The 100th episode is here!

Luke and Davina look back on the podcast - how it started out, where it has come to, what they have learned so far. They also go on conversational detours, considering their own perspectives on this profession, including current discussions about diversity, inclusion and race, along with the nature of music in music therapy, and how individual, as well as multi-faceted, this work is. What were the original intentions for the podcast? Who helped get it started? What's Luke's favourite episode? All will be revealed!

Thanks are also given to all those people who have helped with the podcast, including all the interviewees to date. 

More podcasts to come, but this was a moment to look back and reflect. 

For those people who have been asking Luke, 'When will you be interviewed?', this is (sort of) an answer to that question. 

For anyone interested in getting involved as an interviewer, please contact Luke via email: [email protected] 

References and links

Annesley, L. (2014). The music therapist in school as outsider. British Journal of Music Therapy, 28(2), 36-43.

Vencatasamy, D. (2023). The importance of being diverse: Exploring the journey from Brexit to Belonging. British Journal of Music Therapy, 37(1), 28-35.

Ethan Hein's podcast episode about 'Stormy Monday', referred to in the conversation:

https://ethanhein.substack.com/p/they-call-it-stormy-monday 

Davina talks to Michele Forinash DA, MT-BC, LMHC about her experiences working with AIDS patients in hospice in the 1980s, topics around white supremacy and colonialism in music therapy, Michele's experiences as a queer music therapist, and the decolonisation of research and practice. This is a rich and inspiring interview with a music therapist with deep insights from a long and varied career to date. 

Michele is Professor & Director of the PhD program in the Expressive Therapies Department at Lesley University, Cambridge, MA. Michele, a white, cis, Queer woman, has been involved in music therapy since 1981. Michele's research and publications have focused on supervision, doctoral education, LGBTQIA+ topics, arts-based research, and music therapy history. Michele is a former President of the American Music Therapy Association and former Chair of the National Coalition of Creative Arts Therapy.

Tessa Watson is a music therapist and trainer. She is Associate Professor and Programme Leader for the MA Music Therapy at University of Roehampton and works in that setting with colleagues across the Arts and Play Therapies and other HCPC registered professions. She has extensive clinical experience in mental health and learning disability work and her current music therapy work is with the children and families who use Alexander Devine Hospice. Tessa has an interest in co-production and is one of the founders of HENCoP (The Health Education Network for Co-Production).

Tessa has published and spoken widely about her music therapy work to support adults with profound and multiple learning disabilities, the experience of women in secure psychiatric settings, multi-disciplinary work and learning and teaching music therapy. She has contributed to the development of the profession in the UK (BAMT) and internationally (EMTC) and in 2020 led the BAMT online conference which attracted over 570 delegates. Tessa is an HCPC partner, working on CPD and FTP schemes. She plays cello and sings in local amateur musical groups.

Tessa’s most recent book, written with Cathy Warner is Contemporary Issues in Music Therapy Training, A Resource for Trainees, Trainers and Practitioners (Routledge 2024).

Some other notable publications are ‘Music Therapy with Adults with Learning Disabilities - a view from the United Kingdom’ in The Handbook of Music Therapy (2024), ‘Supporting the Unplanned Journey’ in Collaboration and Assistance in Music Therapy Practice (2017), ‘The World is Alive! Music Therapy with Adults with Learning Disabilities’ in the Oxford Handbook of Music Therapy, OUP (2016), Integrated Team Working: Music Therapy as Part of Transdisciplinary and Collaborative Approaches, London; Jessica Kingsley Publishers (2008) with Karen Twyford, and Music Therapy with Adults with Learning Disabilities, London; Routledge (2007).

Links:

https://www.routledge.com/Contemporary-Issues-in-Music-Therapy-Training-A-Resource-for-Trainees-Trainers-and-Practitioners/Watson-Warner/p/book/9781032853963?srsltid=AfmBOoqv92gfeHbBxe_zmiemr1pyCC769xqTMPqxlu1E7Hfqo-imlCXw

https://alexanderdevine.org/

https://www.roehampton.ac.uk/study/postgraduate-taught-courses/music-therapy/

In episode 97, Davina Vencatasamy talks to her friend and distinguished colleague Jasmine Edwards.

Jasmine Edwards, MA, LCAT, MT-BC (she/her) is a doctoral candidate and fellow within Steinhardt Music Education with a focus in music therapy at New York University. Jasmine holds a BM and MA in music therapy from Florida State University and NYU, respectively. Her clinical experiences include private practice, outpatient, school-based, community, and medical pediatric settings, and she is trained in NICU-MT, First Sounds: RBL, and Austin Vocal Psychotherapy. Jasmine has a vested interest in elevating dialogues about cultural humility within music therapy education and clinical practice within both her teaching and academic writing. She has served as an adjunct faculty member in the music therapy departments at Howard University, New York University, Montclair State University, Nazareth College, Duquesne University, and Molly University.

Tamsin is a multi-instrumentalist and composer with roots in the traditional dance tunes of the British Isles. Her debut solo album FREY (2022) established her as a rising star on the folk scene, with The Guardian praising her "beautiful, filmic compositions for accordion, harp, whistle and voice”. In this work Tamsin explores themes of limbo, pain, healing and acceptance, reflecting on the microcosm of her personal experience of chronic illness alongside wider themes of societal disconnection and environmental grief. Her forthcoming record The Meeting Tree celebrates connection, nature and the joy of sharing tunes with friends.

Tamsin’s critically-acclaimed collaboration with Egyptian oud player Tarek Elazhary explores the parallels and celebrates the idiosyncrasies of Egyptian Maqam music and English folk traditions. Their friendship and resulting duo album So Far We Have Come is a testament to the unifying power of music, and won them a place in The Guardian’s Top Ten Folk Albums of 2023, as well as a nomination for Best Group at the Songlines Music Awards.

A versatile composer-performer, Tamsin also contributes to chamber-folk quintet Hedera and festival-favourite Mediterranean fusion band Solana. As a Musician in Residence at UHBW NHS Trust, she channels her musical passion into healing and connection, writing new music on lever harp and playing for patients on wards including the ICU.

This episode was recorded in Tamsin's studio in Bristol and it includes performances recorded especially for the podcast. Luke and Tamsin also discuss her work as a musician in residence and her cross-cultural musical collaborations.

Tamsin's website, which includes details of recodings and forthcoming live dates, is here.

In this episode, Davina Vencatasamy talks to Dr Chamari Wedamulla.

Chamari is an independent researcher specialising in music education, with expertise in integrating music therapy approaches to enhance student mental health and well-being. Previously affiliated with the Royal Birmingham Conservatoire and Birmingham City University,  Chamari contributed to the Fair & Inclusive Music Midlands (FIMM) project commissioned by Arts Council England, exploring the perceptions of the Midlands music education landscape and current learning barriers faced by young people, while coordinating with a range of key stakeholders and organisations within the field. Chamari's  PhD in Music Education and Music Therapy (Kingston University, London) focused on employing music therapy techniques in education to support adolescents’ mental health. She was a steering group member of EDI MS, which is a cross-organisational network which aims to promote, support and share good practice in relation to Equality, Diversity and Inclusion in Music Higher Education in the UK. Chamari has co-authored reports for Arts Council England and contributed to publications such as The Routledge Companion to Women and Musical Leadership (2024).

Luke speaks to Jonathan 'Jaytee' Tang about his PhD research, which makes links between music therapy, music psychology and cultural psychology. They discuss the concepts of independent vs interdependent self-construal, and the relevance of this to musical interactions. This has some fascinating implications for music therapy practice.

Jonathan (Jaytee) Tang has over nine years of international clinical experience as a music therapist, having worked in medical, special education, and mental health settings. His work with individuals and families from diverse cultural backgrounds fueled his passion for exploring the interconnections between culture, music, and well-being. Currently pursuing a PhD at the University of Sheffield, Jonathan’s research focuses on how culture shapes emotional responses to music. His doctoral project specifically investigates the influence of cultural models of selfhood on affective experiences with music. 

Reference

Taylor, S. E., Welch, W. T., Kim, H. S., & Sherman, D. K. (2007). Cultural differences in the impact of social support on psychological and biological stress responses. Psychological Science, 18(9), 831–837. https://doi.org/10.1111/j.1467-9280.2007.01987.x

Colin Lee talks to Martin Lawes about his musicology-oriented approach as a Nordoff-Robbins trained music therapist, and about the newly published Oxford Handbook of Queer and Trans Music Therapy which he edited. The podcast begins and ends with music. To start with, a composition by a music therapist commissioned to begin the handbook. To conclude, an improvisation from a music therapy session where Colin explains his musical decision-making as a therapist. Colin Andrew Lee studied piano at the Nordwestdeutsche Musikakademie and subsequently earned his postgraduate diploma in music therapy from the Nordoff-Robbins Music Therapy Centre, London, UK. Colin was awarded the Music Therapy Charity research fellowship completing his doctoral thesis on the analysis of improvisations with people living with HIV/AIDS at London Lighthouse, a center for people facing the challenge of AIDS. He continued his clinical work at Sir Michael Sobell House Hospice, Oxford, UK. After immigrating to North America, Colin taught at Berklee College of Music, Boston, USA, and later at Wilfrid Laurier University, Waterloo, Canada. Following the publication of Music at the Edge: The music therapy experiences of a musician with AIDS (1996, 2016), he subsequently created the theory of aesthetic music therapy that was the subject of Colin's monograph, The Architecture of Aesthetic Music Therapy (2003). Colin recently edited The Oxford Handbook of Queer and Trans Music Therapy (2024), and is currently editing The Oxford Handbook of Improvisation in Music Therapy. His research interests also include the analysis of postminimalist composers and their influence on the study of applied health musicology.

References Lee, C. A. (2024) The Oxford Handbook of Queer and Trans Music Therapy. Oxford University Press. https://doi.org/10.1093/oxfordhb/9780192898364.001.0001 Lee, C. A. & Dromey, C. (2023). Towards an applied health musicology: Aesthetic music therapy and beyond. In C. Dromey (Ed.), The Routledge Companion to Applied Musicology (pp. 184-191). Routledge. https://doi.org/10.4324/9781003042983

Tilly Mütter has repeated her roving reporter trick from EMTC 2022. This time she talks to various conference attendees at the BAMT conference in Leicester in May 2024, providing a variety of interesting perspectives on the weekend. the theme of the conference was 'About All of Us, For All of Us, By All of Us', with the primary aims of highlighting and promoting the development of Music Therapy. There are some familiar voices here (to Music Therapy Conversations listeners) along with some new ones. In order of appearance, Tilly spoke to: Naviella Dowds, Anthony Voelcker, Kelly Fraser, Duncan Campbell, Marianne Rizkallah, Helen Odell-Miller, Hakeem Leonard, Kirsty Jane, Kendra Bodden and Karen Diamond. A big thanks to all of these contributors! Before that, Tilly and Luke also share their own (somewhat hazy) recollections in the introduction. You can find another view from Marianne Rizkallah on her blog here, and no doubt there are more conference reports incoming. There were some fresh faces at this conference, new formats, and many inspiring moments, in a different sort of venue - plenty to reflect on and learn from!

In episode 91, Davina speaks to Crystal Luk-Worrall about EMDR and music therapy. Crystal Luk-Worrall is a music therapist and EMDR therapist working with the adoption community in London through her private practice Clap and Toot, as well as working with bereaved families through her work at Shooting Star Children’s Hospices. She enjoys exploring multi-modality practice and systemic practice. Crystal also supports fellow freelance therapists and newly qualified therapists through her role as BAMT’s freelance network coordinator. 

Clap and Toot | Music Therapy