Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. This week co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue onto part two of a four-part special on the North American Soccer League (NASL). They discuss the initial attempts to establish professional soccer leagues in America, including the rivalries between the NASL and the National Professional Soccer League (NPSL). The episode covers the impact of foreign teams, the financial and logistical hurdles, and the ongoing struggle to gain popularity and acceptance in the U.S. market. With input from past experiences and key figures, they provide an in-depth look at why American soccer faced numerous setbacks and what was done to overcome them. Join us next week for part three!

01:09 The Early Years of Soccer in the USA

01:34 The Impact of the Wall Street Crash

06:46 Post-War Challenges

09:43 The Decline of American Soccer in the 1950s

21:46 The 1960s: A Decade of Missed Opportunities

27:15 The Birth of the NASL

33:25 Lack of American Players in Early Leagues

34:55 Rival Leagues: NPSL vs NASL

35:42 Initial Matches and Attendance Issues

40:11 Discipline Problems and Game Abandonments

48:10 Financial Struggles and Legal Battles

49:13 National Team Struggles and Attempts at Growth

50:31 Foreign Influence and Pre-season Tours

54:48 Financial Instability and League Contraction

58:20 NASL's Unconventional Season Format

01:00:32 Legacy and Future Prospects of NASL

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. This week co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by a special guest and former footballer Dennis Tueart. In this first episode of our four-part special on the North American Soccer League (NASL), Dennis, known for his iconic moments with Sunderland and Manchester City, shares his remarkable journey from English football to the booming NASL in the 1970s. Discover his experiences with the New York Cosmos, playing alongside legends like Franz Beckenbauer, replacing Pele, navigating cultural shifts, and understanding the challenges and triumphs that shaped the future of soccer in America. Don't miss this deep dive into football history, glamour, and the evolution of the beautiful game in the United States.

00:57 Dennis Tueart's Transfer to the Cosmos

02:05 Challenges and Decisions

04:19 Arrival and Initial Impressions

07:15 Experiences and Reflections

11:38 Life in the NASL

17:18 Training and Facilities

18:58 Pre-season and Early Challenges

25:14 The NASL's Unique Rules

29:55 Challenges and Triumphs in the NASL

30:25 Play-off Performances and Nicknames

30:59 Intense Matches and Injuries

31:36 The Semi-final Comeback

36:27 Winning the Conference Final

37:40 Facing Rodney Marsh and Tampa Bay

42:51 Touring and Transitioning

46:53 Final Reflections and Legacy

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. In this Christmas Special Episode, co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by author John Smith to talk about his new book - 'Escape: A Love Letter to a Cult Football Classic' all about the film 'Escape to Victory'. The trio delve into the making of the film, revealing behind-the-scenes stories, discussing the film's historical context, and analysing the football sequences. We take a look at inside stories from the remarkable cast and crew, including Pele and Sylvester Stallone. The three discuss amusing anecdotes, the authenticity of the football matches and the film's lasting impact. This episode is a must-listen for fans of film and football history. Wishing you all a Merry Christmas from the It Was What It Was team!

00:00 Introduction and Welcoming John Smith

04:41 The Making of 'Escape to Victory'

20:44 Historical Resonances and Themes

28:59 Behind the Scenes Stories

34:09 The Escape Plan in the Film

37:11 The Cast and Their Connections

41:36 The Missing Footballer Mystery

46:01 Lack of Female Characters

47:06 The Football Game Analysis

53:19 The Half-Time Escape Plan

58:00 The Final Match Moments

01:06:13 Concluding Thoughts and Farewell

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. This week co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper delve into George Orwell's infamous essay on sport, specifically focusing on Dinamo Moscow's 1945 tour of Britain. They explore Orwell's controversial viewpoint that serious sport is akin to 'war minus the shooting,' and delve into the historical and political context of this post-WWII football tour. The discussion covers the tactical innovations introduced by the Soviet team, the media and public's reaction, and the broader implications for international sport and politics. This episode provides an in-depth look at how football can both unite and divide, reflecting on Orwell's critique and its relevance to today's sports culture.

00:00 Introduction: The Dark Side of Sports

01:05 George Orwell's Influence on Sports

01:49 The Political Context of the 1945 Moscow Tour

02:47 The Goodwill Tour: Ideals vs. Reality

05:00 The Soviet Union's Football Strategy

08:23 The Arrival of Dinamo Moscow

21:45 The First Match: Dinamo Moscow vs Chelsea

30:53 The Political Showdown: Arsenal vs Dinamo Moscow

32:31 The Final Game in Scotland

35:56 Soviet Propaganda and the Legacy of the Tour

40:36 Tactical Innovations and English Football's Response

47:36 George Orwell's Critique of Sport

53:18 Football's Role in Nationalism and International Relations

01:00:51 Concluding Thoughts on Orwell and Football

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. Co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper are joined by special guest and historian David Goldblatt. In this episode, they discuss David's new book, 'Injury Time,' which examines the impact of recent seismic events like Brexit, COVID-19, and populism on football in Britain. They delve into the popularity of football despite its numerous challenges, the economic disparities within the game, and the global obsession with the Premier League. The conversation also touches on the significance of football as a cultural and political space, the rise of women's football, and the ethical concerns surrounding state ownership of clubs. They also examine the role of fans and community. This episode provides a comprehensive look at the current state and the future of the beautiful game.

00:00 Introduction

00:55 The State of Football Today

03:21 Football as a National Obsession

07:41 Globalisation and Football's Cultural Impact

19:12 Economic Disparities in Football

21:35 Football Reflecting Social Inequalities

29:50 Football's Role in Social and Political Issues

31:20 The Role of Football in Society

33:38 Economic Inequality in Football

36:50 The Super League Controversy

41:25 Cultural Resistance and Football's Future

54:42 The Impact of COVID on Football

59:20 State Involvement in Football

01:02:11 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. Co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper look into the dark and controversial period of Streltsov’s life. In this second part we cover the heinous crime that Streltsov was accused of, the subsequent trial and conviction, and his years in the Gulag. Despite the damning evidence, Streltsov's eventual return to football and continued popularity are explored, along with the societal implications and unresolved questions surrounding his story. Join us for a detailed look at both the fall and unexpected resurgence of a man once considered the 'Russian Pele.’

This episode contains discussion of sexual abuse and rape, which some listeners may find distressing. If you’ve been affected by any of the issues raised, the NHS provides a list of support services and resources here:

https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/sexual-health/help-after-rape-and-sexual-assault

00:00 A Dark Story Unfolds

00:31 The Accusation and Confession

04:50 The Aftermath and Public Reaction

05:40 Evidence and Forensic Details

07:05 The State's Role

08:22 Personal Struggles and Downfall

23:42 Speculations and Suspicions

26:14 The Case Against Streltsov

28:14 The Soviet State's Role

30:31 Marina's Disappearance

32:08 Life in the Gulag

40:15 Streltsov’s Return to Football

48:21 Legacy and Controversy

52:06 Conclusion

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. Co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper delve into the story of Eduard Streltsov, the 'Russian Pele'. In the first part of this two-part series, we trace Streltsov's meteoric rise from a poor upbringing to becoming a celebrated football talent. Witness his groundbreaking performances, his early brush with fame, and the personal flaws that began to unravel his career. Discover the events leading up to the fateful allegations that would ultimately tarnish his legacy. Join us as we unveil the complexities and the promises cut short in the life of one of Soviet football's most enigmatic figures.

This episode contains discussion of sexual abuse and rape, which some listeners may find distressing. If you’ve been affected by any of the issues raised, the NHS provides a list of support services and resources here:

https://www.nhs.uk/live-well/sexual-health/help-after-rape-and-sexual-assault

00:00 Introduction

03:38 The Soviet Football Landscape in the 1950s

09:35 Streltsov's Early Life and Family Background

16:31 Streltsov's Football Career Takes Off

20:40 The 1956 Olympics and Missed Opportunities

25:17 The Medal That Never Was

27:01 The Downfall Begins

30:37 A Pattern of Trouble

49:50 Streltsov's Arrest

50:12 Confession and Public Outcry

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome back to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. Co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper continue the extraordinary story of Imre Hirschl, the Hungarian who revolutionised South American football. In this second part, we look into Hirschl's impact on Uruguay's historic 1950 World Cup victory and his innovative tactics at Club Atlético Peñarol and River Plate. Discover how Hirschl's genius and controversial methods shaped football history, transforming teams and leaving a lasting legacy on the footballing world. 

00:45 The Tactical Mastermind Behind Uruguay's Success

01:55 Controversial Matches and Referee Decisions

05:20 The Dominance of the Big Five in Argentinian Football

08:37 Hirschl's move to River Plate 

11:59 Tactical Evolution and Direct Play

16:55 Hircshl’s Downfall and Match-Fixing Allegations

21:06 Return to Coaching and Success in Uruguay

28:22 Strict Discipline and Unique Methods

29:09 Young Players and Team Dynamics

31:14 Campaign for National Coach

31:59 Political Disputes and Appointments

33:22 World Cup Preparations and Chaos

35:43 Uruguay's Tactical Genius

37:11 The Shocking World Cup Final

43:48 Aftermath and Legacy

44:58 Hirschl's Influence and Final Years

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Welcome to It Was What It Was, the football history podcast. Co-hosts Jonathan Wilson and Rob Draper deep dive into the extraordinary story of Imre Hirschl, the Hungarian who took South American football by storm. In this first part of a two-part series we hear the story of Hirschl's early life, his emigration to South America, and his unexpected rise to coaching fame in Argentina. From starting as a salami salesman to becoming the mastermind behind Gimnasia y Esgrima La Plata's success, Hirschl's tale is one of perseverance, innovation, and tactical genius. Tune in to discover the myths, challenges, and triumphs of this unlikely football legend who redefined the game during the early 20th century.

00:00 The Unlikely Beginnings of a Coaching Legend

03:46 The Hungarian Influence on South American Football

07:59 Unraveling the Myths and Realities

09:40 A Journey Through War and Immigration

16:29 The Butcher Turned Football Visionary

21:55 The Mystery of Hirschl's Football Career

24:38 Meeting Béla Guttmann and the Next Chapter

26:21 Hirschl's Coaching Journey Begins

28:14 Tactical Innovations and Success

30:21 Challenges and Triumphs in Argentina

31:14 Early Coaching Stint in Brazil

32:42 Struggles and Determination

42:21 Hirschl's Coaching Philosophy

46:48 Building a Winning Team

49:32 Conclusion and Future Prospects

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.