Candice Lim is joined by Yowei Shaw (former co-host of NPR’s Invisibilia) to discuss her new podcast Proxy, which takes listeners through the psychological aftermath of a layoff, starting with Shaw’s own layoff from NPR. In March 2023, the public radio institution laid off approximately 10 percent of its staff, resulting in the cancellation of four podcasts, including Invisibilia. Shaw, along with her team, was working on an upcoming season of the podcast when they were suddenly without jobs. More than a year later, Shaw is back with Proxy, which investigates layoff culture and asks questions like “Is there a good way to lay off employees?” and “Why did my HR representative smile when they laid me off?”

This podcast is produced by Se’era Spragley Ricks, Daisy Rosario, Candice Lim and Rachelle Hampton.

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