Right about now, we're probably all missing the temple. Never before has the need for the instant peace that comes from stepping into these sacred spaces been more keenly felt by so many members. But we can do more during this time than eagerly await the day when we can finally return to full temple worship. In this week's bonus episode, we invite religious scholar Donald W. Parry to help us dig into the meaning behind temple symbols so that we can be ready to enter the Lord's house with a new perspective and greater understanding.

Stories in this episode: After her elderly father passes away, LuAnne finds herself in the thick of cleaning out his home as she struggles to know what to let go of and what to keep; Jessie receives her inheritance a little early only to lose it just when it was needed most; After a string of disappointments, Miya is surprised to discover the resilience she longs for in the form of two pieces of paper from a beloved ancestor.

Show notes:

To see pictures and links for this episode, go to LDSLiving.com/thisisthegospel

Transcript:

KaRyn 0:03

Welcome to This is the Gospel, an LDS Living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host, KaRyn Lay.

So help me out. I cannot be the only one who has a highly developed internal fantasy in the style of Great Expectations, where a previously unknown relative of unimaginable wealth shows up at my door with the life changing news that I am the heir to their vast fortune. And from that moment forward, I pay all my bills without juggling anything, and I add avocado to every salad and every sandwich — devil may care about the additional cost. Is it just me? Okay. All right. That's fine. Nothing to see here, folks. I think it might actually have been this fantasy that got me thinking about today's theme. When you push through all the worldly ideas about wills and rich uncles and millions of dollars, this idea of an inheritance is as deeply ingrained in the gospel of Jesus Christ as just about anything.

Mentions of heirs and heritage and inheritance are everywhere in the scriptures. And in fact, one of my all-time favorite scriptures, Romans 8:17, has the Apostle Paul reminding us all that we are children of God, and if we're children of God, then we are also heirs to His throne, and joint heirs with Jesus Christ. I just love that idea. I come back to it again and again, when I'm worried that all that will ever get handed down to me are some genetically soft teeth — I'm serious, they're made of chalk — and a penchant for drama. Well, today, we've got three storytellers who are surprised by the things that are handed down to them. And the way that that inheritance changes their perspective on the things that matter most.

Our first story of inheritance comes from LuAnne, who worked her way through a mountain of memories to find that what her parents actually left her belonged to her all along. Here's LuAnne.

LuAnne 2:03

My three brothers and my sister and I are gathered around the kitchen table of our childhood. We've come in from three time zones, and we've gathered for the weekend. We haven't been together as siblings for — probably since our first brother left home for college. So this is unusual.

The reason that we're gathered here today is that my dad has passed away eight weeks previously, and we're here to make a plan to sell his house and to distribute his belongings. And we lost our mom 12 years prior to this time. With my dad, though, 12 years later, we, we lost him and he'd been struggling with Parkinson's disease for three years. And even though five of us are gathered, it feels really empty. My siblings and I are sitting around the kitchen table. And actually, we kind of just fell into our spots that we had in our childhood of where we ate dinner. And it's daunting because we're going through the things of my dad's lifetime, and my mom's lifetime and we're deciding are we going to donate something? Are we going to hang on to it? If so, who gets it?

You know, we've seen other families go through this process and have a lot of conflict and leave where they're not friends or close anymore. And that was something that we that we didn't want. And we decided we wanted to try to make a plan that would be impartial and non-emotional. We knew that we were all filled with emotions, we were all grieving still. We didn't really think it was possible to take out all our emotions from this process, but we did want to try to have a process that would try to minimize those misunderstandings that we thought would be happening because we all were coming with so many emotions.

And we sat there and we started with a prayer. And the way we did our picks is we each choose a color and that color was equivalent to the first pick, the second pick, the third pick — on down. Like we have things sectioned out like quilts, family keepsake quilts, and we had figurines and we had furniture and so we each would choose something in the group of items. And then after we'd gone through our picks, then we would snake through. So number five would be number one. And then every so often, we would redo our drawing just so the same people weren't getting the first pick in every group of items.

And so we did start going through things and we could tell as we went through things, what they cared about by how they kept it. For instance, my dad's Navy uniform is dry cleaned. All three dress and casual uniforms are dry cleaned and hanging in his closet in a bag. We also found things that weren't, weren't so cared for like his files, he may have a birth certificate and a file along with a grocery store receipt. And some other thing that we would have thrown away. Or, the drawer with the kitchen utensils had kind of odd things in the drawer, so that wasn't really something he cared about. The Navy uniform, carefully kept.

One thing that my parents kept was Swiss bells that they hung on the wall. And part of our heritage is our grandparents came from Switzerland. And our parents had gone on a trip to Switzerland and then came home with these bells and hung them on the wall. That was by the backdoor. So we all remember as kids, you know, making the bells ring as we ran out the door — in or out the door, we often just kind of did that as habit.

To see and discover the things that my dad cared about and my mom cared about too, um, was kind of like a treasure hunt. It was putting together memories, my own memories that I had, but also stories that I heard. And putting the pieces of our life story felt like a treasure hunt to me.

I started to understand the role these belongings played. The first and most obvious one is probably the belonging or whatever item reminded me of my mom or my dad, either something they had made by my mom and made by hand or my dad carefully selected it at a furniture store, or maybe he had redone it, and it could take us to our mom and dad, but also, I realized that it was a memory, for me, of who I was as a little child. And how my mom and dad made me feel as a little child. How they made me feel safe, and secure and loved. And so – an object could mean a whole lot more than – as important as that was, it was the memory of my mom and my dad, but I found that it was a memory of who I was. And who I was as part of this family, and that I belonged. And that – even the feeling of being a little child where your parents take care of you and you're not the adult out fighting in the world and making decisions and making adult decisions for your dad's life or death decisions for, for his care. And so I found that the objects took me back to being a cared for, loved, little child.

Sometimes we're in business mode of going through things. And other times just one – something would hit us. Like when my brothers were carrying buckets of wheat from the basement to take to the garage to get rid of, I walked into my parents bedroom. They have a big master closet, and this is the place where their personal items have always been. Their clothing – they've kept family heirlooms like quilts that both grandmas have made, they've kept the tape recording of my sister's funeral. They've kept things that are special to them. And it's been full of their memories and memories that we had of them. But when I walked into the room by myself into this empty closet, that, to me, was stunning. It was just the sight of this empty closet that had always been full. It took my breath away, and I had to just stand there a moment and feel the finality of this. This is it. You know, this is the last tie to my mom and dad, and it was like shutting the door and walking into my new role. Not as a caregiver, not as a daughter who has parents on the earth, not – but as the you know, the final buffer, the adult for the family – generation one. But that was the, the feeling of just the finality of seeing this empty closet.

There was this one item that had emotions around it for more than one of us. This one piece that was the one thing – if I could only choose one thing that I wanted, was this wooden cabinet that I used to open the door and, and I loved the smell of it. The wood smell. So we kept piano music, we kept magazines in there and I used to, as a little kid, open the door and smell. And you know how smells can take you back to smells and music and sounds and sights? And that's something that took me back to the safety and security of my childhood. And so we weren't sure even with all of our planning and processing, we still had emotions, we still had feelings that – that caused some division between us, and we had to walk away. So we walked away.

When I walked away, I felt frustrated. And I felt like I thought we had figured out, you know, the process for this and, and so I felt frustrated and, and helpless. And, um, I felt inner turmoil. And so I just had to walk away from the situation, as did everybody else. Monetary stuff is super easy. You divide it, you take the pie and divide it five ways, but things. . . So I was so frustrated that it was about a thing, an item, because we've been through so much, through our childhoods and through caring for our dad and that this, you know, that one thing, this one thing, could cause division.

I was worried how our relationship would play out. If we had these emotions and this discord now, would it seep into the future? That was my worry. When you experience loss, or life transitions – this was both – oftentimes you feel isolated, at least I felt isolated. I felt like – I'm the only one. And sometimes when you're in transition, or you have a loss, you just want people to understand you're desperate to be understood, how this feels, and how, you know, it's like standing in the ocean and wave after wave, you're trying to get your footing and the next wave knocks you down.

And I realized through this process that my parents have given me a gift that outlast them, and it's the gift of my siblings. I mean, there are times when I see my brother smile, or the way he walks or my sister, how she's sitting at the piano and playing the keys and it takes me to my mom or my dad. And so really, that's what lasts. The things that we've inherited are things and items that we can put in a trunk. But the – their mannerisms or their characteristics or the things they've given us live on in my siblings, and I get to see that. Even with our – the emotions that seemed to cause division, and frustration, we still needed each other and needed to be understood. And that's a gift that, that my parents gave us. It's the gift of my brothers and my sister who feel this loss just as intensely as I do. And just as deeply. And when it's all said and done, it's not a possession. It's not the thing. But it's the belonging and the safety and security and the love that I have for my brothers and for my sister that last. It's not the thing.

Um, we – when we gathered back up, you know there were apologies and there was forgiveness and, and we were able to move forward from that. You know, I was lucky I had a mom and dad who loved me. And I never questioned that. I always knew they loved me. And I think because of that it made it easy for me to believe that my Heavenly Parents loved me. And that I have an eternal inheritance. I have a Father who offers me everything He has – not parts and pieces, not things. But He offers me everything He has, and that He's given me gifts to navigate my life right now. And when He offers everything He has, it's even to become like Him. Which I find the things that I was drawn to in my parents' house reminded me of that same belonging and feeling of safety and security and love. So, the inheritance from my Heavenly Parents is eternal and infinite.

And it still helps me when I see the things that I brought home from my parents' house. See the things that I inherited from them, the objects that take me back to memories of them, but also the feeling of belonging that they created and love and safety and security. In fact, at the end of – at the end of the weekend, it was, of course, a rush. My, my one brother had waited till the last minute to leave for the airport and so we're all, you know, rushing to give him a hug and say goodbye and realize, time's over.

And another brother just took a minute to try to process what had happened. And he said, "You know, we did a hard thing this weekend. We did lots of hard things." And he said, "We didn't do it perfectly. But we did it together." Which I thought was a great, a great summary of what happened. And I think our parents would have been happy with that.

KaRyn 14:55

That was my friend LuAnne. I first saw snippets of this story on her social media feed when she was in the process of cleaning out her dad's house, and I immediately wanted to have her share it with us. But as with all stories, timing is just as important as the story itself. And this one – this one needed some time to settle. But when the time was right, we were honored to have the opportunity to help LuAnne tell it.

We all hear those stories about families who allow the inheritance or the lack thereof to tear them apart at the seams. And even when everyone has the best intentions, as they did in LuAnne's case, loss and emotion can complicate things. I think that gentle spirit of reconciliation and understanding that settled upon her family is the truest representation of the Spirit of God and His gifts. And how cool to have that deep, new perspective, that in the end, it's those family relationships that are our true and eternal birthright.

Our next story comes from Jessie who received her inheritance a little bit early, only to misplace it. Here's Jessie.

Jessie 16:00

So about five years ago, I inherited my mom's wedding ring early.

I was cleaning the church with my husband and my family. And I ended up looking down and realized that my diamond had somehow, in the cleaning of the church, been vacuumed up or disappeared. It just wasn't there.

And so I was talking to my mom about it. And she said, "I happen to have my mom's wedding ring and if you want, you can have the one that your dad gave me." And so – graciously and excitedly, I took that ring and it became my own. Which was, timing wise, really sweet because later that year, my dad was diagnosed with vascular dementia, which quickly started spiraling to Alzheimer's.

The ring was designed for my mom by my dad and so I loved it. It was beautiful and it was a piece of both of them with me all the time. And since I was across the country from them, I really appreciated having a little bit of my family with me all the time.

I clean offices for a little extra money on the side and I often have a habit of tucking my ring inside my pocket when I clean, just to keep it protected, and also because sometimes the chemicals can irritate my hands. I misplaced the ring a few times, but I usually find it pretty quickly in a pocket or on the washing machine.

However, there was one time about a year and a half ago that I could not find it. Off and on, I would pray for the ring. I would look in all the normal spots, check pockets, look in drawers and cabinets. I would even get a wild hair and check all the pockets in all my drawers and in all my coats, but no ring. I would wait a bit and pray again and then start the whole process over again. As time went on, I began looking in less likely places like the car or the windowsills, in extra drawers around lamps, like anywhere I could think of – I would look for this ring, but still no ring.

By this time, I was traveling a few times a year back home to help take care of my dad and spend time with my parents and give my mom a well-deserved caregiver's break. I was also giving myself some much-needed time to make memories and say goodbye to my dad. At one point I had a deep conversation with God. I realized that it was possible that maybe I had really lost the ring. Um, I had donated some pants that wouldn't ever fit again to Goodwill and I thought that possibly the ring was gone. That I had accidentally donated it.

Fast forward about six months – my mom had called and said that Dad was really sick, she asked us to pray that he would make it to Christmas because we were all planning on spending Christmas with my parents as a last hurrah with my dad on this side of the veil. Again, I took to my knees and asked for help to find the ring. I wanted to give it back to my mom, so she could have her ring when Dad passed. I thought, you know, "If, if anyone knows where the ring is, my Heavenly Father does, and God can help me find it." I believed that He could send angels that would help bring it home.

And so, so I put that prayer out there and then kind of forgot about it. Let it be for a while. Prayers were answered and we were able to spend a wonderful holiday with my family. We made lots of memories and lit my mom's home up with laughter and noise. Little did we know that while we were in Idaho, a little mouse was on the job.

Upon our arrival home, my oldest daughter found a hole in her stuffed animal. It was one of those diffuser animals that you heat up and it diffuses essential oils. Well anyway, that tiny creature had spread flax from one end of our house to another. We had opened so many drawers to put away laundry and every time, we would find a little corner full of flaxseed. I was bound and determined to clear out the flax and took a day to clean every nook and cranny.

About a week before my dad passed, I was cleaning out the bathroom closet, and found yet another stash of flax. Armed with cleaners and a trash bag, I began throwing away boxes of stuff we haven't used in years. I felt like I should look in that last box one more time to see if there wasn't anything in the box that I might not want to throw away. And the right-hand corner, closest to me, tucked under the flap – was my ring.

I think it's beautiful that Heavenly Father used that little mouse to help me find the ring. I know that He is a God of miracles, and that sometimes those miracles take time. And sometimes they don't look the way we think they should look. And I know that we inherit more than rings and things. I'm grateful for the inheritance of faith. For my mom and dad teaching me to ask God for the desires of my heart, and to believe that with God, all things are possible. Even finding your ring.

KaRyn 21:46

That was Jessie. Jessie shared her story with us on the pitch line. And though I have never met her, she is clearly my soul sister. Losing something important feels really, really, real to me, and I can just feel her pain and that longing to find that ring again so she can honor her parents. And I think what I'm going to take from this story is the reminder that while like Jessie said, the real inheritance isn't a thing, I think our Father in heaven does use these earthly things to teach us about the Eternal One sometimes. The things we receive, the things we lose, the things we find, and the things we give back, become our spiritual preparation for the things that we will inherit forever.

Our final story today comes from Miya, whose rich family heritage of storytelling helped her to find her own narrative through her hardship. Here's Miya.

Miya 22:51

I come from a big family. I'm the oldest of five children, but I had many cousins around me growing up. My family is Polynesian. My dad is full Samoan, and my mom, she is Hawaiian and Japanese.

A typical gathering of my extended family involved a giant, easy-corner tent, made in my grandmother's driveway, and all the cars being parked on the grass outside of the driveway, so that the children had space to play, whether it was basketball or riding on their scooters.

And then underneath the tent, we had those big tables dedicated just to food, but then also other tables dedicated for the adults and the children to gather to talk with one another, but then also to play games.

So we played cards or some board games. And that was just typical, we would have that almost every weekend. I loved it.

Being a part of a big family, the stories that I heard and were told were always around us, constantly being shared and constantly in my mind, and in my heart. I remember distinctly hearing these stories of my family – of those living and dead – in my bed where my dad would come to my room and sit me down. And he would tell me the story of how my mom and dad met and how they fell in love. And then he would tell me the stories of his grandparents, how they came to America from Samoa. And he would tell me stories of his upbringing with his mother, his mom being a single mom, his parents divorced. He would also tell me two Samoan legends of the islands and how they came to be. My favorite story was the story of the shark and the turtle, and how that legend still lives today.

So the legend of the shark and the turtle – there's multiple variations, but the one that I, I was told the most is a story of an old grandma and a little girl who lived in a village. And they were teased because the grandma was blind. And because they were treated so poorly, the little girl wanted to leave the village with her grandma and find somewhere else to live. So together, they got into a canoe at nighttime so that no one would see them disappear. And as they got in the canoe started paddling away, a giant storm came up, and it tipped the canoe over. And both the grandma and the granddaughter were drowning. And the gods took pity on them and to save them because of their love for one another, they turned them into a shark and a turtle.

And to this day, you can see where the shark and the turtle are at this point at a beach in Samoa. You can sing the song to them and a shark and a turtle will appear and swim right there in front of you. But the story cautions too, that you cannot point your finger at them because that would remind them of being teased and being outcast and so they'll swim away and they'll never hear you or come back to you ever again.

My dad was trying to teach me several lessons one, that it's important to be nice to people and that we should treat people with love and respect. And two, that familial piety is stronger than death. It's stronger than anything in this world. And it can keep you and your loved ones safe and close to your heart, no matter where you go.

And those stories, they stuck with me throughout my youth and into my adulthood as well. They are still part of me.

Growing up, I always hoped that I would have a family of my own. I always wanted to be married, I always wanted to have a bunch of children like my family does. I knew that if there was a tribe around me, I would never ever be alone. And that was something that I feared growing up was being left out or being alone. So having an automatic family around you was what I desired and needed.

And as I grew up, even though I had plans, I recognize that a lot of times those plans didn't happen the way I wanted them to. And to be real, it was very frustrating. And it still is frustrating. Sometimes it's like what's the point of a plan if they don't happen the way you want them to? Some examples include, I went to BYU Provo, specifically to major in piano performance. That didn't happen. My wrist gave out because I practiced so much, and a dream that I had since I was a little girl of performing at Carnegie Hall was put to rest.

And then I moved forward with my life and decided to serve a full-time mission. And I was happily called to one of the homelands of my ancestors, which was Japan. And growing up in Hawaii, I was around a lot of Japanese people and I figured that I'd be just fine in Japan because of my upbringing. But as I went out there, I struggled so much with – not only the language, but the culture. And I even struggled with an eating disorder out there. I was severely depressed and anxious, and all of that led to me deciding on my 21st birthday, to leave my mission behind at seven-and-a-half months to go home and take care of myself. I clearly did not have that in my plans. But even in the midst of my disappointments, there were still a lot of blessings and grace there in my life.

One of them being I found my husband, my sweetheart, and we got married. When my husband and I were engaged, we were doing our family planning. We were expecting that in a few years, we would start having children, especially after school. And so, as we agreed upon this, we both went to the temple together. And I received a distinct prompting that I needed to have a child immediately. And so, nine months later, literally nine months later, I gave birth to our little boy. So, we planned it, but also it wasn't part of the plan. Yeah.

So in terms of having a big family, I thought that because I got pregnant right away that this would be very simple to have a big family. And so we were in the plans and in the works of making that happen still. We had been trying for quite some time to have more children. And nothing was happening, which was a shock because we had our son right away. Why wasn't I getting pregnant again, quickly, like before? It already was a long day, I was tired from trying to balance life. In this pandemic, and working from home, when I received the news that it's highly likely that we won't have a family.

I realized quickly that the big gatherings, the big celebrations, the base-support system, that village-like mentality and experience slipped away from me – from hearing that news. And that fear of feeling like I would be alone and my son would be alone was very real. And the thing that I didn't want, was made more of a reality.

My conversations with Heavenly Father involved a lot of frustration, where I explained to Him, "I am confused why this is being denied for me, and I want answers." And the answer that came to me was, "You need to look into the story of your ancestor, Taka Miyamoto," who I'm named after.

And so I logged on to Family Search and I typed in her name, "Taka Miyamoto," into a general search to see if there were any records that I did not have of her. And as I was scrolling through my search results, I saw that her name was listed under two death certificates. One death certificate naming two twins who both died as stillborns, and then the second death certificate was of another stillborn. And the dates were the same year. And as I saw those death certificates, my heart knew that her, her experience was – as heartbreaking as it was – I needed to find that connection to her through that experience, that her story was going to be the healing point for me to know that I was not alone in these hard times and in this heartache.

I knew then that God answered my prayer that, even though this was a good thing, even though having a family is a wonderful thing, that sometimes, even when things don't happen the way they you want them to, He's still there. He still loves us and is still, still has His hands outstretched towards us. That even in the trials and hardships we go through. We have – we've been blessed with resiliency from Him and from our ancestors.

Even though I don't know what she did after she had these traumatic experiences, I've just felt in my heart that she still carried herself through those hard times. She still picked herself up and moved forward because she knew she still has something to live for, which was the other children that she did have. The other people that she was around – her husband, her friends, the community. She was still there for them. And their stories of her being such a wonderful, wonderful grandmother, and loving her grandchildren and being present there for them. Even though she couldn't speak English that well – she only spoke Japanese – she still was present. Because she lived, because she carried herself through – I knew that this was a woman of resilience. I'm proud to be a descendant of her.

I like to say that I've inherited all of her resilience, but I know that her resilience needs to be shared with everybody else in the family too. But yeah, I like to believe that I've received and gladly have flowing within all the veins of my body, her resiliency, every last bit of it.

So recently in my research, I learned this concept of how my ancestors reckoned with time and space. And the way they viewed time was that the future was behind them, and the past was in front of them, so what has already happened is what we can see clearly. It is before us – as in – in front of us. But what we can't see is naturally behind us, we'd have to turn around to look, right? And so when it comes to my ancestors, because they have already gone before me, they are in front of me, guiding me and showing me what I cannot see, which is my future. They're, they're there to prepare me for what I can't see. They're there to teach me what they have already been taught. They're there to walk me through these things that are coming my way. And as I listen to them, and as I seek them out, our hearts are connected. And my ability to move and to endure through life is strengthened because they have done it already, and they're showing me the way. It's my job to listen, to be taught, and to hear them, and to follow them. They're right there in front of me.

Now, I think about the story my dad taught me, about the shark and the turtle – I think about it often. And now I know that my love for my family will carry me through any storm, will be there for me no matter what happens in my life. That as I am there swimming with my ancestors, through my life's journey, they will always be there with me. I'll never ever have to fear being alone. No matter how many children I have or don't have, they will always, always be there with me. Their love will carry me through anything in my life.

KaRyn 37:21

That was Miyamoto Jensen. I follow her Instagram account the Polynesian Genealogist and when I reached out to her about sharing a story on the podcast, I wasn't sure what theme would emerge from the story she had to tell. So we talked for a long time about her life and her family and her gifts, and there was this sacred moment in our conversation when she spoke of the Spirit's gentle nudge towards the stories of her ancestors, and we both knew that that was the heart of her story.

I love how she described that our ancestors are behind us and before us. And though we're the progeny now, we will someday be the ancestors. And how we connect with God in the here and now is a gift from those who've come before us, and a gift to those who will come next.

You know, at this point, I've all but given up hope of that surprise, wealthy relative who makes me the sole beneficiary of an estate worth just enough money to pay off my student loans because I was the only one who remembered to send a birthday card last year. First of all, I'm terrible at remembering birthdays, so that would never actually happen. But also, if we've learned anything from today's stories, it's that expanding our definition of inheritance will draw us closer to our true destiny. Money, rings, land, desirable physical genetics, those really can be life changing. But when the prophets, and the scriptures, and the Savior tell us that we can inherit all that the Father has, they're not talking about a yacht. They aren't talking about a life of ease and creature comforts, and those mansions they refer to all the time – to be honest, I don't even think that's a thing in heaven. I don't think we'll even want it. I think when they talk about "All that the Father has," they're talking about us. They're talking about you, and they're talking about me – His family, His children. We are His work and His glory, and our eternal salvation is his holiest effort.

We're the whole reason that any of these things exist in the first place. These worlds, this organized matter. And when we receive our true inheritance, I think we're going to see that it has everything to do with becoming like Him in love for the whole human family. Can you imagine inheriting a heart that is able to fully love the way God's does? Or being given a singular focus towards the salvation of others instead of having to worry about our self-preservation? Now that's an inheritance I could really do something with.

And while we're here on earth, we practice to receive a perfect heart like Gods by consciously choosing to turn our own imperfect hearts, by forgiving and reconciling with our siblings, despite our own high emotions, by praying, hopefully to find the ring so that we can present it as a healing offering, by calling upon the shared faith and resilience of our ancestors to help us through our faithless moments. We practice and we practice and we practice some more, until we can start to see the shine of our true birthright, peeking through the earth dust.

I'm not getting a check any time soon. And I'm starting to be okay with that. Because if I can work towards that day, when I get to have all that the Father has, all that my Father has, then I believe that that work, and a little bit of grace will make His inheritance – the terms of his inheritance – everything I've ever wanted, and more.

That's it for this episode of This is the Gospel. Thank you to LuAnne, Jessie and Miya for sharing their inheritance and their stories with us.

We'll have pictures and more information about each of our storytellers in our show notes at ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel.

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Stories in this Father's Day bonus episode: While John admits he's not very handy, his attempts to create the perfect swing set falls short when he allows comparison to take over; Donald isn't sure he's got what it takes for fatherhood to begin with but when infertility makes that even harder, he learns that "what it takes" might be different than he imagined.

SHOW NOTES

To see pictures and links for this episode, go to LDSLiving.com/thisisthegospel

TRANSCRIPT

KaRyn Lay 0:03

Welcome to "This is the Gospel" and LDS Living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host KaRyn Lay. For this bonus episode, we have two stories from faithful men who are braving the wilderness of fatherhood. I think we can all agree that parenting, and its accompanying highs and lows is not for the faint of heart. It takes real courage to jump into the woods and even more humility and skill to navigate that path through the forest filled with unknowns, and so many detours. Can you tell that I'm planning a father's day camping trip this weekend? I'll cool it with the outdoor metaphors. But what I will not cool it with, is my admiration for the men in our lives who take that role of fatherhood seriously and with an eye toward the Savior, just like today's storytellers. Our first story comes from John whose attempt at an epic creation for his children is almost foiled by his own weakness. Here's John.

John 1:02

A lot of dads are really good at fixing things. But I've got to be honest, I'm not very handy. I cannot fix things is almost literally impossible. If there's a screw, I can screw something in. If there's multiple levels, or if there's an instruction manual, especially, I'm just not very good at following those instructions. It just doesn't make sense to me. Like a few years ago, one of our toilets stopped working. So I tried a few different things. I used the plunger that didn't work, I grabbed a snake. This is the tool by the way, not the animal. That didn't work. And so I gave up I was like, "Well, I guess we'll never be able to use this toilet again." I came home from work a couple days later, and here's my wife, she's rocking the toilet back and forth. She picked it up, I didn't even know you could pick up a toilet. And she threw it on the ground and "click," out popped this little jewelry box that one of our kids had shoved into it. So the good news was the toilet was fixed. But the bad news was I didn't fix it. But you know, you can only call on your ministering brothers so many times to come fix stuff for you before you start to feel like, "I should be doing this for myself."

So a couple years ago, I decided it was time for me to build a swing set for my children. So I went to a manly store, Toys R Us, and bought a swing set kit, brought it home and unwrapped it. And it turns out there were about 27 steps to building the swing set. And the first step took me eight hours. It was so painful. I talked with someone recently and they said that their family for fun over the weekend bought and built a swing set. They put the whole kit together in 48 hours. That was not my experience. It took us 12 weeks, tons of help from my brothers in law. But finally the magical day came when the swing set was completed. It was in May, weather was nice, we're eating pizza on the lawn. The only downside was that one of my daughters came up to me and she said, "Dad, I love the swing set. But there's one problem, it just has three monkey bars." And I said "Honey, you will love those three monkey bars cherish each one because I promise you I am never building another swing set." But other than that, it was great.

So right now I'm a religion professor at BYU, but at the time when I was building the swing set I was a full time seminary teacher, which meant every day I would teach high school students lessons from the Bible or the Book of Mormon. And so the day before finishing the swing set on a Friday, we had this class focused on comparison and not comparing yourself to others. One of the things that I got really excited about, a little scripture connection I hadn't noticed before was that Moroni was talking with the Lord. And Moroni was really worried that people would make fun of the Book of Mormon and not like it. And he says, Look, I'm not as good of a writer as the brother of Jared was. And I'd never noticed that Moroni was comparing himself to the brother of Jared. And that was the context in which the Lord said to Moroni, "My grace is sufficient, I can make weak things become strong unto you." And I was surprised to see that even amazing heroes from the scriptures like Moroni compared themselves and so then I gave the students a challenge over the weekend. See if you compare yourself to people like Moroni did and how it makes you feel. So that was Friday, finished the swing set on Saturday.

On Monday, I was back at seminary teaching and I handed them a little three by five card and I said write down your experience of what happened over the weekend with comparison. Collected all the three by five cards. That night, my family and I, we were driving over to our brother in law's house for a little get together. And as we're driving my wife and I are reading these three by five cards, and I could not believe how many of my students were struggling with comparison. Everyone seemed to say something like, I always compare myself to others, and it makes me feel so terrible. I felt sad. I thought, I love my students, that are high school students, are 15, 16, 17, I thought, Oh, how tender that they're going through this tough time of adolescence. And they're just struggling with comparison, I felt so bad. And I still remember, I got out of the car and I thought to myself, these people have a real problem with comparison. So we parked the car on the street and as we're walking into the backyard, I noticed I think for the first time, that my brother in law had a swing set. I don't remember ever seeing a swing set in his backyard before. I looked at it and it was obviously bigger than my swing set. And I just happened to notice the monkey bars. And I counted 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 monkey bars on that swing set. And I thought, my swing set is garbage. I think I was particularly sensitive to it because I wanted to build this awesome swing set for my kids. I never fixed anything. I never build anything. And although everyone had had a lot of fun on Saturday playing with the swing set, the one complaint that I'd received was that there were only three monkey bars. So kind of even imagining maybe my kids were looking at his swing set being like, "Oh, now this is a real swing set." Just a couple moments ago, I've been like, Oh, those teenagers have a problem with comparison. I feel so bad for them. But then I realized, I have a problem with comparison. This swing set that I cherished was my prime creation two days ago. Now I hated and the only difference was the comparison, comparing my swing set to somebody else's.

I started to notice lots of different ways in my life where I compared myself to other people, it wasn't just the fact that I couldn't fix things. Here's another real example. That probably sounds silly. It does sound silly as I look back on it. But at the moment, it was so raw. I was speaking at a girls camp with Brad Wilcox. Many of you have probably heard of Brad Wilcox, who's this incredible youth speaker. And he was going to speak second. So I was speaking first getting my stuff set up and this little 12 year old girl came up towards me with her camera, and I thought, "Oh, that's so precious. She probably wants her picture taken with me." And she looks at me with these big guys and said, "Are you, Brad Wilcox?' And I said, "Oh, no, that's the next speaker." And she just said, "Oh," turned around and walked away. And I felt so small. I'm like, I am not Brad Wilcox. And, and, then it, but again, I realized I can't be Brad Wilcox. I'm not Brad Wilcox, and I can't compare myself to Brad Wilcox. The day after seeing my brother in law's swing set when I went back to my seminary class, and we talked a little bit more about comparison. It was more real for me. It wasn't a problem that they had or something that I had to help them fix. It was something that we all were struggling with, and something that we could all be working on, hopefully, finding ways to overcome the challenge. I love going back to this phrase from Jesus though, when he says to Moroni, "My grace is sufficient." Because Moroni, I mean, he was working on a really big, important project, and he felt like his efforts weren't enough. And I can relate to that sometimes. And who knows, maybe Moroni, maybe he really wasn't as great of a writer, as the brother of Jared. And maybe I'm not as good as that other person. But the Lord has put me in this place right now. Maybe I'm not the best father in the world, but I am the father of my children. And I don't need to compare myself to other fathers out there.

For me, this idea of comparison is obviously a, an issue that I continue to struggle with. I'm struggling with as recently as today. Knowing that I was going to record this story I've been listening over and over again to some of the "This is the Gospel" podcast stories which I've heard before and I've loved but I was listening to them with a different ear today thinking about the story that I was going to be sharing. And I literally thought this morning, my story stinks. Compared to these other stories. These other stories are so inspirational, so powerful, I have nothing to share. And what's ironic is I did not even think for about until about three hours later, oh, I just compared myself again. The more I understand grace, it helps me in my fatherhood, because I realized I don't have to do it all. I want to be a super Dad, I want to be the dad that fixes the toilet. that builds the amazing swing set that does all these super cool things. But I fall short a lot. And understanding that the grace of Jesus Christ is there to strengthen me, to help me get through things that I couldn't do on my own also helps me feel a little bit more patient and understanding with myself when I don't meet my own high expectations. I'm a perfectionist and I want things to be perfect. But I realized I don't have to make things perfect. That's the job of Jesus. I do the best I can, and I don't have to worry about what others think. I don't have to look sideways; I can look up to heaven. He can take weak things and make them strong, His grace is enough. And the three monkey bars are enough. And that brings a lot of peace.

KaRyn Lay 9:20

That was professor and author John Hilton. I love the connection that John noticed between his own peace and his efforts to stop comparing himself as a swing set builder and parent. The fact that Christ's grace is sufficient to cover everything from my deepest character flaw to my poor efforts to put together an Ikea bookshelf, that's a powerful truth that can change our lives and our relationships if we let it. And I'm so glad that John with his unique talents was able to illustrate that in his story. I think all of those years researching and writing about the ways we access peace through Jesus for his book, The Founder of Our Peace have already been a huge blessing to so many and to me personally. Thanks, John. Our next storyteller Donald is a good friend of LDS Living . We featured his story in our podcast episode 23, called "How We Move Forward," which I highly recommend, even if you've listened to it before, it's worth going back and re-listening. And today he shares a story about what it takes emotionally, spiritually and mentally to prepare yourself for first time fatherhood. Here's Donald.

Donald 10:27

My relationship to fatherhood is, it's been an up and down journey. I didn't have my dad in my home for a long period of time as a kid, then a mom and dad that had separated. And then as I got older, my mom remarried when we came to the United States, and that was Jake. And Jake didn't have like a long tenure in my life. And then we, my sister's dad came into picture several years later. So, I had different individuals that were there, but over the long span of that time period my mom was a single mom, and to not have that steady father figure, it was a, it was an absence that was notable. Luckily, I was able to have the guidance from other people outside that helped me to realize what it is to be a father. And then that's where the church came in the village, so to speak, to help me to see that and now becoming a dad, it wasn't easy because of the challenges and complexities I didn't know about.

When I first met my wife, the thing I loved the most about her was that she was the opposite of me. She was quiet and reserved, and I was the outgoing talkative type and I felt that was, there's something was mysterious, and she's cute. So it was that pulled me in. When we were dating and the desire, desire to you know, to eventually get married and courting and talked about the idea of family, we both knew that's something that we wanted, we both knew we wanted to have kids. We had, we had different spectrum though. My idea was not coming from a family of three of us, I was thinking, you know what, it'd be cool to have a big family because again, those families that have friends that I've had in the church, their families were big. And you saw how much fun they had as a bunch of kids. I'm like, yeah, we can, it'd be cool to make a soccer team. Right? Cool to have a bunch of kids that could play you know, play with, at least the basketball team. Christina's idea was, well, maybe one and if there's an opportunity for twin for two, then that'd be great. So you find yourself coming to some quick compromise, but we knew we wanted kids. We, the number was, I'm a salesperson. So, I figured you just you take what you get in and you just keep upselling. But it was 2015. We got married in September 2013.

When I was called to be a bishop, a member a couple people saying "Don't you have to have a family to be a bishop to the kids to be a bishop?" Remember people making that, that, that joke, but you know, obviously there's a little bit of jab to that. And obviously, there's nowhere in the handbook where it says anything like that. We were definitely laggers according to societal norms and the ecosystem of the Church, because Christina and I got married when we were 27. So that's, you know, my friends which, seemed like they had grandkids by then. We knew we were gonna have kids but and we knew we wanted to have kids but we just we both felt that we were on the same plane with God, spiritual like, we prayed about it and we fasted, we talked to our Bishop and so forth and you know, the before then they're like, just whenever your take your time on that, and that gives us comfort to know, you just go into when you feel right for you. So not that we were postponing a family for any other reason to just go travel or you know, to get a nice little dog or anything like that. We, we just, it was scary. And we were worried and it, it didn't feel right.

I think the biggest thing about becoming a father that made me the most nervous was, Do I have the right stuff? To take care of a tiny human? Do I, what do I not know that I don't know? Am I going to be able to raise this individual in the right way that they're going to grow up to become a righteous priesthood holder or righteous daughter of God? Or do I have what it takes to make that happen? I think that it was, it was definitely like a fear and also like the idea of taking care of somebody. I mean, the challenges with our family in the past, my mom in the situation was, we were, were poor. And it was, am I going to be able to take care of a family? Am I going to be able to always have that? It nags you in the back of your head. What if? What if that was to happen? You want the situation to be perfect, you want the scenarios to be: the planets align and Jupiter to be bright in the sun, in the sky. But the problem is, I don't think it was ever or it, ever was going to be and thats one of the things I've learned, that we're going to go down this path, and we're going to try and we're going to mess up and we're going to keep learning and growing. But for me, being sometimes a little perfectionist, I want to make sure all is right beforehand. And that freaked me out.

Donald 15:18

So let's fast forward now. And I think it was 2017 when we said, "Let's, we want to have a family, we want to start doing that." And the thing that helped us to decide that that was the right time and to overcome the fears and the challenges, I think it was just it was timing. For us just felt that it was right. It did not go as planned. At all. So we tried. My ignorance, thinking that you're, yeah, you're gonna have a baby right away when you have a desire to have a baby. But it wasn't. That was a huge upset and it was a huge setback emotionally. I mean, and to be honest, I feel like there was some, like, some guilt in that to say, did we wait too long? Now you're in your early, early 30s, you should have started right when you got married, and it's kind of like validating and everything that people have said, "You should have kids right away should have kids." And it's like, you know, did we miss a window? Do we miss an opportunity? And there was guilt on both sides, right? Because Christina was feeling guilty. Like, "Is it because of me that we're not having kids?" And spiritually, it was, "Well, I'm doing what you said, God, I am serving. Why do we have to face this struggle, and this burden if we're doing what's right, if I'm serving, and giving enough time?" and so forth. I mean, I'm just trying to be real with you. Like, that's what it felt like in, but I knew that just like with, like Abraham or Sariah and in all of those people that had children later on in their life, we had faith that we would have children. But in the moment, that's what that feeling was like. It was "Why us? "

So, we found out we were pregnant, and then went to the doctor. That was the hard part. And I remember the ultrasound specialist tech going, leaving out of the room, and she sayings she's going to get the doctor and then you're like, "Okay, so what does that mean? Maybe there's some chance, maybe there's a hope there's something that happened." And then, eventually having a meeting with a doctor, and I knew when I saw Christina's face, she knew that it wasn't, wasn't good. So then we met with a doctor and found out that it wasn't and we had to have surgery. And that was bad. Hearing that news and leaving the day but then the day when she had the surgery, to watch my wife go through that was horrible because there was absolutely nothing that I could do. And it's, it was the, you know her physically in pain and then emotionally and then spiritually in pain and I, no matter what, what can you say? What can you say? "I understand?" No, I don't I can't push a kid out of my body. I can't birth a kid. I don't understand what that feels like. But having as much empathy and love for your wife and trying to console her and take care of her in that situation and physically taking care of her, still having to go and work and running your own business that was does the pinnacle of the worst part, right? I thought that was the pinnacle, until round two. When a year later, everything happened again, the same exact way. And that, if this was a depth of your lowest, then the second time around, it was even lower. I felt physically sick, because I remember going back to work that day, and not telling noone. Not telling team member not telling, my mom didn't know anything. I think the only person that knew was her sister. And it was just like carrying that weight and that burden and then feeling that I can't help her and the guilt that she felt, was saying "That it's, you know, it's my fault," and it wasn't her fault. And I couldn't get that through, she was saying "It's twice that happened, so must be it must be me. And something I'm doing wrong." And, and trying to take that weight from her. That was hard. It was hard.

Donald 19:41

We kept it to our self into our immediate family. And it was a lot. I didn't want to validate, I mean, just speaking again, I didn't want to validate anybody's to say, "Yeah, you should have gotten, you should have had kids a lot sooner, you should have tried a lot sooner." So, even some of that was there. So it's like I'm not going to talk to anybody about it. We're not going to do anything. I did talk to my Stake President about it in my one-on-one with him, because he was just we won't know how you guys were doing how we were doing. And he gave counsel and, and was very supportive and helpful in that. And very helpful and supportive to Christina. And that meant a lot to us as well. One of my best friends, he and his wife, it took them a while before they have a kid. It took them 10 years, and came to the point where they said, "You know what, God, you just take the wheel. Really, like if there's a way that we can foster and we're going to foster." And they started preparing their home for fostering, and it was crazy. All of a sudden, they got pregnant and they had a kid. And he was vocal, I mean, he was open to talk about it. So now it gave me an opportunity to say, "I could talk about it to him, and he could then understand what I'm going through." You know, I mean, and I think that's the biggest thing with guys, we assume too much that, "He's my Bro, he knows what I'm going through," as opposed to saying, "I love you. I cannot imagine what that feels like, do you want to talk about it?" Like giving that window and maybe sometimes people are not ready to talk about it yet, but at least they know, "I have somebody that I can go to."

It gave me an outlet. It gave me an opportunity to know that I wasn't alone. It gave me an opportunity to know that there', that it wasn't. It wasn't a punishment from God, you know, others felt the same or went through similar challenges as well. It opened up a whole different side to our relationship. That helped me to minister to Christina, my wife, better, because I had hope, more hope. I mean, I had faith but then now it was even more hope, because my friend went through it. We have, we have a hope of something to look forward to, that we could still have the same blessings like he did, he and his wife. So I wish that men in general could feel, could feel comfortable to go and talk to other men, about the struggles and the difficulties that they're going through.

Donald 21:59

So my wife posted on social media for uh, nobody knew why. But she was like, "What's a talk? One of your favorite talks on, I think it was like on hope, or to get through a tough time." And then one of our friends, he posted a talk by Elder Holland, it was Elder Holland's talk, "Lord, I Believe" I think that's what it is. And it's like, "Lord, I believe, Help thou my unbelief." Maybe she can recite that talk verbatim now, because she's listened to it over and over. And the idea in that was, "that come with some faith, come with hope, come with something, and I'll carry the rest." And that was very helpful. And then all of a sudden, we had stake conference and Elder Holland came to Florida, and he came to our stake, and we visited with Elder Holland, just for like, probably like two or three minutes to explain to him what was going on. And you know how the talk was good and it helped us. But it's something about him. He looked he just looked and he said, "Don't you worry, you guys will be fine, you guys will be fine. Things will be fine for you." Yeah, so getting that from an apostle was like, "That's kind of cool." At least it gave comfort, right? And we had hope. So we said, "Let's put it back in the Lord's hand, let's just wait and not worry."

And then life went on until 2018. And Christina wasn't feeling good, the end of the year. She said, "Oh, maybe I need to do a pregnancy test." And "We're like, no, it's, that's not the situation." And then "She's like, I think I should." She did. And we were pleasantly surprised. But also equally worried because we're like the third time, if this isn't, it's going to be a huge blow. And I remember we went to the doctor's office, and because we've had two miscarriages before, the doctor wanted us instead of coming in later come in early, so we went in at I think it was six weeks. And there was like a little speck on the sonogram, just like this little, this little thing. But there was something there. And then as we kept visiting saw a little heartbeat and saw a little progress. We couldn't believe that there was something, we were excited. But we were very, very, very scared. Because before we saw stuff, so we didn't want to get the false hope that this was going to work. So we just took it with a grain of salt, and just went one day at a time. I mean, week 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12. It kept going. Every week, we went back, there was a movement and kept growing and it was things were looking right. And we weren't clearly out of the woods at all. But our doctor was very excited for us. And then we got the news that yes, it's a, we're having a little boy.

We're having a little boy. And it was, um, that day was, it was a, it was, I can't think of a word to describe it. It was happiness. It was peace, that no matter what difficulty, no matter what dark moments you go through, no matter what timing you have, trust in God, and as Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego, but if not, we still gotta have hope.

Oh, the day Caleb was born. I was the stereotypical dad because Christina was like cleaning the house and stuff. It was the craziest thing and I would fall asleep and then she screamed, it was like, "Hey, I think my water broke." I'm like, "What..what?" And I remember , I wish we videotaped it but I was running around trying to, like, "What, what?!" She tells this story better so maybe you can get her side one day. You know, I was running around, "Okay, okay, let's go. Let's get this. Let's get the car seat. Let's get the bag."

We went to the hospital and the next day, August 1, he was born. When I first saw him, I could not believe that, that was our child after that whole journey. After that whole time, after the miscarriages after the surgeries, after the emotions, after giving up, after having hope, after feeling false hope, after all of that, that now we were trusted, at this time, to be to be a dad and to be a mom. It was awe inspiring. It was just, it was it made me feel that God is mindful of us. It made me want to be the person that he desired me to be and full circle now to become the father that I didn't have, to this child to help them become the individual that Heavenly Father wants them to be.

For guys going through the same thing in the thick of this, we cannot deviate or forget that the Lord is there, and be open. Be willing to talk to somebody else about that it, it does us no good to hold it back. It liberates us when we're able to release it. And we can get ministered to in the scriptures that teaches us that we are here to minister and to help one another with their burdens. But it's kind of hard to help somebody with their burdens if we don't know they have that burden. And I feel that if you feel that way, you're more than willing to reach out to me, I'm more than willing to talk to you. Because I had a buddy and a friend that was there for me during that moment. There is hope. There is light at the end of the tunnel. There's a Father in heaven who is mindful of you and your wife's situation. And He's here and there to help you.

KaRyn Lay 27:44

That was Donald Kelly. I laughed out loud when he said that as a salesman his idea is to upsell his wife on the number of kids they have. I'm lucky enough to know his lovely and spirited wife Christina and I can only imagine the negotiations in the Kelly household. The thing I think I will really take from this story is that clarion call to make space for the people around me to really share what's going on in their lives, by allowing others into my life. It's not always easy to do that. Vulnerability is absolutely a risky business. But I think the rewards of this kind of true ministry is worth the calculated risk. When he was talking about this, Donald mentioned our baptismal covenant to bear one another's burdens. And I think there's something really important for us to take note of, as a community committed to discipleship. we strengthen the fathers, we strengthen the mothers, and in turn, we strengthen the children, the future Body of Christ when we allow for all people to share their authentic experiences, so that we can minister in real time to our real needs.

Lately, I've become weirdly obsessed with historical novels and books that forced me to imagine myself in a different time with different social structures. I love the creative energy it takes to look through the lens of historical context and try to find myself in the places and the stories of the past. And maybe it's because we're living in this unprecedented time with this pandemic and unrest and all of these things I, I hope someone will look back and read it and try to put themselves here before they judge me. Well, though it isn't a novel I have been reading the book Fathers of the Prophets, which has biographical sketches of you guessed it, fathers of the modern prophets of the restoration, and I have found myself absolutely transported. What strikes me in my reading is the amount of variation in the fathers who parented prophets. Some fathers had no idea their child would be anything special, while others knew by some divine guidance. Some of the fathers were really physically present to their children, while others were called to faraway places for long periods of time. Some were devoted servants of God, while others found little use in organized religion. But in all cases, these fathers and their gifts of imperfection were necessary building blocks to the unique talents and strengths that their children would use in their call to the ministry.

Most of us will not raise a capital P prophet or a Relief Society general president. In fact, some days we might even have a hard time seeing that 13 year old who just broke his arm flinging spaghetti at his brother, or that 10 year old who just refused to comb her hair for the sixth straight day in quarantine, as heirs to the throne of much of anything. But I think the lesson from our stories today and the stories of these fathers from the past are the same. God needs us to show up as ourselves in our parenting. Because these kids, they're the future of everything. He needs us to open up to a friend who's been there before, so that he'll have enough hope to keep trying to become a father. He needs us to admit that we can't fix the toilet and then trust him to tutor us on what we can actually fix. He needs us to show up in our pain and our triumph and our weakness and our power so that our children will get exactly what they need from us, as he fills in the gaps of everything else with his grace. And more importantly, he needs us to show up in our less than perfect state so that we can model for them, where to go for peace and wholeness when their own imperfections, will inevitably bring doubt and discouragement into their lives. We may not all be raising a child who will hold a high calling in church structure. But we are all raising children, all of us whether we're biological parents or not. We are all raising children, who will be disciples of the high priests of good things to come. So let's go back to the beginning. Fatherhood, and loving and caring for children is not for the faint of heart. But that's the good news because with humility, trusting God and a brave willingness to let others help us bear our burdens, our hearts, however weak will not fail us. That's the promise.

KaRyn Lay 32:31

That's it for this bonus episode of This is the Gospel. Thank you to John Hilton and Donald Kelly for sharing their stories and burdens with us today. And for helping us all to see that three monkey bars is enough. We'll have pictures of Donald's sweet baby Caleb and John's swing set masterpiece as well as a link to John's book The Founder of Our Peace in our show notes at LDSLiving.com/thisisthegospel. I'll also add a link to the book Fathers of the Prophets there. Which honestly if you're looking for a last-minute Father's Day gift. This one's so good. Every father will be able to see himself somewhere in the pages of that book. If you aren't already following us on Facebook or Instagram, you really should. We'll have more information about our storytellers there, including follow-ups with some of the stories you've connected to most on the podcast. So, go there, find us at @ThisistheGospel_ podcast on both Instagram and Facebook. Also, we're currently gathering stories for season three. So if you have a story to share about living the gospel, please call our pitch line and leave us a pitch. We often find many of our stories from that pitch line and we love to hear how the gospel has blessed your life. Call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less. We also have old bonus episodes that give you some top tips on how to pitch your story in a really compelling way. So, go and listen to those on iTunes if you haven't already. This episode was produced by me KaRyn Lay, with additional story editing by Erika free. It was mixed and mastered by Mix at Six Studios and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. You can find past episodes of this podcast and all the other LDS Living podcasts at LDLiving.com/podcasts. It's that easy. See you soon.

Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Have you ever wondered how to call on priesthood power as a Latter-day Saint woman? Turns out you're not the only one. Join us for a super exciting bonus episode with Tammy and Barbara Morgan Gardner as they answer questions gathered from social media about women and the priesthood. We promise you are not going to want to miss this one.

Stories in this Episode: Sarah and KaRyn share lessons learned from their very first storytelling project over 15 years ago when they invited accomplished, faithful women (like Emma Lou Thayne, Ariel Bybee, Liz Lemon Swindle, Olene Walker) into their living rooms; Leslie, Claire, Cari, Tennisa, & Emily give us 2 minute stories of letting the Lord lead from the start of our THIS IS THE GOSPEL video series.

SHOW NOTES

To see pictures and links for this episode, go to LDSLiving.com/thisisthegospel

TRANSCRIPT

KaRyn Lay 0:00

Hello from my home office, which is really just my desk by a window in my stepkids' room that I have commandeered during the social distancing. They're thrilled, as you can imagine, to wake up at eight every day so that I can get to work. But I actually think that my daily occupation of their rooms speaks to the reality of parenting and family and relationships during these tricky times—flexibility, creativity, figuring out what works for your unique situation—well, that's the order of the day. And we hope that you are finding your groove and whatever way you can. We're certainly trying to do that with the podcast, and while we gear up for season three, over the next few months, we're still going to bring you a few bonus episodes that just can't wait until we get back into a recording studio. And so today, we've got a quarantine edition of the podcast with some stories that celebrate the ways that women rely on the Lord and the many roles, including motherhood, that they inhabit throughout their lives.

Welcome to This Is The Gospel, an LDS living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host KaRyn Lay.

First step, a few stories within a story within a conversation. This Is The Gospel producer, Sarah Blake, and I recently recorded a conversation we had where we tried to remember all the details from the very first, but clearly not the last storytelling project that we embarked on together over 15 years ago.

I don't exactly remember when we decided, A: to call them the gatherings, and then B:I how did it even happen?

Sarah 1:43

I don't remember either because motherhood has erased so much of my memory, but I think it was 2004 or 2005. We were single in our single sport in Salt Lake.

KaRyn Lay 1:56

Yes, everything starts with us being single.

Sarah 1:58

I know. Side note about that though, the years that we were single that felt like a curse have become one of the greatest blessings and like, to me, it's a constant whenever something hard is going on. I'm like, well, that one big one turned out to be the greatest blessing. So I can trust this one will work out too.

KaRyn Lay 2:17

Agreed.

Sarah 2:18

Okay, so we were single in our singles ward, trying to find our way. Right?

KaRyn Lay 2:23

I think at that point, I kind of was like, not that I was giving up. But I, I sort of had the sense that I was going to be single for a while. Like, I was always hopeful. I loved falling in love, but I, I leaned into it, I leaned into a little bit to like, Okay, if I'm going to be a cat lady, who's just sort of doing life on my own, then, like, we better figure out the best way to be single. That's kind of what I think I remember us talking about.

Sarah 2:52

Yeah, but you never did get the cat. So that was that was a hopeful gesture to not...

KaRyn Lay 2:57

That was. I babysat someone else's cat and lost it on the first night that I had it. But where it wasn't actually lost, it was actually just asleep in one of the drawers of my apartment, but I freaked out and called everybody and made them help me look for this kitten that I thought I had lost. So after that I realized being a cat lady was probably not in my future. Until now. Now I have a cat.

Sarah 3:21

Now you have a cat. Go figure.

KaRyn Lay 3:23

I actually think you were the one who had the idea.

Sarah 3:26

I was, yeah. I had the idea first and, and we had a meeting at your apartment.

KaRyn Lay 3:33

I don't even remember this. I don't remember that.

Sarah 3:36

Yeah, we had a meeting in your apartment and you made us a really nice dessert. And we all sat and talked about it. The idea was I felt like I needed to hear from more women. I needed more examples of what it looks like to be a faithful woman. Especially because we were single. I, at least, didn't have any examples in my family of what it looks like to be single in your 20's. Everyone else had gotten married and had kids, and I was like, am I okay? And how do I do this? But also just about how to be a woman, and a faithful woman? And I wanted not just to read about it in a book, but I wanted to talk to someone and ask questions and stuff, right? So we made the list of women we admired that we wish we could talk to.

KaRyn Lay 4:18

I feel like we had an Excel document or something that we packed in all of the names of people that we— this was before Google Docs, so we were we were old school—

Sarah 4:27

Hard to believe.

KaRyn Lay 4:28

I know—old school spreadsheeting it. And we had, like, a list of, we just kept adding to it like Latter-day Saint women that we admired and that we thought were really cool. And then we we decided to just ask them.

Sarah 4:41

And then we started sending them letters—like old school, typed up letters, put in an envelope and mailed it off. Some of them we just found in the phonebook, I think and others we had a contact or someone who knew someone, and then people were so gracious and responded. And when we started having these awesome women come and speak to a gathering of some of our friends like 20 to 30 people just at our houses.

KaRyn Lay 5:06

Who was the first person that came? Because I think after we had the first couple, that's when we were like, Oh, we can pretty much invite anyone we want. But why wouldn't we? We'll just play the sad, single, like late 20s cards.

Sarah 5:21

Help us find our way. So, the first one was Carmen Pingree, who was an advocate for children with autism in Utah, and the first school for children with autism in Utah was named for her because of all her tireless efforts.

KaRyn Lay 5:38

Were you the way invited her Sarah?

Sarah 5:40

I invited her because she was my boss's mom. And I'd met her and I was less scared to do that. But she was wonderful. And then we had Emma Lou Thayne, the poet.

KaRyn Lay 5:54

Yeah, Emma probably one of my favorites. Like, just that whole conversation with her. She was so gracious. I actually dug up my journal from that time because when we would sit there with them,

Sarah 6:06

We didn't have a good way to record it. So we just did notes.

KaRyn Lay 6:09

We did. Actually do you know who was before Emma Lou? Sally Mart, she was somebody that I knew from Pennsylvania, and I think you said that you weren't there, right Sarah?

Sarah 6:19

I had strep throat. I didn't want to get her kids sick, so I couldn't go.

KaRyn Lay 6:23

She was a nurse. She couldn't have children of her own. So she adopted all of these special needs kids from all over the world. And then she was diagnosed with either stage three or stage four cancer. And I remember her saying that when she got the diagnosis, somebody took her kids for the day, and she went into the bedroom and she got down on her knees, and she said, to Heavenly Father, "If we're going to do this, let's make it a doozy." I remember that she used the word doozy, and I was like, "What is she talking about?" She said, "Oh, I loved having breast cancer." She said, "I talked to the Lord and I said, 'I want to learn every possible thing that I can from this experience so don't hold back Heavenly Father, do not hold back on me. Give everything that you've got to me so that I can do whatever it is that you need me to do, to become the woman that you want me to become.'" And I have never heard anybody talk about a trial that way before in my life. And it felt so like, it was shocking and exciting, and it kind of blew my mind and and I, I just realized, Oh, I want to be like Sally, I want to be fearless how fearless of her right?

Sarah 7:33

Yeah.

KaRyn Lay 7:33

How trusting of God's infinite grace that even when she's got all these kids to take care of, she recognizes that this is going to only work if she learns what she needs to learn from it and I, I've never forgotten that.

Sarah 7:47

It makes me sad. I missed that one. So then we had we had Olene Walker, the first female governor of Utah.

KaRyn Lay 7:55

I wasn't there for Olene so you'll have to tell me what you learned from Olene.

Sarah 7:58

I loved her. I like loved her sense of humor and her perspective that she had from her years of life. And one of the big things that stuck out to me, and I apologize, to Olene and her sentence if I mess up in your stories, but she talked about—she got married and her husband was in grad school, and they had seven kids in 11 years and moved 13 times, or something like that. And she survived all that, and she said it was just a blur. And then when that was over, and they were somewhere stable, she started a PhD when her youngest was two. She's always been a person who didn't need a ton of sleep. So she would help you know, be the mom all day, help her kids with their homework, get them in bed and then start her homework, and do her homework and studying until about two in the morning, and then sleep for four hours and then start the whole thing again. And she was like, "I don't—not that I recommend that to anyone else. But it worked okay for me."

KaRyn Lay 8:53

What has that done for your life?

Sarah 8:55

Well, that's my schedule now, I'm embarrassed to say. But mostly, you know, the thing that I think it was Olene who said this the most clearly, but all of the women said it in one way or another. And this was exactly the kind of guidance I was looking for was this: that in women's lives in particular, there are seasons in your life. And you have to embrace the seasons and accept that, and recognize you can't have it all at the same time. But over the course of your life, you can have it all if you accept the seasons as they come. So like the season of having small children is an intensive, demanding season, and you can't do all the other things at that time. This season of being single is a different kind of opportunity to grow and focus on your own relationship with the Lord. But I think they really showed us by the example of their own lives that if you make the most of whatever season you're in, that's the way to be your best self.

KaRyn Lay 9:52

Yeah. Do you remember Ariel Bybee coming?

Sarah 9:56

A famous opera singer?

KaRyn Lay 9:57

Yes, Ariel Bybee was a famous Latter-day saint opera singer. This is something I won't ever forget. She went around the room after we heard her tell about her life and about all the things that she had learned spiritually. And she asked us, "What are you passionate about?" And she waited for every single woman in that room to answer and we all did, right? I can't remember what I said about what I was passionate about is probably creativity or something. Do you remember?

Sarah 10:24

No, I don't remember what I said. It was probably humanitarian stuff. That's what I did then.

KaRyn Lay 10:29

Yeah. And, and at the end of it, it came back to Ariel and she looked us all I felt likeshe looked every single one of us into our souls like bore into our souls and she said, "Whatever you do, do not, do not do it with mediocrity." She said, "If you are passionate about it, you put your whole soul into that. The world has enough mediocrity. It has enough mediocre art. It needs women who can create with excellence." And I was like, "Ahhhhh." And I don't know if I've lived up to Arial's—

Sarah 11:08

I know, I'm like, "Oh sorry, I'm sorry, Ariel."

KaRyn Lay 11:11

But also, I think there's something beautiful about that, right? Like Ariel's words and Sally's words and Olene's words combined, that there is a season for everything, that God is going to tutor us through them, and that when we're in that season to put our whole soul into it. Like what a cool life plan those women gave us.

Sarah 11:34

Yes. The other thing I think they all spoke about how they were surprised with where they ended up. When you're young you think I'm going to go to medical school and be a doctor you think you have this plan and then this is it and life doesn't ever hardly ever work out that way. Right? We all end up on surprise paths and discover we had a talent we didn't realize or a passion we didn't understand, and, or we're just given an opportunity and sometimes the opportunity looks like a challenge, right? But then it becomes the center of your life's work. And the way to find your best path is by trusting that it's part of God's plan and that those surprises are meant to be.

KaRyn Lay 12:13

What else without that experience do you think you'll take forever?

Sarah 12:16

So I remember in particular, Emily saying, telling the story of when she wrote the lyrics to where can I turn for peace?

KaRyn Lay 12:22

Yeah.

Sarah 12:23

She was struggling with a challenge with one of her kids who was having a really hard time. And she was on the phone with a friend while she did laundry in her laundry basement, and this inspiration hit in the laundry room, like she grabbed a piece of paper, and they co-wrote it together. Inspired by the pain, she was feeling suffering for her daughter. So many of them gave really specific details of the mundane things of life, which are, I mean, there's mundane details for everyone but women's lives often are especially like that stuff is ever present with us the burden of the dishes. The laundry and where did people leave their shoes, and they all mentioned those things and, but with a kind of reverence sometimes that made me feel like the good stuff of life can happen any day, anywhere, in the in your laundry room when you're talking to your friend.

KaRyn Lay 13:16

Here's what I have written in my journal about that.

Sarah 13:18

Yeah.

KaRyn Lay 13:19

It says, "Where can I turn for peace, personal anguish for this beautiful piece of art that has touched and healed so many broken hearts. We are all connected and our life's work is not ours alone."

Sarah 13:31

Yeah.

KaRyn Lay 13:31

I don't know if Emma Lou said that, but that's what I took.

Sarah 13:34

That's what you took from it. It was just so many testaments that the worst times in your life can end up being the best, the greatest blessings that God can turn anything to our good to bless His children. And if we just try to be open to being instruments, then He will use us that way.

KaRyn Lay 13:52

Yeah.

Sarah 13:53

Maybe not today, maybe not this week, maybe not for 20 years, but like, it gave me a sense we can look back and be like, "What a cool life of goodness."

KaRyn Lay 14:01

I was thinking to Sarah, I don't know if you remember this, but we were making those lists of all of those, quote unquote famous Latter-day Saint women. And after we'd done a couple, do you remember that we that we were like, "You know what? We need to talk to our moms.

Sarah 14:17

Mmhmm. And then we had your mom come.

KaRyn Lay 14:19

Yeah. My mom came.

Sarah 14:21

I think she's the only mom that we ever managed to get it done with because then we all started moving away.

KaRyn Lay 14:27

To hear my mom in that setting, talking about her life, like, she and I might have had some of those conversations, but to have this formal evening where all of my friends were gathered at the feet of my mom, literally at the feet of my mom, as she talked about the paths that she has walked. It was such a powerful experience.

Sarah 14:51

That was a powerful experience for me too. I really loved that one was your mom—and I think about some of the things she mentioned all the time.

KaRyn Lay 14:58

Well, and the thing about it as my mom hadn't lived what she thought was an extraordinary life.

Sarah 15:03

Mmhm ,but she had so much wisdom as so many, like, just practical wisdom. And she was so funny. And—

KaRyn Lay 15:10

Yeah,

Sarah 15:10

—fresh and real. Like she was sitting like a queen with us literally—we were because we were crowded in a small living room, but you know, all sitting on the floor and the chairs around her. And we're on the feet of this Queen while she talked about how to successfully fight with your husband. You know,I really liked that one.

KaRyn Lay 15:27

When we were talking about the gatherings, I couldn't have anticipated that some of the greatest wisdom that I would get would come from my own mom. Shortly after that, I think we all started moving to foreign countries, and graduate schools, and all over so it was sort of the, the disbanding of the gatherings happened sort of organically just out of necessity.

Sarah 15:52

Yeah.

KaRyn Lay 15:53

You said at the beginning when we started talking about that the idea for the gatherings came because you wanted wisdom from people who maybe had walked different paths than you as you tried to figure yours out. What did that teach you about womanhood and sisterhood?

Sarah 16:10

The gift that that experience gave us was recognizing—we were expecting that there was a right answer, right. There was—

KaRyn Lay 16:16

Yeah.

Sarah 16:16

They were going to tell us some way we were supposed to do stuff. And instead the answer was: you'll find it. Right? And God has got you. And the answer is going to be different for everyone. And it's going to depend on your, the combination of your inspiration, of course, and your talents and gifts that you're supposed to use, and then the opportunities you're given to use them right? And—

KaRyn Lay 16:39

Yeah.

Sarah 16:40

And that we can find it ourselves. But there's no one, there's no one way.

KaRyn Lay 16:46

And, and that honestly each, each of our lives, whether we deem them extraordinary or not, is extraordinary to God.

Sarah 16:55

The meeting with your mom was the one that that brought home to me—everyone has things to teach us, and we tend to have the great men lens on history, like who accomplished a lot, and who has an impressive resume. But anyone, if we sat them in that chair and we sat at their feet and asked them questions like they're an expert on life, because they are, because they've been living can teach us some amazing things.

KaRyn Lay 17:21

Yeah. And there's value in women telling each other our stories, like, I feel like the gatherings set up a foundation for a large part of the rest of my life. I mean, I it's been 15 years since we did that. And I, and I still have the Sally Mart quotes running through my mind. I still have the moment when Ariel Bybee pointed to us and said that, you know? And I still have that feeling of sitting in a room huddled together with 20 women who I admired and loved I still have that feeling that warmth, that feeling of closeness with you, and with the other girls that we did it with. And there's something really powerful about that for me.

Sarah 18:11

Yeah, for me, too. This was good to reminisce.

KaRyn Lay 18:15

I know. I only wish I took better notes. I have no idea what this means.

Sarah 18:19

I only wish I had climbed into the attic to call my journal.

KaRyn Lay 18:25

Maybe next time, Sarah, maybe next time.

I am so grateful to Sarah and our friends Celeste and Carrie for being the catalysts for such an amazing time in my life. I don't know if you're listening. But if you were part of those gatherings, we would love to hear what stuck with you through all these years. And more importantly, we hope that this has inspired all of you to start asking the women in your life to share their stories, in whatever setting makes sense for you right now. We're going to actually have a list of questions that you can use to spark the conversation in our show notes at ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel. We know that it can feel pretty awkward sometimes to get those things going, so we'll give you a cheat sheet, so that it's easier to make that happen, especially right now when we have a little bit of extra time. You know, long before This Is The Gospel was a storytelling podcast, LDS living produced a series of videos that were also called, This Is The Gospel. They were simple, and they reflected my amateur filmmaking skills at the time. But I still have such a soft spot in my heart for this humble beginning because, even though the music underneath the stories was a little too loud and unbalanced, it was honest and stripped down. People telling their stories to camera, no props, and a funny little stock bumper at the beginning and the end. We limited the time of each of the stories to about two to four minutes to appease the social media attention span. So they're just little bon-bons of faith. And today, I want to share five of those little stories with you from five women who let God lead them and their families through whatever came their way.

Leslie 20:00

My name is Leslie, when my fifth baby was born—my family and I have seven—lived in a two bedroom duplex, we were squeezed in there. And for weeks and months, we tried to find a new situation for our family. We put money down on lots that fell through, we made offers on new homes that fell through, we just couldn't find a new place to live. Nothing seemed to be working out for us. After a while I finally thought maybe I should take this to the Lord and decided to go to the temple. And I went with a faith-filled heart knowing that the Lord would here and hear my plea and answer our prayer. So I went through the session, and nothing happened. I didn't feel anything. It was quiet. And I finished the session, still feeling a little sad because I hadn't felt anything. I really almost felt like the temple ceiling would open in my little address would fly down from the, from the sky and that I would know exactly what was going to become my family situation. And so I went to the celestial room and sat on the couch, feeling a little sad, and I started to weep. And a feeling of warmth and love washed over me as I sat there, feeling so sad. And an assurance and unknowing came. And I heard a voice say, "Leslie, I know you and I love you and all will be well." The voice was familiar to me, and so sweet and I heard it again, "Leslie, I know you and I love you, and all will be well." And I left the temple that night knowing that heaven was aware of my situation, not knowing my new address, but knowing that heaven was aware. The next day was a typical day of a family of seven. My baby was unusually fussy, and I sing him a lullaby before his nap. And I kissed his little cheek and I put that baby down for asleep from which he would never awake. And my experienced in the temple just the day before, it didn't have anything to do with my new address, but everything to do with the sweet assurance from heaven, that I was known to the Father, and that even in my darkest of nights, all would be well. I knew from that experience, that heaven knew my name. And if heaven knows my name, heaven surely knows your name. And this is the gospel to me.

Claire 22:52

My name is Claire, and I'm a good mom. And that's a hard thing for me to say and most days I struggled to remind myself of that This time last year I was in bed in a basement with feeding tubes and IVs. And my husband had just quit school, so that he could take care of me full-time. And even with all of that, I tried to just continue to have faith that everything would work out. That my unborn child would be healthy, that I would be able to function for my husband, and for my baby. And then the day arrived when I gave birth to her, and it was one of the most beautiful days that I can remember. And I thought, "Wow, you know, I have won the good fight. I have fought my hardest and here's the blessings." And I thought that they were just going to come right like pouring. And then two months later, I wound up in the ER, fighting for my life, because I had such strong urges that I needed to end it. That life wasn't worth living that I was a horrible mom. That everyone was better off without me. And from there, I was taken from my family, my husband and my baby girl. To go spend a couple of weeks up in a psychiatric facility, where I learned a lot I learned a lot about myself. And I learned a lot about my testimony. Because I felt utterly alone when I was taken from them and spent that time away from them. But I was reminded that I'm not. I am now on the up and up, I'm progressing and I can't say I'm completely whole yet but I know that because of the sacrifices of Christ and because of the love of my Heavenly Father, I will get there. And that's enough for me. So even when I'm not enough, I know that Christ's love for me is and that's the gospel to me,

Carrie 25:19

I'm Carrie, and I never imagined that the answer to my prayer that morning would be to willingly send my son to prison. I remember saying my morning prayers and pleading with my Heavenly Father, that I wouldn't get the answer that I so desperately needed. That afternoon as we met with our attorney, my husband, my son, and myself, we were facing the decision of whether to go to trial and face a possible 10 year or more sentence or take the plea bargain that had been offered to go to prison for three years. And I knew as we heard that three year prison sentence offered to us that that was a choice. that we needed to take and I knew it from the top of my head to my toes. I knew I had the answer that I had been looking for. And as I thought forward to when they would take him away from us, and they took him bound in bound hand and foot from that courtroom, I wondered how to get past that day, how to move forward. And I think as you hold that new baby in your arms, and you look into their eyes, and you dream of all the places that they'll go, and all the things that you want for them. I know that this is definitely nothing that you ever see for your child. And I wondered, how will I get past this? How will I help him realize his full potential. I want you know that you do get past it and you get past it by praying and by leaning on your Heavenly Father and that he helps you every step of the way. He helped me and he helped my family and he helped my son through those three years. We spent lots of time on the phone. And I had many visits with him there on weekends where we learned more about each other than a lot of moms get to know about their sons and their 20s. We spent lots of time together and I'm grateful for those times. There were times when I wanted to crawl under my bed and and just stay there, and sometimes you do. Sometimes there are days like that, where you have moments where you break down. I wasn't always strong, but you are able to get back up and get out there and and be there for your family and have those good times and find joy in your journey. And I know that this is just a small moment in time, and this is the gospel to me.

Tennissa 27:47

My name is Tennissa. If you worked at the most stress causing events in someone's life you would find among the top: the birth of a child, the death of a parent, the loss of job, and buying and selling of a home. And our family experience these, recently, in the matter of 15 months. Nine months after my daughter was born, and four months after my father in law unexpectedly passed away, my husband got word that he was losing his job. And it just so happened that at that time our house was under contract, because we had decided to move. And the very day that he found out who he was that he was losing his job, was the same day we were making an offer on the perfect home for our family. So needless to say, we didn't make an offer on that perfect home. But we did sell our house, because we felt like Heavenly Father guided us to do that. And after almost six months, we realized why. One of the tender mercies that He gave us was allowing us to live with my mother, who was in need of company after losing her sweetheart. And it was the best possible place for our family to be. And after interviews and searching, and a long, long period of time, our loan officer let us know that if my husband was unemployed much longer, that it would be extremely difficult for us to get a mortgage. And so with lots of prayers and fasting, and begging people for contacts, three months, three days shy of six months what the deadline was, My husband was offered a job. And so as we looked back over that everything felt heavy, and it was it wasn't the easiest thing we've ever been through. But we know by the tiny things along the way that Heavenly Father was aware of us and He provided the direction he needed. And all of the—lined up the timeline and the people and the experiences that we needed to end up where we are. And we've, we've been in our home that we found like three days after my husband got a job for a year and we felt like it was the money pit because so many things have gone wrong. But because of the journey that got us there, and all the tender mercies that Heavenly Father has shown us along the way, we know it's where we're supposed to be and this is the gospel to me.

Emily 30:45

My name is Emily. Several years ago, I found myself sitting in a hospital waiting room, waiting for my two year-old son, Hudson, to be x-rayed for what I thought was just an inner-ear infection. My son, Hudson, was diagnosed with an inoperable glioblastoma, brain tumor. Hudson was given only one year to live. I have such a vivid memory of sitting on Hudson's hospital bed, and his oncologist coming into the room and sitting down and explaining to us that we could do chemotherapy, and radiation, but that the outcome would be the same, that regardless, the tumor would inevitably start to grow and take his life. So she suggested that we just wait it out, that we make him as comfortable as possible over the next year, and that I go home and enjoy the last year with my son. My family and my incredible Bishop met all together together in Hudson's hospital room and gave Hudson a priesthood blessing. And in that priesthood blessing, they told Hudson that Hudson had more faith than all of the people combined in that room. Heavenly Father wanted us to know that we were to do everything medically possible to save his life. So we made the decision to fight the cancer. Two days into radiation, I remember falling to my knees on a hospital, bathroom floor, pleading with the Lord, to lift the burden, and to just coach me to breathe so that I could survive the rest of the day. Sometime after the procedures my sister had purchased a picture of Christ for me. And I held the picture on my lap and Hudson came up on my lap and with his little finger traced to the eyes and the face of the Savior, and looked up at me and said the name of his great protector, Jesus. I knew that Hudson knew his Savior, and that he testified to me as he traced the Savior's face that the Lord really does visit his people during their afflictions. Hudson is 13 years old today. And although he suffers many post radiation side-effects, his life is miraculous. And despite the threat that the tumor may still grow, I know that no matter what happens in the future I can trust the Lord. For the Son of righteousness arises with healing in his links. The same month that Hudson finished chemotherapy, my marriage of 12 years dissolved, and later I faced my own cancer diagnosis. But what I know now, is that the Lord has and will always be the greatest source of comfort, and He will strengthen me to rise triumphantly to through every trial to the very end. And this is the gospel to me.

Sarah 33:58

That was Leslie, Claire, Carrie, Tennissa and Emily, every single one of those stories has something to teach you and me about living a Christ-like life in a totally different way. It reminds me of that moment Sarah talked about during the gatherings when she described how each woman was transformed into a queen and an expert. As we sat at her feet, it didn't matter how much quote, unquote extraordinary was present in the story of her life. The very fact that she was living it with faith and courage made her life worthy to be told. I was recently honored to have one of my essays about being a stepmother published in a compilation of women's writings called, "All Kinds of Mothers." And at first I was excited that something I wrote had made it into a book. And then, as it always does, the doubt crept in as I stared at the company I was keeping on those pages: Chieko Okazaki, Elaine Dalton, Patricia Holland, Emily Bell Freeman, Emily Watts, Sheri Dew—all women that I've admired and learn from over the years through their powerful words and immediately, immediately, I felt inadequate and embarrassed. I mean, I had made a joke about Brad Pitt in my essay. I didn't belong anywhere near those women, and that heavy wave of imposter syndrome, that washed over my excitement. And to be honest, I didn't tell anyone about the book until very recently. It still feels awkward for me to talk about it. But this past week of remembering the gatherings and the bravery of every woman who steps forward to share her story so that other women can feel validated and honored and heard. Well, that memory has come forward to fight back against my shame, a shame that absolutely doesn't come from a loving Heavenly Father. And instead I can focus on the truth. Someone—maybe just one person—someone needs to hear what I have to say in the way only I can say it. Someone needs to hear what you have to say. We need each other. We need each other stories and our thoughts and we need to hear and feel the diversity of our experiences so that we can be united in our efforts to help one another, make it home to Jesus Christ and toward eternity. And if we're focused on that aim, then we don't need to worry about whether what we say is profound, or extraordinary or even beautiful because it will be made beautiful in its purpose. Our stories of faith have inherent power because ultimately they testify of him. So here's my invitation to you: find your story, believe that it belongs in great company, because it does, and then share it with those you love.

That's it for this bonus episode of This Is The Gospel. Thank you for listening. Thanks to the storytellers who graced us with their presence in our living rooms, 15 years ago, and to the storytellers who graced us with their presence on camera. In our This Is The Gospel video series just a few years ago. We are so lucky to have cross paths with you all will have links to the videos, a few pictures of our journal notes. Well, mine not Sarah's because that attic is the worst. And that list of questions to get you started and gathering the stories of women you love and know, in our show notes at ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel. We're currently looking for stories for season three. So if you have a story to share about living the Gospel, please call our pitch line and leave us a pitch. We often find many of our stories from that pitch line and we love to hear how the Gospel has blessed your life. Call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less. This episode was produced by Sarah Monson, Blake and the KaRyn Daly Lay with story editing and producing by so many amazing LDS Living video production interns over the years. It was mixed and mastered by Mix at Six studios and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. You can find past episodes of this podcast and other LDS Living podcasts at ldsliving.com/podcasts. Happy Mother's Day.

Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Stories in this episode: In the early days of his firefighting career, Steve enters a burning home to save a life and is forced to choose between protocol and following the Spirit; Heidi anguishes over her efforts to help create a documentary about Joseph Smith's life until she receives a special witness from God; Alone in the rainforests of Madagascar, Elizabeth finds herself in dire need of heavenly power to call down a miracle.

SHOW NOTES

To see pictures and links for this episode, go to LDSLiving.com/thisisthegospel

TRANSCRIPT

KaRyn 0:01

I have mixed feelings about what I'm about to tell you. I know that we need stories more now than ever, but the time has come for us to take a break here at This Is the Gospel so we can gather and prepare new episodes. We'll be back as soon as we can with season three, filled with totally new themes and new stories on those themes. And in the meantime, we'll still be over on Instagram @thisisthegospel_podcast and on Facebook at This is the Gospel, sharing all of our upcoming themes and pitch line requests, and maybe even a bonus episode or two.

And so, while we won't have weekly episodes, we're not going to stop thinking of ways to help us all tell the stories that matter and lift up our week. Now on with the show.

Welcome to This is the Gospel. An LDS Living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host KaRyn Lay.

I'm feeling pretty inadequate today. I'm sitting in my home office, the day after my very first earthquake, which also happens to be for me the seventh day of an unprecedented self-quarantine due to a global pandemic. And as I've attempted to write something to introduce today's theme, the only thought that keeps coming to me is, "I'm not sure I'm strong enough for these latter days, Heavenly Father. I'm just not sure I can do it." Well, maybe you've wondered the same thing about yourself, or maybe you've been through stranger moments than these and have a sure knowledge of your capacity to make good during hard times.

Well, either way, I think it's still difficult to watch as things shut down all around us, left and right. Doors, literally closing, the doors of restaurants, libraries, businesses, and our homes as we step inside to protect our families, our neighbors, and our communities. And that's probably why today's episode took so long to come together.

When we first launched Season Two in September, "The Heavens are Open" was one of the first episode themes we had slated to produce and air. And week after week, it got pushed back. First, we didn't quite have the right stories, and then we didn't quite have the time to make it what we wanted it to be, and so it kept moving further and further away from the beginning of the season and landed here instead, the very tail end of Season Two, in the middle of a time when I think maybe there's nothing that I need to know more than the fact that God really is present, that He's still here, and He's pouring His power and His glory and His goodness down on us in the midst of these latter days.

He's coming to us in a still small voice, and He's coming to us in the thunder of a general conference broadcast, where despite the fact that we can't attend, we will hear Him in the prophetic council. He's here in the midst of us right now. He is here with us in the trenches of our humanity. The heavens are open if we choose to hear Him, as President Nelson has invited us to do.

So today, finally, we have three stories from people who engaged with heaven here on Earth, in their own unique way. Our first storyteller is, a This is the Gospel favorite, my neighbor Steve, who shares a story from early in his days as a firefighter when a choice to follow the spirit over protocol just may have saved his life. Here's Steve.

Steve 3:31

So we respond to an early morning fire, probably 5:30/6 o'clock in the morning, and we arrive and it's a call of just smoke. So we pull up on the fire apparatus and we get off and you can see that there's some smoke kind of coming out of the air conditioning unit on the top of the roof, but not nothing really crazy at this point.

So we kind of look around, I'm with my captain because I'm a new guy, so I'm following him around, you know, and we kind of look up to the window and the inside of the window is pitch black, full of smoke, and there's always kind of streaks of water that runs down because all that water vaporizes and then kind of condenses on the window, and so you can tell -- so we know there's a fire inside, a pretty significant fire.

Pop the door, breached the door, and huge smoke comes out, right? It's on fire. It's burning and it's hot. So I get the hose line and with my partner and we kind of start making our advance into this very dark structure. One of the first things I learned that becoming a new firefighter is not like TV. The real fires, structure fires, when the fire is contained inside of a box, a house, are black, heavy, oppressive smoke, you cannot see, and it's terribly hot.

Some of those things that we can't simulate in training is the oppressive heat and just the the density of the smoke. I mean, you literally cannot see your hand in front your face. So I'm kind of bumping around in you know, inside dragging the hose on, and we're trying to find a fire. We can't find it. We can hear it cracking. The heat is oppressive. So we know we're getting close, and there's dense, heavy smoke.

You know, we're yelling, "Is anyone in here? Is anyone here?" You know, "We're looking for people," and then somehow I kind of get a little bit separated from my partner and it's getting really hot now and I'm just pushing a little bit farther, a little bit farther, a little bit farther, right, the statement is, "We will risk our lives a lot in a calculated manner to save a savable life. We will not risk our lives at all, to save that which they're already lost or has no value."

So I'm in that calculated manner "Save a saveable life." We think someone's inside here. I can notice very distinctly, I can feel through my gloves, the change in kind of carpet to linoleum, so I know I'm in a kitchen, and now it's really hot in the kitchen, so the fire is probably around here somewhere, and I'm only about half a meter inside. And it's one of those rare times in my life and that I hear in my mind, "Stephen, get off the floor."

To my shame, I kind of ignore it the first time because I'm looking for someone, right? So I push a little bit, a little bit farther into the room.

"Steven, get off the floor and move out of the kitchen."

"Okay," so I started backing up. I'm kind of pulling the hose line back, and literally the second I move off that linoleum floor and back into the carpet, the entire floor caves in. Suddenly, you can see everything. There's fire to to the ceiling, fire to the wall. My partner, I hear him call a mayday and he bails out of the window. And now I am, I'm in here and I've lost the hose line.

So I don't know where I am. So I'm trying to back up, it's hot. I see a bunch of orange in front of me. And I'm starting to back out and you can hear the radio traffic is escalating on the outside. And I don't know how long I was in there, but I'm trying to bump my way back to the front room through the smoke, and I think I'm just about to the door and this big hand comes in, grabs me by the scruff of the neck, my turnout gear, pulls me out of the front door and kind of stands me up and it's this big, classic, if you were to make a character of any firefighter, it would be this guy. Big mustache, like 6 foot 2,300 pounds, big dude stands me right up on my feet and says, "Hey, are you okay?" and my turnout gear is all smokey and burned and I "Yes, thank you," you know, that kind of thing.

And I get out, and then we fight the fire from the exterior, we can't find anyone inside at the time. But it was one of those rare, rare occurrences in my life where somebody cared about me and told me to do something and move, and I moved. Given my experience, I'm pretty sure I would not have survived that, frankly. But I'm so grateful, right, for that experience, and for that loving Heavenly Father and that still small voice. It wasn't loud in the chaos or the fire, wearing my turnout gear, I'm all encapsulated, and it was that still small voice that called me by name and told me to move.

Since that time, I have resolved to do the best I can to listen. Now clearly there have been times when I can't tell what it is, if it's just an impression, if it's... who knows? Who cares, right? Doesn't matter. And I've done what I felt like I should have done or what I felt like I was told to do and there was no miraculous, no seminal moment in my life, but there have been other times when I have listened and things have changed. I hope I'm always worthy enough to have that connection.

KaRyn 8:48

That was Steve. If you haven't heard Steve's season one story from our "To the Rescue" episode, it's definitely worth revisiting. What I appreciate about the story and about Steve is that acknowledgement, that moments like these, moments of pure and clear revelation, are rare in his life. But when they do happen, if he chooses to listen, things change.

And there's something really interesting about the practice of listening that Steve mentioned at the end of his story. You know, sometimes we may have an impression, a thought, or a feeling, and maybe we're unsure of its origin. "Was that the still small voice? Or was it last night's very bad decision to go to Taco Bell?" It's not always easy to discern.

But if we practice moving forward with confidence, as long as the impression is moving us towards discipleship and Christ, we will make ourselves ready to receive and obey when the pure heavenly messages reveal themselves through revelation. Our next story comes from writer and historian Heidi who received a special witness from God through a story from the Prophet Joseph's life.

Here's Heidi.

Heidi 9:56

I was walking in the Salt Lake City Cemetery. I like to walk, and I love walking into the cemetery because there are all of these grave sites and you look at the names and the dates and you recognize that in each one of those graves is someone who has a host of stories you wish you knew. Now -- I'm a writer and a historian, and so that's very intriguing to me.

So as I walk along, I'm often looking at that. Well this particular day, I was walking along in the cemetery, and I had just finished a very major project that had taken me almost two and a half, three years, and it was about the Prophet Joseph Smith. I was writing a documentary for PBS. It wasn't for the church. It was for people that didn't know Joseph. It was for people, it had to be what we called "bilingual." It had to speak to them and to members of the Church, but mostly to people who could be a little bit angry.

Well, I'm walking along, and I realized that my hands no longer have an opportunity to do anything to that documentary. It's gone off to PBS to be signed off, and to be put up. And I was so sad. I was so sad that as I'm walking along, there are tears running down my face. And I could just imagine that the people who are mowing the grass were looking over at this lady who's walking and she's weeping, and that just doesn't seem to be right.

But I was crying because I felt like I had failed. I wrote 47 versions of that documentary trying to get it right. What I wanted to have happen in people's lives because of the film, because of the book that would be out there as well, because of my understanding of Joseph Smith, I didn't want them to just place him in history. I didn't want them to just say, you know, "He did a lot of interesting things." I wanted them to have the experience of having the spirit say to them, "This is a prophet of God."

I wanted them to be able to reach beyond everyday life, that linear plane we live on, that date, time, and place, I wanted them to reach beyond that, and have a spiritual experience that can only be administered from the heavens. I love Brigham Young's statement. I felt like shouting "hallelujah" to think I ever knew the Prophet Joseph Smith. I wanted people to feel that because I felt that. I felt like I knew him and I knew him before I came here. I felt like I had the responsibility to tell the story of the Prophet Joseph Smith in such a way that people would be drawn to him who otherwise had no interest or were even negative about his life in his teachings.

That I had the opportunity to tell how great he was and how significant he was, not just in the history of the United States or religion as it was growing, but in the history of the world. And I had this grand view, and I didn't feel like I had gotten the documentary to that place. I didn't feel like I had just nailed it. You know how it is sometimes when you feel like, "Ah I got it!" and in this case, there were pieces that as hard as I had tried, I hadn't pulled it together. And so now here I am 47 versions later. I just felt this, "wait," that this is Joseph Smith we're talking about, and so I'm walking along, and I started talking right out loud to my Father in Heaven.

I can remember saying to him, "I tried so hard. I can't remember anything being as difficult as this was." I'm telling the Lord about how I feel, and He knows because I was so prayerful while I did this. I was always talking to Him about, "I just don't know how to handle this, and I don't know how to handle that." And I would like to say that, you know, all of a sudden it would just appear on my screen, the Lord would say, "Oh, well, here's what you do with that," never happened. I just had to slog my way through it, and that's the way it is for almost everybody.

These things don't just drop down from the sky, and so I'm telling him about how Heidi feels now. I'm putting Heidi back in the picture because Heidi's given two and a half years of her life, lost 28 pounds, worked herself to the bone, and but it didn't matter. None of that mattered. What mattered was that I did my part for Joseph Smith.

So I'm walking along and the tears are running down my face and I'm just saying, you know, "I wanted this and I wanted that," kind of some of the things I've talked about. And then all of a sudden this sense of peace came over me, and I remember stopping. I didn't keep walking. I remember stopping and I know right where I was, I was on the hill right below where John Taylor is buried.

And I stopped there, and the thought came into my mind, and I'm one of those people the Lord communicates to in words, I don't get those burnings and the tingling's and I don't get those. I'm a word person, so I think He knows that and He says, "Oh I'll just talk to her and she'll listen." But words came into my mind, and the words were, "Heidi, Joseph had to give the endowment in the red brick store. It wasn't the way he wanted it, but it worked."

Now, let me flashback for a minute to the second story of the red brick store. Joseph Smith, in 1840, had stood up before all of the saints who had gathered from many of them from the British Isles and eastern United States, and he said to them, "We need the temple more than anything else." And then he said, "if I can just live to see the temple completed, I'll say, 'Lord, it is enough. Let thy servant depart in peace.'"

He gets down the road a couple of years, and it's 1842. This is an important date for Joseph Smith because the temple is starting to rise up on the hillside. It's only to ground level if that, but they are beginning to see that though they're living in tents and in caves on the mountain side, they're beginning to see the significance of this temple that is going to tower over the Mississippi River on this bend, and the people are excited about that. They're giving everything they have.

And Joseph is giving everything he has, contemplating that when this temple is completed, he gets to essentially complete his mission, that he has done the Book of Mormon and he's received priesthood power, and he's brought the saints gathered to here they are, they've started doing baptisms for the dead, and the temple is going to be the culmination of their religious experience.

Okay, so Joseph knows all of this. It's in his head, and he's just wanting the Lord to let him just see it through to the end. And then 1842, he knows that he's not going to be there when the temple is completed. He sees how slowly it's going, and he recognizes, "I'm not going to be here." And so then he has to make the decision. "What do I do? Well, I've got to give the endowment," and he knows what it is, "I got to give the endowment in such a way and to enough people that it can be carried on when I'm gone and when the temple is completed."

He takes them into the second story of the red brick store, nine men to the red brick store, it takes all day, and he gives them their endowment. I just sometimes think about how Joseph Smith must have felt. Here's Joseph watching this last piece, this culminating piece of the restoration slipway, he doesn't get to be there for it, after everything that he's given and everything that he's done.

That experience in the red brick store came back to my mind in the cemetery. It was like the heavens had opened and the light came down, and I looked around, wondering if anyone else had heard what I'd heard because it was so pronounced, and it made so much sense to me because it kind of put some closure to Joseph's life for me, but more than that, I felt connected to him in a personal way.

I understand now, that you put everything forward and the Lord knew that, and He said, "It wasn't the way he wanted it, and this isn't the way you wanted it, but it worked for Joseph." And then I thought to myself, "It will work." And it was one of those times where the heavens opened, and where the Lord kind of brought the whole thing together for me, not for anyone else. Now, it was just for me.

And I have reflected back on that so many times of when things haven't come together just the way I wanted for this or for that, I just say to myself, "Heidi, Joseph had to give the endowment in the red brick store. It wasn't the way he wanted it, but it worked. It worked." And I will say to myself over and over again, "This will work."

I don't, I don't think we allow Him to be that much a part of our lives sometimes. I think we want reinforcement from a lot of other places, and that was the only reinforcement that really mattered because it was so tied to what I've been doing, and it moved me legions forward.

I think sometimes we expect the heavens to open when we ask for it, and we expect the heavens to open with the answer that we're asking for. And what I found so engaging in my connection to the heavens, is that the Lord came to me with something I didn't expect, but it was far more, it was far broader and far more enveloping for me because He knew what I needed.

I think I came to the end of this project with a perspective because I had come to know Joseph Smith in a way that I prize not just my testimony of him and his work, but my witness of his goodness, all the way to his heart and his soul. I learned from him that it was not easy, not ever, to move the work forward, the restoration, it was not something that just the heavens opened and all the answers were there, he had to do a lot of legwork in order for things to get done. It isn't about the work per se. I learned from him that it's about the effort and the willingness to submit to the Lord.

KaRyn 22:15

That was Heidi Swinton. Heidi is the award-winning writer of the PBS documentary "American Prophet: The Story of Joseph Smith," which was recently reissued as part of the bicentennial celebration of the first vision. And aside from her delightful storytelling abilities, Heidi holds a special place in my heart because it was during a deep and meaningful airplane conversation with her four years ago that I first jotted down the phrase "This is the Gospel" in my journal.

Her unique knowledge of the Prophet Joseph Smith and her love and respect for him is absolutely inspiring to me. Sometimes he feels really far away and when I talked to Heidi, somehow he becomes real. And isn't it so cool that our God is an efficient God, He parts the heaven for Joseph in 1842, and then uses that experience to pour down his love and grace to Heidi in the 20th century.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, and I'll just keep saying it, our stories may just be the instrument that God chooses to use when he opens the heavens to our posterity generations from now. So write it down, write it down now so that it can do some good in the future. Our final story today comes from Elizabeth, who needed a miracle and got it when she discovered just how to ask for it.

Here's Elizabeth.

Elizabeth 23:46

I was in this room with just a bed with a mosquito net and a little nightstand. I took off my boots and my sock and my foot was horribly infected.

It was red, it was swollen, and I was really scared about how I was going to get out of there because I was three days into a seven-day hike in Madagascar and there were no hospitals.

The whole reason I was there was because when I was a kid, I saw the show on the Discovery Channel about Madagascar, and how the forests were all being cut down and that lemurs only live there, and they were all endangered because of all this deforestation. And so my plan when I was a kid was to win the lottery, which I've played the lottery, but I was going to win a million dollars and buy Madagascar, and then everybody had to leave unless they agreed to not cut down the forests.

So I've always loved wildlife, and I became a park ranger when I grew up. And I was working at Denali National Park in Alaska, and I had two months off every winter, so I would go someplace warm and sunny. I've been to Africa a bunch of times, to South Africa, Botswana, Namibia. In 2011, I was in Uganda, worked at a clinic for five weeks and then climbed Kilimanjaro.

And then in 2013, I finally got to go to Madagascar. And I had three things that I wanted to do when I was there. I wanted to see a fossa. The fossa is the largest predator of lemurs in Madagascar, and I read that the best place to see him was Kirindy National Forest Park, so I went there. And then I wanted to do some volunteer work, so I found a place to volunteer for two weeks with nutrition for kids under age four.

And then I wanted to hike in Masoala national park on the Masoala peninsula. So when you hike in the national parks in Madagascar, it's required that you hire a guide. So I flew into Maroantsetra and I went to the park office to arrange the hike, and the only guide they had that spoke English was Claudio, so I hired him.

Because it was really hot and humid there, I didn't want to carry my own backpack. So I hired a porter. So the porters, they carry your backpack, they set up the tents, they cook the food, they even cooked lunch, they cooked all three meals. They didn't let me do anything actually, they were really good. And my backpack was kind of heavy, it had everything for six weeks in there, and we still needed food, so I hired another porter.

So I had Gerard, who was an older guy, and Jovan and Claudio. Gerard and Jovan didn't speak any English, there's just Claudio. And then the trail was seven days long. We started on a pirogue, which is a little canoe that you can either paddle or push with a pole.

After we got off the pirogue, we started hiking, and that was the one place where like the trail was kind of wide, and there were villagers, people living there and there was fruit trees, mango trees, and lychee trees and people were fishing and they had their fish laying out in the sun to dry, and there was a lot of shade on the trail because of all the big trees.

So on the first night, we stayed in a hotel which had one one room and there was a shed out back with a barrel of water and a little cup for a shower. And on my way to the shower, after I had taken off my boots, I noticed that I had this big blister in between my big toe and the bottom of my foot. Really strange place for blister, I've never gotten one there before.

And I wasn't worried about it, I've gotten so many blisters. It seems like every hike that I go on, I get blisters all over my feet, and it's just kind of an inconvenience, but I'm used to it. And I've never had a, you know, a serious problem, it's just been painful.

During the night, my blister kind of filled up with fluid, and so when I started that second day, it almost immediately popped and Claudio told me there'd be river crossings, so I was wearing my sandals that second day. And there were river crossings, but they're also like the trail was flooded because we were walking between rice paddies, and it was really dirty water because there were cows everywhere and the rivers weren't particularly clean either.

And so the trail was sometimes up to my shin in water and the river crossings were, you know, mid-thigh, so it was a lot of splashing through water that second day. And at the end of the second day, I thought, "well, I gotta clean this blister as best as I can." So I had some hand sanitizer and I kind of, you know, washed it off with that, but I did find a leech in the broken blister and I pulled that thing out. So I washed it as best as I could and didn't think much of it because it's just a blister.

So on the third day, I wore my boots again and I was just hiking along like normal and around the afternoon, my foot started to get pretty sore, and I loosened the laces because I just thought, "Well, maybe I just tied my boot too tight today." But by the end of the day, as we were getting into the village where we're going to spend the night, I was trying really hard not to limp because my foot was so tender just to walk on and I just assumed that I had a lot more blisters.

But then when I got to my room and took my boot off and my sock off, I saw that my foot was red, and it was swollen. I couldn't even see my ankle bone. My little toes were like little red sausages, and my foot was hot to the touch, and it was infected. And I didn't know how I was gonna walk the next day because it hurt so bad.

So I didn't know how I was gonna get out of there, I didn't think that I was going to be able to walk the next day. And I was so freaked out that I didn't, I was afraid to tell Claudio, and there was nobody else that spoke English, and there were no clinics, there were no hospitals. There wasn't even electricity, there was no running water. I felt like I was in the middle of nowhere, and I was really stressed out. I didn't know if the infection was gonna get worse in the next day. I'm 5 foot 10 and I was taller than most of the people I met there and I thought, "they can't carry me out. We're three days in, four days the next way," you know, like, "What am I gonna do?"

And I was just in this little room with there's little stick walls, the sticks close together, and you could see people moving around outside, like through the gaps in the sticks. And there's this lonely dark room with just my little kerosene lamp, and I felt so alone because I was feeling really far from anything I knew, and just all by myself out there in Madagascar, in the middle of nowhere, and I really, I really just wanted a priesthood blessing, and I wanted to find a member of the Church to give me a blessing, but there were no churches out there, there were no members of the Church.

I had my little iPod touch with me and I hadn't used it because there's no way to charge it, but I knew I had conference talks on there. So I turned it on, and I had October 2012 conference talks on there. I had one by Elder Holland, about the first commandment, and he talks about the apostles and how they must have felt after Jesus was crucified and was resurrected and then he left, and they say, "Well, what do we do now?" And Peter says, "Well, I guess we just go back to fishing."

And then he talks about, you know, he paraphrases Jesus saying to them, "Shouldn't this have, you know, being with me for three years, shouldn't it have changed you?" And I thought about how I've been changed by going to the temple and making my covenants there.

I just, you know, sitting there in that dark room with just Elder Holland, in that conference talk, it made me realize that I wasn't alone and that I could ask for the power to be healed, I could pray. So I did, I knelt down on the floor outside the mosquito netting, and I said a prayer and I said, "Heavenly Father, I know you can heal my foot. Even if you choose not to, I know you won't leave me here. You haven't abandoned me, something will work out."

And I knew that because I try to keep my covenants, I had this power I could ask for; to help me. And the best part was that I got done with that prayer and I felt peaceful. I wasn't worried about it. I knew something would work out. And I didn't feel so alone anymore.

After that prayer, I went to sleep. I was able to get to sleep, and I woke up in the morning and my foot was back to normal size, and it wasn't hot anymore, it wasn't red. It was still a little sore, but it was healed. And my foot was better. It was miraculous. The other blisters I had didn't bother me for the rest of the hike. I was able to finish the hike. I had a wonderful time.

I didn't even get any more leeches. It was just a fantastic experience, and I am so thankful that I could have that reassurance that I knew that I had that power to draw on and that I wasn't alone, that Heavenly Father wouldn't leave me and that I could ask for his help.

KaRyn 33:36

That was Elizabeth. I adore the simple story of healing for so many reasons. but I think my favorite part is this. Yes, waking up to a healed foot overnight is miraculous, but I think the real miracle in a rain forest in Madagascar thousands and thousands of miles from home, was actually her revelation about the Priesthood of God. That it's here, on the Earth right now because of the restoration of the gospel in this dispensation, and as a faithful covenant keeping Daughter of God, she is never without access to its power, whether she's home or abroad.

She said she feels grateful to be able to draw on that power. You know, this is a really interesting phrase that we sometimes use when we talk about the priesthood. To draw on something or to draw down something, means that we access a thing that is useful or precious that we've held in reserve. It's used in reference to money or oil or gas or water.

There's a sense that when we draw on reserves, they diminish and I know that that's true about my canned peaches, and that's why I hold on to them with a fist of iron, but you know, the Priesthood Power of God is never diminished when we call it down. And the Prophet Joseph Smith promised us that it will, quote, "Never be taken from the Earth while mortality endures, for there will always be need for temporal direction, and the performance of ordinances," end quote.

And you know what that means to me? That while everything else seems like it is closing around us, the heavens will never be closed to us as long as we're here trudging through dank waters on African islands with our broken bodies. That we can be sure of.

You know, we chose the theme for this episode after reading Sister Wendy Nelson's book with the same title, and as the wife of our Prophet, President Nelson, she has a courtside seat to the continuing revelation and heavenly guidance that defines his role of Prophet, Seer, and Revelator for the Church.

One of my favorite moments in the book was when Sister Nelson shared this, she said, quote, "Recently my husband said to me, 'Wendy, the Lord is just as eager to give revelation to you as He is to give it to me,'" end quote. I think it's easy to forget that we're entitled. By virtue of our divine nature as Daughters and Sons of God, that we're entitled to call down the heavens and all that that entails.

Prophets or people with weighty jobs in the Church do not get a more direct line to the heavens just because of the work they do. They may receive different kinds of information or have a different scope to that connection, but our God is no respecter of persons. And while the Prophet has a special calling and specific authority to receive revelation for the Church as a whole, he is no more entitled to the gifts of such connection than you or me.

And so how do we do it? In these absolutely wild and crazy times when we might need to draw upon the endless reserves of heavenly power more than ever? How do we move with confidence when the voice calls us by name to get off the floor in our smoke filled spaces, or open the door to the piece of heaven when we're not sure we've done enough?

How do we call down healing and hope in the jungles of loneliness? Well, we start with the Savior. We always start with the Savior. Sister Nelson wrote this quote, "As we truly focus on the Savior, as we truly remember Him and His infinite Atonement, as day after day we think of Him more and more, the heavens will open. Our fears and doubts will decrease. Some will even flee! We will be led along. We will know what to do, step by step. We will learn how to draw upon the power available to us because the Savior atoned for us. We will learn how to access His cleansing, healing, redemptive, strengthening power. And we will experience the freedom to be our true selves as we unyoke ourselves from the world and instead yoke ourselves to the Savior," end quote.

So for those of you, who like me, struggle with feeling just a little bit inadequately matched to the times ahead, what we have to remember is that we're already here. We're here, and we're already made adequate through Christ, through our best efforts and his grace and mercy.

Maybe we're showing up imperfectly and in pieces right now, and maybe we could choose to be a little bit more intentional in those efforts. I know I could. But if we're trying, then we're exactly where we should be, doing exactly what we should be doing, the heavens do see us and they do know us, and they are blessing us as we call upon them and draw down their powers.

That's it for this episode of This is the Gospel. Thank you to our storytellers, firefighter Steve, historian Heidi S. Swinton and adventurer Elizabeth. We'll have links to Heidi's documentary as well as Sister Nelson's beautiful book "The Heavens Are Open," and other good stuff including a transcript of this episode in the show notes at LDSLiving.com/ThisistheGospel.

All of the stories on this podcast are true and accurate as affirmed by our storytellers. We love to hear all the ways that this type of storytelling strengthens your faith in God and love for his children. If you have a minute to leave us a review, and a rating, wherever you listen to your podcast, please do. We've got plenty of time, I know you're sitting in your house wondering what to do. Especially during this hiatus, all the good words help us to keep working hard and know more of the kinds of stories and themes that are most meaningful to you. And, added bonus if you didn't already know, every single review helps us to show up in the search for more people when they're looking for something good to listen to.

If you have a story to share about Living the Gospel, please call our pitch line, leave us a pitch. We often find many of our stories including Elizabeth's story today from the pitch line, and we love to hear how the Gospel has blessed your life. And the pitch line is very much open during this social distancing, so call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less.

This episode was produced by me, KaRyn Lay, with story editing and producing by Jasmine Mullen, Katie Lambert, Erika Free, and Danielle Wagner. It was scored, mixed, and mastered by Mix at Six Studios. That is such a tongue twister. Our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. You can find past episodes of this podcast and other LDS Living podcasts at LDSLiving.com/podcasts. Stay healthy, catch up on old episodes, and we'll see you soon.

Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

As we all adjust our routines in an effort to flatten the curve of the novel coronavirus there is still so much good we can see and do in the world. KaRyn shares a story of a time when her already terrible driving record hit an all-time low (pun intended) and the undeserved kindness of a stranger changed everything.

SHOW NOTES:

To view shownotes for this episode, go to LDSLiving.com/thisisthegospel

TRANSCRIPT:

KaRyn Lay 0:00 Hey friends, maybe you're like us. You're trying to socially distance right now so you can help keep the novel coronavirus at bay in your community. And if that's what's happening for you, Well done, well done. But we wanted to make sure you know that if you get lonely or you get bored, or you're just looking for something uplifting, we're still here. We're here with you virtually. And you can come find us on Instagram and Facebook @thisisthegospel_podcast. You'll find a community of story lovers there just like you. And we're always thinking about fun ways that we can stay connected during the week and especially during this interesting time. We want to help you use stories to keep your home-centered church-supported efforts engaged so come find us on Instagram and Facebook where we can uplift each other.

Welcome to THIS IS THE GOSPEL, an LDS Living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host KaRyn Lay.

Well, this has been a wild week in our little corner of the U.S. You're probably feeling it too, with temple closures, the suspension of church services for the next few weeks and other adjustments to our lives and routines in all of our efforts to practice social distancing. I know. I know. My friends in Asia and parts of Europe have been at this much longer than we have. And believe me, I've been watching and learning from you. All the events of the last few weeks have me thinking pretty acutely about the ways that we take care of one another in our moments of deep vulnerability. I mean, I'm not sick right now and, and I still stand six feet away from everyone and wash my hands like a maniac while I'm singing my ABCs because I know that I could inadvertently be the cause of someone else's suffering. And if I unknowingly pass something off to an elderly neighbor or a friend with a compromised immune system, it will make me feel terrible. And I'm also really aware of the privilege that I have that allows me to work from home and to have more time Toilet paper than I currently need. I promise, I promise I am not hoarding it. But I did go to Costco a week before things got nuts. So, I'm well stocked. Come on over if you need a roll, I'm serious.

After I got over the shock of going to the grocery store and finding nothing on my list, I started to wonder just how the best parts of us as a community, a global community are going to shine during these uncertain times. And I felt a deep twinge of hope run through me. I've been following the Instagram account tiny kindnesses for weeks now and every day I read the stories, small, little stories about the way that we show up for one another in those critical moments when isolation or desperation could make us feel separated. We know how to do this. We have been preparing for this moment spiritually, much longer than most of us have physically. Well, at least me and that's the conclusion I have to draw from the swarming on grocery stores over the last two days. So today in celebration of all that is good in us. I'm sharing a tiny story of my own when I experienced a kindness from an absolute stranger in an unexpected way.

Now, I don't want you to think terribly less of me, but I've never been a particularly awesome driver. I mean, I'm fine. It's fine. In fact, it's been almost 10 years with no incidents. But when I'm overly stressed about something or someone, I really should probably take an Uber. I once made a timeline of my many accidents for a friend who needed to know that she wasn't the only one with a marred driving record, and I was surprised at the amount of collisions that I remembered. There was the time I backed into a melon truck at the U-pick-it farm, or the time I forgot the car was behind me in the driveway, or that embarrassing time that I rear ended someone because of a spider on my dashboard. And then I had to go to court to tell a judge and an entire courtroom the story. They laughed, and I still had to pay the court fees. Luckily, most of the accidents I've been involved in have not hurt anyone. But that wasn't true the day that I turned a corner without really looking.

When I was 28, I did something totally terrifying. I fell in love and I flew to Australia to see if marriage was in the cards for me with my internet boyfriend. I came back to the United States three weeks later, knowing that it wasn't going to happen. The breakup was devastating. I struggled for weeks to get my head back in the game, I was having a really hard time at work. I was having a really hard time at Church. I was having just a really hard time period. And it was like everything in my life was underwater, and I could never come up for air. Nothing felt easy, or even doable, to be honest. So it really shouldn't have surprised me when about a week after I got home, I got a flat tire on my way to work. It was the last straw...I'm telling you. It was the final proof that I needed that life was going to be nothing but sorrow and difficulty from here on out. I was out of money because it turns out that flying to a foreign country to see your internet boyfriend is not cheap, and I was out of hope. And just to put salt in my wounds, when I got to the tire shop to get that tire replaced, they told me that I would have to have all four tires replaced, not just the one with the flat. I don't even remember how I made that work financially, but by the time I left, Les Schwab Tires with four gleaming new wheels..I, I was spent and I was worried and I didn't have any room in my brain for driving. And that's when everything got worse.

Just as I turned the right corner onto the main street from the tire shop, a kid on a bike flew into crosswalk from seemingly nowhere, and I hit him. With my car. I hit a child with my car. He fell off his bike and I screeched to a stop and immediately ran out to see if he was okay. And of course I apologized 400 times. It seemed like he was in his early teens, maybe he was like 12 or 13. And he said he was fine, and he could walk. His bike was clearly damaged, but I didn't know what to do. Honestly, I was so distraught, and I'm sure that I probably should have called the paramedics or the police or someone, but I didn't. I couldn't really think clearly in that moment. So, I just gave him my cell phone number on a crumpled piece of paper from my glove compartment and told him to call me when he got home, or have his mother call me when he got home. I very carefully drove back to my office. I mean, I was devastated. What a horrible thing to have happen.

Well, a little bit later, his mom called me and told me that he was totally okay physically, and they weren't taking him to the urgent care anything and they weren't even planning to make an insurance claim. But they did think that it was only fair that I pay for the damages to his bike - to get his bike fixed. So, I agreed that I would meet them at the bike shop so that I could pay the bill. And when I walked into that shop, I took one look at his mom, and it hit me. It hit me really hard. I could have killed her child. I could have killed him. And that's when I lost it. The tears started and they would not stop. I I think she probably thought I was a maniac - like what is wrong with this woman? - but I'd like to say that the tears were for the accident and all the trouble that I'd cause for her family. But in reality, my tears were for everything I'd lost for that hope that hope of a future that was never going to happen. And for the present that seemed so difficult, so painful, and unbearably hard. I was broken. And as much as I wanted to hide it, my heart was just bare,laid out bare and exploding right there, right there in front of these people in a stupid bike shop.

So I awkwardly paid for the fixes to his bike, it actually looked like it was brand new, which was really great. And I thought to myself, "I have bought a lot of tires today, like a lot of tires." And then I headed back to my office. About an hour after I got back, the front desk receptionist called my office and told me that I had a visitor. But you can only imagine my shock when I got downstairs to the front desk and I saw the boy that I'd hit with my car, standing in the lobby. He had his new fixed bike with him and a helmet, which was a new accessory that I suspect was the result of ... me. And he kind of looked at me weirdly and sheepishly held something out to me. And as I held my hand out to receive it, he said, "This is from my mom. She just wanted you to know that she doesn't hate you. And she thought you might like this." It was a $25 gift card to Subway, you know, to get a couple of footlong sandwiches. We still joke about that, that I might seriously be the only person to have ever been rewarded in sandwiches for nearly maiming a child with my car. But in all seriousness, the lesson of that subway gift card wasn't lost on me. And something in me shifted in that moment. I didn't deserve it. I didn't deserve that stranger's kindness. I was just some lady who could have ruined her life, like, in a really big way. I didn't deserve her mercy or her empathy, or her willingness to show forgiveness. But she gave me those gifts with a generous heart and a gift card. And because of that, I believe that I was healed a little bit more than I had been at the start of the day. There was a lot more to get whole again. And I would actually spend the next two years in Korea working on that. But that's simple kindness marked the twist in the dark tunnel. And I could finally see some light - just a little pinprick - just a little pinprick of light shining through. I don't remember that woman's name. That was literally the last time I ever saw her or her bike riding son. But her kindness at a time when I should have been the one giving, not receiving has stuck with me. It's made me a more aware driver. And it has continued to be an invitation throughout my life to see people instead of circumstances and to reach out even if it's awkward. And isn't that the blessing of ministering? That opportunity to show up for one another with the Subway gift card, or the phone call, or the text message, even when we don't know the right thing to say. To give compassion, even when we're not so sure that the person receiving it really fully deserves it.

You know, right now we're all watching as things fan out across the globe, wildfires, viruses, hateful rhetoric, divisiveness, fear. All of these things, whether natural or manmade, start small and work their way through our communities. glomming on to whatever is most vulnerable in their path. They grow and they grow and whatever is not fortified will fall. This feels devastating to our hearts sometimes, especially when we feel powerless to protect the weak and the weakest among us. If you watch the news at all lately, you can't avoid the word, "pandemic." It's defined as an outbreak of a disease that affects large geographic areas. But maybe you didn't know that the word "pandemic" comes from the Greek "pan-", meaning, "all" and, "-demos" meaning, "people." And that up until the 19th century, which is the 1800s. It wasn't really used as a noun by itself at all. It was used as an adjective to describe things that affect all people everywhere. And what that means to me is that there are other things that can be pandemic, like compassion, empathy, love, service, forgiveness, hope in Christ, and kindness. These things also start small and they also have exponential impact. And when we combine these acts of discipleship with the power of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, they can radiate beyond borders and generations and time, a pandemic goodness. So, over the next few weeks, as we all lean into our civic duty to protect our communities, I hope we'll also watch for opportunities to lean into our Christian duty to spread the Good News and the good works, to bring light where there's darkness - to minister. We can start small, tiny even. And I know that our efforts will be magnified.

That's it for this episode of THIS IS THE GOSPEL. Thank you for all the goodness that you're already bringing into the world and for sharing it far and wide. We'll have a transcript of this episode in our show notes at LDS living.com/this is the gospel. If you're sequestered and looking for a meaningful activity to pass the time... Well, I've got an idea for you. How about practicing your personal or family storytelling? Pick a theme and ask your friends or family members to take turns telling their own stories around that theme. You can even do this virtually back and forth on Google Hangouts or through text messages. You might be surprised at what you learn about one another and your faith.

We love to hear all the ways that this type of storytelling strengthens your faith in God and love for His children. If you have just a minute to leave us a review and a rating on iTunes, that's another way that you can share the good stuff. Every review that you leave helps us to show up in the search for more people who are looking for something to brighten their day.

If you have a story to share about living the Gospel of Jesus Christ, please call our pitch line. We find so many of our stories from this pitch line. And as we prepare for season three, we would love to hear how the gospel has blessed your life. Call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less.

This episode was produced by me KaRyn Lay. It was scored, mixed, and mastered by mix at six studios. Our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. You can find past episodes of this podcast to keep you busy while you're at home, and other LDS living podcast at LDSliving.com/podcasts. Stay healthy, stay calm and wash your hands!

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Stories in this episode: Bullied most of her life, Julie discovers that the autism that made her different is actually the exact thing that makes her gifted at family history work; A comic book heroine helps Sarah find her own superpowers when it comes to connecting with others; Kurt struggles with the weight of his calling as a bishop until the memory of a red superhero cape reminds him of his true desire to help others.

SHOWNOTES

To see pictures of our storytellers and get a look at Sarah's DATING GIRL comic, go to ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

Follow us on instagram @thisisthegospel_podcast and facebook to find upcoming themes and to learn more about our team.

TRANSCRIPT

KaRyn 0:03

Welcome to This is the Gospel, an LDS Living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host, KaRyn Lay.

I can't exactly remember when I first heard the phrase "double-edged sword." It was probably in Mrs. McAfee's eighth grade English class, or maybe Ms. Turse's ninth grade English class. Well, whichever well named English teacher at Rockland Junior High taught it to me, I have never forgotten it. Because a double-edged sword basically describes life.

If your junior high teacher never taught you that phrase, let me explain. A double-edged sword is anything that has the potential to have both positive and negative consequences in our lives. It's that thing that is both a strength and a weakness all at the same time. Need a concrete example? Okay, let's talk about perfectionism. It's the standard answer to the question, "What's your greatest weakness?" in a job interview because it's a strength disguised as a weakness. Or is it a weakness disguised as a strength? Trick question. It's both. And I know this because a desire to get things right is my constant companion, and it spurs me forward in so many cool ways in my life. But it's also the thing that when left unchecked leads to anxiety and deep paralysis. See? A positive and a negative, all in one, a double-edged sword.

I suspect that if we dig deep, it won't take long for each of us to recognize this pattern of strength and weakness coexisting in ourselves. It's what makes us both human and heroic. And today, we'll hear stories from three people who discovered exactly what kind of superpowers were waiting at the other end of their weakness. Our first storyteller is Julie who learned that her greatest challenge in life could be transformed when she focused her efforts in service.

Here's Julie:

Julie 1:54

When my daughter was four years old she was diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum, and when I was reading through the symptoms of it, I realized that most of the symptoms applied to me as well.

I was very socially awkward as a kid, and I was often bullied for it. I didn't understand social cues or body language very well, and I would come off as rude because I would interrupt people and I would kind of be silly in a way that they just didn't understand. So it was hard to make friends.

I was really fascinated with names and dates and I didn't understand why. I come from a very big family and I would make lists of everybody's full names and their birth dates and how old they would turn that year, and I didn't understand why I was driven to do this and I didn't want anybody else to see it because they wouldn't understand it either.

It wasn't until many years later that I realized that it was because of family history research that I had that unique quality in my mind. In fact, when I was 16, I had my patriarchal blessing and I was told that I would recognize the choice quality of the mind that my Heavenly Father had given me. And I always thought that maybe I would just realize I was smart, but I think it was more to do with my autism, that my mind worked in a unique way from other people, that I would be able to look at different family records and decipher information that other people had overlooked.

And because of that, I was able to break down a lot of walls that we had come to in our genealogy. I think I was given that because Heavenly Father knew that I would be the one to be able to find these people to have their temple work done for them.

After my dad died in 2001, after a couple of years, I had a dream where I saw him in our backyard, and he was bathed in a white light and wearing the purest white clothing, and he was walking toward me and all of a sudden I could see the veil separating him from me, and it was of the finest material that I had ever seen. It was completely see-through. It was like a curtain hanging down.

And he turned to his right and I could see couples standing just behind this veil. And he would point to them and name them off and I recognized the names in the dream of people that I had been researching, but I hadn't done their temple work for them yet. And they were looking at me with pleading in their eyes, smiles on their faces, but this pleading and they never spoke to me, but I felt that they were saying that they wish that their temple work could be done. And they were like, "Please, please, please get our work done for us." And that is something that I've kept with me for 20 years of just remembering that feeling and it's really spurred me on to be able to find these people.

When my oldest was very young, I started doing family search indexing because I had watched my mom do it. And at that time, it wasn't done on computer, it was done where I would have paper copies of documents, and I would transcribe them over to index cards that I would send over to the temple or to the church office building.

And I really enjoyed that aspect of it because I realized that I really enjoyed the data entry part of it. And it was after we started doing indexing on the computer, I realized that touching the keys gave me a lot of good sensory input that really helped calm my mind. Something about autism is people will really like to have sensory input where that sense of touch gives you comfort.

And because of that gift, I was able to do about 90,000 names in indexing because I can type really fast and it feels really comforting to me, and I can do it with a very high rate of accuracy. And I believe that's a superpower that heavenly Father is giving me because now I can help other people find their family members.

In 2002, I went to the Navoo Temple open house with my husband and our young son. And we were going to be staying in the same city that my relatives came from, and I was really excited about that because I could do research, and I dedicated an entire day to be able to go out and do research, but because of our schedule, I ended up with only an hour.

And so we went to a cemetery and I prayed to Heavenly Father to help me to find my family. Even though I had hardly any time, and I went into the office and I found the information that I needed to go out and find their graves, and I found a branch of the family that I only had very minimal information on. And I was really excited that I found... their oldest daughter actually passed away as a child and I had never even seen her name, and I was excited because I was able to record her and submit her for her temple work to be done when I had never even seen her name before, and this was the only way that I would have found her until many years later when those records were available on the internet.

And I really did feel like that was a miracle Heavenly Father had given me. It was at that point that I realized that family history research is really a treasure hunt, and I knew that my unique mind could help me with that. I have an urgent desire to help these ancestors of mine because I'm doing a work that they can't do for themselves. And I really believe that it is helping me build Heavenly friendships and relationships and deep bonds that I struggle to have here on this Earth.

And I like the fact that I can be a savior on Mount Zion and be a hero for them. I like to tell my daughter who's 14 years old now that her autism can be a superpower for her as well. She has an immense love of animals and ecology, and she has an amazing talent with art. And I know that she can go out there and make a difference. And I tell her that. I tell her that she has a unique quality in her mind that she could get out there and maybe think of solutions other people haven't thought of, and that she can help save the world. And I'm just really glad that Heavenly Father gave me this ability because it helps me to help her to make a difference.

KaRyn 9:19

That was Julie.

From the first moment we heard this on our pitch line, one of my favorite things about Julie's story is that as she began to rely on the Lord to tell her who she was, through things like her patriarchal blessing and personal revelation, she could tune out those voices that were telling her that she was awkward and weird, and begin to see her autism as a gift, and a superpower, a superpower that literally helps her to save souls through genealogy, family history, and temple work.

And that's not all. Her autism also helps her to be the coach and the mentor that her daughter needs. I think about that all the time. Wouldn't it be so great if we could all have someone sooner rather than later who tells us that the things that make us feel different might actually be the key to our greatest successes.

And the good news for those of us who are still looking for that reassurance is that it is available to us right now from a loving Heavenly Father. Even if there's nobody here on Earth who wants to tell us that, he really does, and I believe that, and Julie's story helps me to realize that it's never too late to ask and to receive.

Our next story comes from our friend and my fellow producer, Sarah Blake.

Here's Sarah:

Sarah 10:29

Growing up, I lacked confidence in social situations. Somewhere along the way, in my preteen years, I became convinced that I wasn't pretty or fun, no guys would ever like me. And although I was confident in school and the things that I felt like I was good at, I was very unconfident and uncomfortable in standard social situations like parties or dances.

Teenage girls tell themselves a lot of mean things in their heads and I definitely fell into that, and believed in this narrative that I wasn't good at social things, and no boys would ever like me. And so this was how I went into my young adulthood.

I served a mission and then I found myself living in Salt Lake City as a single member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, who still believed she was really not good at social stuff, but the greatest desire of my heart was to find love and get married and have a family.

And I began to realize how ill-equipped I was to make that dream come true. One of my survival strategies, actually, pretty much my only trick for getting through social situations was to look around for people who looked more uncomfortable or lonely than me and go be friends with them. I definitely had an identity as a kind person, and so I had the confidence to do that and I still think that's a good thing. I'm glad I learned that skill and that habit, but it did become clear that it wasn't the way to find my people, my match necessarily.

I was living at the time in the Avenues in Salt Lake with a wonderful roommate who was a really good friend who was really pretty, cute, and fun and was really gifted at all the social stuff that I felt kind of inept at. And it would happen all the time that she would get asked on dates and I would be overlooked. And the low point came when I was at a ward mix and mingle, and I look around for someone more lonely and uncomfortable than me, I see this really nerdy guy sitting alone at a table, I go over and sit down and start talking to him, and he barely looks at me, just stares at my roommate and then asks me if I know if she's dating anybody. It was a pretty low blow.

And the next day, I came home from work, I was alone in the house, and I was just pretty bitter and grumpy, and I was saying to myself, like, "How do people even date? How is it even done? Do you have to be like a superhero to date? Because it seems impossible to me." And I had just read a book about the history of comic strips, and so inspired by that and fueled by my bitterness, I started drawing a comic strip called, "The Adventures of Dating Girl."

The plotline was a mild, mannered legal secretary, Mary Shanahan, whose initials were a transposition of mine, was a nice girl, hard worker, smart, funny, spiritual, but just not a dater. And then on Valentine's Day Eve when she's walking home from work, she stops to smell some flowers in front of a florist shop and she is hit by magic cosmic lightning, and there's this huge explosion of roses and her glasses go flying off and when she finally stands up from the pile of sizzling roses, she's been transformed into this mega babe, and her outfit is different. She's wearing boots that say "Dating Girl." And there's a crowd of onlookers, some of them are holding up signs telling her how hot she is now.

That was as far as I ever got with drawing the comic strip, and it was just kind of cathartic and fun that night. A funny thing I thought to do with my bitterness about dating.

But I found I couldn't stop thinking about the story of Dating Girl, and I talked about it with my best friend Megan and it kind of became a hobby of ours to talk about the adventures of dating girl and imagine the continuing storyline. And a couple other friends got into it, and we spent a lot of those dateless nights talking about the mythology of Dating Girl, and the story evolved.

So the rest of the story is Mary Shanahan goes home that night after being struck by lightning and she washes her face and goes straight to bed and she doesn't even look in the mirror or notice that she's become this super babe. And in the next morning, she wakes up and her roommates wake up and discover that they also are kind of magically transformed. And over the next few weeks, they're like, "Something's different. We're kind of looking better," but also they felt like they had some new wisdom or skill in social situations and dating, understanding that they hadn't had before.

As they're trying to figure that out, they find themselves magically transported to this location where they meet a woman, Magda, who becomes their mentor. And Magda tells them that she used to be Dating Girl, but she has since retired and moved on. And there has always been a "dating girl" and there always has to be a "dating girl." And when Magda retired, the new "Dating Girl" had to be risen up and that's why the universe chose Mary Shanahan to be struck by lightning to become the new dating girl. And every dating girl has her sidekicks who are also dating girls, and they all have this power to bring balance to the force I guess or to improve healthiness and wisdom and goodness in dating.

And dating girl also learns that she has power to look out over the Salt Lake Valley and little like heart flares go up and she can tell where she's needed and she can go there and also she can fly, but that's like nothing compared to the power of love that defines her now.

So we came up with a bunch of plot lines for the dating girls. The most significant story arc of which was the rise of her arch nemesis, Matthew Nan, the natural man, who was a very cool, accomplished, smart guy who moved into her their ward who was a natural leader and who should have been an influence for good, but instead used his power for evil to encourage people to be lame in dating, to not try hard, to not take risks, to not think the best of others, to be selfish and insecure. He was just a bad dude and they were constantly trying to thwart him.

So, time went on, and the really interesting thing was that the story began to change all of us. It certainly began to change me. We had a lot of conversations about what exactly is Dating Girl's power? What is the superpower in dating? And I was very insistent that her power was not going on dates, that was stupid, and her power was also not being hot, because that's not a superpower that was just like a random side effect of being struck by magic, cosmic lightning.

But the power that she had was the power that she already had in her that was magnified by becoming a superhero. And the power was Christlike charity or love, to apply that to dating. Thinking about what that meant was really healthy for me to think, "What does that mean for the way you treat the person you're dating or the people you're flirting with or the people you want to know better? How do you Treat yourself, and how do you wish the best and work for the best for both parties in a relationship?"

And out of that came for me what was wisdom and self awareness about the ways that I was kind of competitive with other women and I was embracing my insecurities rather than my strengths. And I was letting bitterness lead me rather than hope, and that I was also really hard on guys.

I realized that if I tried to see my dating scene with Dating Girl's magic supervision, it made me see people more as I think Christ would see them, more for their potential and their hopes, and less their weaknesses and their failings. It made me see that we're all very scared and vulnerable in the scary world of dating and that we all needed people to be kind.

It was interesting to see that I had really gone through a time of thinking my strategy of finding people who are lonelier than me and reaching out to them was a weakness. But in fact, that was part of my strength that I did want to be kind when I dated, but I could also do it with more confidence.

The way the dating girl mythology affected my friends was also interesting. As my friends chose a "dating girl" alter ego, their superpower was something that they themselves thought was a weakness but became a strength.

And I think just the act of sitting around and talking about this, imagining these superhero plotlines, for each of us helped us organically move on to being the daters we had always wanted to be. We thought we were being super nerdy. I mean, we were talking about imaginary superheroes and comic strips but it actually was making us more competent daters, more gifted socializers, and it really made a difference in our lives.

After a while, I found that before I was going to a party or something that had me kind of nervous, I would literally psych myself up by saying, "You can do this. You're Dating Girl. Nobody knows it. Nobody has to know it, but you know it inside and you can do this." Sometimes in dating, I would literally say, "W-W-D-G-D. What would dating girl do?" And I would sometimes make lists of the ways that I thought Dating Girl would handle a certain dating situation, and then realize that that was who I was now, and I could do it.

It gave me so much confidence and comfort with myself, and I think because her superpower was based in something that was a part of me that I'd seen as a weakness, ut through the power of charity was turned into a strength, it stuck and it became a part of who I am.

I think it's so true in life in general. Whatever we believe about ourselves can become true. I'm happy to say that all of the "dating girls" that generation of Dating Girls got married, found love, got married. We all have kids now. And there's a funny ending to the story.

My husband and I run our own business and a lot of our employees have ended up being singleyoung adult members of our church. And I was talking to one of these girls in our home one night after work, she was telling me about her dating woes, and I started telling her the story of Dating Girl and she was really into it, and she's starting to imagine her own dating alter ego.

When suddenly there's this huge flash of lightning and a huge clap of thunder like right on top of the house, the lights go out and everything, and then they come back on and we just looked at each other like, "What just happened?" And we realized a new dating girl has been risen up. I just retired and I'm Magda now and she's the new Dating Girl and the generation continues. Dating Girl lives. She always lives.

KaRyn 22:05

That was Sarah. I never get tired of hearing her stories. And I'm also always surprised by the inventiveness of her imagination. And great news, the original Gating Girl comic still exists, and we'll have it in our show notes, so you can take inspiration as you try to find your own inner superhero.

There are a few things worth taking from Sarah's story about how we seek to understand our weakness and our strengths. I think it's really easy to compare ourselves to others, like Sarah did, or assume that all hero stuff happens to other people and not us. But I think something special happens when we open ourselves up to the possibility that we can become the hero of our own narrative.

We find that our capacity is magnified through Christ, and consequently our capacity to see others in their full heroic glory is also magnified. We begin to realize that there can never be too many superheroes and that our work is blessed by the existence of everyone conquering the natural man together. That kind of unity is what it's all about.

Our final story today comes from Kurt, who describes the experience of growing into a new calling as he accesses the only true superpower, the power of God upon the Earth, the priesthood.

Julie 23:17

Here's Kurt:

Kurt 23:19

It's Sunday, February 6th, 2011, and I've been Bishop for one hour.

I'm sitting in the bishop's office, I guess it's my office, but it sure doesn't feel like that, even though the plaque says that outside the door. I noticed the candy dish that I guess I now preside over, the strange carpet wallpaper, and various pictures that hang in the room, the First Presidency, Christ, and a random temple. And I guess I really am the bishop.

My Ward clerk comes into the office with a stack of papers, "Bishop Francom, I just need you to sign here, there, and one more here. Thank you." I noticed as he leaves the room, that he is going through a group of people outside the office. All these people suddenly look into the office hoping that it's their turn to now see the bishop. Because some for some reason, they think I have the solution to all of their problems.

Do they really understand who they're dealing with? I mean, I'm a 28 year old that was called to be bishop in an inner city ward, not because I'm anything special, but because the list of options was incredibly short. But nonetheless, the responsibility is on me to answer their questions.

It just doesn't sit well yet. I don't feel like a bishop though I am standing there in a suit. It feels like dress up. And believe me, I know a thing or two about dress up. As a five year old. I'm sitting there in front of the TV day after day watching a man I later find out is really named Christopher Reeves flying around on the TV screen, saving people from falling buildings, landing a helicopter that's on fire, and it was remarkable.

This being, this Superman was something to aspire to. I mean, the suit, the cape, I mean the strength that he exemplified. I thought, "I got to be that. I've got to be a superhero." My mother gave me a remarkable home sewn Superman cape, and every day I represented being that superhero and represented becoming that dream by wearing that Superman cape.

And sometimes, sure, my mom needed to go to the grocery store or run some errands. But I protested and said, "I will not leave this house unless this Superman cape goes underneath my clothes because crime could break out at any moment, and I must be ready so that I could become a great superhero." But now as Bishop Francom, that memory, that feeling of being a superhero seems so distant.

I've survived one full year as a bishop somehow because now I'm standing in the clerk's office with the ward clerk. He's busy at the computer printing off checks, one after the other, after the other. This has been such a heavy welfare month. I mean so many requests from so many people. Some I know, some I don't, and everybody turns to me as the bishop to make the decision. "Will I pay the rent? Will I pay the water bill? Will I pay the utilities?" As these envelopes are being in the stack in my hand all stuffed with these checks, going to landlords, going to banks, going to utility companies.

They remind me of another envelope I receive quite often. From Alice Wilkins. Every Sunday she shows up to church, big smile with their bright red lipstick. She's 92 years old and couldn't be a happier person, hands me the envelope every week trusting me that I will use these fast offering funds for the family most in need that needs these funds.

But I don't know, as I stand there, holding the stack of envelopes, it just gets heavier and heavier. I mean, these are sacred funds. These are Alice's funds that she has sacrificed. She skipped meals so that she could contribute. And now it's up to me to figure out how to use these funds? Maybe there's more I could do. Maybe I should think this through before I really place these in the mailbox.

Because what if I'm making a mistake? Maybe I've spent too much money. I've definitely spent way more than the ward's brought in. And should I sign the next check? I mean, I don't know. I don't really know that guy. And so maybe I should look more into it. What if I have disgraced these funds that have been given to me to use through the authority I've been given. Again, the pile of these checks gets higher and higher and higher. And I don't know if I'm being a good bishop.

The weight of this responsibility presses down on my shoulders, and I don't know if I want to do it anymore. I'm so frustrated with it all of the pressure of making the right decision, that I'm tired.

And in the moment, where I'm frustrated, I begin to utter the words under my breath, "I hate this." I couldn't complete that sentence before the spirit rebuked me in my mind with one simple phrase.

"I thought you wanted to be a superhero."

It was in that moment that I realize that capes don't exist or make men fly, but authority exists. Opportunities of service exist. There were so many families in dire need of help. In the sense I was wearing the cape, that could answer their prayers wth one quick, "Yes, cut the check." Suddenly, that stack of envelopes didn't seem so heavy.

Four more years followed of me being bishop, and throughout those years, there were so many decisions that weighed on my mind, so many circumstances, so many situations that were impossible before me, that took me to my knees to make the right decision and to give the right guidance and advice.

And I didn't always give the best advice, and I made a lot of mistakes, but I always went back to those words, "I thought you will wanted to be a superhero," because then I was reminded that I was doing a good work and that I was helping people, even with all my weaknesses.

The authority in which I was acting under as a bishop, the authority of Jesus Christ, the Priesthood of God, the keys that have been restored to Earth that make it all possible to reach out and use his authority as the greatest superhero of all time, where redemption is found, where infinite grace is in abundance. He is the superhero. We can turn to him in the moments when we have to stand in his place and act like the superhero, and he will strengthen us because he is our Savior.

KaRyn 30:53

That was Kurt Francom.

You may recognize his voice as the creator and host of the Leading Saints podcast. Kurt's work is focused on building the leadership capabilities of Church members around the world. So it's great to hear his personal story of feeling inadequate and then finding a way to grow into a leadership role.

I'm sure he's not the only overwhelmed disciple to mutter under his breath, "I hate this," and I'm also sure he's not the only person to discover that there is divine instruction, and divine power in the mantle of his calling to help him move beyond that place. We all have access to that superpower here on this Earth as covenant making and covenant keeping people of Christ.

So here's a confession. I probably wouldn't ever go see a superhero movie of my own volition, if it weren't for my comic book loving 16 year old stepson. I can barely keep track of all the franchises and the zillions of characters with backstories. My feeble brain cannot retain it all. And I'm a little bit partial to romantic comedies, but I will also admit that I regularly find myself weeping into my popcorn and Diet Coke at those same movies because they speak to a universal truth about weakness and strength.

In almost every movie, while the battles rage, the good guys are faced with impossible odds, their weakness is exposed, their strengths are many, but they're still never quite enough. They are always up against impossible odds.

And I feel that. I really, really feel it. Aren't we up against some really impossible odds? Aren't we staring down the cresting enemy with our battered and bruised armor and exhausted resources? Every day, aren't you and I praying and praying and praying that somehow our weakness, our insufficient faith, our fear will be replaced with power and strength and fortification from something bigger than us all.

And in the movies, that help comes often in the form of a magically activated forcefield, or the discovery of a new superpower they never knew they had, or perfectly timed dimensional leap from a long missing friend. Well in real life we don't get X-ray vision or super strength, or my personal favorite superpower, the ability to do 40 things all at the same time on deadline.

But there is in fact a real force in the universe that can transform us weaklings and weirdoes into truly spectacular beings. It's that transformative power that the Savior comforted the Prophet Moroni with in Ether chapter 12, verse 27, when he said, "...I give unto men weakness that they may be humble; and my grace is sufficient for all men that humble themselves before me; for if they humble themselves before me, and have faith in me, then will I make weak things become strong unto them."

Moroni charged with bringing the Word of God to you and me in these latter days with enough power that we would be convinced to stay faithful. He was convinced that his weakness was going to ruin everything, that he wouldn't be able to accomplish the task place before him.

The odds were against him, but the Lord wanted him to see in that moment that his weakness, his humility would be made his strength through grace. And I think that's what comes through in each of the stories we've heard today, evidence of the Savior's miraculous power to change us, to show us the double-edged sword of our weakness turned to strength, through his grace, his enabling power.

It reminds me of this quote that I love from President Ezra Taft Benson, where he taught, quote, "Men and women who turn their lives over to God will discover that he can make a lot more out of their lives than they can. He can deepen their joys, expand their vision, quicken their mind, strengthen their muscles, lift their spirits, multiply their blessings, increase their opportunities, comfort their souls, and pour out peace," end quote.

If that's not superhero stuff right there, then I don't know what it is. At the end of the day, we can feel assured that God wants and needs all of us, our whole selves, including whatever we think is unacceptable or failure -- our overwhelm, our lack of follow through, our social awkwardness, our inability to withstand that one temptation.

What we learn from these stories, from the scriptures, from that President Benson quote, is that if we offer our hearts in humility, he will help us to see our weakness clearly, which isn't always pleasant, but it's necessary, and in turn, he'll offer a hope that is stronger than any superpower we can imagine.

That's it for this episode of This is the Gospel. Thank you to Julie, Sarah, and Kurt for sharing their stories and their faith. We'll have pictures of our storytellers including Sarah's dating girl comic and a transcript of this episode in our show notes at LDSLiving.com/ThisistheGospel.

And if you aren't already following us on social media, there's way more good stuff throughout the week. Find us on Instagram and Facebook at "ThisistheGospel_Podcast."

Thank you so much for sharing the stories that means something to you with your friends and your family. We love to hear all the ways that this type of storytelling strengthens your faith in God and love for his children. If you have just a minute to leave us a review and a rating wherever you listen to this podcast, that's another way that you can share the good stuff. Every review helps us to show up in the search for more people.

All of our stories on this podcast are true and accurate as afirmed by our storytellers. If you have a story to share about living the Gospel, please call our pitch line and leave us a pitch. We often find many of our stories like Julie's from the pitch line, and we love to hear how the gospel has blessed your life. Call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less.

This episode was produced by Sarah Blake with additional story producing and editing by Jasmine Mullen, Katie Lambert, Ashley Porter, and Casey Blake. It was scored, mixed, and mastered by Mix at Six Studios And our Executive Producer is Erin Hallstrom.

You can find past episodes, we have 50 of them now of this podcast and other LDS Living podcasts, at LDSLiving.com/podcasts. Have a great week.

Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Stories in this episode: As a missionary in Chile, Brad Wilcox struggles to find the answers to his gospel questions until a transfer leads him to the light and hope he is looking for; Cody finds the spark of her testimony in a barren patch of desert after she prays for the impossible; An empty Primary room becomes sacred ground for Dave as he seeks to come back to the gospel he once knew.

SHOW NOTES

This episode is sponsored by the Deseret Book FIRST LIGHT Concert Event.

To see pictures and links to this week's episode, click here.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

KaRyn 0:04 Welcome to This is the Gospel, an LDS Living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host, KaRyn Lay.

Okay, pop quiz time. When you hear today's theme -- sacred ground -- what are the first words that pop into your head? I'll give you just a minute to think about it.

And... now I'll tell you that I conducted a highly scientific study, highly scientific study, around the LDS Living offices, and here are just a few of the words and phrases that came to mind for some of my friends: "trees, light, field, holy place, sacred grove, Joseph Smith, and temple grounds."

Maybe some of those were the same things that you thought of and maybe you thought of something totally different. I for one thought of the words "Native American" because of the beautiful spiritual tradition that culture has around burial spaces. But it was interesting to me that so many of the words that my friends thought of were related to the first vision, "grove, trees, light, Joseph Smith."

It is true that our whole team has been knee deep in participating in President Nelson's invitation to really celebrate the 200th anniversary of that miraculous event. But I kind of think that even if that weren't the truth, we'd still make all of those associations. As members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, we have this unique privilege of having a modern origin story that includes a seminal, transformative, divine event happening in a decidedly ordinary place.

I've been to the grove, and I come from Pennsylvania, the land of groves, it's trees, and grass, a little clearing, and now there's even a well worn footpath in and out of the forest. What makes it special is not the location in and of itself, but what happened there has transformed those trees and that grass into something special and dedicated, set apart, holy. The appearance of the Father and the Son to the Prophet Joseph Smith turned an absolutely ordinary grove of trees into a sacred grove. And we who believe, get to celebrate that event and honor that place. It's so cool.

Well, in today's episode, we have three stories of holy experiences that could have happened anywhere, but they didn't. And how those places became sacred ground for the people who tread there are stories we're excited to share.

Our first story comes from Brad, whose "sacred ground" moment came during a particularly difficult time as a missionary in Chile. Now listen, I know we normally start with just first names, but the voice of Brad Wilcox is so recognizable that it wouldn't be fair to you not to just tell you it's Brad Wilcox. Otherwise you'd spend the whole time wondering, "Is that Brad Wilcox?" We're not monsters.

So, here's Brad Wilcox.

Brad 3:06 In Chile, there's a beautiful city that's on the coast and it's called La Serena, which means the "serene." For me, it will always be a sacred grove. It will be a place where I came to know God.

When I was a young man and I received my call to Chile, I was excited to go and share my testimony of the gospel, and it's not that I didn't have a testimony. I mean, I wasn't going on a mission without a testimony, but really quickly, I realized that my testimony was not as personal and not as deep as it needed to be.

Oh, I'd grown up in the church, had a wonderful family, and I had wonderful church experiences and wonderful church leaders, but when I confronted the difficulties of a mission, when I realized that learning Spanish was not going to be a piece of cake, and when I got to Chile, and I found out that the culture was so different, I just realized that this was hard.

I was sent to a little town up in the north of Chile called via na, and my companion and I were the only missionaries there, and it was hard. It was hot. Oh my gosh, you're out there working in the hot sun. I mean, this is in the north of Chile, which is desert. And I just thought while I was out there one day, and somebody had rejected us, and I just thought, "Why am I doing this? Why am I doing this?" When you grow up in the church and you have seminary teachers that tell you, "You must go share the gospel because there are people out there wanting this message."

Oh, I got out there and found out that nobody wanted my message. And that was kind of a, I guess you kind of think that somewhere out there, there's somebody who's just, you know, reading the Bible and just praying for missionaries to show up. And then you find out that they're all just busy getting along with their lives, and they didn't want to take time to talk to a couple of North Americans who couldn't even speak Spanish very well.

And I think I just missed home. I was missing my family. I was missing my friends. I was missing the involvement that my life had had before. Suddenly, I was focused on one little thing and it was hard because nobody cared about it. And I think that's when I said, "Wait, why am I here? Why am I doing this? Why don't I just go home?" But I knew the answer. God needed me. God wanted me. God called me. And I was there.

But then I thought, Well, where's God? It's not that I had all these overwhelming doubts, but it's just that my testimony had not deepened to a point where I knew for myself. So when I was there, and it got difficult, I really said, "Where's God?" And that thought shook me. It really shook me.

And so I think my companion noticed because when we went back to the apartment for lunch, he said, "What's the matter with you?" And I said, "I think I lost my testimony today." And he started to laugh. He's like, "Hahaha. Wilcox, you're so funny. You always just crack me up. Now go wash so we can eat."

So I'm in the bathroom, washing my hands, and I'm thinking, "Man, this is not good," you know, "This is not good. I need an angel. That's all there is to it. I need to see an angel. Joseph Smith saw one and he was younger than me. So I need an angel." And so I got through the rest of the day, and then that night I got up on the top bunk, I always chose the top bunk. One, because it was a little closer to heaven, and two, it was a little farther from the fleas. But there I was, and I knelt down in my top bunk and with all the faith that I could muster, I said, "God, are you there?"

And suddenly, my room was filled with light, and then the car passed. Joseph Smith gets a vision, Brad gets headlights. That's what I got. A car passing, and then I was really disappointed because you know I'd finally prayed with faith, really prayed sincerely, and that was the answer that I got? And I felt kind of ripped off because, you know, we've been teaching people that if you read, if you study, if you pray, then you can know the truth. Well, here I was asking, and I felt like my prayer wasn't being answered.

But that was a wake up call for me. Because as I laid there, I thought, "Have I really read as much as I should have? And have I really pondered as much as I should have? Have I prayed beyond the "Thank thee for everything, please bless everybody prayers," that I had given my whole life. And so that was a turning point for me. And the next morning I woke up with such a desire to read. I read the Book of Mormon, I read the Doctrine and Covenants, I read the pearl of great price, I read the miracle of forgiveness, I read a marvelous work and a wonder. I mean, I just read, and suddenly, I just could not get enough as I read and as I pondered.

Now, we had a zone conference. And our mission president came and he did interviews and I was a young missionary in the mission. You know, I hadn't been there all that long. And so I was still, you know, really worried about making a good impression on my mission president.

So he did the interview and he said, "How are you elder?"

I said, "Fine. President."

He said, "How's your companion?"

I said, "Fine. President."

"How's your area? How are your investigators?"

"Fine, president."

He says, you know about seven questions and seven "fine, presidents" later. I stood up to leave and then he said something that he'd never said before. He said, "Elder Wilcox, do you have any questions?"

Woah, questions. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, I just had a million questions. I mean, let's start with, "Is there a god? Does he even exist?"

I just looked at him and I said, "Me, questions? Oh, no president. You know, I've never even had a cavity. I don't have any questions."

A little while after that I got transferred to another area. And I packed my books, I packed my clothes, I packed you know, everything, but I didn't have room for doubts. But inside I packed those also. I just hadn't felt like I had an answer as clearly as I wanted the answer. I realized that I wasn't doing what I needed to do to be able to deserve an answer that I was asking for. I think sometimes until you have a doubt or a question, you don't feel a motivation to learn. I think the questions, the doubts, the unanswered prayer, motivated me to dig deeper.

For me, it was like, "Okay, it's time to buckle down. It's time to take this seriously. It's time to do what you know you're supposed to do to get what you want to get." So I dove in. In the new area where I was transferred, my companion and I worked harder than ever. I mean, we just loved that little branch. This was in the town of La Serena, the one I mentioned at the beginning, and we loved our little branch, we loved the people in the branch, we loved the people we were teaching, we worked harder than I'd ever worked on my mission.

We loved with a more genuine love than I'd ever loved before. We served with such a complete selflessness. And yet still, the answers, I mean, I felt good, I knew that I was happier. But the answers that I really wanted were eluding me. And then I got another interview. So there I was, in La Serena, and we met with a mission president.

He said, "How are you Elder?"

And I said, "Fine."

And he said, "How's your companion? How's your area?"

I said, "Fine, fine, fine, fine, fine."

And then, as I was leaving the interview, again, he asked me, "Elder Wilcox, do you have any questions?" And I don't know, maybe I'd just been working hard enough and long enough that I didn't care anymore about the fact that he was the mission president. I needed answers.

And I said, "President, is there a god?"

And he said, "Yes."

That was it. No quotes from the brethren, no scriptures, no judgmental looks. Just one word -- "Yes."

And I said, "President, does he know me?"

"With all of his numberless children, on all of his numberless worlds, does he know me?"

And President Day said, "Brad Wilcox. He knows you by your first name."

And then I said, "President, does he love me?"

"Me even with all the stupid things I've done and all the dumb mistakes I've made."

"Does he love me?"

And he said, "Yes."

And that was it. The spirit just washed over me confirming the truthfulness of my mission president's words. Suddenly, that answer was so clear and so personal. Suddenly, I knew for myself, the Spirit spoke to my spirit that became such an anchor for my soul, and such a foundation for my testimony. And I thought, "Why didn't you just answer me? Months earlier, why didn't he just answer me the first time I crawled up on my top bunk and prayed, "Are you there?" Why didn't he just answer me then?" But then I thought, "If he had answered me then, would I have studied as hard as I had studied? Would I have read with the ravenous desire that I read? Would I have pondered as deeply as I pondered? Would I have talked to mission companions about the gospel? Or would I have just kept shooting the breeze and wasting time?" I mean, "Would I have served as sincerely as I served?" And I realized that I wouldn't have.

If God had still been holding me above the water, I never would have learned to swim. And it's when he finally let my head dip below the water, which scared me. That's what finally motivated me to search and to do what I've been instructed to do. And so even now sometimes when I might wonder, I go back to that moment. And that's why Chile is sacred ground for me. That's why that little town of La Serena is a sacred to me as the sacred grove is to Joseph Smith. That is the place where my testimony deepened to the point that I knew, and I knew that God knew and I could not deny it.

KaRyn 17:15 That was author and teacher Brad Wilcox. I love that Chile became a sacred place for him because of both the depth of his struggle and the brilliance of light that he found there.

It reminds me of Joseph Smith's description of that thick darkness that gathered around him in the grove that was trying to convince him that he was doomed to destruction. And then, of course, my favorite part to share when I was a missionary, that welcome moment of illumination when a pillar of light above the brightness of the Sun descended gradually upon him. It seems to me that often our sacred ground is defined by moments that are symbolic of the salvation that comes from Jesus Christ and His Atonement. Darkness turned to light, death turned to everlasting life, despair turned to hope.

And it doesn't surprise me that my friend Brad is the teller of such a story. He has spent his entire writing career trying to help us understand the atonement, grace, and mercy of our Savior, that he so acutely felt on that sacred ground. And we're all just a little bit better because of it.

Our next story comes from Cody, who allowed a wet, cold, barren patch of desert to be transformed into a place where the fire of her testimony could burn brightly.

Here's Cody.

Cody 18:34 I was 15 years old, this is in 1989, and I had a big tennis tournament that I was supposed to be competing in that day. And my family, extended family all showed up to come and cheer me on, but I didn't. I had gotten high with some friends earlier in the day and kind of lost track of time and just really was oblivious to any of my responsibilities.

When evening came, I went home and I remember thinking it was very strange because I had extended family that was there and my mom had laid out dinner on the table. And we were all about ready to sit down for a family dinner, which didn't happen in the middle of the week very often for us. And when we sat down to eat, a knock came at the door.

When it was open, two large men came in, and I was told that I was going to be just living in the wilderness for an untold number of days. And it was a wilderness survival program meant for troubled youth.

At an early age, about 12, I was introduced to recreational drugs, drinking, smoking, and I associated with people that were a lot older than I was, and so I just was surrounded by a lot of influences that affected me at such a young age.

On the surface, I think people probably looked at me as somebody that was a good girl. I grew up in a home that was a pretty normal home as a good family, my parents, you know, members of the church, I was baptized. But I wasn't in a place where I had my own strong testimony. I was a competitive athlete, I was doing well in that, but you know after time, the more and more you get involved in these kinds of things, the more you go down a kind of downward spiral. And by the time I was 15, that was when my parents started recognizing that there was a serious problem that was going on. I think they realized that they needed to do something drastic.

So when I first arrived on the top of Boulder mountain, all I saw was just a bunch of pinyon pines and rocks and recognized the vastness that surrounded me. It was just lots of sky, lots of wilderness, and the men that ran this program, were ex Navy SEALs. And so their tactics were to be as frightening as possible. They yelled, they didn't talk, they yelled, they yelled at you.

They gave me these clothes that had been sent down, you know, by my mom, my mom had gathered ahead of time. They said that that's what I needed to wear, but that was all that I was going to possess, that later they would give me a knife, and they would give me an army poncho. Those were the only two items that we had in our possession. I was put into a group. There were some other kids that are my age, so anywhere between 12 to 18 that had been there already for about a week.

I was very frightened. And I just remember feeling like even though there are people there, I'm so alone. I was there for four months. So I went there the beginning of August and came home the day before Thanksgiving in November. During the first couple of weeks that we were there, we had actually a Native American guide that would teach us how to recognize edible plants, and how to find water, and how to build fire, and how to create shelter and things like that. And that's what we used our knife for. We used this kitchen knife to be able to cut down the types of woods that we needed in order to make a fire making kit.

And we learned how to make rope out of yakka fibers or sage bark and things like that so that we could make these bows or traps and things like that. You literally were stripped of every comfort, everything. It was just a rough like I just was angry. I didn't like anyone that was there. I was not going to go about this easy. I was full of pride, you know, full of that, like teenage angst you know, that you would think of?

I was breaking inside, but I wasn't going to show them that I was breaking. I was just going to try to like seem tough. I was so mad at my parents. I never really wanted to see them again. My plan was to never ever go home again. You know, I don't know how I would've worked that out. But that's how I felt at the time. I felt betrayed, I felt more and more determined to not have a relationship with my parents and to just get as far away from them as possible.

So one of the things that we were given an opportunity to do twice during the time that I was there is we had what they call solos. Basically what that means is that instead of being with the group of kids, that they would go, and they would give you an area, like a parameter of like about a mile, maybe a square mile of where you could stay, but you weren't supposed to go past and you were completely alone.

The first solo was for five days. So during that five days, we were supposed to just completely fend for ourselves completely survive on our own. We're supposed to find our own water sources. We're supposed to find our own food, our own shelter, and just have complete, alone time. And then we had an eight-day solo.

During the eight-day solo, they took me to a place that was... it's called Harris Wash and it's kind of a slot canyon in a way, little bit bigger than slot canyon, it's in an area that's very remote, but it's along the Escalante river, and it was raining the day that I started the solo. And so all of the wood was wet, the sand was wet, I was soaking wet. And I just kept getting rained on and rained on with really no way to kind of keep myself dry or warm. And so I was not able to boil any water, I just had to drink the water that was in Escalante river just knowing that it was probably going to make me sick.

I had trapped some mice but I had no way to cook them because I couldn't make the fire. Luckily, you know, being right near the water, I was able to eat bulrush which is just a kind of water weed that grows along the banks of the river, and I would just suck on juniper berries and things like that and anything that I could really just fine, but it wasn't really enough.

It broke me, it broke me.

I felt totally and utterly, like hopeless and in despair and just felt like everything, every attempt that I was trying to make on my own, wasn't working out. That's when I realized that I really can't do this on my own, that I am in need of some other help. I remember having the thought that, "Is there really a god? And if so, why is he allowing me to be like this? He knows that I'm in this situation. He knows that I'm desperate. But yet, where is he?"

All of a sudden, like I started kind of having this song that came to me, "I'm a child of God," and the lyrics came to me and I hadn't sung it since I had been in primary as a I don't know, eight or nine year old, but I just started singing it out loud and kind of paying attention to the words and the words you know, I'm a child of God, and the words about you know, "sent me here, loving parents."

I mean, there was all these things that just were kind of flooding me with like a really strong desire to really hope that this was true. My dad's a convert to the church. And I remembered stories about him telling me about some of his first prayers, and that when he had, you know, been asking if there was a God, or if the Book of Mormon was true, that he would kneel and pray and some of the experiences that he had had with that, and the story of Joseph Smith going to the sacred grove that came to my mind, and I kind of almost felt like I was in a similar situation here, just in the middle of this wilderness.

So I kneeled down and I prayed. I remember just praying in a way, like not in a formal way, but almost as if I was just talking to somebody that was right there in my presence. And I just remember having this overwhelming feeling at the time when I finished the prayer that not only is God real, but he's there with me, and that he knows me, and that he loves me because those were the things that I was really desperate to know. I wanted to know if he existed, I wanted to know if he knew who I was, you know, in this huge, giant world, you know, why would he know me? And does he know the situation I'm in, does he care?

And I just remember having this overwhelming comfort and peace that came over me. I was freezing cold, it was rainy, I was wet, but I was warm. And I just remember feeling loved. I felt embraced. I just remember, you know, praying that I could somehow be able to create a fire. And so when I finished the prayer, I went to my fire starting kit, but where everything was wet, it was impossible. There really was no reason that I should have ever been able to make a fire for days because it was that wet.

But I know that because of the prayer that I gave, now it didn't just happen like I instantly you know made a fire, but pretty quickly, quicker than it should have been for sure, I was able to make that fire. So for the remaining days, I was able to keep this fire burning and be able to use it to not only heat myself, but be able to eat and be able to boil water, and just to bring me comfort. That fire was the most precious thing that I had.

And you know, honestly, I have thought about that fire and how kind of it was a representation of what was going on in that moment where I just needed to have that little prayer that was kind of like that little coal or that little spark that I could not find. And then I finally found it and then I was able to spend time tending to it and helping it to grow and helping it to last.

After the eight days, the group of kids they started becoming gathered by the leaders, and they would kind of hike through and gather each one of us and we would join back up with the group and I was out in the wilderness for another, probably another month, we still continued our day to day hiking, but my experience during those hikes completely changed, where I used to be somebody, I'm a pretty talkative person so I would be like talking with the other kids, I would be, you know, giving other people hard time or whatever, I'd like to joke and do things like that, but instead, I became very quiet and kind of reflective. And what I was doing was praying, I was praying twenty-four seven.

And so during that time, that's when I really felt like, my relationship really grew with our Father in Heaven. I recognized that he's not just this like distant being that just, you know, every once in a while, throws down a miracle. You know, it was he's there, he knows me, and he loves me. And he, he wants to just hear all of the random thoughts that I had in my head. He could understand and he would give me a little signs here and there that, "Yep, he was listening and he understood what I was feeling," and there would be little miracles that would happen all of the time where we would find water. I mean, I mean, that's, that sounds like it's not a miracle, but it's hard to explain, you know, when you're in that situation, but I would have a need, it would come, the solution would be presented. And so last month, being there really, really prepared me to be able to go home.

So the last day that you're there, they set up what they call a run in. And basically the leaders will take you to this road, and they will say your family is waiting for you down a mile or two. Just keep going.

I remember. I didn't stop running. I just ran with all the strength that I had because I knew I was going to see my family again and I saw my mom and my dad, and I just ran into their arms. I loved them. I wanted to be with them. I had no anger towards them. I had just complete, unconditional love, and appreciation for them.

I had every desire to do what was right. I have often thought about that day and thought about how it symbolizes so much about that same feeling that I felt, I think will happen when it's time for us to go home to see our heavenly parents like that was just something that just really represented that same thing to me.

We stayed in a little hotel in Escalon, Utah called the Circle De motel and I was able to take a shower and I took like a two hour shower. And I just kept looking down at the floor to see when it would finally be clear. I was just covered in soot and dirt, and we didn't bathe, we didn't brush our teeth, we didn't do anything like that for four months. And so you can only imagine, but I'm sure I smelled amazing when I hugged my parents. I'm sure they were trying to not gag.

I don't know. I just remember just having all of these little things that we totally take for granted now. That as a 15 year old, I all of a sudden recognized, like how blessed, how lucky we are.

That experience of that prayer and not just total without a doubt answer, that has stayed with me for the last 30 years. But at that time, it didn't immediately, like make me think that the Church was true. It was the foundation, but a lot of times I still didn't go to church, I would go out to the wilderness, I'd go up into the mountains.

It wasn't until like a year later that I ended up actually reading the Book of Mormon for the first time and reading it pretty quickly and having a you know, saying a prayer, wondering if this is also true, and just having that confirmation that it's true, then at that point, it was like there's no turning back now. I just wanted to read my scriptures all the time and listen to Janice Kapp Perry, like that's just who I wanted to be, which was so different than what I was before all of this happened.

There has been a lot of criticism about the particular program that I was in. And I know my parents received a lot of criticism from others that thought it was too harsh of a program. I know that this program was eventually shut down by the state. There were a lot of things that happened while we were there. That shouldn't have happened. But I wouldn't be the person that I am. I really, I think back on anytime, actually, any trial that comes my way, that's where my mind goes, is back to that four months that I was out there.

I think that when we think of the sacred places in our lives, that it doesn't always have to be a physical place, a location. A lot of times it can be the times in our life, the place in our life that made the biggest difference that put us on the road that we were meant to be on.

KaRyn 33:58 That was Cody. Now before anyone starts to think that sending your teenager into the wild with a bunch of Navy SEALs and no toothbrush is the answer to all of your parenting struggles, we want to make sure you know that we are in no way endorsing intense survivalist programs for youth like the one Cody described from 1989.

The fact that she was able to make something beautiful out of something that could have been deeply traumatic is a testament to her resilience. But we believe that God can work those same kinds of miracles without adding unnecessary trauma.

What I love about Cody's story is the reminder that the ground we are currently sitting on may seem anything but sacred. It may be wet and inhospitable, unable to receive even a spark of warmth, but our Father in heaven has the power, the ability, and the will to transform everything we think is impossible into possibility.

Our final story from Dave makes the case for the everyday sacred ground we might take for granted in our discipleship -- the Chapel.

Here's Dave.

Dave 35:05 I was not at a place in my life that I ever thought I'd be at. I was about 26/27 years old living in Las Vegas. No license. I had pending charges for at that time my third DUI. I tried lots of different methods to get sober. I feel like I read 10 different self help books from Dr. Phil to Joel Osteen. And I even had spent time in a inpatient rehabilitation center for three months. I even had a sponsor through AA who had 10 years of sobriety who was trying really hard to help me, and none of that was working.

So it all started, I was off my mission about two months, I had never tried alcohol, never tried any drugs. Couldn't even spell the word marijuana probably. And so I found myself on Super Bowl Sunday with my friend that I had known since high school, and that's when I tried alcohol for the first time.

I love the effect of what the drink did for me. It took away the really I think, as I think back on it, and what alcohol did for me is it took away the feeling of shame, and not measuring up and feeling guilty and feeling like I wasn't worthy of God's love. And when I would drink alcohol, all that went away and I could live in the moment.

When I would drink during the week, I would feel like a fake when I was at church because I almost felt like there was a price of admission to get into church, and I snuck in the back of the line. For me to go into church that meant I had to be doing x, y, &, z, to even walk through the doors. And since I hadn't been doing those things, it was like I was there without a ticket. That's what it felt like. I would miss maybe one week and then it's a little easier to miss the next week and long before it is sort of a gradual like falling away, up until where I just was so tuned out to spiritual matters and it just didn't matter to me.

I mean, I remember one time when I was trying to come back to church and it was a sacrament meeting and as soon as that hymn started, this desire to drink, and I think it was just because I didn't feel worthy to be at church that day. And it was that feeling of everyone around me is judging me, I don't belong here, I'm the outcast.

And I remember leaving sacrament meeting in the middle of the opening hymn and going straight to the 7-11 buying a six pack and I was like, as soon as I got out the door of the 7-11 I remember cracking open the can and started to guzzle it and it was just like get rid of these feelings because I don't want to feel this way. And alcohol is very effective at making it so I didn't feel that way.

I thought I was you know, at my rock bottom at that point, and little did I know how much worse it was going to get from then on.

I went into Mexico with one of my friends and brought back prescriptions because you didn't need to see a doctor to buy things. So we were basically like, like mules going into Mexico and bringing some pills back with us. And we stopped to drink right before we got out of the border. And he ended up getting a DUI and I was with him in the car and so next thing I knew I was in downtown San Diego jail.

I probably hadn't prayed in two years, and I was so disconnected from spiritual matters, but at that point, I remember a prayer to Heavenly Father where I just said, "Please help get me out of this jail cell and I promise I will not drink again." And I managed at the time, I feel like I was genuinely... my desire was to stop because I didn't want to keep finding myself in these situations that I thought I never would find myself in, like a jail cell for example, where your freedom is gone, and I remember feeling like a monkey in a cage. And it was just, it was the worst place I'd ever been in my life. And so the idea was, "If you get me out of here God, then I will never drink again and I will fly right. I'll straighten up as a good soldier and I will become active."

And you know, at that point, I thought it was a turning point in my life that I could actually do that. I'm not even kidding. The next day. I remember the guard saying to me "belt roll up" which meant basically get your mattress pad and roll it up. And I said, "Okay, what's going on?" He's like, "You're getting released." And basically all three felonies were dropped.

So yeah, God definitely came through for me. He got me out of jail, miraculously. I think I made it a weekend after getting out of jail that there I was back in the liquor store line buying more whiskey when I thought I was done. As soon as that desire, the temptation to drink came back up, it was like I had no defense against it, I was just I was, I gave right into that temptation again, I was desperate.

My friend Fred, said, "Dave, I know enough of your past to know that your upbringing in the LDS Church and I suggest that you find a way to go get close back to that because I can't really help you anymore." We were basically at that crossing point. And he said, "Dave, reach deep and and see what you can do."

It was a Saturday afternoon. And I thought, "Well, I know there's a chapel on Warm Springs and Eastern. I think I'll go there." And I got my bike, and I started to pedal. Immediately, the destroyer, the adversary started to put thoughts in my head like "don't go back to the chapel like give up." This is another thing that he does is tell me if I start, it's all or nothing and it's like, "Okay, you're heading back to the chapel, I hope you know this means that you're going to be temple worthy in a year."

And those are the kind of things that get me discouraged, like, "Oh, that's too insurmountable." But nonetheless, I pushed on, I got to that chapel super sweaty. And I didn't even think that the chapel would be open because there was actually just one car in the parking lot. My plan was actually to go sit under a tree, because it was super hot in Las Vegas, in the middle of July, and I thought I would go sit under a tree at the chapel, but at least I would be at a chapel and that's when I would pour my heart out to God and say, I don't know where to turn next because my life has been ruined by my constant decision to drink alcohol.

I tried a door and it actually opened up, and I went in there and I could hear some beautiful piano music coming from the chapel. I peeked into the chapel, and I saw the chorister playing the organ practicing probably for the hymns for the next day. I still remember walking through the chapel and oh my gosh, what a feeling of overwhelming peace that I had missed for so long. I walked down the hall and flashbacked to when I was a little kid and running through the halls on my way to primary class, and I just remembered back to the feeling I used to have as a kid where the world was great, and I didn't have to worry about what I had done.

I walked down the hall and I opened that primary door and I went in and I grabbed one of those little tiny chairs and I set it down. Again, my thought was, "I just need to sit in here and pray. I'll sleep in here if I can, but I need to feel the Holy Ghost." I was so desperate to feel some spirituality in my life.

I started to pour my heart out to God and just that surrender, "Help me please." There was no real bargaining like I'd done in the past. It was just kind of like "help me" and I looked up and there in the middle of the room of the primary was a picture of the Savior. And it's that picture where he's wearing the red robe, and those eyes were just telling me "I love you, Dave." I felt him saying, "Dave, I'm your advocate. You don't need to do this alone. Thank you for asking for my help, now accept it and embrace it, and let's do this together."

I had that feeling that I was being hugged. I know that I needed to be in the chapel that day because it was a giant step for me to even go back to a chapel, but I think that maybe it displayed some humility, and it allowed me to start on that path back.

I had several relapses after that point. But I had some hope.

That's when I realized that I was no longer an outcast. God wanted me back in his arms. And I know that his love is what I need every single day. I think the door was open that day because God wanted me to know that the door would always be open for me, that he was never going to shut me out, that I could come back anytime.

God set up the environment for me by giving me an empty building, an open door, and I didn't have to worry about what I was wearing. I didn't have to worry about what I had done. There was essentially no price of admission that day. I know that chapels are for spiritually sick people that need to be well. The temple might as well have been on another continent. There was no way I saw myself getting into the temple. But the chapel was realistic. I'd passed the chapel on the bus and I can go back to a chapel even if just to sit on the grass.

I walk into the chapel now knowing that I'm going to find the Savior inside, and that he's my advocate. He's my big brother that's glad I'm there. He's like, "Dave, I'm glad you're home. Come on inside. Kick your feet back and enjoy the spirit and today, and this will help recharge your batteries, and you're going to learn more about me here. You're going to remember what it was like to be a child in primary and to feel okay." And now I have access to that wherever I go in the whole world now, I don't even need to recommend to go to the chapel. I can go there now and it has become a sanctuary to me.

KaRyn 45:49 That was Dave.

When we called Dave after hearing his story on our pitch line, we realized that he and my husband Justin actually knew each other, over 20 years ago when they were both preparing to serve missions. So we orchestrated a little reunion for the recording, and I couldn't help but see that word "reunion" echoed in Dave's story.

Sometimes our sacred ground is a long forgotten friend, a tiny chair in a room with carpet halfway up the walls, or a quiet chapel where the organist is practicing hymns for another day. We may have lost touch, walked away, forgotten that we ever felt grounded in that space to begin with, or we may have even chosen to break the bonds of that connection ourselves.

But our Savior is the Redeemer. He is the reconciler. Through him, what is profaned or desecrated can become reestablished, regrounded, reconsecrated. And I think for Dave as he grappled with his addiction and his pride, the chapel became a symbol of everything that he wasn't. But the minute that he let himself become as a little child, and go toward his Redeemer, he found himself in the space where he could actually hear what God was trying to teach him, and in the process, he was reunited to a place, to that sacred ground where the real work could begin.

You know, the sacred grove would not be the only place that our beloved Prophet Joseph Smith would find holy ground in his earthly existence. It was only the start of a lifetime of transformative experiences with deity and a mix of mundane and exalted spaces -- the Susquehanna River, the home of Peter Whitmer Senior, Liberty jail, the Nauvoo temple, the Red Brick store, Carthage.

Each of these places are held with deep reverence not because of the actual land that they exist on, but because of the way they transformed Joseph's faith, and in turn our faith and the way we practice in our effort to walk the path of the Savior. I believe that as we look back upon the story of our lives, if we are seeking and walking that path of discipleship, I think that we'll find that our journey was actually made upon a path of truly sacred ground.

That's it for this episode of This is the Gospel. Thank you to Cody, Dave, and Brad for sharing their stories in their faith. We'll have links to Brad's newest book about the Savior. It's a beautiful one called "Because of the Christ on Calvary," in our show notes, as well as pictures of our storytellers and a transcript of this episode at LDSLiving.com/ThisistheGospel.

A big thank you to all of you for sharing the stories that mean something to you with your friends and your family. We love to hear all the ways that this type of storytelling strengthens your faith in God and love for his children.

If you have a minute, just a minute, to leave a review and a rating on iTunes, that's another way that you can share the good stuff. Every review helps us to show up in the search for more people. All of our stories on this podcast are true and accurate as affirmed by our storytellers, and if you have a story to share about Living the Gospel, please call our pitch line and leave us a pitch. We often find many of our stories and our long lost friends from the pitch line and we love to hear how the gospel has blessed your life. Call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less.

This episode was produced by me KaRyn Lay with additional story producing and editing by Jasmine Mullen, Katie Lambert, and Emily Abel. It was scored, mixed and mastered by Mix at Six Studios and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom.

You can find past episodes of this podcast and other LDS Living podcasts at LDSLiving.com/podcasts. Have a great week.

Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

During a week-long break from running track at Utah State University, Brittany fell in love with climbing the red rocks of southern Utah. And a moonlight rappel from a 200-foot cliff with a friend was just the adventure Brittany was looking for. But that night, adventure quickly turned to tragedy, leaving Brittany with a life-changing diagnosis that ultimately led her to a new relationship with her self and her Savior.

This episode of THIS IS THE GOSPEL is sponsored by the First Light Concert Celebration of the First Vision presented by Deseret Book.

SHOW NOTES

To find the pictures and videos of Brittany's story, head to our shownotes at LDSLIVING.com/thisisthegospel

EPISODE TRANSCRIPT

KaRyn Lay 0:03 Welcome to This Is the Gospel, an LDS living podcast where we feature real stories from real people who are practicing and living their faith every day. I'm your host KaRyn Lay. We all know that person, you know, the one who takes all the hard things that life sends their way and eats them for breakfast. The one who somehow finds the way to remain fully cheerful regardless of their circumstances. And can I tell you a secret? I've always been a little bit suspicious of that person. As someone who generally seeks consistent happiness, but sometimes can't find it, I often wonder if it's all a show- a mask- because I felt the pressure to put on a happy face even when I wasn't feeling it, so why wouldn't someone else? And I guess you could say that I'm a little pessimistic about whether it's actually possible for someone to remain fully optimistic in the midst of really hard things. And then I was put into a church calling with someone that I would have described, once upon a time, as painfully cheerful. From the outside, her life seemed perfect. Her children were perfect. Her hair even seemed perfect. And if she was struggling with anything, it would be impossible to know. And I didn't trust it. I made it my mission to try to figure out what was really under all that optimism and hope. I brought all my suspicions to our joint service. And do you know what I discovered? To my chagrin, as I grew to know and love this woman, I learned that life her life was far from perfect, but her choice to see and speak the positive was as real as it gets. In those moments of conversation, when it would have been easy to head below the line, I could actually see the wheels turning in her heart and in her mind as she worked her way back up to the top, finally landing her words in a place of hope, and goodness, and possibility. Now listen, I'm a huge fan of honoring our vulnerability and allowing our vetted safe people to cradle us in our sorrow, but this wasn't about that. She had her people to mourn with her. But she also made a conscious effort to speak hope. To turn her words and her face to the Savior in all things. And frankly, that's something I'm still trying to learn how to learn.

Well, today we have one story from Brittany who learned her lessons in optimism in a unique way that she believes was tailored specifically to her. Here's Brittany.

Brittany 2:27 In 2012, I was a 21-year-old student athlete at Utah State and I ran cross country in the fall and track in the spring, and I was always on the go. I rarely sat still. And I just loved being in nature. I genuinely loved running. Running in nature is where I would pray and felt closest to God and just loved every moment of life. I had great friends. I was doing well in school. I was healthy, no stress fractures and I felt closest to the Lord than I ever had in my life. And so just every aspect of my life really seemed to be going my way. And it was just this beautiful, busy life that was spent outdoors as much as I possibly could.

So, in March of 2012, our coaches gave us the weekend off before outdoor track season started. So, I took the opportunity to join some friends down in St. George for a little bit of a spring break climbing trip and it was there that I fell in love with the red rocks. I think I went on like six runs in one day. We started climbing at 7:30am - climbed all day- I fit in six runs in between and ended the night I think swimming. So when I got the invitation to go out for a moonlight rappel... If you haven't gotten the gist, I was always up for an adventure... And so when I got that invitation I, I accepted and, and was all for it. And it was there that we went to Cougar cliffs.

Sitting at the top of the cliff, I was just looking up at the stars and had this peaceful feeling while the fellow I with was setting everything up. And once we started the descent of the rappel, I had no idea how big the cliff was. I hadn't seen over the edge. And so as we started rappelling, that rope was really heavy and I never done a repel like this before, of this size. The cliff was 250 feet. And so as the speed kind of picked up, I tried to slow myself down, and my hand was burning so badly that, just kind of like when you touch a hot stove, it was just instinct to let go. We later found out I had a third degree burn on my hands so I had held on for as long as I could to try and slow my slow my descent but... At that point, it was a free fall for the next 80 to 100 feet. If you've ever been cliff jumping into water, it's that same feeling in your stomach or a roller coaster. I couldn't scream. I couldn't make any noise because I was falling so fast. But I kept wondering, when's the ground going to come? When's the ground going to come? And all of a sudden, just bam, there was.I fell about 80 to 100 feet, I hit the ground. From that moment, things went a little blurry.

After the initial shock of the fall, I kind of came to my senses again. I looked up at the sky and how peaceful it was. And the fellow I was with had gone to call for help so, I was all alone. And I knew something was wrong. I assumed there was some bone sticking out in my legs, so I didn't look down at the damage... But as I looked up at the night sky, I just had this peaceful feeling again, and I thought to pray. And I think it was just instinct. And so I tried to roll over for the first time since I had fallen. I tried to roll over to maybe kind of kneel and pray and I couldn't even roll over. I didn't think anything weird of it. I just decided to stay on my back and look up at the stars and pray and it was kind of one of those desperate. "Heavenly Father, you know, please help me. I know I'm in trouble. I don't know what kind of trouble, but, like, if you help me in this situation, I'll do anything you ask." and maybe kind of bargaining with the Lord. But I I just felt such peace as I laid there alone.

Slowly, search and rescue came and found me and started boarding me up. Lifeflight had landed and they were getting ready to take me to the hospital. When search and rescue had been called, they typically get two types of calls: a rescue and recovery. Recovery, they're just going in to get a body and rescue, they're going in to get someone in danger, someone who's hurt in a tight place. And so when they heard my situation, they assumed they were coming in for recovery just to get a body. And so you can imagine their surprise when not only was I alive, but I was awake. And so from there they life flighted me to Las Vegas. I went through all the initial CAT scans and MRIs. And from there, they whisked me away into surgery, and I woke up 10 hours later, 12 hours later, I think, is how long the surgery took, with my mother by my bedside. She had had time to fly from Chicago- book a flight from Chicago and get to the hospital to be by my bedside. But I was still intubated and couldn't speak and my mom was able to just sit by my bedside and read scriptures to me to help me calm down because I'd woken up really anxious. I knew what had happened, but I didn't know why I couldn't talk or move. And so the scriptures were able to just bring peace and I was able to fall back asleep until they could take all the tubes out of my throat.

And the first few days were just cycles of in and out of sleep and pain medicine. I ended up with lots of broken bones in my legs,a burnt right hand and multiple fractures in my spine, including my T 12 vertebrae, which burst instantly paralyzing me from the waist down. The official diagnosis was a spinal cord injury and paraplegic. And it wasn't until I had been moved out of ICU. I had been filled with a lot of optimism and hope in those moments that I was awake. And it wasn't until I had been moved upstairs and I looked down my legs for the first time. I'd been so afraid that there were bone sticking out. But I figured at this point, I've had surgery on my legs. I've had surgery on my back, like, it can't be that bad. And when I looked down, I wanted to see my strong running legs, my great calves and quad muscles that helped me run fast in college. But instead, what I saw were these swollen, lifeless, cut up and bruised legs. That ...was.... that was my first moment of kind of doubt and discouragement crept into my mind. And that was the first time that I questioned "Who am I anymore?" You know, before I was this student athlete, this rock climber and this runner, all these things that I identified with my legs, and that was no more. So I kind of went through this identity crisis, wondering Who am I? doubting myself for the first time.

From Las Vegas, I was eventually transferred to another rehab hospital in Colorado, which was Craig Hospital. It was a hospital just for spinal cord injuries and traumatic brain injuries. And it was there at Craig hospital that I learned to live life again in a wheelchair. I learned how to dress myself; how to go the bathroom; how to drive a car; how to cook in the kitchen. The simplest tasks became such a struggle to learn again, and from there I went through months and months of intense rehabilitation and physical therapy. And even after I was discharged from the hospital, I continued to learn how to walk. Once my bones had healed in my legs. I'd regained some muscle function and sensation in my legs enough to walk with a walker. And then eventually I learned to walk with crutches. And I can take some independent steps on my own, but I fall pretty quickly. And so, it was just this juggling act of wheelchair, walker, and crutches. And it was an intense year of physical therapy and healing both spiritually and emotionally.

I think one of the biggest struggles I had, on top of all the physical pain, there was neuropathic pain, which was unlike anything I'd experienced before. Then there was also just a spiritual stretching, which was painful, as I learned so many new lessons. And the hardest thing physically though, was not having running to cope with anymore which was also emotional because running was my therapy. Running was what I did when I was happy or when I was sad, when I was frustrated or when I was excited. And so finding something to fill that hole that running had left in my life.... It wasn't until about a year and a half into my recovery. I had graduated from Utah State. I had student- taught in my wheelchair. I had walked across the stage at graduation. And I had finally kind of slowed down and realized that this is permanent. That this diagnosis wasn't going anywhere. My paralysis wasn't going away. And that's when I kind of hit my spiritual and emotional low. And that's when I faced the depths of grief and depression. And those were the moments where I felt completely alone and wondered where that promise was that that God had given us saying, "I will not leave you comfortless." There I was, feeling pretty dang comfortless and questioning everything that I had... I knew about our loving Heavenly Father. But I came to learn with perspective in hindsight, during those those months of darkness and depression and grief, that Heavenly Father was aware of what I was going through. He was aware of my loss and my struggles and my sadness, but he had to allow me to feel that darkness... to feel that sadness, so I could understand what others have gone through and will go through and are going through. So I can empathize and have compassion towards them and minister to others.

It was so meaningful to know that the Savior understood my struggles individually because I was facing some really unique circumstances, some pain, some neuropathic pain that literally caused me to cry out in the night. I couldn't even describe the pain to anyone. And learning to go to the bathroom again, the simplest little task that we learn at two years old, I was learning this again and the Savior knew I was struggling with once again. He knew the pain and the loss that I was experiencing. And that meant so much because even other spinal cord injuries didn't know exactly what I was experiencing or feeling. They may have a better understanding, but only the Savior truly knew and had felt that neuropathic pain - had felt that emotional pain and loss that I was experiencing. And, it just helped me feel like I wasn't alone at all. But during that season when I wasn't so optimistic when the grief and and loss and depression was so heavy, it was hard to find the light. And that's where I just practiced CPR: church, prayer, reading the scriptures. It was spiritual CPR and I wasn't feeling it for so many months... But as I continued to do those small and simple things, there was no one light bulb moment when everything came together and I was happy again. It was more of a gradual sunrise. It was more of a gradual coming back to myself... coming back to finding joy and and choosing joy. Because we're taught that it's our reaction to adversity, not adversity itself, that that really matters. And so, we don't always get to choose what happens to us, but we always get to choose how we react. And I don't think Heavenly Father's upset with us when we feel the sadness and the darkness, but just as long as we still choose him at the end of the day.

I believe in a just and loving Heavenly Father, and I believe he doesn't cause bad things to happen, but he allows them to happen. And that night, he allowed that accident to happen. He allowed the effects of gravity to pull me down to the ground and to cause all these broken bones upon impact. I mean, that's the laws of gravity, like God is not only a just and loving God, but He's the God of order. And, and that's a part of it -- our free agency and those consequences. And so I've found a lot of peace and knowing that Heavenly Father didn't cause this to happen, but he allowed it to happen. But he also did so much more in preserving my life. First off, I mean, the fact that I even survived. I know that Heavenly Father was involved in the details. That he preserved my life and not only my life, but my ability to speak and think for myself, and have relationships... because I didn't have a helmet that night, and that there was no brain damage is such a tender mercy, a miracle in itself on top of the miracle of still being alive. So I know that Heavenly Father was involved in the details, but that he didn't cause it to happen, but he allowed it to happen.

My life now is nothing like what I would have pictured myself. If you had asked 21 year old Brittany where she would be in seven years, I would not have painted this picture. But now that I'm living it, it's so beautiful, as I've become a wife and a mother and I have my boys- my husband and my son and my dog --and I still am able to be active and get outdoors. That looks different than what I would have imagined and what I would have preferred running on my own two feet, but I still able to get out there until live a full and beautiful life regardless of my abilities and my circumstances. And each and every one of us can live this beautiful full life that Heavenly Father has planned for, for us as we learn to be content with our circumstances. I learned this before my accident, during my accident and now still. Especially when fall comes around my legs just like yearn to run again in the fall crisp weather. And it's so hard when those feelings of loss and grief resurface. But, then I look at my beautiful life and I realized that gratitude and grief can coexist. You can still mourn your loss. You can still feel the sadness, but you can also still feel so much joy and so much gratitude. And so just allowing myself to feel the sadness, but then to look up and to look around at how beautiful life still is - that I'm still getting out in nature. It may be a little different than it used to be, but I'm still out there. I'm still... I'm still me. I'm still Brittany. And that that has brought a lot of comfort to me knowing that grief and gratitude can coexist.

The other thing that I do is silly and and simple, but I call it two goods and a bad and I've been doing it since I was in high school. And it's just a practice of, you know, you may have a really crappy aspect of your day or life and acknowledging that... but then balancing it out by seeking out good things in life too. And sometimes the bads in our life are really heavy and you have to find 2,3,4,5, 20 good things to help kind of balance out the bad, but, just practicing that two goods and a bad by acknowledging the hard things in life but also seeking out the good and the sweet things.

I came across the scripture in Philippians 4:11 and Alma 29:3 and they both talk about being content with the things which the Lord has allotted you. And the Lord has allotted me so much. He's given me so much. He's given me an opportunity to bear my testimony and to share my light and to become a mother. I don't know if I ever would have slowed down enough to become a wife and a mother if I still had my own two legs to carry me through the mountains and adventure up every peak and canyon. Even if it's on four wheels instead of my own two legs, it still is a beautiful life regardless of my trials. Regardless of my circumstances, I can still become who Heavenly Father... because of my trials and circumstances, I'm able to become who Heavenly Father wants me to be.

KaRyn Lay 21:09 That was Brittany Fisher Frank. Brittany's story of incredible optimism has been featured in so many cool places, including the Today Show and People magazine. Like she said, she truly has had so many opportunities to share her testimony with the world as a result of her experience. And were you as struck as I was by the wisdom that she just casually dropped about grief and gratitude coexisting? I can't stop thinking about that. And I really think that that understanding might be one of the secrets to living a more optimistic life.

Here's my deep thought of the day. So many times we define optimism as the choice between seeing the glass half empty and seeing the glass half full. But I don't think that's quite right. If Brittany's lesson is correct, then the glass really is both things at once. And that means that I dont have to ignore the emptiness in order to see the fullness. The glass just is...in perfect balance without judgment. And I can honor the space where there is no water and also be excited about the water that is there. I think what Brittany's story teaches us is the true nature of the principle of opposition and all things. Maybe, just maybe, true optimism is just allowing ourselves to live in a world filled with the word "and" instead of the word "or."

We met Brittany when we filmed her for an LDS living video documentary, and if you wonder why you can basically hear her smile as she talks about falling off a cliff? Well, that's because she IS smiling as she talks about falling off a cliff. In fact, Brittany sent us several pictures for that documentary and I was shocked as I looked through them to see one of her grinning at the camera as she's being loaded into that lifeflight helicopter. And while we might attribute some of that to the effects of adrenaline and shock, I can honestly say how met and spoken to Brittany. That that's just genuinely who she is - no mask, no pretend, authentic Brittany. But if you were listening closely, you probably heard what I heard. Before her accident Brittany was already practicing her two goods and a bad. Before she ever had to accept the truth about her new life, Brittany was practicing the art of accepting gratitude AND grief. Now, you may write this off and say that she's lucky that she was just born with an innate ability towards optimism. And that may be true because there really are as many spiritual gifts as there are people. But we cannot dismiss the truth of the matter. That positivity, perspective, and peace are some of the fruits of practiced discipleship. If, like me, you don't feel that you already have these gifts the way you wish you did. You can seek them. You can practice toward them.

And here's the best news. Our Savior and our heavenly parents are true optimists. Elder Uchtdorf said this in his October 2014 General Conference talk, "Yes, God loves you this very day and always. He is not waiting to love you until you have overcome your weaknesses and bad habits. He loves you today with a full understanding of your struggles. He is aware that you reach up to him in heartfelt and hopeful prayer. He knows of the times that you've held on to the fading light and believed even in the midst of growing darkness. He knows of your sufferings. He knows of your remorse for the times you have fallen short or failed, and he still loves you. He knows everything about you. He sees you clearly. He knows you as you really are and He loves you today and always." Isn't that so interesting? We, you and I, are God's half empty, half full glass of water. He sees all of us and the Atonement of Jesus Christ makes it possible for us to be filled up with and feel the love of God, whether we find ourselves in joyful or dire circumstances, or both. And to me, that is some good news worth smiling about.

That's it for this episode of This Is the Gospel. Thank you to Brittany Fisher Frank and her family for letting us invade with cameras and recording equipment last year. We'll have links to the video we made with Brittany including that picture of the lifeflight transport and a transcript of this episode in our show notes at LDS living.com/thisisthegospel.

If you have a minute to tell us what you love about this podcast, we would love to hear it. Please leave us a review on iTunes. And if you're not sure how to do that, go to our Instagram @thisisthegospel_podcast and in our highlights wewill have all the instructions on how to leave a review. It really does help us and it helps more people to find this podcast. All of the stories on this podcast are true and accurate as affirmed by our storytellers. If you have a story to share about living the Gospel, please call our pitch line and leave us a pitch. We often find many of our stories from the pitch line and we love to hear how the gospel is blessing your life. Call 515-519-6179 and pitch your story in three minutes or less. This episode was produced by Sarah Blake with additional story producing and editing by Jasmine Mullen, Ashley Porter and me, KaRyn Lay. it was scored, mixed, and mastered by mix at six studios and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. You can find past episodes of this podcast and other LDS living podcasts at LDSliving.com/podcasts. Have a lovely week.

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Show Notes + Transcripts: http://ldsliving.com/thisisthegospel

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