State of the Second

By Gun Owners of AmericaBusiness News Government Politics

State of the Second episodes

November 15, 2023Gun Rights Activist Definitions, Tyrannical Policies, and 1000% Excise Tax | #11 Ghost Tactical
State of the Second hosts Kaylee and John bring on Trey from Ghost Tactical, a Marine Corps veteran and 2A content creator, for a wide-ranging conversation about what it actually means to be a gun rights activist. Trey resists the activist label, arguing it belongs to people doing the political work at the highest level, while Kaylee pushes back with GOA's definition: an activist is anyone who takes personal responsibility in both the use of their firearms and the defense of their right to own them. The disagreement becomes the heart of the episode. They land on a shared idea, that the movement needs generals fighting the political fight and soldiers in the trenches living it out day to day, and that everyone's activist journey looks different.
From there the conversation turns to gun culture, training, and how to talk with people who disagree with you. Trey makes the case that true gun owners are among the safest people to be around and that it isn't his job to force anyone to change their mind. His approach is to plant seeds and let people reach their own conclusions, since the 10% on each side won't move but the 80% in the middle are open. On training, both agree it should never be mandated. Trey argues mandates invite low-quality instructors to feed on new gun owners, while the free market pushes the bad ones out. He stresses that training doesn't have to cost much: dry fire at home, stop the bleed and first aid courses, and tools like Mantis all count.
The back half digs into policy. They break down the proposed 1,000% excise tax as a bargaining tool designed to make a 10% tax look reasonable, and Kaylee explains why holding the line matters when the Second Amendment already has the high ground. She walks through GOA wins, including comments that stopped the green tip ammo ban, the lead ammo fight where over 90% of comments came from GOA members, and the six coalition letters tied to the House pistol brace resolution. The pistol brace rule, Trey says, is really a story about the federal government being willing to turn 30 million citizens into felons overnight. Trey closes by pointing listeners to Ghost Tactical and his podcasts, and John reminds viewers that GOA membership is $25 for the year.
Links
ghosttactical.us

Questions this episode answers
What is the difference between being a gun rights activist and being an advocate?
Trey from Ghost Tactical sees the activist label as reserved for people doing political work at the highest level, and calls himself an advocate instead. Host Kaylee pushes back, and they settle on a model where the movement needs generals fighting the political fight and soldiers living it out day to day.
How does Gun Owners of America define a gun rights activist?
By the GOA definition Kaylee offers, an activist is anyone who takes personal responsibility both in the use of their firearms and in the defense of their right to own them. That framing makes the label far broader than just full-time political operatives.
Why does Trey believe firearms training should not be state mandated?
Trey argues that training mandates invite low-quality instructors to feed on new gun owners, while a free market pushes the bad ones out. He believes everyone should train, but that it should never be required by the state.
How can someone train and practice without spending a lot of money?
Trey and Kaylee stress that training does not have to be cost prohibitive. Dry fire at home, stop the bleed and first aid courses, and tools like Mantis all count as real practice.
What is the strategy behind a proposed 1,000% excise tax on firearms?
They describe the proposed 1,000% excise tax as a bargaining tool designed to make a smaller 10% tax look reasonable by comparison. Kaylee argues for holding the line, since the Second Amendment already holds the high ground and any concession gives up that position of strength.
How did public comments and coalition letters affect the pistol brace rule and other ATF actions?
Kaylee points to Gun Owners of America wins driven by member action, including comments that stopped the green tip ammo ban and a lead ammo fight where over 90% of comments came from GOA members. On pistol braces, six coalition letters were tied to the House resolution against the rule.
Why is the pistol brace redefinition a bigger story than the brace itself?
For Trey, the real story is that the federal government was willing to turn roughly 30 million citizens into felons overnight, after a decade of telling them they were not. The brace is secondary to that reversal of the rules people relied on.
How should gun owners talk with people who disagree with them about firearms?
Trey's approach is to plant seeds and let people reach their own conclusions rather than force anyone to change their mind. He notes the roughly 10% on each side will not move, but the 80% in the middle are open to the conversation.
Chapters
00:00 — Welcome and meet Trey from Ghost Tactical
00:32 — From Plano to the Marine Corps: Trey's origin story
02:01 — How the Ghost Tactical YouTube channel started
03:31 — Activist vs advocate: defining the terms
07:57 — Generals and soldiers: every voice matters
10:56 — Is there really a gun culture?
13:35 — Talking to people who disagree, planting seeds
16:01 — Be your own first responder and carry ready
19:09 — The narrative that gun owners want to be heroes
21:04 — Why training should not be mandated
25:50 — Low cost training, dry fire and Mantis
29:32 — The 1,000% excise tax as a bargaining tool
38:28 — GOA wins: green tip, lead ammo, pistol brace letters
42:06 — Pistol braces and 30 million citizens
43:42 — Where to find Trey and closing

About the guest
Trey is the creator behind Ghost Tactical, a 2A-focused YouTube channel and podcast. He grew up in Plano, Texas, a suburb outside Dallas, where guns were not part of his life, and first learned to shoot the M16A2 after joining the Marine Corps when he was almost 19. Two days after boot camp he went to Walmart and bought his first gun, a Winchester 30-30. He got into competitive shooting about 10 years ago, starting with steel targets and then IDPA, and began making YouTube videos around 2017 after a stranger at the range suggested he film himself. He now lives in rural Arkansas and hosts several shows, including the Armed Citizen podcast (live on YouTube every Tuesday at 7 Central), the Jarhead podcast about veterans transitioning to civilian life, and the Ghost and Clover podcast with Clover Tack. He describes himself as an advocate rather than an activist.
Key quotes
"And it's someone who takes personal responsibility not only in the use of their firearms, but in the defense of their right to own them." — Kaylee
"You're never going to change 10% on the left. You're never going to change 10% on the right. The 80% in the middle are up for discussion. Plant some seeds, let them find out the information on their own." — Trey
"I think training is something that everyone should do, but it shouldn't be mandated." — Trey
"And a key point there is training doesn't have to be cost prohibitive." — Kaylee
"The federal government was okay saying 30 million of our citizens were okay making them felons overnight after we've been telling them they're not felons for 10 years." — Trey
"Anytime that we allow that to get whittled down, we're losing that position of strength that's so vital." — Kaylee
48 min
November 08, 2023NFA Laws, House Joint Resolution, and Unequal Restrictions | #10 Matador Arms
Dave from Matador Arms joins hosts Kaylee and John to talk about what the federal brace rule did to a small firearms maker, and how Matador is pivoting to survive it. Matador builds 9mm PCCs that run a bufferless, forward-charging system and work with any AR9 lower, from Glock to Sig to CZ Scorpion magazines. The company started in Canada, and Dave and his partners bought it after the previous owners moved to Las Vegas and became U.S. citizens. Much of the early business was built around short-barreled, brace-equipped uppers, so when the brace rule landed it hit Matador's inventory and sales directly. Dave walks through the response: fast-tracking a 16-inch route and a 9mm bullpup that sidesteps NFA regulation, finishing a full lower that removes the AR9 compatibility variables, and pushing toward a complete lineup of guns and caliber changes.
Kaylee lays out the legal picture from GOA's side. A preliminary injunction is in place on the brace rule, and the House passed a House joint resolution in a bipartisan vote, which she argues blows a hole in the ATF's claim that it has authority to redefine items under the NFA. She and John return repeatedly to the same point: the ATF cannot write law, that is Congress's job, and a rule that turns roughly 40 million Americans into felons overnight is both unenforceable and unjust. They cover the Bruen and Heller decisions, the text-history-and-tradition standard, red flag laws as Fourth Amendment problems, and the way the NFA's 1930s tax was designed to price firearms out of reach for ordinary and lower-income buyers.
The conversation also gets into the business reality behind a small firearms brand. Dave shares how a payment processor and host (Shiffer Shop) skimmed and then held about $14,000 of Matador's funds, citing a right to hold a firearms company's money for six to thirteen months, which pushed Matador onto a new platform and eventually WordPress. He covers the 80% frame-and-receiver lawsuits that use public-disturbance law to target manufacturers, banks and card networks flagging firearms purchases, and the grind of testing thousands of rounds before a launch. He plugs Matador as a veteran owned and operated company out of San Antonio with a lifetime warranty, and the episode closes on the message that the silent majority is finally pushing back and GOA is winning cases.
Links
matadorarms.com

Questions this episode answersWhat did the federal brace rule do to a small firearms manufacturer like Matador Arms?
Much of Matador's early business was built around short-barreled, brace-equipped uppers, so the brace rule hit its inventory and sales directly. The company responded by fast-tracking a 16-inch route and a 9mm bullpup that sidesteps National Firearms Act (NFA) regulation.
What is a House joint resolution and why does it matter for the ATF's brace rule case?
The House passed a House joint resolution against the brace rule in a bipartisan vote. Gun Owners of America argues this undercuts the ATF's claim that it has authority to redefine items under the National Firearms Act, since that power belongs to Congress.
Can the ATF redefine what counts as a firearm or write its own laws?
The hosts argue it cannot. Writing law is Congress's job, not the ATF's, and a preliminary injunction is already in place on the brace rule while the case moves forward.
How is Matador Arms pivoting its products in response to the brace rule?
Matador is fast-tracking a 16-inch route and a 9mm bullpup that sidesteps NFA regulation, finishing a full lower that removes the AR9 compatibility variables, and pushing toward a complete lineup of guns and caliber changes.
What happened when Matador used a third-party payment processor and host for its website?
Dave says the processor and host skimmed and then held about $14,000 of Matador's funds, citing a right to hold a firearms company's money for six to thirteen months. That pushed Matador onto a new platform and eventually WordPress.
How were the original NFA laws designed to affect lower-income gun buyers?
The hosts explain that the National Firearms Act's 1930s tax was designed to price firearms out of reach for ordinary and lower-income buyers, putting legal ownership beyond what many people could afford.
What are the Bruen and Heller decisions and why do they matter for gun owners?
Bruen and Heller are Supreme Court decisions the hosts cover alongside the text-history-and-tradition standard used to judge gun laws. They frame how courts now weigh Second Amendment challenges to restrictions like the brace rule.
What does Matador Arms make and where is the company based?
Matador builds 9mm PCCs with a bufferless, forward-charging system that works with any AR9 lower, from Glock to Sig to CZ Scorpion magazines. It started in Canada and is now veteran owned and operated out of San Antonio, with a lifetime warranty.
Chapters
00:00 — Meet Dave and Matador Arms
00:16 — What Matador's 9mm PCC does
01:03 — How the brace rule hit the business
01:37 — Preliminary injunction and a long legal road
02:30 — The House joint resolution explained
04:46 — Turning 40 million owners into felons
06:56 — The case to repeal the NFA entirely
10:18 — NFA as a tax on poorer buyers
14:52 — Bruen, Heller and the Supreme Court
21:11 — 80% lawsuits and frame-and-receiver law
23:11 — Buying Matador and the Mat Nine
26:21 — Going 16-inch and a 9mm bullpup
36:03 — Payment processors holding the funds
45:54 — The silent majority pushes back
50:26 — Where to find Matador Arms

About the guest
Dave is an owner of Matador Arms, a firearms manufacturer he and his partners bought from the company's previous owners after pooling money with three others. Matador makes 9mm PCCs with a bufferless, forward-charging system that works with any AR9 lower. The company started in Canada and is now veteran owned and operated out of San Antonio. Dave is an FFL and has worked on the 80% and pistol side of the industry. The company has five owners, including Alex and Justin, the latter an overseas private military contractor.
Key quotes"The entire premise that the ATF could define anything they want as a firearm is bizarre." — Dave"Well, it's even the fact that the ATF doesn't have the ability to make laws." — Kaylee"I think that the brace rule is great, but ultimately NFA removal should be the, the end goal." — Dave"It took 27 words to get across the point that you have the right to keep and bear arms." — Kaylee"Our website's matadorarms.com we're a veteran owned and operated company out of San Antonio." — Dave"I hate to break it to you, but there is no your truth, my truth, There is the truth and the stats don't lie on this." — Kaylee
53 min
October 31, 2023 Domestic Violence, Woman in the Gun Community & Due Process | #9 Kerry Slone, Executive Director at CrimeResearch.Org
To wrap up Domestic Violence month, John and Kailey sit down with Kerry Slone, the Executive Director of Education at crimeresearch.org.
We emphasize women's involvement in the firearms community and the necessity of building knowledge and confidence. Our conversation also touches upon the intricacies of background checks and highlights the importance of due process.👏
Learn more at CrimeResearch.Org
Follow Kerry: https://www.instagram.com/stilettosandshotguns3.0/
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24 min
October 25, 2023 Zero Tolerance Policy, Loopholes, and Guns in Hollywood. | #8 EAA Corp
This week’s episode of State of the Second features an insightful discussion between John, Kailey, and Chase Duffey, the National Sales and Import Manager at EAA Corp. The episode offers an in-depth exploration of the ATF’s Zero Tolerance Policy, uncovering its implications for gun stores and the potential loopholes it presents.
They also dive into various difficulties faced in the process of importing firearms into the country, outlining the obligatory steps necessary for manufacturers to follow. Moreover, the conversation delves into the depiction of firearms in Hollywood and notable industry events.
Learn more about EAA Corp.: https://eaacorp.com
42 min
October 18, 2023 Gun Confiscation & Youtube is making more Gun Owners? | #7 Clint Morgan
In this episode, John and Kailey are joined by Clint “Mag Dump” Morgan, the Brand Engagement Manager at Classic Firearms, one of the largest online retailers for military surplus firearms in the United States.
Clint tells the story of Classic Firearms, as well as the challenges they’ve faced running a gun channel, and why he’s optimistic about their future on YouTube. They discuss the ATF’s war on plastic, as well as the rogue agency’s blatant hypocrisy and contradictory attitude, and how being a 2A advocate is more than just saying you’re pro-gun.
Kailey tells the story of her first gun store experience, and what’s changed since then. They also talk about the changing demographics of firearms owners and the importance of educating the next generations.
1 hr 8 min
October 11, 2023 The ATF’S Two Faced Approach to Import/Export & Debunking Misconceptions About Turkish - Made Firearms | #6 SAR Firearms
This week on State of the Second, Kailey and John sit down with VP of sales, marketing and product development of SAR Firearms, Jacob Phair.
They address the full spectrum of issues and logistical considerations surrounding firearm imports, while also dissecting perceived inconsistencies within the ATF and deliberating on the potential consequences of the Safer Banking Act.
1 hr 12 min
October 04, 2023 Giving a Voice to a Silent Majority | #5 Nine Line Apparel
In this episode, John and Kailey sit down with Nathan Kilburn, Senior Account Manager, and John Bohannon, Sales Director at Nine Line Apparel. Nine Line is a veteran-founded lifestyle brand, dedicated to giving back to the military and first responder communities that fought and died for our freedoms.
They tell the story of how Nine Line was created by helicopter pilot Tyler Merritt, and how the company has continued to grow and help veterans in need without compromising their values. They also talk about memorable creators they’ve worked with, their favorite designs and collaborations, and discuss the importance of family and community to the Nine Line brand.
The State of the Second is available on all podcast platforms. New episodes air every Wednesday.
Learn more about Nineline Apparel:https://www.ninelineapparel.com/
1 hr 11 min
September 27, 2023 How the Pistol Brace BAN Attacks Disabled Shooters | #4 - Battle Buddy 3Gun
This week on State of the Second, Kailey and John sit down with Frankie Waddell, VP and Secretary at BattleBuddy3Gun, and Jack Smith, President at BattleBuddy3Gun.They break down the more compassionate side of the Second Amendment community and show how we can come together to make a difference for shooters who refuse to let any challenge—physical or otherwise—prevent them from bearing arms. They also dive into the war against firearms and how the ATF's ban on pistol braces is a direct assault on adaptive shooters.Learn more about Battle Buddy 3Gun:
https://www.battlebuddy3gun.org/
Youtube: @battlebuddy3gun620
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/battlebuddy3gun/
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/battlebuddy3gun---------------------
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Listen on Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/state-of-the-second/id1706665365
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48 min
September 20, 2023 ATF's War On Plastic, 1000% Gun Tax & Brace Ban | #3 - Century Arms
This week on State of the Second Kailey and John sit down with Adam Ruonala, the VP of Marketing and Business Development at Canik and Century Arms. They break down the latest on government overreach, import restrictions, ATF's War on Plastic, and the 1000% gun tax. Oh my!
Want to help support our fight against the ATF? Grab our latest limited edition shirt from Nine Line Apparel!
https://www.ninelineapparel.com/collections/goa-life-with-plastic

Follow Century Arms: https://www.instagram.com/centuryarms/
Follow Canik Firearms: https://www.instagram.com/canikusa/
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1 hr 33 min
September 15, 2023 Liberty Safe Turns its back on its Customers? | #2 - Secureit
Introducing The State of the Second Podcast, presented by GOA. Join Kailey and John as they pull back the curtain of the firearms industry through conversations with the community and industry leaders. We will discuss, policy, activism, and industry insights.
Follow State of the Second: https://linktr.ee/stateofthesecond
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17 min