Show Notes – The Potters Cast

Trevor Foster | Episode 1266

Trevor Foster is an American ceramic artist based in Chiang Mai, Thailand. Tevor’s intricately sculpted porcelain vessels, tiles, and objects explore mortality, ritual, historical craft, and dark humor. Throughout his career, Trevor has built an international studio practice while learning from artists including Doug Jeck, Charles Krafft, and Shin Koyama.

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Trevor, I don’t think that there’s anything fun about anything being stolen. The question though is that there’s a lot of people who will “find inspiration” from someone else work. What makes the difference between being inspired by another artist and stealing from another artist?

Oh, I think that’s kind of night and day. I got lucky, I think, because it was blatantly stolen and it made a case for it. Inspiration is okay. I mean, there’s other people who make skull cups or octopus cups or another thing that I make out there. But my thing is, as long as you make it different and hopefully make it a little bit better, I don’t see any problem with that at all. if you’re making it from scratch. If you buy something that somebody else made and you take a direct cast of it, that becomes a little of a different thing. With all this AI and stuff nowadays, everything’s getting a little squirrely. Right. In a way, I feel lucky that it was so blatant because if he would have made a few changes other than the logo, I probably wouldn’t have had a case in this kind of thing. And a lot of cases similar to this are probably in a more gray area. So it’s a difficult thing to navigate. And I was just lucky that mine was a little bit more black than gray, like most cases probably are.

When somebody steals from you, what’s something that is taken that people who aren’t artists might not understand?

Well, I just think all of the hours leading up to it and just from art school to conversations you had to life circumstances that made you create that thing, they’re just cutting the queue. They didn’t go through. They got to the peak of the mountain without hiking up there, and that’s disheartening.

When it was resolved, what was the feeling that you experienced when you got word that the case had been won?

Once I saw that it had been resolved, it was just a great feeling. I mean, the whole experience, oddly enough, was kind of positive. There was the community that supported me. There was the foundation that supported me. I just got really lucky. I don’t know. I think it could have happened 10 more times than I wouldn’t have, but gotten lucky or had the outcome that I did. But I just felt really grateful. It actually led to more sales and more followers and a better community and some kind of settlement. So the whole thing was positive, which is amazing because it really was not a positive situation.

Did you have any kind of public apology sent your way?

No, there wasn’t anything like that. There was never an apology, but I think that the settlement was kind of enough of an apology for me.

Can I just change the subject just a little bit from your stolen art to now just you as a sculptor? What’s your favorite tool in the studio as a sculptor.

Oh, there’s like these little serrated, like a kayak paddle. And I think that, I’m not sure what company that makes them. I can only get a Seattle pottery supply, but it matches like a miniature kayak paddle. And then on, there are two round ones and they’re serrated on either side. That’s my favorite one. I don’t have a name for it. It is like a little serrated kayak paddle that’s six inches long.

Book

Japanese Death Poems, compiled by Yoel Hoffmann

Contact

trevorfosterstudio.com

Instagram: @trevorfosterstudio

Alex Arden | Episode 1265

Alex Arden is a high school art and ceramics teacher with an MFA in Ceramic Arts and 19 years of experience guiding others in creative practice. After years devoted to teaching, Alex is reclaiming studio space and returning to a personal ceramic practice—exploring new ideas, forms, and a renewed relationship with clay.

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I appreciate, Alex, that you wanted to take a one-year break and just give your brain a chance to reset. And that one year stretched out to 2 to 3 to 5 to 8 years, and you realize, Oh my word, my studio’s getting dusty. So let’s clean it up. Let’s put it back together. And thus you started Project Reclaim. When you are doing this, do you feel that you are returning to something you left behind or you are beginning something new?

It is a little mix of both. So I’m picking up how I have always viewed myself as a person, but I find it exciting to start something new.

Do you find yourself a little bit nervous about, guy, will you have the chops to make what you want to make?

I’m less nervous about abilities, but more nervous about will I be able to follow through with the time commitment.

Do you feel like by going public that that gave you a bunch of accountability?

I think the idea of being held accountable to the public eye is part of what drives me. I think if I’m setting out to create a video, well then I have to make the things to record. And I find that to be really motivating for me too.

You had taken for so long you thought of yourself more or did you think more of yourself as a teacher than as an artist?

I’ve always viewed myself as an artist first. However, maybe it’s just how I approach teaching where I just bring that to the classroom every day.

As a teacher, your grading and letting students know their progress. How will you be grading yourself now as you’re going to be making in the studio on your own?

Boy, that is a great question. I think I’m going to set out to have some markers to indicate success. The first one being literally just renovating the studio, creating a space for myself again. And then as I move along, there’ll be more checkpoints that I can define and hopefully complete successfully.

Do you feel like your work is going to look different than what you were making for your MFA?

I think it will look different, but there’s something about textural kind of authentic materials. I did a lot of atmospheric firing. I’d love for some of those things to return in new work in new ways.

If you knew no one else was looking and you didn’t have the accountability of the internet and your friends and family now, if you knew nobody else was looking, what would you make?

I think I would always do a mix of functional pots, cups particularly. I love cups, but I’m always going to explore sculpture, big, expressive, experimental, and a lot of them are going to fail and I won’t worry about it because it’ll be fun to make.

Book

Studio Thinking by Lois Hetland, Ellen Winner, Shirley Veenema, and Kimberly M. Sheridan

Contact

Instagram: @Alex.arden.studio

Thuan Ton | Episode 1264

San Diego ceramicist Thuan Ton creates unique, handcrafted contemporary ceramics that blend artistic expression with thoughtful design. Inspired by form, texture, and the tactile nature of clay, Thuan’s work celebrates the beauty of handmade objects, offering distinctive pottery and art for collectors, enthusiasts, and anyone who appreciates exceptional craftsmanship.

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With that precision that comes with architecture, how does that conflict or challenge the idea of working with clay that can be precise but can also have times have a mind of its own?

Oh, you’ve touched on a nerve point because that’s the challenge. I’m so used to the precision and the preciseness of certain things, measurements, lines being absolutely pristine. And then I get to the clay and controlling it is, really is no controlling it. It’s got a mind of its own. So that’s going to be an ongoing challenge for me, I think. Yeah.

Does that mean that you are more comfortable with imperfections?

I believe so, or at least I’m getting more comfortable with it. Although there is a certain sense of precision that I hold myself to. And when appropriately so, depending on the type of work I’m working on, that I think is absolutely necessary. Otherwise, I’m just going to have to bend in it.

Do you feel that having the background as an architect, do you feel that that helps you notice things in ceramics that another potter might simply overlook?

I believe so. I mean, I don’t have any specifics for you, but bringing any kind of experience into what you’re doing right now and making it what you would call it pertinent for the time, then it’s It’s always good to have that background because you are seeing something that maybe someone else isn’t. And seeing it will eventually make you react to it. And so that kind of informs the work.

Do you feel that ceramics has changed the way you look at buildings?

That’s a tough question. I actually, I haven’t thought about that. I’ve actually thought of it the other way around because obviously that’s my background coming from buildings into ceramics. But like I mentioned before, I just happened to come upon another artist, ceramic artist in the 80s that is starting has very architectural features to it, and I love it. And it’s starting to make me vision or see, what am I trying to say, how the material clay can speak to architecture as opposed to the other way around.

Is there something that you’re still struggling with, having been three years in, that you thought you would have had mastered by now?

Throwing on the pottery wheel. I’m still struggling with it. Although I think a lot of times I’m comfortable with doing what I need to do, I wish I could throw taller, bigger pieces. So yeah, I think there’s a lot of things that’s challenging me in this medium. But yeah, that’s one of the things. Not to mention glazing.

As an artist, as a designer, as an architect, you’re a designer. Can a pot be beautiful, but poorly or badly designed?

I think happy mistakes happen all the time. Unintentional things occur in my work a great deal of time. And sometimes when you look at it in hindsight, it’s like, hey, I kind of like that. And that’s actually kind of looking nice, right? And I think a lot of potters feel that way sometimes. A lot of things are unintentional, especially when you’re starting out, your first three years of touching the material. But yes, I would agree with that.

Book

The Recipient by Audrey Cole

Contact

Instagram: @tonceramics

Trey Foster | Episode 1263

Trey Foster is a high school ceramics teacher and potter from Southwest Virginia. Trey shares his love of ceramics and teaching on social media and has a line of pottery tools called polliwogs.

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I’m looking at a person that is a teacher, a social media guy, and also trying to be an entrepreneur. How do you make sure you still have time to make?

That has been one of the biggest struggles, I think, for me. I fired my kiln one time this summer. And so luckily, the content kind of forces me to make things, but it forces me to make them much more slowly.

If you could, knowing that you are limited in your making time, if you could only make one piece or one form again and again, What form would you lean towards making?

Oh, that’s so easy. I’m a mug guy through and through. I love mugs and I finally started making some mugs that I really am proud of and I would consider it to be sort of art mugs. And so those are coming out of the kiln tomorrow and I’m super pumped.

Are there skills that you think about that you wish you had under your belt that you don’t have now?

Yeah, I just ran into this recently. I am teaching an adaptive art class this semester, which is, I’m so excited about. But my goal for that is to make tools for my students to make clay a little bit more accessible. And so my school got me a 3D printer for this. And I do not have the modeling skills, the 3D modeling skills to make what I want to make for them quickly. And so I am trying to do as much research and to grow that skill as quickly as possible.

You said that you make work slowly, but you’re still making work. What do you do with the work that you make now?

That’s such a good question that I wish I had a better answer to. I really don’t enjoy selling at markets. I think part of the reason that I moved into the space that I’m in is because I did not want to spend my weekends sitting at a booth and selling, but I do maybe like one or two a year. And so I save up stuff for that. And then I’ll hopefully finally sell some pots on my website, which I’ve never done really.

Into the classroom… You said during your interview process, one of the big things that drew them to you was that you said you wanted to care for the kids deeply. What’s one thing you do for your students that lets them know you care for them?

The number one way that I want my students to know that I care for them is by teaching them to care for each other. And so what that looks like in my class is every Friday we put the tools down, we sit down, and we just talk. I have a question that we all answer together and I make them memorize everyone’s full name. And so that way every person in the room is given the dignity of like everybody knows your name, people know things about you. And I think when you know people’s names and when you know things about them, then you start

Trey, it’s 50 years into the future, and I don’t know how this could happen, but you’ve passed away and you’re able to listen in at your funeral… What theme would you want to hear most come up?

That’s a big one. That goes well beyond clay. I don’t care if clay comes up in my funeral one bit. I want to be known as someone that was dependable. I want to be known as someone that led people towards light, good places.

Book

The Wing Feather Saga by Andrew Peterson

Contact

claywithtrey.com

Instagram: @clay_with_trey

Grace Chaplin | Episode 1262

Muckware Ceramics are handmade pieces by Grace Chaplin in the Byron Bay Hinterland. Grace creates wheel-thrown forms with a focus on form and function. Each piece is carefully crafted to be enjoyed and used every day. All Muckware pieces are made from stoneware clay and finished in their signature glazes and high-fired.

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When you look at your making and the way that you do things, can you identify the things that actually require your attention and your involvement? Have you been identifying those specific things?

Yeah, I believe at the moment, and I’m not sure if this is the right answer or the answer that I don’t want to let go of, but the actual making process, the physical throwing of the piece to me seems the most crucial.

Is there a way that you can divide up your pieces that you make to be handmade and slip cast and to be able to market them that way to where you can take your hands off of 1 and not have to be so dependent on the other.

Yeah, absolutely. I think that there will always be wheel throwing within my practice and within my products, but I’m currently looking at how to incorporate the two, slip casting and wheel throwing and have one range or a core range that’s slip cast and then maybe some other products that are wheel thrown.

When you look at hiring people to be able to take on some of those tasks that you have in the studio, what tasks beside the slip casting are you able to transfer to someone else that doesn’t require the wheel?

Oh, there’s endless tasks in the studio from Everything from cleaning, recycling, sponging, kiln packing, waxing, glazing, and then wiping again, all of those menial tasks can absolutely be outsourced.

So you have a pretty long list of things that can already be taken off of your plate and put onto an assistant.

Yeah, for sure.

What’s holding you back from actually hiring that person full-time or part-time today?

Yeah, so currently the studio is based about 30 minutes from my home and within the next three months, the studio will be moving to my home location. So There’s a bit of up in the air at the moment with how the business is going to operate, what it’s going to look like in the new space. So I’m really kind of focusing all my energy on getting that happening and designing the space so that I have designated areas and have the ability to have someone else in there to help me.

When you start to bring this person on, whoever this full-time person is going to be, Will you have a written list of this is how grace does things list, the systemized approach.

Yeah, I’m very type A and quite particular about things. So having all of those processes and formulas written out for people is the easiest way to maintain that consistency.

Do you have a list of things that you would rather them not ask, but to let them make the decision on their own?

I think that there’s no question that I don’t want someone to ask me, but I do believe that there’s so much in making the mistake and learning from that mistake.

When you start thinking about bringing someone on, how will that change your pricing structure?

Yeah, interesting. Those are thoughts that are still kind of rattling around in my head. that I don’t think I have an answer for currently. My head’s been in slip casting development and new studio designing and yeah, bringing someone on is very close, but it’s not at the forefront of my mind currently

Book

Grit. by Dr. Angela Duckworth

Contact

Muckware.com

Instagram: @muckware

Kirsty Kash | Episode 1261

Kirsty Kash is a Winnipeg ceramic artist creating carved porcelain with sprawling floral designs inlaid with vibrant colour. Drawing on her musical background and Ukrainian heritage, Kirsty’s work explores femininity and self-worth. Exhibited across North America, Kirsty’s work reminds us to trust ourselves and push beyond our assigned limits

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Do you do anything in the community studio now?

No, I just work out of my home studio in the basement.

Now that you have your own studio, in a community studio, there’s lots of weird things that happen. People touch your pieces and all that. But when you get to your own studio, it’s your space. But have you ever had anything weird happen in your own studio that should not have happened?

So once when I was throwing and I was sitting at the wheel, all of a sudden there was a drip on my head. And it turned out that one of my kids in the room above had spilled something and it was seeping through the floor and dripping onto my head while I was trying to throw.

Not what you would expect in a home studio. Being that it’s all private area for yourself also is that you don’t have to have people messing with your work also. But do you find that going back to the idea about treating things as being super precious, do you find that there’s times that the loss is less significant for you because people aren’t seeing your work and it’s not necessarily that big of a deal?

Yes. One thing that was frustrating in a community studio was sometimes, people touching it and inadvertently maybe breaking something or damaging it. So it’s nice to have my own space where that doesn’t happen.

You mentioned the idea about not taking it too preciously. How has failure made you a better potter?

Well, that’s a great question. I think it just makes me really determined to figure out what happened and then improve from it.

Do you think that the idea of shooting for perfection as a young potter is a good thing to do?

Good question. I think I’ve always tried to do my best, but that isn’t perfection. So I try to see what I can do, what I’m capable of.

And I don’t think that you are saying that if something is too precious, that means that we can settle for shoddy.

No, definitely not. I hold myself to a high standard.

What does a high standard look like for you?

Know, it means that each piece has I’m doing the best I can for that particular piece. So if I notice something, I fix it.

What’s one of your favorite family activities that you guys do?

We love to play board games. So we’ll play, there’s this fun game that we’ve been playing lately called Space Base. And you basically have like a base and you like try to make it the best it can be. It’s just a fun, silly game.

Book

Mastering the Potter’s Wheel by Ben Carter

Contact

kirstykashceramics.com

Instagram: @kirstykash

Joshua Simmons | Episode 1260

Joshua Simmons is the founder and potter behind The Goods Pottery, a small-batch ceramics studio dedicated to crafting intentional, functional pieces that bring simple beauty to everyday life. Rooted in the belief that thoughtfully made objects can enrich our daily rituals, The Goods Pottery creates handcrafted ceramics meant to be used, loved, and passed down.

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I don’t know if anybody out there doesn’t like a good comeback story. But it is quite fascinating that Joshua, it took you 20 years before you figured out that you didn’t have what it took. And that would be very discouraging to me. Once you had kind of asked that question, Do I have the goods? and then you found the answer, which was No. How did that make you feel?

So much of my identity is wrapped up in being a potter. When I had the opportunity to start over after failing, it helped me Choose, what I was gonna be and who I was gonna be as a potter and that Is the major takeaway for me is that I had experience, but now I got to choose a new path Why didn’t you choose a different path?

Why didn’t you just find a new job or take up a new hobby?

Because I identified as I still do. I am potter. I am man with pottery wheel. And I really wanted to make pottery that people would want to buy. And I was committed to that process. And I couldn’t be more grateful for the opportunity to have done this work.

At 20 years, I would have thought, especially with you saying it’s your whole identity, I don’t have anything to learn. But you were willing to turn around and learn. How important is having a humble heart and being willing to learn again?

It’s critical, isn’t it? But I wish I had a really good answer for that question because when you unload the kiln and you see things that aren’t good, they’re terrible. They have to go in the garbage. I guess it just kind of is a measurement of like, is failure to you a reason to stop or is failure a stepping stone to success? You know, are you going to quit or is this just part of your journey?

What were the signs for you? What were the signs for you that things were turning the corner?

It was as soon as I started taking advancing glazes. When I had the ability to look at the chemistry in a glaze recipe and make decisions and become conscious of the ingredients that I was adding and what they were doing, then I began to have control over my process. And once I started taking notes and photographs and then making those adjustments and doing tests, I got control over my glazes. And it wasn’t until then where those two parts came together, like the glaze and the form, where I made them work together. That’s when I think it was the turning point for me.

Now, apart from your glaze and forms, is there one specific thing that you do now that you weren’t doing when you first quit being a teacher that you say, this is definitely helping me be successful?

As a teacher, I had glaze recipes that were handed down to me, that were handed down by someone else. And now these recipes are my own. I handcraft each of these glazes to fit the clay body that they’re on. Right now I’m switching over to speckled buff. And so I’m re-engineering the same recipes to fit speckled buff so they don’t craze, so they look the way I want them to look. And that control is the main difference. Sure, my forms are a lot better now, but before it was a glossy glaze dipped and you just roll the dice and hope that it turns out nice. Now when I fire my kiln, within a measure of, what would you call that, a variance, a certain tolerance. But I expect and then I get to see what I expected and it blows my mind to have that kind of consistency.

What is one thing that you look forward to working on next that you need to develop?

Dinner plates. Dinner plates are simple and so complex. And I love them. I have just recently finished a set of them for my sister-in-law, Susan, who I love. And I really want to make plates for the goods pottery because I think there is something wonderful about a stack of plates that all go together and being handcrafted, but then also very uniform. I love the matte lip with the glossy middle. They just have like the complete package. You know, they’re, they’re fun to use and they’re pretty and they make your Thanksgiving dinner look real, real snazzy.

Book

Talented and Gifted by Kelly Kearsley

Contact

thegoodspottery.com

Instagram: @thegoodspottery

Lindsay Langsdale | Episode 1259

Lindsay Langsdale is a San Francisco ceramic artist and educator whose colorful and highly textured work explores storytelling, humor, and imagined characters. Lindsay is the owner and operator of Brick and Mortar Studios and General Manager of Ruby’s Clay Studio. Lindsay’s playful sculptural and functional ceramics celebrate curiosity, individuality, and the wonderfully strange.

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Your work is unique and beautiful and all those things that we’ve already talked about, but do you have stories that go with your work?

Oh, yes, sometimes. My show actually that I just had had a slip transfer wall hanging and a tea set that went with it. And each of those groups had a small story about becoming and changing and they were adapted from journal entries over the last five years of my life.

When you start a piece, does it already have a story or are you going to add the story as you make it?

That’s a good question. I actually, it depends. Sometimes I just let the piece become what it’s gonna become and then I add a name to it afterwards and a story. Or sometimes I think about, I wanna make a triceratops and so I make a triceratops and it just happens to be a triceratops.

When you start a piece, How much of the piece is actually pre-planned versus it just kind of develops as you go?

I think my functional pieces are the most planned because they’re made from templates that I’ve developed to do repeatability. For like the sculpture work, like the heads that hang off the wall, I like to have those a little bit more freeform. It helps me have a little bit more freedom in my practice.

You said that you color your clay first. Is it possible to make the work without actually using colored clay? Like could you do it all with underglaze?

Yeah, I actually started out using underglazes. So I used velvet underglazes. I found that it took away from my texture. So sometimes I also, instead of just doing the color clay, I’ll do plain white porcelain, and then I’ll use my washes as the main color component at bisque. So I’ll layer different washes to get a different effect.

When you’re making, are you thinking about making people smile as you work?

Yeah, I mean, I think that’s one of the most rewarding things to hear somebody say that you made them smile and laugh. I think part of my work is to bring joy to people, and I hope it works.

Do you find yourself smiling as you work?

It depends on if it’s A hundred mugs or a sculpture?

Your work doesn’t look sophisticated, but it is really sophisticated when it comes to technicality. So it gives this wonderful sense of playfulness and silliness. How do you keep the technical side of the ceramics from killing the fantasy of the final piece?

Oh, I like that question. I really think that I treat most things like a sculpture and I want it to feel like it’s actual fabric. So I let it blump and I let it do its own thing where it needs to. The one like teapots, I make sure that they pour well and that comes from just researching different types of spouts and kind of just playing around with how something looks and how something functions and trying to make the decision on if I want it to function better or I want it to look better at the time. Yeah, it’s hard to reconcile sometimes, but if I’m making a teapot, it needs to teapot.

Book

Paperclay: Art and Practice by Rosette Gault

Contact

linlangcreative.com

Instagram: @lin.lang

Drew Herstam | Episode 1258

Drew Herstam is a functional potter based in Chicago, IL. Drew received a BA in studio art with a focus in ceramics from Goshen College in 2006. Drew is a former resident of Terra Incognito Studios in Oak Park, IL which also serves as his current studio.

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One of the things that I really appreciate about your approach to making is how much you take ceramics seriously. Seriously enough to say, I’m going to have this other gig to support this gig. My question is, why do you put that kind of value on your work?

I think the easiest way to say it is just that it’s really hard to stay away from what you love. I think people get a lot of different things out of clay. Oftentimes it’s described as a blend of art and science. And interestingly enough, nursing is too. But I think multiple people, or sorry, different people are drawn to different things within it, so some people might be drawn more to, some of the formal elements where they’re more interested in form, color, texture, and then other people get really sucked into glaze chemistry, firing process, all of that. And I think that I really appreciate both of those. But yeah, back to that initial answer, it’s really hard to stay away from what you love.

Does that mean that for your work that is a functional object, that it doesn’t have to become sculptural or conceptually complicated to be considered significant?

Yeah, I think that definitely the functional object can I mean, it serves multiple purposes, yeah. I think that ideally it’s as, it serves its function as it was created. I mean, it’s meant to be used, but at the same time, when it’s not in use, it can be a beautiful object. And so yeah, I mean, my work, I definitely, I try and blend those two ideas.

You’ve mentioned  in the podcast that you like to have a little bit more control so that you like to allow the firing to participate in the work, but not to dominate the work. Would that be safe to say?

I did say heavy-handed. I might want to walk that back, but it can be. It can be. But I definitely, that process especially, and then also the way that I’m engaging it in like a reorganizer different way, it’s very much a conversation, I think, between the maker and the process itself. And so I do I guess I’ve kind of modified some approaches where I maybe want to speak a little bit more than the tool I’m using.

In your work I see the presence of your hand, but it doesn’t seem to become sloppy in terms of handling. How do you get that balance of presence without sloppiness?

That’s a good question. I actually so I really admire people who do work really loosely. And so I as I think about because my forms are really tight, but then I get loose with blaze. And so ideally, I, it’s trying to strike some sort of balance. You mentioned the finger marks though. I do, there’s a number of reasons why I like to use that. First of all, it’s like a loud and proud reminder that the piece is handmade. And then also I use it as a way to highlight certain characteristics of the glaze. and kind of what it does and how it handles so just in the fingerprint itself it will like it Like it kind of pulls up around there so you get the white that the Chino gives you when it’s thick and then around that then you get more of that gradient of the other ways that the color can respond and then also it drips so kind of similar in that and so it’s just kind of It’s me trying to show multiple looks of what that glaze can do all in one place.

It feels like what you end up doing is that you are somewhat embracing imperfections, but you’re not abandoning craftsmanship. Is that a difficult balance to maintain?

I think that’s a good summary of like certain ideas that I play with and try and highlight. But yeah, this is a difficult balance to… Yes. And I think in my own work, I mean, there are certain times where I feel like I might be pushing one further, a little too far, and then I, you know. might have to scrap an idea and kind of dial it back in. But yeah, balance is key. I think it’s really difficult to achieve, but it’s usually for rewarding when you can find a place of balance.

You mentioned just a moment ago the idea that sometimes that balance between the imperfection and the craftsmanship, that balance is sometimes pushed too far. What makes an object become pushed too far? What is the pushing that ends up getting it over the edge?

Well, so for me in my work, because I’m dealing with the ash glaze and it’s drippy or that kind of thing that I try and keep all those effects on the pot. If it runs off the foot and I have to grind it, then I consider it lost. So the That’s a specific example for me and how I work and my own work is that, yeah, if I, if I, I like to keep the bottoms nice and clean.

Book

American Shino by Lester Richter

Contact

Etsy: DrewHerstamCeramics

Instagram: @dherstam

Halley Quinn | Episode 1257

Halley Quinn is a Columbus, Ohio-based potter and graphic designer who founded Ice & Dust Pottery after receiving a grant from a tech startup to purchase her first wheel. Today Halley creates colorful functional ceramics, has raised more than $8,000 for cancer research with her ceramics, and is constantly teaching herself new techniques — from mold making to 3D modeling.

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It’s amazing that five years have made such a big difference in the world. As you said earlier in the podcast, social media had a different kind of algorithm- post a picture and that was all you needed. And now things have changed so much. So we’re finding that the algorithm is a thing that is becoming increasingly the thing that potters have to become dependent upon to get attention for your work. And I’m curious, do you feel like that has hurt ceramics or helped ceramics?

Oh gosh. I think it’s a mixed bag. I got to think on that one. I mean, I don’t love that as a society we feel that we have to communicate in this hooky, dopamine hacky kind of way. And I think those effects are wide reaching beyond the art community. And I think it stresses a lot of artists out who want to just show up and share their work and have people react to something that is beautiful or interesting to them. And discussions can happen from that. But I think now we’re trying to hook people into reacting and having them approach it in a specific way. And it’s a little weird. At the same time, I think reels are really awesome because they can have those discussions. Folks can have those discussions live and get really engaged with strangers in a way that they didn’t before when they were just looking at beautiful pictures. So I think reels are fantastic. It’s just how the algorithm approaches content to where if you don’t get folks reacting in some way on the platform within 3 seconds, it just goes into the void. And that’s unfortunate because I think that hinders folks seeing a lot of beautiful things or having great discussions.

Another thing that has changed is that Etsy was such a big deal. Shopify was kind of a big deal. And it seems also that because of the shift of algorithms that I’ve heard a few Potters say that the personal in-person markets are actually a little bit stronger selling point than trying to grab attention online. Have you found that to be the case?

I really hope that is true. As someone who just came back to markets and I’ve only done two, I can’t say that’s the case just yet, but I really did miss having those connections with folks that I might not have been having online or having at all. So I really hope that’s true. I think people do still crave connection. And maybe that connection online, it doesn’t feel as authentic when you’ve got people literally jumping into a bucket of reclaim to get your attention on Instagram. You know, that feels like we’re all just clowning to try to get ourselves out there and get that attention. And props to folks who do that, you know, for their dedication to the algorithm. But my goodness, I am not going to be jumping into a bucket of reclaim to get people to see my art. So I think definitely folks are craving that connection and I really hope that I can have that at more markets down the road as I’ve got a couple more in the future and I’ve been missing my people and I’m really excited to see them all again.

Have you seen that the way that customer relationships are being developed, do you feel like that’s changed in any way?

Maybe. I think there was a time where people cared a lot more about your follower count and mine’s not especially expansive or anything, but there were people who would get wowed by me in person and be like, my God, I follow you on Instagram. And I’m like, I am just some lady who lives in Columbus and makes pottery in my basement. So I think like people aren’t as impressed by that kind of thing and they aren’t chasing those high follower counts anymore. And I think that’s a good thing for sure. It’s more about, you connecting with someone’s art and not so much connecting about or thinking that they have something inherently impressive because they’ve, shot up in Instagram follower numbers or something like that.

You mentioned reels and the hook and things like that. So are you saying that the storytelling process is becoming a more significant part of the selling process?

Can be, I think. There’s a lot of creators out there who are making really interesting content and getting people interested in ceramics by showing the process. And I really want to get into that a little bit. I haven’t yet been creating any like longer form reels that have a nice solid hook at the beginning and get you to watch a longer video. I’ve mostly been playing around with really short hooky ones and seeing where that goes just to experiment. But I don’t know. I’m trying to think through like how I’m going to show up on reels now that that’s a challenge that I have to tackle as an artist. And I do love video editing, so I think I’m going to have a lot of fun with it, but I just haven’t really found my voice there just yet.

So are you saying that you feel like there’s more pressure to become a “content creator”?

I think so. I noticed myself, doing a market and realizing like what we were just talking about of everybody drinks iced coffee and there’s no babies. And I’m like, could this be a carousel or a reel? And how would the algorithm react to each? And how do I reach the most people with this? And I’m like, why am I thinking that way? It’s an interesting discussion to have. And I have to think like, what is the format for that discussion if I want to have that with a bunch of strangers? And if I even want to have a conversation with a bunch of strangers, I just want to make pots. I don’t know. But it is kind of fun to have an audience to be able to talk to and spit ideas off of, but it’s also kind of intimidating and terrifying.

One last question for you: If you could go back five years and talk to your younger potter making then, what would you warn or what would you tell yourself to do to be ready for today?

Oh my gosh. Well, I’ll give you one artistic answer and one practical answer. One will be very short. Artistically, I’d say don’t wait until you feel ready to make art. You’ve learned by making work and not by thinking about making work. Practically, I’d say make your first kiln a brand new kiln if you can, and I’ll get into why. I bought my first kiln in 2020 during the pandemic when it was very difficult to buy a new kiln because of the long wait times. But my studio shut down and I needed a kiln. So I found a secondhand kiln. It was barely used. It was in beautiful condition. But eventually those elements wore out. And I learned the hard way that replacing elements for an old kiln that’s no longer made can cost quite a bit if it was a really big kiln like mine was. And it almost costs as much as buying a brand new kiln with modern controls. So, buying a kiln can be a little bit like buying a horse. The purchase price isn’t really the expensive part. It’s beating that horse that gets expensive. And in this case, the food was the new heating elements. So if you can stretch your budget a little on the front end, buy something new that you can learn to program the controller and adjust your firing schedules and things like that. I think you’ll be happier in the long run.

Book

Make Your Art No Matter What by Beth Pickens

Contact

iceanddustpottery.com

Instagram: @iceanddustpottery