"The Bus Routes Of South London"

The London-born Jah Wobble is one of the most legendary musicians on the planet. The celebrated bassist burst onto the radar with PiL, playing on the first two albums--Public Image: First Issue and Metal Box--both of which remain undisputed classics.

After leaving the band, Wobble stayed busy, playing in The Human Condition and on the Snake Charmer EP with The Edge and with his own band Invaders Of The Heart. Wobble left the industry for a few years working for a while with The London Underground--more on that in a minute--but in the late '80s a newly sober Wobble reformed the Invaders and they put out a string of winning albums like Rising Above Bedlam and Take Me To God. And from there? Well, from there, he just kept working with a list of impressive folks like Sinead O'Connor, The Orb, Ginger Baker, Dolores O'Riordan, Massive Attack, Gavin Friday, Brian Eno, Bjork and Primal Scream. Wobble has also put out a memoir called Memoirs Of A Geezer, which is such a great read, he finished his university degree at the University of London, wrote book reviews for the Independent, wrote a book of poetry, started teaching, played in a band with his sons, and played with the Chinese Dub Orchestra. This list only tells a percentage of the story; Jah Wobble is a man whose lane is not having a lane. He's one of the greatest dub musicians of all time, but he's also someone who's curious about the world and his curiosity has found him exploring ambient music, dance usic, post-punk, world music, dub, Chinese folk, English Folk, and industrial music. His album Old Fashioned Ways with reggae hero Ken Boothe came out in 2025 and it's a glorious and affecting listen. Meanwhile, his other 2025 album The Old North London Line is a proper sequel to The Bus Routes Of South London, where Wobble explores the cinematic and atmospheric sounds of the daily grooves that can be found between stops on the London tracks.

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"Measure Of A Man"

The North Carolina-born Clay Aiken rose to fame on the strength of his record breaking appearance on American Idol, but if you just think of him in terms of that show, you're not getting the full picture. At all. With seven albums under his belt, the golden-voiced Aiken has sold close to ten million albums worldwide, was the first artist whose first single hit #1, hosted two network television specials, toured with Kelly Clarkson, appeared on Broadway in Spamalot and for a Christmas show with Ruben Studdard, wrote a memoir, sang the National Anthem at the World Series, and appeared on Scrubs, SNL, Jimmy Kimmel, All My Children and Days Of Our Lives. Keep in mind this is a partial list. Outside of music, Aiken co-founded the National Inclusion Project which helps advocate for children with disabilities, he's a UNICEF ambassador and in 2014 he ran for congress. Partial list aside, I know as I was reading that all of you and me, by the way, were like, I haven't done enough with my life. Aiken is also a father and he decided to step away from music to raise his son without distraction. And so he did, but with college on the horizon for his son, Aiken has decided to re-enter the ring and this conversation is all about his return. And a bunch of other things, too. Talking to him felt familiar--like catching up with an old friend. You're going to love him.

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“Merry Christmas, Emily”

David Lowery does so many things, his CV needs a sequel. He's a professor, a mathematician, a writer, a musician, a producer and an entrepreneur. He's also the singer of two of my all-time favorite bands: Cracker and Camper Van Beethoven. Let's start with the former. Lowery formed Camper Van Beethoven when he was a student at UC Santa Cruz in the early '80s. I was so obsessed with Camper Van when I was in high school I cut class to buy their new album--but I had the wrong day, so I cut class the next day to get it. Totally worth it, by the way. Camper Van Beethoven put out a handful of genius albums likeOur Beloved Revolutionary Sweetheart and Telephone Free Landslide Victory before temporarily disbanding in 1990. Lowery didn't miss a beat and formed Cracker with guitarist Johnny Hickman and they put out a handful of genius albums like Kerosene Hat and The Golden Age, logged a #1 Modern Rock track with "Teen Angst (What The World Needs Now)" and scored three platinum albums. This is only a partial history, by the way; but I would recommend reading up on both bands because they have fascinating histories.Lowery has produced everyone from Counting Crows to Sparklehorse, founded Sound of Music studios, was a seed investor in Reverb.com (), knocked out his PhD and was named a Global IP Champion by the U.S. Chamber of Commerce. A ferocious advocate for artist's rights, among other things, Lowery launched a pair of class actions alleging major streaming services had failed to properly license and account to independent songwriters. Lowery currently teaches the economics and finance of the music business at the University of Georgia.An authentic career-spanning collection that boasts re-recordings, demos, b-sides and live takes that have never been heard, ‘Alternative History: A Cracker Retrospective’ is out now. It's a deep and privileged dive into the rich and vast Cracker cataloge and to say it's a treat falls short of the mark. It's a musical treasure chest. Cracker are touring now and will be on the road at the beginning of 2025 and Camper Van will be playing dates as well.

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"Shine On"

Formed in Seattle in the late '80s, Sweet Water got their start under the moniker SGM. Comprised of childhood friends from the private Bush School, which we talk about a lot in this episode, SGM played with Nirvana and The Melvins and their 1988 Aggression album was produced by Jack Endino and was lauded by Sub Pop's Bruce Pavitt. A thrashy blast of American post-punk SGM underwent a few lineup changes, recruited a few new members and re-named themselves Sweet Water. Their 1992 self-titled indie album got them signed to Atlantic where they put out another self-titled album. They moved to EastWest Records, put out the Superfriends record, which was a catchy blast of glam, grunge and hard rock and from there, things get a tad confusing. Legal issues held the band in abeyance, so they played under the name Parc Boys with a C, put out a record, went back to being Sweet Water, recorded an album that was supposed to come out on the Enclave label but didn't and instead was released independently. Sweet Water took a break and didn't put any new music out until their fabulous 2009 effort Clear The Tarmac. Since then, they've put out EPs like Dance Floor Kills and their brand new long player Shine On. An infectious, hook-filled album that's rife with melodic muscle and hooks galore, Shine On is a shimmering effort that proves Sweet Water just keep getting better. Now, I mentioned The Bush School and for good reason--that Seattle school is kind of the secret hero of the Sweet Water story and you'll see why in a second. I'll let the fellas tell you everything, but let me say this: when the foundational education is one that fosters artistic freedom, students feel like they can do anything because they're not self-conscious, they're deeply brave and they're not afraid to make bold strikes out there in the world. And Sweet Water has made a career out of doing that. 

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"When It Comes To Love"

The Massachusetts-born Michael Bluestein got a quick run out of the musical gates and started studying classical piano by age nine, so it's no surprise that the young prodigy's trajectory found him studying at Berklee College of Music. With his B.A. under his belt, Bluestein headed west and wound up in San Francisco, where he spent a decade putting out his own music and working as a venerated sideman and session player with Jon Evans, Will Bernard, Matt Chamberlain, Kitty Margolis, Kenny Washington and Mary Stallings. He has toured and recorded with Shelby Lynn, Boz Scaggs, Stevie Nicks, Burt Bacharach, Enrique Iglesias and Rodger Hodgson. He joined Foreigner in 2008 and that's where he's been ever since, but he's also putting out music under the Beat Glider moniker. Filled with undeniable groove and musical dexterity, Beat Glider is a careening and moving dose of chillwave. Michael talks to us about his San Francisco days and importance of putting oneself out there in the artistic community.

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"Black Butterflies"

The Vancouver-raised Rebecca Foon grew up with parents who were artists and activists, so it's no surprise that she became an artist and an activist herself. Let's start with the artist part. The Juno-award winning cellist, singer and composer Rebecca Foon has been in so many bands it's hard to keep track, so this is a partial list. No stranger to the post-rock and experimental world, Foon has been in Set Fire To Flames, Fifths Of Seven, A Silver Mt. Zion and the Gorecki Symphony Of Sorrow with Colin Stetson. She's also recorded under the Saltland moniker and she's the co-founder of the modern chamber ensemble Esmerine, whose 2013 Dalmak record won them a Juno. Under her own name Foon put out Waxing Moon in 2020 and the follow-up is the rather stunning new album Black Butterflies. Filled with sonorous vocals, inventive percussion and wondrous, sneaky rhythms, the reflective trip-hop groove of Black Butterflies summons the work of everyone from Massive Attack to Portishead.

Redolent with rhythmic precision, musical dexterity and the kind of sonic architecture that builds worlds in the sky, Black Butterflies is a dose of real magic. Foon has collaborated with a list of luminaries like Laurie Anderson, Grant Hart, Nick Cave, British Sea Power, and Patrick Watson. As an activist and environmentalist, she's a member of the sustainability and climate change consulting cooperative Sustainability Solutions Group. A creative force powered by grace, Rebecca Foon is a real treasure.

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"The Things You Don't Know Yet"

I seem to care more about the band Adult Leisure than my own adult leisure and there's a good reason for that. The Bristol outfit Adult Leisure are one of the most exciting indie pop bands around. Formed in 2020, Adult Leisure have put out a succession of catchy singles and EPs like The Weekend Ritual which have all led up to the release of their debut album, The Things You Don't Know Yet. Filled with infectious hooks, inventive arrangements and a singer in Neil Scott whose delivery is a mix of lippy confidence and pure pop grace, Adult Leisure are poised to be huge. They've got the songs, they've got the attitude and they've got the ambition. But they're also down to earth--in fact, Neil, who's a really nice guy, just got off work when this conversation took place. And he talks about the balance between civilian life and potential stardom with both wisdom and perspective.

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"Love Rollercoaster"

To say the Ohio Players are one of the greatest funk bands of all time kind of falls short of the mark. The Ohio Players are, quite simply, one of the greatest bands of all time. The Dayton R&B outfit got their start in 1959 as the Ohio Untouchables and their leader Robert Ward was like a funk version of Jim Morrison--brilliant but unpredictable, Ward would walk offstage mid-gig and never come back. He was punk long before there was punk and he was a wild card for sure, but charisma can carry you pretty far in art. But, to be fair, it can't always carry you over the line and the Untouchables started swapping out personnel, Ward included, and they rebranded in the late '60s as the Ohio Players. A false start found them skidding to a halt in 1970, but then, things started to gel. A furious blend of funk and soul, The Ohio Players started racking up hits like Love Rollercoaster, Fire and Who'd She Coo? Albums like Skin Tight, Honey and Contradiction remain indisputable classics and the band is still at it, currently in the studio cooking something up. As for James Diamond Williams, he joined the band around '74 and he quickly asserted himself as one of the very best behind the kit. A muscular player with swagger and swing, Williams is one of those guys who makes it look easy--and if someone is great enough to make something difficult look easy, you can be assured it isn't.

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"Forever Shining"

In 1976 brothers Tony and Chip Kinman founded the legendary Carlsbad punk band The Dills, who in just four short years crammed their music CV with highlights. Before they disbanded in 1980, The Dils had recorded classics like "Class War" and Mr. Big" opened for the Clash and appeared in Cheech and Chong's Up In Smoke. The Kinmans went on to form Rank and File, who are considered by many to be one of the first cowpunk bands around. Rank and FIle's rootsy stomp and melodic muscle powered them through three perfect albums--Sundown, Long Gone Dead and their self-titled 19897 swansong. The Kinmans had an uncanny ability to read the cultural room before anyone else--they were hardcore before it hit the suburbs and they were cowpunk before it was cool and with their next band Blackbird, they were techno metal before Korn and Linkin Park shirts at Hot Topic. The Kinmans went on to play in bands like Cowboy Nation and Ford Madox Ford and sadly, Tony Kinman died in 2018. Which brings us to KInman's self-titled Kinman's new album. A stirring song cycle filled with acoustic numbers, Tex-Mex techno, the undulating rhythms and "Me And Tony" a streetwise tribute to a life in music with his brother, Kinman's new record sounds like nobody else. It's filled with unexpected sonic flourishes, heartfelt emotional ruminations, great storytelling and devastating beauty. It's bold and brilliant work.

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"Rocks Off"

The Connecticut-born singer songwriter Sean Griffin has helmed the Irish punk outfit The Ruffians for close to thirty years. With three great albums under their belts, the band has played shows with everyone from Shane MacGowan to Black 47 and in the process, they've garnered a reputation for being one of the best live acts around. Sean's solo work swaps some of the traditional instrumentation of the Ruffians and makes winning detours into Britpop and indie rock bliss. His first single was the rousing "People Are Mad" which was followed up by "Rocks Off" which is a swaggering blast of pop mastery which may very well be a late entry into one of the year's biggest bangers. Griffin's voice has plenty of muscle and plenty of elegance and that rare mix brings to mind the raw but polished athleticism of a gymnast, which, by the way, Griffin actually was. We talk about that and so much more...

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