In this episode, Tim chats with psychologist and theologian Richard Beck about his book The Shape of Joy, which explores the idea that much of modern misery stems from a life turned inward—and that joy comes when we shift our attention beyond ourselves.

Drawing on ancient theology, modern psychology, and lived experience, Richard challenges the dominance of a belief-centric, self-focused faith and invites us into a more outward-facing spirituality. He unpacks the difference between therapeutic introspection and the kind of excessive rumination that often leaves us stuck, and offers a vision of spiritual practices that open us to the world, to others, and to the divine.

After the interview, Nomad hosts Tim and Anna reflect on how Richard’s insights resonate with their own journeys—particularly their experiences of rumination, mental health, the role of spiritual practices, and the inward/outward tension in modern life.

Interview starts at 16m 11s

Books, quotes, links →

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