Joining Pam and Rich for this discussion are Professor Daniel Ho and RegLab Fellow Christie Lawrence, JD ’24 (MPP, Harvard Kennedy School of Government).

Dan is the founding director of Stanford’s RegLab (Regulation, Evaluation, and Governance Lab), which builds high-impact partnerships for data science and responsible AI in the public sector. The RegLab has an extensive track record partnering with government agencies like the Environmental Protection Agency, Internal Revenue Service, the U.S. Department of Labor, and Santa Clara County on prototyping and evaluating AI tools to make government more fair, efficient, and transparent. Building on this work, the RegLab also helps agencies strengthen AI governance and operationalize trustworthy AI principles.

Christie, a third-year JD student, worked with RegLab and Stanford’s Innovation Clinic on projects to advise DOL on responsible AI and development practices and to support the work with Prof. Ho on the National AI Advisory Committee, which advises the White House on AI policy. In this interview, we’ll learn about several RegLab projects—and the importance of helping government develop smart AI policy and solutions.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• Dan Ho >>> Stanford Law School web page

[00:00:00] Chapter 1: Setting the Stage

• Mention of the rapid acceleration of technology and the release of ChatGPT.
• Highlighting the risks associated with AI, such as bias and privacy concerns.
• Discussion on the relationship between AI and governance, including recent developments in AI policy and governance.
• Mention of the Biden administration's executive order on AI and its implications.

[00:03:04] Chapter 2: The Role of Reg Lab and Collaboration with the IRS

• Explanation of the Reg Lab and its purpose.
• Discussion on the need for government agencies to modernize their technology infrastructure.
• Overview of the collaboration with the IRS to improve tax evasion detection using machine learning.
• Discovery of disparities in auditing rates and subsequent IRS reforms.
• Highlighting the intersection of AI, social justice, and government practices.

[00:09:12] Chapter 3: Student Perspective

• Christie Lawrence shares her experience working on AI policy at Stanford Law School.
• Discussion on bridging the gap between policy, law, and technology.
• Impactful work done by students in collaboration with government agencies.

[00:11:38] Chapter 4: AI and Social Justice

• Pam Karlan's experience with AI issues in the Justice Department's Civil Rights Division.
• Examples of algorithmic discrimination and its implications for social justice.
• Discussion on the challenges of addressing AI-related issues in government practices.

[00:23:55] Chapter 5: Future Directions

• Optimism about the future of AI governance and the recent executive order's impact.
• Anticipation of legislative proposals and state-level initiatives in AI regulation.
• Importance of maintaining an open innovation ecosystem and addressing talent gaps in government agencies.

[00:25:55] Chapter 6: Audience Questions
 

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Professor Easha Anand, co-director of the Stanford Law School Supreme Court Litigation Clinic, joins Professors Pam Karlan and Richard Thompson Ford, along with Gareth Fowler, JD '24, for a discussion about three cases that she argued before the Court this term, the people behind the case titles, and what it takes to represent them at the highest court in the land. 

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• Easha Anand >>> Stanford Law School Page

(00:00:00) Chapter 1: Introduction and Setting the Stage

• Easha Anand shares the story of Mr. Ciavarini and the impact of the Stanford Supreme Court Clinic on restoring his reputation. Hosts Rich Ford and Pam Karlan introduce the episode and guests Professor Easha Anand and Gareth Fowler, discussing their work with the Stanford Supreme Court Litigation Clinic.

(00:01:52) Chapter 2: Joining the Clinic and the Clinic's Unique Approach

• Gareth Fowler describes his experience joining the Stanford Supreme Court Litigation Clinic and the process of working on cases as a student. Easha Anand explains the distinctive features of the clinic's model, emphasizing the significant role of students in producing legal work.

(00:05:38) Chapter 3: Working on Cases and the Sarbanes-Oxley Case

• Gareth Fowler discusses the specific cases he worked on during his time at the clinic, including Mendez-Colleen and United States v. Jackson. Easha Anand recounts her experience arguing the case of Murray v. UBS before the Supreme Court and the significance of the outcome for whistleblower protection.

(00:15:52) Chapter 4: Insights from Oral Arguments

• Easha Anand reflects on the differences between arguing cases at lower courts versus the Supreme Court, emphasizing the unique challenges and opportunities of Supreme Court advocacy.

(00:18:16) Chapter 5: Clinic's Trip to D.C.

• Gareth Fowler shares his experience attending Supreme Court oral arguments in Washington, D.C., providing insights into the courtroom dynamics and the significance of the proceedings.

(00:20:27) Chapter 6: Preparing for Future Cases and Impactful Moments

• Easha Anand discusses the upcoming case of Chiavarini and the journey of preparing for oral arguments, highlighting the client's story and the clinic's commitment to justice. Pam Karlan and Easha Anand reflect on the profound impact of their work with clients and the meaningful experiences shared during their collaboration with the Stanford Supreme Court Clinic.

[00:24:23] Chapter 7: Audience Question and Answer

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Dive into the complex history of America's drug war with George Fisher, former Massachusetts Attorney General and acclaimed scholar of criminal law. In his latest book, "Beware Euphoria," Fisher explores the moral and racial dimensions of drug prohibition, challenging conventional narratives. Join the conversation on Stanford Legal as Fisher discusses the impact of racial justice movements on drug policy, including the legalization of cannabis, offering profound insights into a contentious issue shaping legal and social discourse.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• George Fisher >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Beware Euphoria: The Moral Roots and Racial Myths of America's War on Drugs

(00:00:00) Chapter 1: The Origins of Drug Prohibition 

• Podcast guest, George Fisher, traces the history of drug prohibition, highlighting the departure of cannabis use from medical preservation. He also discusses the 19th-century roots of drug prohibition, particularly the moral concerns driving the anti-drug laws.

(00:11:42) Chapter 2: Racial Narratives and Mass Incarceration

• Rich Ford discusses the common narrative linking mass incarceration to the war on drugs and its alleged racial motivations. Fisher challenges this narrative, arguing that early drug laws were about protecting whites' moral purity rather than targeting people of color. The conversation explores the racial dynamics of early drug laws, emphasizing the racism of indifference rather than explicit targeting.

(00:20:20) Chapter 3: Moral Valence of Mind-Altering Drugs 

• Fisher delves into the historical moral perceptions of mind-altering drugs, tracing back to Early Christian notions of reason and morality.He explains why certain drugs, like opium and later marijuana, were seen as threats to moral character, while alcohol was treated differently due to its varied uses.

(00:26:15) Chapter 4: Legalization of Marijuana and Racial Justice 

• The conversation shifts to the legalization of marijuana, highlighting its historical bans and recent movements towards legalization. Concerns about the increasing potency of marijuana and its potential backlash are explored, suggesting a need for careful regulation and messaging.

(00:30:19) Conclusion: Closing Remarks

• Rich Ford wraps up the conversation with George Fisher discussing insights and emphasizing the importance of discussing the ongoing struggle with drugs and intoxicants.

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Pam Karlan and labor law expert and former NLRB chair William Gould IV explore the quickly changing arena of college athletics including the push for student-athlete unionization, the debate over compensation, and other issues at the intersection of sports and academia. From the Dartmouth College men's basketball team's union election to the broader challenges facing university athletics, they discuss the complex issues shaping the law and the future of collegiate sports.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• William Gould IV >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Recent Q&A with Gould >>> Stanford's Bill Gould on the Dartmouth College Basketball  Union Vote

(00:00:00) Chapter 1: Introduction to the Intersection of Sports and Labor Law

• Pam Karlan introduces the topic of sports law and labor law, highlighting the recent developments in the field and the significance of the intersection between the two areas. Bill and Pam look at an overview of the Dartmouth College men's basketball team unionization case and its implications for the traditional understanding of student-athlete status.

(00:02:03) Chapter 2: The Evolving Definition of Student-Athlete

• William B. Gould IV delves into the historical context of the student-athlete designation, tracing its origins and evolution over time. He discusses the complexities of defining student-athletes within the framework of labor law and examines the factors that have contributed to the recent challenges to this classification.

(00:06:49) Chapter 3: Labor Law Considerations in Collegiate Athletics

• Gould explores the key principles of labor law as they apply to collegiate athletics, emphasizing the factors that determine employee status and the obligations of universities as employers. The chapter addresses issues such as control over athletes, compensation, and the role of collective bargaining in shaping the future of collegiate sports.

(00:10:00) Chapter 4: Implications for Intercollegiate Sports

• Karlan and Gould discuss the broader implications of the Dartmouth case and similar unionization efforts for intercollegiate sports as a whole. They examine the challenges posed by conference realignment, Title IX considerations, and the evolving landscape of athlete compensation, including name, image, and likeness rights.

(00:14:23) Chapter 5: Legal and Policy Perspectives

• The conversation shifts to a discussion of the legal and policy considerations surrounding student-athlete rights and the role of the courts in shaping future outcomes. Gould offers insights into the potential impact of Supreme Court decisions and judicial attitudes towards higher education institutions and their treatment of athletes.

(00:21:08) Chapter 6: Looking Ahead

• In the final chapter, Karlan and Gould reflect on the future of collegiate athletics in light of ongoing legal battles and shifting societal norms. They explore potential scenarios for reform and address lingering questions about the balance between academic and athletic pursuits, the role of unions in protecting athlete rights, and the broader implications for labor relations in the sports industry.

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When does life begin? In this episode of Stanford Legal, co-hosts Rich Ford and Pam Karlan dig into the recent decision by the Alabama Supreme Court that has sent shockwaves through the fertility treatment community. The ruling, which considers frozen embryos as children under state law, has wide-ranging implications for in vitro fertilization (IVF) practices. Bioethics and law expert Hank Greely joins the discussion, providing insights into the background of the case, its legal implications, and the potential ramifications for IVF clinics and patients in Alabama—and throughout the country. The conversation highlights the intersection of law, medicine, and ethics, revealing the complex challenges surrounding embryo rights and reproductive freedoms.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• Hank Greely >>> Stanford Law School Page | Twitter/X

(00:00:00) Chapter 1: Introduction & The Alabama Supreme Court Ruling

• Hank Greely, discussing the recent Alabama Supreme Court decision regarding frozen embryos. He provides background on the Alabama Supreme Court decision and the implications for fertility treatment in the state along with explaining the legal basis of the ruling and the claims brought forth by the plaintiffs.

(00:03:43) Chapter 2: Wrongful Death Act & Implications of the Decision

• Discussion on the Alabama Wrongful Death Act and its application to unborn children, including frozen embryos. Exploration of the broader implications of the decision, including ethical and legal concerns.

(00:08:21) Chapter 3: Understanding Frozen Embryos

• Hank Greely explains the process of in vitro fertilization (IVF) and the concept of frozen embryos, including the harvesting of eggs and the reasons for freezing embryos.

(00:14:05) Chapter 4: Legal and Ethical Concerns

• Analysis of the legal and ethical implications of the Alabama decision for IVF clinics and patients. Greely, Karlan, and Ford then discuss the political and legislative responses to the Alabama decision, including potential future actions

(00:26:49) Chapter 5: Gender and Control Over Reproduction

• Show Notes: Discussion on the gender dynamics and control over reproduction highlighted by the Alabama Supreme Court ruling.

(00:33:29) Chapter 6: Political Ramifications and Predictions

• Hank Greely offers his perspective on potential legislative responses and the broader implications for reproductive rights. From congressional bills to grassroots activism, we explore the evolving landscape of reproductive justice. They also explore the political ramifications and the future outlook for fertility treatment.

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Why does the U.S. have the highest incarceration rate in the industrialized world, with individuals, communities, and taxpayers paying a steep price for lengthy prison terms for even nonviolent offenders?  Michael Romano, a criminal justice lawyer who founded and directs the Three Strikes Project at Stanford Law School, the first law school program of its type in the country focused on securing reduced sentences for incarcerated people deemed to be serving disproportionate sentences, has spent his career on this uniquely American challenge. As the project’s director for the past 16 years, Mike has worked with Stanford Law students to win the release of more than 200 Californians imprisoned under the state’s Three Strikes law.

Along with helping hundreds of people sentenced to life in prison for minor/nonviolent crimes, the Three Strikes team also worked to change California’s Three Strikes Law. In 2012 they celebrated passage of the Three Strikes Reform Act, a landmark legislative effort led from start to finish by Stanford Law students and project staff members in partnership with the NAACP Legal Defense Fund.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X
• Michael Romano >>> Twitter/X

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Important questions regarding Trump: can he be prosecuted for criminal wrongdoing when he was serving as president, whether the two impeachment trials matter, and if Colorado’s decision to disqualify him from the state’s primary ballots is constitutional. Pulitzer Prize winning historian Jack Rakove joins Pam and Rich for a discussion on the U.S. Constitution, originalism, charges against former president Donald Trump, and the role of historians in constitutional litigation.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• Jack Rakove >>> Stanford University Page

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Drinkable water is a precious commodity. But as population growth, aging infrastructure, drought, and climate change pose challenges to freshwater quality and quantity in America, the safety and amount of water in parts of the U.S. is in question. With more than 140,000 separate public water systems in the country, how can federal, state, and local governments, along with the various water authorities, take on this challenge alone? In this episode we hear from global water and natural resources expert Barton “Buzz” Thompson, about this new book Liquid Asset: How Business and Government Can Partner to Solve the Freshwater Crisis —and his recommendations for how to solve the freshwater crisis in the U.S.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Pam Karlan >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Links:

• Buzz Thompson >>> Stanford Law School Page
• Liquid Assets: How Business and Government Can Partner to Solve the Freshwater Crisis.
• Paul Milgrom & Auction Theory

Chapter Timestamps:

(00:00:00) Introduction & Water's Scarcity 

Hosts Rich Ford and Pam Karlan introduce guest, Buzz Thompson, an expert in water law and author of Liquid Assets

(00:01:18) Water Challenges Today

The scarcity of fresh water globally, and the multiple crises facing water resources: uneven distribution, climate change and the depletion of groundwater resources.

(00:04:30) Water Infrastructure 

What is water infrastructure in the United States, the current state of it, and the repairs and upgrades required and being undertaken.

(00:07:14) Updating Infrastructure & 21st-Century Technology 

Examples of modern wastewater treatment methods, advocating for resource recovery centers and outlining their potential benefits by adopting 21st century technology.

(00:09:08) Fragmented Water Systems 

The complexity of water systems, & the challenges created by small water systems 

(00:12:00) Water Rights & Legal Structures 

The current legal structure of water rights in the USA,and defining the goals of both protecting water as a public resource, and a private commodity.

(00:16:25) Private Sector's Role & Future Solutions 

Buzz discusses water markets internationally, and the private sector's role in innovation, technology, and financing to bridge the gap in water management. 

(00:18:59) Challenges with Outdated Water Rights 

Rich & Buzz  discuss the challenges created by the current water rights model, and the necessity, possibilities, and challenges for legal reform.

(00:21:18) Proposal for Tradeable Water Rights 

The concept of converting existing water rights into more easily transferable ones similar to real property, in order to eliminate the current challenges.

(00:25:49) Changing a System of Water Rights

Australia's successful reform in the Murray-Darling Basin, where water rights were revamped for better tradeability and how they safeguarded the environment.

(00:27:31) Conclusion

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Women and minorities continue to be underrepresented in patent issuing and less often are granted credit for their innovations. We examine why this is, the impacts it has, and what can be done about it. Patents, and the protection of inventor rights, was deemed important enough that when the U.S. Constitution was ratified in 1788 it included what is now known as the intellectual property clause: Article I, Section 8, Clause 8, which reads “[The Congress shall have Power . . . ] To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their respective Writings and Discoveries.” Our guest in this episode is Lisa Larrimore Ouellette, whose latest research looks at inequality in the patent system and how that impacts innovation. Her paper “Improving Equity in Patent Inventorship” was recently published in Science.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X
• Lisa Ouellette >>>  Twitter/X

Chapters:

(00:00:00) Introduction and Patent System Overview

The significance of patents and their historical context. Intro of guest Lisa Ouellette’s research on inequity in the patent system 

(00:01:47) Understanding Patents and their Benefits 

The purpose of patents, their duration, and their impact on inventors' rights. Discussion on how patents apply across various industries like pharmaceuticals, software, and AI.

(00:04:10) Inequities in the Patent System

Disparities within the patent system, and discussion on the lower representation of women and minorities in obtaining patents.

(00:07:15) The Innovator-Inventor Gap

Exploring the gap between authorship on scientific papers and recognition as patent inventors & potential mechanisms causing it.

(00:11:15)  Impact of Patent Recognition

The significance of being listed as a patent inventor: impact on career, earnings, and professional reputation. 

(00:13:33) Innovation Type with Diverse Inventorship

Insights into the potential shift in innovation focus due to diversity within inventor teams.

 (00:14:54) Addressing Inequity: Policy Reforms

Challenges faced by underrepresented groups in persisting through the patent application process, suggestions for change and the impact of real-world programs to address these challenges

(00:18:37) AI's Influence and Challenges

Speculations on AI's impact on patent accessibility and equity. Challenges and potential exacerbation of disparities due to AI-generated patent claims.

(00:21:11) Conclusion

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 In June, 2022 the U.S. Supreme Court delivered an historic and far reaching decision overturning Roe v. Wade and turning abortion law to the states. Less than two years on, we are seeing just how that decision is playing out as women navigate a divided country with a patchwork of reproductive rights.  The recent example of Kate Cox, a Dallas-area mother of two who sought to have a medical exemption from Texas’ strict abortion laws and was forced to leave the state to receive the care she needed when her request was denied, brought the consequences of the Court’s decision to the headlines. In this episode we hear from the show’s co-host Pam Karlan, an expert in reproductive law, about the Texas case and reproductive rights in the US after Roe was overturned.

Connect:

• Episode Transcripts >>> Stanford Legal Podcast Website
• Stanford Legal Podcast >>> LinkedIn Page
• Rich Ford >>>  Twitter/X
• Stanford Law School >>> Twitter/X
• Stanford  Law Magazine >>> Twitter/X

Chapters:

(00:00:00) Introduction

Rich Ford introduces the episode and highlights the significant changes in abortion laws over recent years. 

(00:01:08) Current Legal Context

Pam Karlan provides an overview of the legal landscape since the Dobbs case decision and summarizes the changes and confusion it has led to.

(00:05:00) Texas Abortion Controversy: Kate Cox Case

Focus on the case of Kate Cox, a woman in Texas seeking abortion due to fetal health complications. Analysis of the legal, political, and ethical implications of the verdict.

(00:10:02) Impact of Returning Abortion Laws to States

The misconception that returning abortion decisions to states would reduce controversy. Analysis of attempts to to restrict travel for abortion services.

(00:12:20) Legal Ramifications and Political Scenarios

Discussion on potential legal consequences for aiding abortion travel and comparisons with state laws regarding child-related travel. Contemplation of federal abortion bans utilizing the Commerce Clause and the potential scenarios for imposing such bans.

(00:14:48) Medical Abortions and Legal Challenges

Insights into the rise of medical abortions and the controversy surrounding the approval and distribution of drugs, and subsequent legal battles.

(00:20:20) State Politics, Abortion Laws & State Referendum Dynamics

Exploration of the shifting dynamics in state politics, including red states' stances on protecting abortion rights, and measures in California & Ohio.

(00:22:56) Shifting Political Narratives

Discussion on the evolving focus of the abortion debate, and examination of how abortion politics are playing out in national and state elections, influencing political strategies.

(00:24:59) Federal Legislation Prospects and Responsive Activism

The potential for federal legislation protecting or banning abortion rights & insights into citizen activism  both aiding and impeding abortion access. 

(00:28:18) Abortion in Unlikely Arenas

Examples showcasing how abortion politics infiltrate seemingly unrelated areas, affecting military promotions and governmental functionality. 

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