Next Level Agents: The Kevin & Fred Show - Interviews with the best and brightest minds in the real estate industry

Adults don’t need to be instructed, they simply need to be reminded.  

Pain will always be the leader in the lessons of our lives. If you chase the pain, you learn the lessons quicker. Chase the pain of growth, the pain of the next level. The things you have avoided will always show up on your doorstep like a bill collector. 

The better you get in your life, the better your business gets. How can an organization provide everything people need to succeed and they still fail? One person can take a strategy 100 miles and another can take the same strategy and only push it for 2 feet. That’s because the majority of success is based on our psychology. 

There’s only going to be 2 agents in the marketplace this year - the drama agent and the growing agent. 

Signs of a drama agent; 

These are the symptoms of someone who will fail. 

Signs of a growing agent; 

A lot of leaders make shit happen, get comfortable and then expect everyone around them to make shit happen. 

What do you want, specifically?

The reason the brain likes to make it vague, foggy is so it doesn’t set up conditions for failure. When you get specific on what you want, now you know if you’re failing or succeeding. 

Success can be a really terrible teacher. It can teach you that you don’t need to keep going. You may not need more money but your spirit needs more growth. 

Guest Bio 

Dustin Runyon is a real estate team leader, speaker, coach and connection specialist. He is a stimulant for change, helping thousands find their truth and their path in order to create a life they can truly be proud of. Helping guide companies and individuals break into their power! 

Dustin believes we need the truth in order to move forward and that your truth lies inside of you waiting to be faced, waiting to be confronted with arms of openness and readiness.

Runyon dreams of a world where we are filled with joy, fulfillment and a deep need to give and serve those around us. A world where we are excited about who we are and are moving towards becoming more of who we were destined to become. A place where we help instead of hurt, give instead of take and love instead of hate. His mission is to create just that. He hopes that you decide to take part.

Head to https://www.dustinrunyon.com/ for more information. To sign up for Fired Up Fridays visit https://firedupfridays.com/. 

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In our industry, owning a brokerage has always been seen as the pinnacle of success. But for many owners who love what real estate offers but not running a brokerage, it’s a necessary evil. 

Owning a brokerage is a doorway to many great things, but what happens when that starts to hinder your excellence in the areas you really care about? That’s where Keith Riddle found himself. After becoming an indie brokerage owner, almost by accident, he realized he didn’t have to control everything to be successful. 

It’s like a saw mill. Back in the day, saw mill owners put all their focus on the trees and planks, and gave away the wood chips and sawdust for free. Today, saw mill owners realize that there’s actually a ton of money in the wood chips and sawdust, so why not let someone else run the mill? In real estate, Keith kept the brokerage for the ancillary benefits, but he came to realize that he doesn’t have to run the brokerage to get those benefits. 

Many of us think we make more by controlling the entire process, but that’s not the case.  

That’s why he has chosen to move his brokerage to eXp. He can get the wood chips without running the brokerage out of obligation. Today he shares how he came to this decision, the trap many business owners find themselves in and the mindset shift that will set you free. 

Guest Info

Keith Riddle is an investor, Saas & iBuyer Software Developer and the CEO and Designated Broker at Synergy Properties & Development. 

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Making a change, whether it’s to a belief system, a business model or brokerage is something many people won’t do, even if it would benefit them. Only people who think critically and aren’t caught up in ego are willing to shift how they see things when presented with new information. 

Being willing to change our beliefs publicly means people reminding us of what we believed or said before, or even being labeled as a flip flop. There’s a huge difference between an emotionally intelligent person and someone who changes with the wind. In real estate, too many people hold onto a belief or business model simply because they can’t take the ego risk of being seen differently. 

The problem is, that keeps us in places that might not be beneficial to us anymore, even if we’re seemingly being rewarded for it. The more accustomed we get to constantly re-examining and reconciling what we believe, the more we grow as people and as business owners. 

Today, Chris Bowers and I discuss this and the power of challenging our thoughts and mindsets.

Guest Info

Chris Bowers is a Realtor, Investor and owner of the Bowers Team, and the host of The agentXcel podcast. Chris has been in real estate for over 16 years, but he has been an entrepreneur since his teens. Today, Chris and his wife run a successful team selling over 140 units with half of those being Chris’ personal production. He has also built a solid rental portfolio that continues to grow to this day. 

Follow @chrisbowers_realestate on Instagram and listen to agentXcel on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.  

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Profit - it’s the whole entire point that we run businesses. For such a critical, and even fundamental topic, agents will talk about everything else but whether or not they are making a profit, and there’s a reason. 

Staying on top of your numbers requires a scary level of maturity. Whatever financial decision we make has an impact on the bottom line, and that level of responsibility is so uncomfortable, we’d rather avoid it altogether. It’s the equivalent of stepping on the scale and knowing we have to make lifestyle changes to take care of our health. 

If we ran a publicly traded company, every decision would need to be justified to a board, a CFO, and a whole horde of people. In real estate, we can get away with not doing that, but it’s something we must force on ourselves if we really do want to be profitable. 

How do we overcome the Fear of Finding Out? What’s so powerful about getting in rooms with smart people? 

Chris Bowers and I continue our deep dive conversation on real estate, curating relationships and the power of masterminds. 

Guest Info

Chris Bowers is a Realtor, Investor and owner of the Bowers Team, and the host of The agentXcel podcast. Chris has been in real estate for over 16 years, but he has been an entrepreneur since his teens. Today, Chris and his wife run a successful team selling over 140 units with half of those being Chris’ personal production. He has also built a solid rental portfolio that continues to grow to this day. 

Follow @chrisbowers_realestate on Instagram and listen to agentXcel on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.  

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In the conversation about scaling our real estate businesses, systems come up a lot, but that’s not the first and most important thing. Systems come a distant second to people, because ultimately, how can we step out of specific roles and tasks if we have no one to hand them off to? 

Because we don’t put the necessary premium on hiring and people, we don’t get to fully experience their effect. Like cold calls, scripts, and negotiation, hiring is a skill we need to nurture, focus on and master. In this business, agents will have one bad experience with a hire, and tell themselves “hiring sucks”, instead of thinking that they hired the wrong person, or that they hired the right person, but didn’t set them up for success. 

A lot of agents don’t know when it’s the right time to hire. The simple answer is: when you’re doing all you can and you can’t do more. It’s not about hiring when someone says you should from the stage or when your real estate buddy hires someone with a fancy title. Hire based on your goals, and what you want to step out of. We have to master the art of recruiting way before we need the hire, because that’s the secret. 

How did we approach our own hiring? Why did we hire probably long before we were really “ready”? Chris Bowers and I talk about the power of treating hiring like a skill (because it is). 

Guest Info

Chris Bowers is a Realtor, Investor and owner of the Bowers Team, and the host of The agentXcel podcast. Chris has been in real estate for over 16 years, but he has been an entrepreneur since his teens. Today, Chris and his wife run a successful team selling over 140 units with half of those being Chris’ personal production. He has also built a solid rental portfolio that continues to grow to this day. 

Follow @chrisbowers_realestate on Instagram and listen to agentXcel on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.  

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Intro Paragraph/Email 

Without a doubt, Warren Buffett and Charlie Munger are 2 of the greatest investing minds of all time. Because they’ve been at it for so long, they’ve seen market highs and market lows,  and built a massive holding company where the main share trades at $538k. 

These guys have got to know a thing or two about how to build and keep wealth. That’s why thousands go to their annual shareholder meeting every year. But you don’t have to go to Omaha to get the benefit of their brilliance. Every year, they publish a shareholder letter and it’s absolutely packed with nuggets that apply today. 

In a volatile market like the one we’re in right now, maybe some of the greatest wisdom we can gain is from the past. That’s what led Brian Gubernick to go digging into Berkshire Hathaway shareholder letters from the 1980s, 1990s and 2000s. 

There’s got to be strategies we can learn from these investing greats to better our own portfolios…well their advice will surprise you. It’s not as flashy as you think, but considering what Warren and Charlie built, it’s worth paying attention to. 

Today, Brian goes through his top takeaways from taking a deep dive into these investor newsletters.

Guest Info

Brian Gubernick is a 15+ year residential real estate industry veteran, having held the roles of real estate investor, sales agent, sales team owner/leader, expansion (multi-state) team owner, brokerage operating partner, coach/trainer, and corporate executive. He is the co-founder of the Metrix Mastermind, Chief Real Estate Officer at PLACE and host of No Days Off.

Listen to No Days Off on your platform of choice. 

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Anytime an agent gets an appointment from a cold call, it’s like walking into a war zone. They don’t know you, like you or trust you, so they aren’t exactly warm and fuzzy when you go and meet them…unless they’ve already viewed a ton of your content online. 

Having a YouTube channel can take people from not knowing who you are to rolling out the red carpet for you. It warms the lead up before you even meet them, and when it comes to signing a listing agreement - it’s nothing more than a formality. 

Chris Igoe’s YouTube channel has become a solid source of business, but that took weeks of figuring it out, understanding the algorithm and months upon months of consistency for it to pay off. 

Today, he shares his journey into real estate, discovering his superpower and how he is making YouTube work massively well for him. 

Quotes 

The great thing about this industry is you can just copy someone and get results to a varying degree. The problem is it might not be the best result for you. -Kevin Kauffman 

The best thing anyone can do in any industry they’re in is build up their brand on YouTube. -Chris Igoe 

There were people having success and generating leads through YouTube, if they could do it, I can do it. -Chris Igoe 

If someone was going to hire me through a cold call, they would probably Google me and I wanted them to know I was real. -Chris Igoe 

Many of the things that used to work on YouTube have been obsolete for a very long time. The only thing that matters is pleasing its audience. -Chris Igoe 

Key Points  

Good mentor vs. great mentor 

The great thing about this industry is you can copy someone and get results but that is a double-edged sword because that might not be the best  for you. Good mentors will show you how they did it and create a path to follow. Great mentors will take time to ask questions, and find out whether the activities line up with who you are as a person. 

Find your superpower and double down

The advice new agents get is to blindly follow whatever model works. The truth is: whether you choose cold calling, social media or referrals, all the models work, but everyone has their own unique superpower. The key is figuring out what that is, playing to your strengths and consistently hammering at it until you have success. When Chris realized that cold calling was his superpower, he went from making $25k in his first year to millions in volume. 

Warm up the lead before you meet 

When you get an appointment off a cold call, you’re going into a war zone. They don’t know, like or trust you and they are getting hounded by other agents. Before you even show up to their door, they will Google you so having a deep catalog of content on YouTube starts the process of warming them up. 

What works on YouTube 

Many of the things that used to work on YouTube have been obsolete for a very long time. The only thing that matters is pleasing its audience. We have to understand our ideal viewer/customer and get really specific so we can craft and create that right-fit content.  

The metrics don’t matter 

When you’re creating YouTube content, it’s really easy to get caught up in the vanity metrics - how many views, likes, subscribes and shares you’re getting. If you’re doing YouTube to get more leads and transactions, the vanity metrics don’t matter. What counts is how many leads this is generating, and how it’s leading to more buyers and sellers. 

Guest Info

Chris is a real estate professional, investor, and retired stockbroker providing current housing market analysis with financial and economic market commentary. He empowers people with the truth to make the best decisions for themselves, their families and the financial bottom line.

Subscribe to Chris’ YouTube channel. 

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In real estate, agents, teams and business models don’t fit in one box, but we constantly fall into the trap of doing things one specific way. People start teams because it’s the next indicated step, what everyone else is doing or an ego boost, not because it’s what works for them. If ego, identity and emotion weren’t part of our decision making, the paths we’d take would be more authentic. If we treated our businesses as if we reported to a board of directors, we would make decisions differently. 

That’s why it’s so necessary to get into environments that pull our businesses apart so we can make them better. Whether you’re a solo agent or a mega-team leader, we need to be in rooms that force us to pivot in the direction of what’s right for us. 

Most agents won’t take this step because their identities and egos are wrapped up in where they are now. Ultimately, the decisions we made before are the tuition we pay to get to the destination we want. Today, fellow Arizona agents, Angela Gordon and Trevor Halpern join me to talk about the decisions we make, what we’re looking forward to in 2024, and choosing the right model for you (even if it goes against the status quo). 

Caring about people and learning about them is a great strategy for business. -Kevin Kauffman

If you can get a room full of givers, you’re winning. -Angela Gordon

When you strip down a team and the revenue model often times, team leads aren’t making that much money. -Trevor Halpern

We’re always being sold the next shiny object, but most agents aren’t focused enough so we’re really easy to take advantage of as a community. -Kevin Kauffman

The only person that’s going to give you a plan, structure and help you implement is you. -Trevor Halpern

It’s okay to say that something doesn’t work for us and pivot. If you put a lot of time, effort and money into something that failed, it’s only a failure if you don't take lessons from it. You can use the lessons from that to make more money or better decisions going forward. 

Our businesses take the biggest leaps when we get around other people and learn from them. There’s a time to hunker down, but there’s also a time to get ideas, insights and pull apart our businesses to make them better. The problem is, most people do one or the other - both pieces are necessary, they aren’t sufficient alone. We have to find the balance between taking in information and taking action based on that information. 

As agents, we get so caught up on the brokerage we’re at and how our clients might react to us changing. The truth is, the consumer doesn’t care what brokerage you’re at, it’s not that big a deal to them. Ultimately, the relationship they have with us overrides their relationship with our companies. 

Guest Info

Trevor Halpern is a Phoenix based Realtor with over a decade in the business. As the founder of Halpern Residential, Trevor takes pride in delivering high-level strategy, efficient negotiations and precise tactical execution. He conducts his life and business by simple rules: treat people with respect; lead with honesty; put more than he gets out; and do the right thing 100% of the time. Follow @halpernresidential on Instagram. 

Angela is the host of Ponderbox and a real estate agent who focuses on the east valley cities of Phoenix, Arizona.  With an emphasis on community impact and support of local businesses.  As an agent who finished 2022 in the top 1% in Maricopa county, rest assured, the experience you have with her will be one you will rave about. Follow @angelagordon_ on Instagram. 

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We may not see it this way, but real estate isn’t as risky as we think. In fact, in many ways, we’re conditioned against taking risks, and that’s why leverage is such a hard concept for the majority of our industry. Think about the restaurant business - leverage is built in from day 1, you know that you’ll need a manager, front of house, chefs and servers so you take loans and do what you need for the business to succeed. In real estate, leverage is a line we cross kicking and screaming, and that actually harms our businesses in the long run. 

There are many reasons why we won’t invest in leverage - we don’t think we have the time, the money or even the ability to let go. All these reasons are barriers we can overcome. With the right strategy and roadmap, leverage is something we can implement. What are the roles that can propel out businesses if we hire them? How do we overcome our limiting beliefs about leverage? 

Today, founder and CEO of Rocket Sphere VA, Justin Nelson shares how VAs can make your business more valuable. 

Quotes 

Being a solo agent’s not a problem but being a solo agent with no leverage can be a big problem. -Justin Nelson 

Key Points  

Why you need leverage 

Comparison isn’t always bad for you

Reinvest your time wisely 

How to seamlessly integrate VAs into your business 

If you had $50k to spare, this is how to build out your leverage;

VA hiring order for agents; 

Use leverage to retain the best people 

Guest Info

Justin Nelson is an entrepreneur, leader, coach to Top Producers and CEO of Sphere Rocket VA, an 8-Figure Company with 5800 VAs. 

For more information, head to www.sphererocketva.com. 

To get access to all the files and documents mentioned today, head to sphererocketfiles.com. 

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“The road to success and the road to failure are almost exactly the same.” On any given day, we’re walking a tightrope between success and failure, but when we’re in a good market and a time of abundance, we don’t see how thin that line is. Right now, we’re in a time where our bad decisions, bad business practices and bad habits are being exposed. 

Leadership is a constant conversation of caring. -Ben Kinney

We get paid to help humans make good life decisions with their most valuable asset. -Ben Kinney 

If we’re struggling in our businesses today, that means you’re not having enough empathetic conversations. -Ben Kinney 

The number 1 killer of a business is optimism. -Ben Kinney

Why we quit 

Quitting is easier than plugging away at something when it gets hard. Whenever you start something new, there’s this unfounded amount of optimism, but ultimately, reality will set in and we sink into the pit of despair. This happens with every new thing. Real happiness comes from digging out of the pit and enjoying the journey. 

The undisciplined pursuit of more 

As human beings and business owners, we tend to think that if we’re doing great in one thing, we can take on something else. We think that more will solve our problems so we add a bunch of stuff to our lives. It’s fine when things are going good, but when things start to go pear-shaped, it collapses on us. We have to master boredom if we want success. 

Treat leadership like parenting 

Every real estate leader has found themselves frustrated because their agents aren’t calling leads. Instead of putting it on your agents, point your frustration back to yourself because it’s a leadership problem. How many times do you have to tell your kids not to touch something hot? Why do we expect adults to be different? You have to have the conversations over and over, find different ways to say it and even find other people to say it.  

The variables you need to put pressure on 

If you’re not succeeding, you need to fix one of those 3 things. If you have a team, you need one more thing: enough people saying the right things. 

Expect 2024 to be filled with great opportunities for 50-75% of the year, but in the first couple of months, we should be filling our hopper with people that would take action if rates drop 1 or 2%. We have to spend the first 2 months making sure the entire year is kickass instead of feeling bad for ourselves. At the same time, don’t have rose-colored glasses that it will magically happen in 90 days. Optimism can be deadly in our business, so we have to maintain a healthy balance. 

Guest Info

Ben Kinney is an entrepreneur, professional speaker, author, real estate agent, and CEO of Ben Kinney Companies. He owns and operates one of the top 25 producing real estate teams in the nation from all brands. He also owns and operates multiple Keller Williams Realty Franchises that includes 1200+ agents across multiple locations servicing all of Washington State. In 2015 he opened his first international brokerage in London, UK and in 2016 he purchased the KW master franchise for all of the U.K. Those offices sold over 10,000 units equalling over 4 billion in closed sales volume. Ben is also a nationally recognized author, trainer, and speaker. In the last few years, he has personally trained over 100,000 business owners via conferences, classes, and webinars.  Ben Kinney Real Estate Team is ranked by the Wall Street Journal and Real Trends as one of the top 25 real estate teams in the nation. 

https://www.youtube.com/BenKinney

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