The AJP Podcast talks to the Pharmaceutical Society of Australia’s inaugural Aged Care Pharmacist of the Year – Neil Petrie, who has been working primarily in aged care, undertaking medication reviews for the past 25 years.

He has also owned his own community pharmacy in the past and semi-retired into aged care onsite pharmacy under the ACOP program.

With a father and uncle who were pharmacists, he says he remembers being about six or seven years old, “and going to the pharmacy after hours with my dad to make up an APC mixture, if I remember rightly, which was aspirin, phenacetin, and caffeine in it”.

“And I vividly remember my father saying, hold that needle and don’t drop it. And what did I do? I dropped it onto the footpath, didn’t I?

“So pharmacy’s been in my blood for a long time and I did have my own pharmacy for about 13 years, but I realised I wanted to do something a little bit different and when I had my pharmacy, I started servicing some hostels at that point in time and I really enjoyed that work.”

Petrie was one of Australia’s first pharmacists accredited to conduct medication reviews in 1998 – and ever since, his motto has been change.

He says ACOP will only increase in time, and “highlights our impact on direct resident care, medication safety, the quality use of medicines, and really system-wide improvements to medication procedures. So it really showcases us as pharmacists as a valued integral part of the care team.”

This is also highlighted, he says, by the sheer need for pharmacists’ services; discussing the most common medication-related problems in aged care facilities, given the amount of polypharmacy – and more importantly, inappropriate polypharmacy – underway.

01:13 – Neil’s introduction to pharmacy

03:42 – Aged care: a changing environment

05:11 – RMMRs and lack of rural and remote support: a disillusioning moment

06:14 – The responsibility of promoting ACOP

07:39 – Over 30-plus years in the field, what has changed the most?

09:29 – “How one person within the organisation can change an organisation overnight”

10:40 – The most common medication-related problems in ACFs

11:46 – Beginning an antibiotic stewardship program

13:11 – Taking the workload off the nurses

15:09 – “We have to get to a point where society says wherever medication is involved in therapy, there’s a pharmacist involved.”

17:11 – Thoughts on deprescribing

18:36 – The role of interdisciplinary team-based care

20: 54 – “How do you approach educating both residents and their families about their medications?”

22:07 – Practical strategies

23: 58 – “Polypharmacy is challenging.”

25: 06 – Neil’s vision for the future

29:26 – How can technology help?

32:18 – What advice would you give young pharmacists?

42:07 – A passion for antimicrobial use

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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Meridian Lawyers’ Chandrika Darroch joins PDL Podcast host, Amy Minion, and pharmacist, Georgina Woods, to discuss how to apologise when incidents occur. 

This episode of the Be Risk Ready PDL Podcast looks at how to apologise for an incident, and what to do and not do.  

The topics covered include: 

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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The Capital Chemist Charnwood is in the news again: 11 years after being named Guild Pharmacy of the Year, it has again taken home two of the final awards in the competition, being recognised for excellence in Community Engagement and Excellence in Harm Minimisation at APP25.

Co-owner Samantha Kourtis told AJP Podcast host Carlene McMaugh that government decisions, made without input from pharmacy, were a strong influence on her implementing a fee-for-service model.

“From the early days, I’ve been a huge advocate for charging [for] things,” Kourtis says.

“And 13 years ago I walked into this pharmacy. Everything was free, free blood pressure, free home delivery, free Webster packs, free consult with the baby nurse, free everything.

“And early on I was like, well, this has to stop.”

It simply wasn’t a viable business model, she realised – perhaps counter-intuitive given that Charnwood is one of Canberra’s lowest socioeconomic demographics, but as it turned out, customers are happy to pay what pharmacist expertise is worth.

She pointed out that she bought into the business in March 2010 – and that in October that year, the federal government announced accelerated price disclosure.

“I was in a real position where my business loan could have crashed and burned. The bank could have come in and taken it away because overnight the value of our businesses went down…

“And we’ve seen this happen several times over the last 10 years with what the government’s done.

“So it was my commitment to valuing the work that a registered healthcare professional did and my commitment to stopping the of services in pharmacy and then the financial pressure on me as a brand new young business owner that had to go, okay, well, I don’t want to pay my pharmacist award wage. I want to pay them well, because they do a really great job.

“So if someone wants to sit down with a pharmacist for a blood pressure check, they’ll pay for it. And that has gained momentum from then. And we were charging $15, 13 years ago, for a wound consult fee.”

01:40 – Becoming an award-winning pharmacy through the ups and downs

05:01 – What did winning the awards mean for staff and the community?

06:59 – Talking about harm minimisation in schools

08:07 – What it takes to being an award-winning pharmacy in this space

11:11 – Engaging with the community

13:22 – The viable business model

16:11 – Why $10 for a consult is “such a joke that is so disrespectful to our profession”.

17:01 – “Nobody complains really about the price.”

18:29 – What does being unsurprised in pharmacy mean to you?

21:10 – “I could not believe that the leaders in our country thought that [disparaging pharmacists over 60-day dispensing] was a good idea.”

22: 31 – “Actually, it doesn’t matter what I think. Doesn’t matter how I practise, doesn’t matter how much I care, things are going to happen. And that was quite freeing.”

24:11 – On being part of the scope trials

28:38 – What are the core values of your pharmacy?

31:35 – A challenge for pharmacists: be unsurprised

34:36 – A “vulnerable time” for pharmacy

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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Pharmacist Amanda Quek is currently working on her PhD, focused on developing clinical practise guidelines for deprescribing common medications used by older people.

She told AJP Podcast host Carlene McMaugh that it’s vital to take a “pragmatic personalised approach when it comes to prescribing and deprescribing”.

“This just means that understanding what matters to the person, the values and preferences and priorities for treatment, other expects that are important is to consider the person acceptability to deprescribing the support system life expectancy and ability to safely manage changes in treatment,” Quek says.

“And I think the shared decision making and clear communication between the patient and the healthcare providers is especially important.

“People need to feel supported and reassured, especially when stopping a medication they’ve been on for a long time.”

Quek notes that health professionals often note a lack of clear structure to support desprescribing.

“An effective literature review published last year found that around 70% of all clinical practice guidelines for treatment don’t include any guidance about deprescribing,” she tells McMaugh.

“And most of them focus heavily on when to start a medication but rarely offer advice on when or how to safely reduce and stop them.

“And there’s a huge missed opportunity.”

01:04 – What is deprescribing and why does it matter?

02:53 – “Deprescribing isn’t just about managing a medication list, it’s about looking at the whole person.”

05:43 – Gaps and challenges to address

08:37 – What do these guidelines add to the existing evidence that supports deprescribing?

09:56 – The team that put the guidelines together – including patients and carers

12:53 – “One of the most valuable things we learned from them was just how critical clear communication is in healthcare.’

14:06 – What does this feedback mean for pharmacists and for patients?

16:02 – How to share feedback

17:01 – “The main thing is just to remember for both patients and pharmacists is that deprescribing is a team effort.”

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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During NAIDOC Week, fourth-year pharmacy student and proud Wiradjuri woman Jesyca Pearson has told AJP Podcast host Carlene McMaugh shared a store of information for pharmacists.

A key issue is acknowledging the difference in cultures, says Pearson, giving a slew of tips which can help pharmacists understand not only their Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander patients better, but patients from other cultures and with other needs as well.

“As a pharmacist we might write, for example, on our Webster packs, we have morning lunch, dinner, bedtime,” she says as an example.

“I think it’s important to steer clear of that, especially among mob patients, and instead of having those specific times have an actual time.

“So for example, 8:00 AM, 12:00 PM, 7:00 PM, 8:00 PM… Just so we can establish an actual time and avoid those medication issues at home because some mob might call their tea time morning tea, or dinnertime could mean lunchtime, and then we’re getting our doses at the wrong time of the day or we’re missing doses.”

Pearson also goes into the concept of cultural safety – particularly important for pharmacy as accessible health professionals.

“There’s just been a lot of distrust in the past and we’d hate for this to be ongoing, especially as pharmacist scope is expanding and we’re having such a bigger impact on our community’s health,” she says. “I think it’s very important to have the whole team trained…

“I’m a Wiradjuri woman, so I know my culture quite well, but I also know lots of other mobs have different culture and different traditional law as we call it.

“So I think as a pharmacist and as a pharmacy team as a whole, it’s important to know what land you’re practising on, know your people, know their history, and know their culture, which you do through talk.

“We always talk. You’ll find if you open up in conversation with an Indigenous patient, if you are kind, caring, open and willing to understand, most of them will be very, very appreciative to share their culture and tell you about it.

“Especially me being an Indigenous person. If I was to go and work in another state, for example, and I’m not familiar with the customs on that land, I would engage in conversation with the elders, with local people and just ask the questions, be upfront, be inquisitive.”

And there’s a lot to be learned from the international experience as well, Pearson says, such as Canadian First Nations programs which even allow OTC medicines and vitamins to be provided free of charge.

1.3—Where Jesyca’s passion for Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander health comes from

03:45—Why NAIDOC Week matters – especially for young mob

05:00—“To First Nations people, health and wellbeing isn’t just about being healthy or being sick.”

06:21—“We got all of our medicine from the land…. And when colonisation happened, we didn’t have that.”

07:51—The key conditions First Nations people are most likely to live with

10:02—On cultural differences

11.17—What does cultural safety mean in the context of pharmacy?

12:44—Taking steps towards cultural safety

15:27—“Practising with culturally safe care in the front of your mind is essential to developing those healthy relationships and having the best outcomes for our patients.”

18:23—Close the Gap and Aboriginal Health Services

20:45—“We can sometimes forget about programs that can be beneficial to our patients.”

22:41—Program limitations, and why pharmacists should be able to sign patients up to CTG… plus what’s happening in Canada

26:55—Integrating pharmacists within Aboriginal community controlled health services

29:14—“Expanding scope is pretty essential because we’re changing.”

31:06—Encouraging more Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people to work in pharmacy

33:43—Inspiring pharmacists and students

38:03—How can the pharmacy profession better support and empower Indigenous leadership within the sector?

41:00—Successful initiatives in the community

42:55—”Listen to your community, engage in those meaningful conversations and get to know your patients.” Pearson talks sorry business, men’s business and women’s business

46:10—Pearson’s vision for the future

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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“We know that a lot of the people who are going to come into the course are people who haven’t studied for a number of years,” UWA course director Amy Page told the AJP’s podcast host Carlene McMaugh. 

“So, we’re not wanting to test them on their ability to write an essay or to reference because we know that a lot of the time when people go back to uni after a number of years, they spend just as much time trying to work out how to use the referencing software as they do learning the content,” she added. 

“So we’ve designed all of our assessments to be authentic assessments; they’re around how to deliver a consultation or how to write a report or how to do your documentation. They’re not around how to do

To deliver on its aims, course designers engaged a number of different disciplines. 

“In our medication management review and aged care course, it’s being written not only by pharmacists,

Highlights include: 

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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“Because it’s very difficult, what sounds normal,” Jess Burrey tells AJP Podcast host Carlene McMaugh. “You have to then start hearing what does not sound normal.”

Burrey is a central Queensland pharmacist who has just become a prescribing pharmacist and joined as the central Queensland representative for the Queensland Pharmacy Guild.

In this podcast, she tells McMaugh what the training was like, including a practical placement at a local GP where she got “out of her comfort zone”.

“I structured my practical component where I did a combination of doing or I guess stepping into the consult room more often in the pharmacy and just kind of working with my general patients and doing a little bit more and then having discussions with my supervisors and then also going in and working half a day a week at the general practice,” she said.

“Initially I just sat in, watched them deliver consultation, kind of get a feel for how to really connect with patients and then fast forward, kind through a few steps and by the end I was going through the wait list where I live, we have a six week wait to see a GP.

“So I was going through the wait list trying to pick out patients that looked like they fell hopefully within my scope and I would ring those patients, see them at the general practice, and then my supervisor would come in at the end, review all of my work and then decide, yes, I’ve made the right decision about what I would like to treat and prescribe, and then they would just finalise off the consultant and write the prescription when I was not able to do so.”

Highlights include:

(01:15) – Burrey details the Queensland prescribing course

(04:12) – Practical placements

(06:15) – How Burrey is using her new skills

(07:25) – An opportunity to intervene

(09:55) – Five hours in ED – or an hour and a half wait in a pharmacy?

(11:38) – Staffing: “As a rural pharmacist, I am working with reality”

(15:07) – “Even while I was doing the training where I was practising on my patients, they were wanting to pay me”

(17:27) – “I think it’s really cool to have a stethoscope and to be able to use it”

(19:00) – What’s next for pharmacists?

(20:20) – Pharmacy services: Business as usual

(22:41) – The “slow burn” as pharmacists’ interest gains ground and begins to explode

(24:40) – What do patients think?

(25:42) – Advice for the hesitant

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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With Victorian premier Jacinta Allen and health minister Mary-Anne Thomas “very, very keen to support us in exactly the same way as Queensland and the other states,” the former Pharmacy Guild national president has explained the state branch’s current priorities, as well as offering advice for thriving as pharmacy evolves.

Tambassis, now the Guild’s Victorian state president, defined full scope, and how things are changing, particularly in Victoria.

He told AJP podcast host Carlene McMaugh that at a recent regional Guild meeting, he presented on full scope, and was pleased at the response.

“People my age were actually getting excited,” he said. “The young people were getting excited, it didn’t matter.

“I was a little bit reluctant and nervous that sometimes 60 year olds or older guys and ladies that are still practising at our age, my age group might be a little bit nervous or too lazy or …don’t want to do the extra training.”

But that was far from the case.

“[O]ldies like me have put their hand up and said, you know what? This is something that I’d like to get involved because it just keeps me fresh.”

Not only is Guild membership keen to get going on scope of practice, but the universities are excited to start upskilling pharmacists as well, he said.

“Any pharmacist that’s listening to this podcast should really be advocating as best he or she can within any decision maker,” he advised, after noting that he had first met former health minister Greg Hunt when the then backbencher had visited his pharmacy’s reopening.

“He just got a really, really good taste of pharmacy that he wouldn’t have had otherwise…

“They come across at any time… You never know when you’re working in a pharmacy or a hospital, wherever your place of practice is.

“You can really never know who that patient or that customer may be. So when you get the opportunity to explain to them, explain to the consumer or the member of the public that pharmacists are very, very, very highly trained healthcare professionals and we’ve got quite a bit of capacity to do more.

“You never know who you’re talking to.”

02:42 – How Tambassis started out

03:36 – “This strange organisation called the Pharmacy Guild reached out to me”

06:42 – “You never, never know when the next person’s going to walk in your pharmacy. They might end up being the prime minister in 10 years or the health minister.”

08:04 – The importance of full scope – and the process of having it approved in Victoria

10:51 – Scope as a member priority

13:09 – How can pharmacists prepare their pharmacies for increased scope in Victoria?

15:47 – What does the federal election mean for the Guild, and for pharmacists?

17:30 – The upcoming beginning of the reduced general PBS copayment

19:15 – “The future should be good”

20:22 – Pharmacy’s current challenges

22:24 – End of financial year advice

24:20 – The uptake of existing opportunities, such as the UTI service and oral contraceptives

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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“LGBTQIA patients often face fear of judgement, misgendering or having to show up in discomfort when they have to educate their own healthcare provider just to receive that appropriate care,” says Deni Salmon, the founder of Queer Pharmacists of Australia.

“In pharmacy, this can show up in when people are trying to access gender affirming hormones or if we take a look at the other parts of the queer community… it includes the cisgender community, but the HIV status being over-sensationalised when you’re going to get to antiretrovirals and stuff like that,” says Salmon, a transgender woman and community pharmacist.

“Or even just assumptions about sexual health in general, not being able to navigate from a cis heteronormative kind of aspect,” she tells AJP Podcast host Carlene McMaugh.

“The result usually leads to delayed care, poorer health outcomes, and deep mistrust in the system.”

And LGBTQIA+ pharmacists face challenges of their own, she warns.

“Ultimately that can look like misgendering being passed over for leadership opportunities and I don’t think that’s secluded to L-G-B-T-Q-I-A pharmacists or transgender pharmacists

“It can be for women and people of colour and then dealing with those microaggressions from both colleagues and patients in the workplace…

“And when we do speak up, there’s often a fear of being labelled difficult or too political, and that’s something I’ve encountered so many times and I know I’m going to still encounter it in the future,” she says.

“I’m quite passionate and strong to deal with it, but I wish it would just stop because there’s other people who I don’t want that to happen to and I don’t think they can be as determined I guess, or they don’t even need to be determined.

“Those sorts of interactions can really just beat down at your ego and you shouldn’t have to deal with that at work.

“It can be isolating, but that’s also why peer support and visibility matters so much.”

More highlights include:

(00:49) – What does championing diversity and health equity mean for you?

(01:57) – “I think an ideal outcome would be a pharmacy landscape where every patient feels safe, seen and affirmed.”

(03:16) – How can pharmacists be more welcoming and inclusive for all?

(04:14) – Barriers to care for LGBTQIA+ patients

(05:30) – Challenges for LGBTQIA+ pharmacists

(07:49) – Salmon’s own experiences in pharmacy

(11:00) – Why using ‘Sir’ or ‘Ma’am’ never felt right in pharmacy

(12:48) – Bias and stigma in health care

(14:06) – “Start by using gender neutral language.”

(15:40) – Why Salmon founded Queer Pharmacists of Australia

(16:53) – Engaging in activism

(19:23) – Why the recent Fair Work decision on pay for feminised workforces was “very long overdue”

(21:29) – Women in pharmacy and the “double bind”

(25:11) – Why cultural competence and inclusivity matter in pharmacy

(26:04) – Self care and remaining resilient

(28:21) – Doing things better in the future

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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AJP Podcast host Carlene McMaugh has spoken with Pharmaceutical Society of Australia national president Dr Fei Sim to find out what pharmacy, pharmacists and not least patients need from the next government.

Sim takes us through the series of recent reviews into scope of practice, and why it matters so much, particularly given the chronic workforce shortages across the health sector.

“I really believe that if nothing changes the health system is really not going to cope,” Sim warns.

“We do have an issue in Australia in terms of ageing population and we know that ageing population will come with increased healthcare needs and we know that if nothing changes, nothing changes.”

She cited the Deloitte report which showed that by 2050, Australia is going to need four times as many full-time equivalent health professionals as it does currently – “and we know that’s not possible”.

“And that’s why there needs to be a reform to really look at how we can enable all healthcare professionals to practise to our full and top of scope,” she says.

Sim tells McMaugh that the top priority for PSA this election is “to ask the government for their commitment to support professional practise education and training of pharmacists because these are all needed to support pharmacists to practise to full scope.

“It’s so important that this has to be the immediate policy priority because all of the measures that were previously committed by the government, which are designed to enhance professional practice, education and training of pharmacists, they need to be fully funded.

“Because if pharmacists are not supported in terms of not just remuneration, but if pharmacists are not supported in terms of upskilling, in terms of the availability of training and education in terms of the availability of a strong and robust professional governance framework underpinning the practise and especially the fast evolving practise, then pharmacists are not supported to do the job well.”

Sim goes through the eight “very, very clear election asks” put forward in its recent pre-election platform.

Highlights include:

(01.54): “Everybody cares about health.”

(03:08): How have the recent pharmacy reviews influenced PSA’s agenda?

(06:40): “If nothing changes the health system is really not going to cope.”

(11:11): PSA’s number-one priority: supporting pharmacists

(14:40): Support to improve patients’ access to PBS medicines

(17:50): Don’t forget about medicines-related harm

(20:33): Credentialled pharmacists and why the HMR cap must be removed – and remuneration must be adequate

(23:06): The Aged Care Onsite Pharmacist program

(25:03): Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander health

(26:52): How has government responded to these priorities?

(29:44): The member advocacy push

(33:22): “This needs to be an ongoing conversation.”

You can access the full transcript of this podcast here. While we endeavour to ensure all important words and phrases are correct, please note there may be some minor inaccuracies in the transcription.

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