneers, The House of Mirth, and The Age of Innocence by Edith Wharton

The Wolf Den by Elodie Harper

Life is full of pinch me moments, and this certainly is one: talking to the Savannah Guthrie about our shared faith in God. All glory to God for this conversation! The public facing Savannah is the co-anchor of Today on NBC, a position she’s held for nearly 12 years, since July 2012. She’s a former attorney turned NBC News professional who, in addition to her Today responsibilities, is an NBC News anchor, a substitute anchor on NBC Nightly News, and, since 2012, she’s hosted the Macy’s Thanksgiving Day parade and the annual Rockefeller Center Christmas tree lighting. In her personal life, she’s married to Michael Feldman, and they have two children. But here’s the more private side of Savannah that you might not be as familiar with: a woman of deep, deep faith whose faith is imperfect (just like the rest of us) but whose faith is firmly rooted in the belief that mostly what God does is love us. In her new book, Mostly What God Does: Reflections on Seeking and Finding His Love Everywhere, Savannah is extraordinarily candid about her faith, sharing how it has impacted her and how it can impact us all, if we’d be open to receiving it. It is a beautiful book written by a beautiful soul, one who I can’t wait for you to get to know a little more through this conversation.

Mostly What God Does: Reflections on Seeking and Finding His Love Everywhere by Savannah Guthrie

Today’s episode is a tough one—but it is also such a beautiful one. I want to insert a trigger warning here: my guest and I will be discussing the loss of a child to stillbirth today, so if you are grieving any type of pregnancy loss (or any type of loss, period) this conversation may be upsetting to you. Please take care of yourself and return to the conversation when you can. This is an absolutely beautiful, powerful conversation with a dear friend of mine, Vera Chapman, who is also the first children’s book author we’ve ever had on the show. Vera’s book, Our Baby In Our Hearts, focuses on the real life experience that her two living children, Grayson and Ivey, faced when confronted with the loss of their baby brother, Hayes, on February 15, 2021. (Yes, this episode is being released on Hayes’ third birthday.) Our Baby In Our Hearts offers practical mindfulness exercises to help young hearts cope with big feelings. It is also stunningly illustrated and will truly be so moving to anyone, but especially anyone who has experienced pregnancy loss. After losing Hayes in 2021, Vera has turned her pain into purpose, not only writing this book but also creating the “Light in Loss” daily healing affirmation cards series for women. She is the founder of the wellness coaching practice Resonating Soul Wellness and has over a decade of experience supporting women through coaching and counseling. I am so proud to call her my friend, and today’s esteemed guest.

Our Baby In Our Hearts: A Mindful Story of Grief and Healing by Vera V. Chapman

Daily affirmation cards for grieving mothers and women

More affirmations for both women and children

Follow Vera on Instagram @veravchapman!

I first became familiar with the dynamic Jennie Allen in the thick of the COVID-19 pandemic in 2020, when my Bible study group did a study on Jennie’s book Get Out of Your Head: Stopping the Spiral of Toxic Thoughts, which is a book worth reading anytime, but especially in the summer of 2020. Now she’s back with a new book called Untangle Your Emotions: Naming What You Feel and Knowing What to Do About It, which is out February 13. As you’ll hear Jennie and I discuss, Untangle Your Emotions is a perfect companion piece to Get Out of Your Head which, by the way, was a New York Times bestseller. Untangle Your Emotions dives deep into understanding where our emotions come from, what to do with them, and how to honor God in processing all that we feel. Jennie admits that this is the most difficult book she’s ever written, and the subject matter is tough—but through this book and this conversation, if we take it all to heart, we can walk away so much the better for it. Jennie—thank you for writing a difficult book. It will touch so many lives, and it has already touched mine.

Untangle Your Emotions: Naming What You Feel and Knowing What to Do About It by Jennie Allen

Today on the show we have the remarkable Patti Davis, daughter of U.S. President Ronald Reagan and First Lady Nancy Reagan. Patti’s new book, Dear Mom and Dad: A Letter About Family, Memory, and the America We Once Knew is a book, in Patti’s own words, about acceptance, forgiveness, and moving on from the past, a book that—though Patti’s parents were much more famous than most, even before her father entered politics—anyone can relate to. There’s not a person among us who hasn’t at one point or another struggled with their parents, as the parent-child relationship is so complicated; this is Patti’s story, and it’s a powerful one. When her father became president, Patti became Ribbon, her Secret Service code name. The complexities that go along with being the child of a president are daunting, and we talk about that in today’s episode, as well as family secrets, living life as the world watched, and what she’d like to say to her father and mother after their deaths in 2004 and 2016, respectively.

Dear Mom and Dad: A Letter About Family, Memory, and the America We Once Knew by Patti Davis

The Long Goodbye: Memories of My Father by Patti Davis

I am so pleased to have Dr. Caroline Leaf on the show today to impart knowledge from her 30-year career as an applied neuroscientist. I originally intended to do a career retrospective on Dr. Leaf’s many books, but quickly realized that if I did that, this would become an hours and hours long episode. So I decided to choose one of her books, Cleaning Up Your Mental Mess: 5 Simple, Scientifically Proven Steps to Reduce Anxiety, Stress, and Toxic Thinking, to zoom in on for our conversation today—but I highly recommend all of her books. In this book (and in this conversation), she teaches us what mental mess is, how to practice mind management, what neuroplasticity is, and about the neurocycle, which she formulated. The neurocycle has, amazingly, statistically reduced depression and anxiety by a staggering 81 percent! I guarantee you’ll learn something in this episode, and for this episode in particular, I’d recommend listening when you can really absorb what Dr. Leaf is saying. Some episodes on the show are light and frothy and can be listened to while multitasking; I’d say this episode is not one of those. To get maximum impact from what Dr. Leaf is teaching us, set aside some time for yourself to truly take all of this in, because you know what? You deserve it. Dr. Leaf is also a podcaster, and in addition to her own show, “Cleaning Up Your Mental Mess,” she is an extremely frequent guest on other podcasts. That’s actually how I found Dr. Leaf—from hearing her on other podcasts and then discovering her work. She has spent three decades researching the mind-brain connection, the nature of mental health, and the formation of memory, and her work centers around helping people learn how to use their mind to detox and grow their brain to succeed in every area of their lives—talk about work that truly matters!

Cleaning Up Your Mental Mess: 5 Simple, Scientifically Proven Steps to Reduce Anxiety, Stress, and Toxic Thinking by Dr. Caroline Leaf

A link to all of Dr. Leaf’s books