In this episode, Oliver talks to Dr Murray Horn, former Secretary of the New Zealand Treasury and former CEO of ANZ.

They talk about the fiscal challenges facing the new government as it prepares its first budget amidst high inflation, recession, and mounting debt.

Murray provides his expert perspective on what reforms are needed to control spending and put New Zealand's fiscal framework on a more sustainable trajectory, advocating for a focus on results, strengthened fiscal responsibility principles, public service leadership changes, clarified priorities, and improved service delivery.