Church leaders seldom crash and burn because they fail at preaching or ministering. Christian leaders often burn out because they don’t know how to manage themselves and what they’re experiencing. In the second episode of a two-part conversation we lay the groundwork for understanding how human relationships work and our part in those relationships referencing the eight concepts of family systems theory developed by Murray Bowen.  Ruth is joined by a new friend R. Robert Creech (PhD, Baylor University), an experienced pastor and seminary teacher.  Robert is the director of pastoral ministries at George W. Truett Theological Seminary, Baylor University, in Waco, Texas and is the author of several books.

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