America’s welfare programs have long operated on the assumption that states and nonprofits could responsibly steward federal dollars with minimal oversight. But a series of explosive fraud cases—from California to Mississippi to Minnesota—have exposed just how broken that system has become, with lax oversight and minimal accountability leading to billions of dollars stolen from taxpayers.

Shad White, Mississippi’s state auditor and author of Mississippi Swindle, joins Oren to explain how his office uncovered one of the largest welfare scandals in modern history and what it reveals about America’s safety net. They discuss why grant-based welfare programs are uniquely vulnerable to abuse, how federalism often undermines accountability, and how practical reforms like stronger enforcement, clearer metrics, and simpler program design can restore public trust while helping the families who need support most.