The Butcher Shop

Episode Overview

On this episode of The Articulate Fly, host Marvin Cash sits down with Eric Hurst, the fly designer behind the Umpqua-produced Thrasher and Agent Scully streamers, fresh off his first season in Montana. It's a candid conversation about guiding burnout, building a name from scratch and designing streamers that actually swim. For serious streamer tiers and anglers weighing a move from Southeastern tailwaters to big Western trout water, Hurst's perspective is unusually raw and practical.

Hurst grew up bass fishing in Alabama and came to fly fishing self-taught, learning to tie largely from YouTube before spending close to a decade guiding out of Alpharetta Outfitters on the Georgia tailwaters around Atlanta, with days in Tennessee and North Carolina. Now working for Kelly Galloup at Galloup's Slide Inn in Montana, he explains why Western trout key on hatches far more exclusively than Southeastern fish, why he would rather fish a good caddis hatch than chase the salmonfly hype and why he has stepped away from guiding until he knows his new water well enough to be fully confident. The heart of the episode is streamer design: his profile-first philosophy, the Mike Schmidt "rule of halves" for building a tapered silhouette, pairing buoyant and sinking materials so the fly works with less input on the retrieve and a glue-free thread wrap, also from Schmidt, for securing articulation wire. He also shares how Umpqua came to him about the Thrasher and Agent Scully, previews his new Secret Shopper, walks through the materials currently on his bench and makes the case for Bobbin the Hood as the event every streamer tier should attend.

Key Takeaways

• How to build a tapered streamer profile with the "rule of halves," sizing each successive material at roughly half the length of the one behind it.
• Why pairing buoyant materials like deer hair with sinking materials like Laser Dub produces a fly that moves on its own and requires less work on the retrieve.
• How to secure articulation wire without glue using Mike Schmidt's back-and-forth thread wrap that tightens under tension like a Chinese finger trap.
• Why trout in Montana key on the hatch more exclusively than fish on Southeastern tailwaters like the South Holston, and what that means for an angler moving west.
• Why less is more at the vise, from trimming back a fly that already looks finished to pulling out long fibers rather than stacking materials.
• How handing new patterns to shop staff and clients gives a designer more objective field-testing feedback than fishing them personally.

Techniques & Gear Covered

The tying discussion centers on articulated streamers and swim flies, including Hurst's Thrasher, a swim fly tied weighted or unweighted, and the Agent Scully sculpin pattern, both produced by Umpqua in standard and mini sizes, with the newly added Secret Shopper to follow. He breaks down two techniques he learned from Mike Schmidt, the rule of halves and a glue-free thread wrap down the articulation wire, along with his recent move from two Hareline 3D beads to one for better swimming action. On the materials side he highlights Montana Fly Company's peppered chenille, used on Mike Schultz's Woodsman to build profile without holding water, and Kelly Galloup's Fish Feathers from MFC printed in rainbow, brown and speckled trout patterns. At the bench he ties on a black-and-gold Regal vise and brushes out fibers with a switchblade-style comb from Gatlinburg, Tennessee. For a deeper dive into swim fly mechanics, see BONUS - The Science of Streamers (Pt II): Kirk Klingensmith on Swim Flies.

Locations & Species

Hurst cut his teeth guiding trout on the Georgia tailwaters around Atlanta, with additional trips in Tennessee and North Carolina, before relocating to Montana for his first season on Western trout water. His biggest adjustment has been how selectively Montana trout key on hatches compared with Southeastern tailwater fish, even during strong sulphur hatches on the South Holston. He describes this year's Montana salmonfly hatch as hit or miss, fishing more like streamer fishing where you have to be in the right place at the right time, and says he would rather catch a good caddis hatch. His fishing roots go back to bluegill and bass in Alabama, which he still revisits to keep himself grounded.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhat is the rule of halves in streamer tying?

The rule of halves, which Hurst credits to Mike Schmidt, sizes each material at about half the length of the material tied in behind it. For example, a schlappen tail is followed by bucktail at half the tail's length, and the main body is half the length of the bucktail. The result is a fly that tapers naturally, and Hurst says you can see the improved profile when it swims.

How do you secure articulation wire on a streamer without glue?

Using a technique he learned from Mike Schmidt, Hurst wraps thread down the wire, back up halfway, down the full length and back up halfway again so the wraps behave like a Chinese finger trap: the harder the connection pulls, the tighter it gets. He stopped using glue on his articulation connections entirely after adopting the technique.

How is fly fishing for trout in Montana different from Southeastern tailwaters?

According to Hurst, Montana trout key on the hatch far more exclusively than fish back east. Southeastern tailwater trout will lock onto a strong sulphur hatch on the South Holston, but Western fish often want only what is hatching. He also found the salmonfly hatch less dependable than its reputation and prefers a strong caddis hatch for dry fly fishing.

How did Eric Hurst get his fly patterns picked up by Umpqua?

Umpqua reached out to Hurst first, while he was still tying purely for fun, and asked whether he had ever considered submitting patterns. He sent in the Thrasher, named for Georgia's state bird the brown thrasher as a nod to brown trout, and the Agent Scully, a sculpin pattern named as a nod to The X-Files. Both are now available in standard and mini sizes, the Secret Shopper is coming and he hopes to add micro versions.

What does it take to be a good fly fishing guide?

Hurst says a good guide has to love teaching and sharing, and that catching fish is secondary because no guide can make fish eat. He approaches every trip as a teacher who wants to fish through his clients, and he will not take anyone out on water he is not fully confident on. He also warns that giving everything to clients day after day takes a real mental toll.

Sponsors

Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use ARTFLY20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.

Related Content

BONUS - The Science of Streamers (Pt II): Kirk Klingensmith on Swim Flies

BONUS - A Deep Dive into the Swingin' D: Techniques and Tips with Mike Schultz

S8, Ep 14 - Crafting Connections: Blane Chocklett on Fly Design and Conservation at Tie Fest

S7, Ep 9 - Inside The Chocklett Factory: New Fly Tying Products, Bobbin and More with Blane Chocklett

S8, Ep 64 - Streamer Strategies: Ellis Ward's Late Day Fishing Tips for East Tennessee

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Follow Eric on Instagram.

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Helpful Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction

01:34 First Fishing Memories and Finding Fly Fishing

05:43 From Tailwater Angler to Guide

09:30 Building a Guiding Business and Finding His Style

12:48 Heading West and Starting Over

16:45 Montana Waters and the Joy of Guiding

21:04 Boat Lunches, Beers and Good Company

24:28 Finding His Way at the Vise

27:45 Tying Influences and the Pull of Streamers

31:26 Designing Streamers That Swim

34:08 The Stories Behind the Thrasher and Agent Scully

36:34 Tying Tips, Tools and New Materials

43:50 Winter Plans and Tying Events

Episode Overview

How should anglers pick streamer color when the light drops out on an East Tennessee tailwater? On this East Tennessee Fishing Report from The Articulate Fly fly fishing podcast, host Marvin Cash checks in with guide Ellis Ward for a conditions update on the Watauga River and the South Holston River after an unusually wet stretch pulled the region out of a prolonged post-Helene drought. Ellis walks through how the sudden swing from months of low water to near-constant rain has scrambled the normal dam release schedule, turning a predictable one-to-six-o'clock Watauga generation window into something closer to ten-to-six or noon-to-nine depending on the day, while the South Holston has only recently returned to regular releases after the TVA system spent the better part of a year recovering from drought. That inconsistency has made dry fly fishing unpredictable, so Ellis has leaned harder into dirty water streamer fishing, night fishing and mousing to keep clients on fish. The back half of the episode tackles a listener question on late-day streamer selection: Ellis explains that a fly's color has almost nothing to do with how a trout perceives it in low light or off-color water, since a backlit fly reads only as a silhouette regardless of hue. Instead, he breaks down why opacity and water-column position, not color, drive strikes when the sun drops or the water turns dirty, using a four-inch Drunk and Disorderly as his low light standard.

Key Takeaways

• How to read Watauga and South Holston release schedules when heavy rain pushes actual generation windows well beyond their posted baseline times.
• Why a streamer's color becomes irrelevant to trout in backlit or off-color water, since profile and opacity determine what the fish actually sees from below.
• When to switch to a bigger, opaque streamer fished higher in the water column for low light or dirty water strikes.
• How positioning a streamer near the surface exploits the same predatory "kill shot" instinct anglers see when a big trout follows a fly up before committing.

Techniques & Gear Covered

Ellis breaks down a practical framework for low light and off-color water streamer fishing: when light is reduced by cloud cover, a low sun angle or dirty water, color stops mattering because a backlit fly is seen only in silhouette, so the two variables that matter are opacity (how fully the fly blocks light) and where it sits in the water column. He favors densely packed materials such as deer hair or craft fur over sparsely tied bucktail for maximum light-blocking, contrasting a sparse bucktail fly with a Craft Fur Changer to illustrate how much more effectively the denser material blocks light once it's wet and compressed. He fishes that fly higher in the water column so a predatory trout gets a clean, unobstructed shot at it rather than having to hunt it out of deeper, murkier water. His go-to for these conditions is a four-inch Drunk and Disorderly, fished in white, yellow or tan with some flash since color reads as irrelevant to the fish in these conditions.

Locations & Species

This report covers the Watauga River and the South Holston River tailwaters in East Tennessee, both part of the TVA's 32-dam reservoir and tailwater system. The primary target species is brown trout, with the discussion centered on dry fly fishing during stable release windows and streamer fishing when water runs high or dirty. Seasonally, the region is climbing out of a prolonged drought that followed Hurricane Helene, with persistent heavy rainfall now producing extended and inconsistent dam releases, flash flooding on Watauga tributaries and a tradeoff between stained water (better streamer fishing) and clearer water (better dry fly fishing).

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhat color streamer should I fish in low light conditions?

Color is largely irrelevant once light is reduced by clouds, a low sun angle or dirty water, because a fly viewed from below against a backlit sky reads only as a silhouette. Instead, focus on opacity (how completely the fly blocks light) and fish it higher in the water column where a trout can see and commit to it more easily.

Why doesn't fly color matter to trout in dirty or backlit water?

When an object is backlit or viewed through off-color water, black, white and every color in between look essentially the same dark shape, since there isn't enough light transmission for the fish to distinguish hue. What a trout actually keys on in these conditions is the fly's profile and how much light it blocks, not its color.

How should I position my streamer in the water column during low light or stained water conditions?

Fish it higher in the water column rather than dredging it deep, since a trout has an easier time targeting prey it can silhouette against the surface than something buried in dark, off-color water. This also mimics how predatory fish naturally corral baitfish toward the surface for an easier, more effective strike.

How have this season's dam release schedules on the Watauga and the South Holston been affected by heavy rain?

After a long post-Helene drought, persistent heavy rainfall has pushed the Watauga well beyond its normal generation window, turning its typical one-to-six-o'clock release into stretches closer to ten-to-six or noon-to-nine depending on the day. The South Holston only resumed regular releases in the past couple of weeks after the broader TVA system spent months recovering from low water, making dry fly fishing inconsistent this summer.

Related Content

S8, Ep 50 - Navigating Summer Waters: Ellis Ward on Trout, Musky and the Art of the Evening Bite

S8, Ep 37 - Big Water, Big Fish: Ellis Ward's Strategies for Streamer Fishing Success

S7, Ep 45 - Navigating the Waters: Streamers and Strategies in East Tennessee with Ellis Ward

S6, Ep 128 - Catch Big Fish: Ellis Ward's Insider Tips for East Tennessee Anglers

View all East Tennessee Fishing Report episodes with Ellis Ward

Connect with Our Guest

To learn more about Ellis, check out our interview!

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Episode Overview

On this episode of The Butcher Shop fly fishing podcast, host Marvin Cash welcomes back Kirk Klingensmith for Part Two of their Science of Streamers conversation, this time digging into the physics behind swim flies and the Game Changer platform. Klingensmith brings an engineer's eye to the vise, breaking down why doubling a fly's length doesn't mean doubling its diameter and why that distinction matters more than most tiers realize.

The conversation opens with the geometry of drag: length scales linearly, but diameter drives drag by the square, so a modest increase in diameter has an outsized effect on a fly's action. From there, Klingensmith and Cash trace how turbulence created at the front of a swim fly, whether from a deer hair lip, a cupped popper head or simply a bulky front-loaded profile, sets up the unstable eddy currents that make the rear of the fly undulate on the retrieve. They cover material choices (marabou, rabbit, craft fur, Flashabou) that add movement, the role of shank engineering and segmentation in producing a serpentine swim, and how stinger hook placement and connection material (wire, gel-spun, mono) change both the fly's action and its hookup rate on short-striking fish. A highlight of the episode is Klingensmith's breakdown of Brian Shumaker's Shimmering Minnow and the "hover and twitch" presentation he uses on pressured smallmouth bass in warm summer water.

Key Takeaways

• How to scale a streamer's diameter separately from its length, since drag increases geometrically with diameter while length scales in linear proportion
• Why turbulence-inducing elements like a deer hair lip, a cupped popper head or an oversized front profile make a swim fly kick and undulate on the retrieve instead of just sinking straight
• When to fish a swim fly on a dead-stop hover rather than a fast retrieve, particularly for pressured smallmouth bass in warm summer water
• How to use material mass and segment placement to dial in a tighter or more gradual S-curve swimming action on an articulated fly
• Why adding a stinger hook can improve hookups on short-striking predatory fish while also changing how much mass and crash the tail of the fly carries
• How fly designers use a "chassis" mindset, treating patterns like the Clouser Minnow or Game Changer as adaptable platforms rather than fixed recipes

Techniques & Gear Covered

Klingensmith explains swim fly action as a function of engineered turbulence: a drag-inducing front end (a lip, a cupped head or simply a bulky profile) creates unstable eddy currents that the rear of the fly follows, producing the swimming motion, while a laminar (streamlined) front would produce no swim at all. He details how progressively smaller shanks toward the tail increase segmentation and produce a more serpentine undulation, and how adding mass to those rear segments dampens the action into a slower, more gradual S-curve. On stinger hook rigging, he walks through connection options (wire, gel-spun, mono) and how hook placement and gauge affect both the fly's swim and its hook-up percentage on fish that nip at the tail rather than eating the head. Named patterns discussed include the Game Changer platform and two of its variants, the Jerk Changer and the Feather Changer, along with the Drunk & Disorderly, Brian Shumaker's Shimmering Minnow, the Clouser Minnow, Bob Popovics' Beast Fleye and Chris Walker's Kreelex-variant, a stinger-hook trout streamer designed for brown trout that key on the tail.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhy don't fly proportions scale linearly when you size up a streamer pattern?

Because drag from a cylindrical or spherical shape increases geometrically with diameter while length only scales linearly. Klingensmith explains that it's reasonable to scale a fly's length proportionally when going from, say, four inches to six inches, but the diameter should only be increased modestly, not scaled by the same ratio, or the fly's action and drag profile will be thrown off.

What makes a swim fly like the Game Changer move with a swimming action instead of just sinking?

The action comes from turbulence engineered into the front of the fly. A lip, a cupped popper head or simply a bulky, non-streamlined front end creates a drag source that generates unstable eddy currents, and the rest of the fly follows those currents on the retrieve. A streamlined, laminar-flow front would not produce this swimming motion.

How does adding a stinger hook affect a swim fly's action and hookup rate?

It depends heavily on how the shank-to-stinger connection is built, whether with wire, gel-spun line or mono, and whether the hook is left free or incorporated into the tail material. Stinger hooks are especially effective on predatory fish that nip at a fly's tail rather than striking the head, and shorter-shank designs like octopus hooks tend to hold hooked fish more securely than long-shank hooks.

What is the "hover and twitch" technique Kirk Klingensmith uses for pressured smallmouth?

Rather than burning the fly back with a fast retrieve, Klingensmith lays the Shimmering Minnow within six inches of structure and lets it twitch and suspend with almost no forward motion, letting subtle microcurrent movement do the work. He believes this near-motionless presentation gives pressured smallmouth, especially in warm water, something they haven't already learned to refuse.

How can fly tiers control the tightness of a swim fly's S-curve swimming action?

By adjusting material mass in the segments behind the head. Lighter segments produce a tighter, more pronounced undulation, while adding more mass and gradually stepping it down through the rear segments dampens the action into a slower, more gradual S-curve.

Sponsors

Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use ARTFLY20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.

Related Content

Listen to The Science of Streamers (Pt I)

BONUS: The Science of Streamers (Pt I): Kirk Klingensmith on Jigging and Wrecking Flies

BONUS: Castability Unleashed: Mark Sedotti's Journey with the Sedotti Slammer

BONUS: Swine Design Secrets: Eli Berant Discusses the Optimus Swine

S6, Ep 144: The Chocklett Factory: Conservation, New Products and a Legacy Remembered

Connect with Our Guest

Follow Kirk on Facebook and Instagram.

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Helpful Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction

02:51 Scaling Fly Geometry

05:35 How Swim Flies Swim

11:28 Paused Retrieves Matter Most

16:26 Stinger Hooks and Fly Action

21:12 Tuning Line and Tippet

23:14 Mentoring the Next Generation

Episode Overview

On this episode of The Butcher Shop fly fishing podcast, host Marvin Cash sits down with Kirk Klingensmith, a retired Corning engineer and lifelong angler, for a physics-driven breakdown of why streamers move the way they do. Klingensmith, who wrote the "physics of fly motion" chapter for Blane Chocklett's Game Changer book, brings a scientist's eye to the vise, translating drag, momentum and weight placement into practical tying and fishing decisions. In Part One of this two-part conversation, he and Cash work through jig flies and wrecking or kicking flies, saving swim flies for a follow-up episode.

The jig fly discussion centers on the Clouser Minnow, where lead-eye placement and hook angle (90-degree versus 60-degree versus 15-degree jig hooks) determine whether a fly dips gently or nose-dives on the pause, and on how bucktail's stiffness contrasts with the collapsing action of flash-bodied flies like the Kreelex. From there the two turn to wrecking and kicking flies such as Blane Chocklett's T-Bone, unpacking how momentum in the tail and drag in the head combine to create the sideways "kick" that triggers strikes from muskies, smallmouth and brown trout alike. Throughout, Klingensmith returns to a central theme: the fly is only one part of a system that includes leader construction, tippet stiffness, fly line selection and retrieve style, all of which anglers can manipulate to fine-tune a streamer's behavior on the retrieve and on the pause.

Key Takeaways

• How lead-eye placement on a Clouser Minnow determines whether the fly dips gently or nose-dives on the pause
• Why bucktail and flash materials like Kreinik Flash create fundamentally different drop behaviors when a jig fly stalls
• When to switch to a full-length tippet leader, as used in Alaska salmon fishing and Euro-nymphing, to amplify a jig fly's drop and sink rate
• How momentum in a fly's tail combines with drag in the head to produce the sideways kick that triggers musky, smallmouth and brown trout strikes
• Why reverse-tied bucktail heads, as used on the T-Bone, stall and flare on the pause to exaggerate a wrecking fly's action
• How retrieve style, fly line choice and tippet stiffness work together as a system to control a streamer's action, not just the fly itself

Techniques & Gear Covered

Klingensmith walks through how lead-eye placement on a Clouser Minnow governs its jigging action and contrasts bucktail's stiffer, slower-collapsing profile with the accelerated drop of flash-bodied flies like the Kreelex, tied with Kreinik Flash. He details how 90-degree, 60-degree and 15-degree jig hooks change the abruptness of the transition between retrieve and pause, and how a full-tippet leader system, borrowed from Alaska salmon fishing and Euro-nymphing with jig streamers, sinks a fly faster and amplifies its drop. On wrecking and kicking flies, he breaks down the reverse-tied bucktail construction behind Blane Chocklett's T-Bone, explaining how a dense, high-drag head stalls on the pause while a lower-drag tail continues forward and kicks sideways, and how material choices such as deer hair, wool, synthetics and foam heads change how a fly suspends or sinks at rest. He also touches on line selection, using sink-tip or full-sinking lines to present a kicking fly low in the water column, and loop knots as the standard connection for preserving that action.

Locations & Species

Klingensmith fishes primarily for smallmouth bass on the Chemung River, a Susquehanna tributary in the Finger Lakes region of New York, running a drift boat and carrying both floating and sinking lines to cover different parts of the water column. The bite triggers discussed apply broadly across predatory species, with specific mentions of musky, brown trout and smallmouth reacting to kicking and wrecking fly action, and striped bass responding to jigging presentations on pressured saltwater flats.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhat determines whether a jig fly dips or nose-dives on the pause?

Weight placement and hook geometry are the primary factors. Moving the lead eyes farther from the hook eye on a Clouser Minnow produces a flatter drop, while placing weight closer to the eye causes a more pronounced nose-dive; steeper jig hook angles (90 degrees versus 60 or 15 degrees) create a more abrupt transition between the retrieve and the pause.

Why do bucktail and flash-bodied jig flies behave differently when they stall?

Bucktail is a stiffer material that resists collapsing, so a fly like the Clouser Minnow dips rather than dives when it stops. Flash materials, like limp Kreinik Flash, offer far less resistance, and flies like the Kreelex fall more like a flimsy parachute, making them sink faster but with less controlled action.

How does reverse-tied bucktail create the kicking action in flies like the T-Bone?

Reverse-tying builds a dense, drag-heavy head that stalls abruptly on the pause while the tail, carrying more momentum and less drag, continues moving forward and swings sideways, similar to a tractor trailer truck jackknifing when the cab brakes. Tuning the length and diameter of the front section, along with the materials used, controls how sharply that kick occurs.

When should anglers switch to a full-tippet leader for jig flies?

A leader made entirely of tippet material, as used in Alaska for salmon and increasingly in Euro-nymphing with jig streamers, reduces resistance in the system so the fly sinks faster and produces a stronger, more pronounced jigging pull on the pause. This is especially useful when maximum depth and drop are the goal.

Why do predatory fish sometimes strike a fly that doesn't resemble food at all?

Klingensmith points out that fish lack hands, so investigating an unfamiliar object or eliminating a struggling intruder from their territory can trigger a strike independent of whether the fly looks edible. Klingensmith sums up the goal as tying a fly that wins an award for looking helpless, hurt and vulnerable rather than one that looks like a healthy baitfish.

Sponsors

Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use ARTFLY20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.

Related Content

S1, Ep 2: The T-Bone: A Deep Dive with Blane Chocklett - The Butcher Shop

S2, Ep 2: A Deep Dive into the Swingin' D: Techniques and Tips with Mike Schultz - The Butcher Shop

S6, Ep 124: Fly Tying with Chase Smith

BONUS: Mastering the Beast: A Deep Dive into Bob Popovics' Legendary Fly with Captain Ben Whalley

BONUS: Castability Unleashed: Mark Sedotti's Journey with the Sedotti Slammer

Connect with Our Guest

Follow Kirk on Facebook and Instagram.

Follow the Show

Follow The Articulate Fly on Facebook, Instagram, Threads and YouTube.

Follow our Substack newsletter for episode updates, tips and resources.

Support the Show

Shop through our Amazon link to support the podcast.

Join our Patreon community to support the show.

If you are in the industry and need help getting unstuck, learn more about our consulting options.

Subscribe & Advertise

Subscribe to the podcast in your favorite podcast app.

Think our community is a good fit for your brand? Advertise with us.

Helpful Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction

05:28 Engineering Meets Fly Fishing

09:27 Blane and The Game Changer

14:19 Jig Fly Physics

22:41 Rigging Jig Streamers

34:43 Wrecking Fly Triggers

42:40 Shaping the Stall

47:09 Shanks, Length and Kick

51:04 Line Control Matters

57:55 Irregular Retrieves Win

Episode Overview

What happens to smallmouth bass fishing in Southwest Virginia when a big summer rain event hits after weeks of low, clear water? On this Southwest Virginia Fishing Report from The Articulate Fly fly fishing podcast, host Marvin Cash checks in with guide and writer Matt Reilly of Matt Reilly Fly Fishing for a real-time look at a region caught mid-storm, with rain hammering areas south of Radford and across northeast Tennessee while the New River itself stays comparatively unaffected. Matt breaks down why the coming days of rising, cooling, discolored water will actually put feeding smallmouth on more aggressive behavior than the low, clear conditions anglers had been dealing with, and why a passive, finesse-driven bug approach that worked so well in low water gives way to power fishing with bigger, darker profiles once the water comes up. He walks through the underlying logic: cooler water lowers a smallmouth's metabolic cost of chasing prey, rising flows create a predatory veil that lets fish hunt more boldly, and the same early-morning-versus-midday light and temperature gradient that governs a single summer day also governs the multi-day arc after a storm. Matt also answers a listener question about what conditions put smallmouth in a genuine feeding mood during the dog days of summer. The conversation closes with a look ahead to the fall calendar, as Matt discusses booking musky trips for the final weeks of the season and striped bass dates for next year, and points listeners to his monthly newsletter as the fastest way to hear about last-minute cancellations and openings.

Key Takeaways

• How to read a rising, cooling and discoloring river as an opportunity rather than a setback for smallmouth fishing.
• Why finesse bug presentations dominate in low, clear, hot water while power fishing with streamers takes over once flows rise and temperatures drop.
• When to target slack water, eddies and bank cover with large, dark profiles during high, dirty water conditions.
• Why the same light-and-temperature gradient that drives fish activity within a single summer day also plays out across the days following a storm.
• How to stay ahead of last-minute musky and striper trip openings by subscribing directly to a guide's newsletter.

Techniques & Gear Covered

Matt contrasts two core approaches for Southwest Virginia smallmouth: a passive, finesse-oriented topwater bug presentation suited to low, clear, high-pressure summer conditions, and a power-fishing approach built around larger profiles, darker colors, and faster retrieves once rain raises water levels and drops temperatures. He emphasizes targeting protected water, including slack water holes, eddies, and bank cover, when rivers run high and stained, since these areas concentrate fish that are less willing to fight heavy current. The conversation also touches on the same early-morning topwater and baitfish-imitating streamer window that opens before direct sun and rising temperatures push fish back into a more conservative feeding pattern later in the day.

Locations & Species

This report centers on the rivers of Southwest Virginia, including the New River and the broader drainages around Radford, Narrows and Pearisburg, with Matt tracking an active storm system moving through the region alongside spillover effects from flooding further north in West Virginia. Smallmouth bass are the primary target discussed, with the conversation focused on how a shift from low, clear, hot conditions to high, cool, discolored flows changes both fish behavior and angler strategy heading into the heart of summer. Matt also flags the approaching transition into fall, when Southwest Virginia's musky season picks up, along with striped bass dates he's already booking for the following year.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhy does rising, cooler, dirtier water often improve smallmouth fishing instead of hurting it?

Cooler water lowers the energy cost of chasing prey, so smallmouth can afford to move around and feed more aggressively than they do in low, clear, hot conditions. Rising, stained water also gives fish a kind of predatory veil that lets them hunt more boldly instead of feeding cautiously to avoid predators themselves.

How should anglers adjust their approach right after a big rain event hits a smallmouth river?

Matt's first move is to get below the freshest, most turbid water or find a stretch of river the storm has not fully reached yet. In the days that follow, the priority shifts to identifying the most promising combination of temperature, clarity and flow, since conditions can vary drastically from one stretch of river to the next after a storm.

When should anglers use finesse bug fishing versus power fishing with streamers for smallmouth?

Finesse bug presentations work best in low, clear, hot water, where fish feed conservatively and a subtle approach out-produces aggressive retrieves. Once water levels rise and temperatures drop, anglers should shift to fishing bigger, faster, and with darker colors in protected water like eddies and bank cover, since fish become willing to chase and expend more energy.

What conditions put Southwest Virginia smallmouth into an active summer feeding mood?

Beyond the day-to-day storm cycle, the same gradient shows up within a single day: lower light and cooler water temperatures in the early morning trigger windows of aggressive topwater and streamer activity, which then wanes as the sun climbs and the water warms through midday.

When does musky season start in Southwest Virginia, and how can anglers get last-minute trip openings?

Matt's musky season picks up on the tail end of smallmouth season, with October representing some of the last open dates before the fall push. Because cancellations and last-minute openings move fast, Matt recommends subscribing directly to his newsletter at mattreillyflyfishing.com, since that is where schedule changes get posted first.

Related Content

S8, Ep 46 - Low Water, Big Bugs: Matt Reilly's Southwest Virginia Fishing Update

S7, Ep 19 - Weathering the Winds: March Fishing Insights and Pre-Spawn Strategies with Matt Reilly

S6, Ep 112 - Smallmouth Transitions and Musky Prep: Matt Reilly's Southwest VA Update

S8, Ep 52 - Hot Days and Night Bites: Brian Shumaker's Guide to Pennsylvania Smallmouth Fishing

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Episode Overview

In this episode of The Butcher Shop, host Marvin Cash sits down with Mark Sedotti, inventor of the Sedotti Slammer and one of the pioneers of weight-balanced streamer design, to trace nearly 35 years of big-fly development for striped bass and bluefish. Sedotti explains why a lead keel and the right amount of absorbed water can make an oversized streamer cast further and more accurately than a small one, overturning decades of conventional wisdom that heavy flies are harder to throw.

Working from western Long Island Sound, where he first tied the Slammer to imitate adult menhaden up to 15 inches long, Sedotti walks through the evolution of his high-and-low bucktail tying method, the construction of a rectangular lead keel to stop wide-profile flies from rolling, and the concept of weight balancing that ties it all together. He also details how the Slammer found its way to Michigan's Manistee River in the early 1990s, where guide Russ Maddin nicknamed it the Screaming Jesus and helped ignite the modern big-streamer trout movement.

The conversation covers rod and line selection for casting giant flies, including Sedotti's signature Sayonara sling casting technique, along with retrieve mechanics, leader setups, and where to source materials and commercially tied Slammers. Anglers chasing striped bass, bluefish or trophy trout with oversized streamers will come away with a working framework for why some big flies cast beautifully and others simply won't turn over.

Key Takeaways

• How to weight balance a streamer so it casts smoothly regardless of its size, rather than dragging through the air
• Why adding water-absorbing materials like bucktail can improve a big fly's castability instead of hurting it
• How to build a rectangular lead keel from lead wire to stop a wide-profile fly from rolling in the water
• When to size a streamer to match adult versus immature baitfish, since selective stripers and bluefish may refuse flies shorter than the natural forage
• How the Sayonara sling casting technique adds effective rod length and line speed for longer distance with a single-handed rod
• Why a long leader of eight to nine feet improves fly action and strike rates when streamer fishing for trout

Techniques & Gear Covered

Sedotti's core concept is weight balancing: adding just enough weight to a streamer to counteract wind resistance and drag during the cast, which he discovered by building a rectangular lead keel out of 0.030-0.035 lead wire to prevent wide-profile flies from rolling. His high-and-low bucktail tying method, refined with input from Bob Popovics on achieving a three-dimensional bunker profile, remains consistent across pattern sizes from three and a half to over 20 inches, with synthetic yak hair, bucktail and feather substitutes used as natural saddle hackle and schlappen became harder to source. For casting, he favors a fast-action 11-weight rod paired with either integrated sinking lines, shooting heads or a floating line for shallow presentations, and retrieves with long, fast strips followed by a pause where most strikes occur.

Locations & Species

Sedotti developed the Slammer in western Long Island Sound around Greenwich, Port Chester, and Rye, New York, targeting striped bass and bluefish keyed in on schools of menhaden, or bunker, ranging from three and a half to over 15 inches depending on the season. He later carried medium-sized versions of the fly to Michigan's Manistee River, where it proved effective on trout and helped spark the region's big-streamer trout culture, as well as to Montana's Beaverhead River for trout. Today, he fishes deep structure at Montauk and Southwest Ledge on Block Island for large striped bass, working the fly 35 to 45 feet down on sinking lines.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhat is weight balancing in streamer fly design, and why does it matter for castability?

Weight balancing means adding enough weight to a fly to counteract the wind resistance created by its materials as it moves through the air during a cast. Mark Sedotti found that a properly weight-balanced fly, regardless of size, will false cast smoothly with a normal loop, while an unbalanced fly either drags or develops an uncontrollable loop.

How do you build a keel to stop a wide-profile streamer from rolling?

Sedotti wraps half-inch strips of lead wire in layers of five, stacking three levels to form a rectangular, raft-like keel along the underside of the hook shank. The exact method matters less than achieving the correct total weight for that specific fly to keep it weight balanced.

Why can waterlogged flies actually cast better than dry ones?

A dry fly with the same amount of bulky material is more wind resistant and harder to turn over, while a wet fly collapses and cuts through the air more easily. Sedotti found that the added weight from absorbed water often helps counteract that wind resistance, provided the fly isn't carrying so much water and weight that it becomes overloaded.

What rod and line setup works best for casting large weight-balanced streamers?

Sedotti prefers a fast-action 11-weight rod for big saltwater patterns, paired with either an integrated sinking line, a shooting head or a floating line depending on depth and structure. His Sayonara sling casting technique adds effective rod length and increases tip speed for longer casts with a single-handed rod.

How did the Sedotti Slammer influence Michigan's big-streamer trout fishing?

In the early 1990s, Sedotti brought a medium-sized Slammer to Michigan's Manistee River, where guide Russ Maddin was stunned by how aggressively trout attacked it and nicknamed it the Screaming Jesus. That introduction is widely credited with helping launch the modern big-streamer trout movement centered around Michigan's guiding community.

Sponsors

Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use ARTFLY20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.

Related Content

BONUS: Tying the Circus Peanut: Streamer Secrets and Fishing Strategies with Russ Maddin

BONUS: Mastering the Beast: A Deep Dive into Bob Popovics' Legendary Fly with Captain Ben Whalley

BONUS: A Deep Dive into the Swingin' D: Techniques and Tips with Mike Schultz

Connect with Our Guest

Follow Mark on YouTube.

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Helpful Episode Chapters

0:00:00 Introduction

0:02:33 Designing the Original Slammer

0:06:43 Unlocking Castability

0:15:33 Perfecting the Profile

0:19:17 Synthetic Evolution

0:32:53 Michigan Streamer Breakthrough

0:47:15 Casting Big Flies Well

0:53:42 Lines and Leaders

0:56:35 Fishing the Retrieve

1:06:26 Final Thoughts on Weight Balance

Episode Overview

In this episode of The Articulate Fly, host Marvin Cash sits down with Jason Taylor — a Philadelphia-area fly tier, Tiers Row fixture at the Edison show and regular contributor to Masters of the Fly — for a wide-ranging conversation about fly tying philosophy, natural materials and the tradition of innovation rooted in Bob Popovics' work. On this fly fishing podcast episode, Taylor traces his journey from a 2008 Belize honeymoon that ignited his passion for the sport, to the early-2010s online forums — particularly Stripers Online — that connected him with a formative community of Northeast saltwater tiers including Popovics and David Nelson. Taylor shares the philosophy that drives every session at the vise: every feature in a fly must serve a purpose, and materials should be used as sparingly as possible to achieve it. The conversation digs into the enduring versatility of the hollow fleye platform — what Taylor calls "the Christmas tree" — its adaptability across materials and applications, and his own innovations including an ostrich herl hollow fleye variant and a Surf Candy adaptation with embedded foam for neutral buoyancy when targeting false albacore in calm, glassy conditions. Taylor also offers detailed guidance on selecting and handling bucktail and ostrich herl, shares tying tips rarely covered elsewhere, and takes listeners through the exotic and vintage natural materials currently occupying his tying bench.

Key Takeaways

• How to apply Bob Popovics' "Christmas tree" principle to hollow fleye design — preserving the core profile shape while freely adapting materials, proportions and techniques.
• Why using less material than you think you need almost always produces a more castable, livelier fly.
• How to select bucktail for hollow fleyes by identifying soft, kinky fiber pulled from the middle half to two-thirds of the tail for the most predictable flare under thread pressure.
• Why a neutrally buoyant fly presentation — using embedded foam under a hard body paired with an intermediate line — consistently outperforms standard Surf Candy patterns when false albacore become selective in calm, flat-water conditions.
• How to stabilize thread wraps using brushable cyanoacrylate applied directly to the thread before making final wraps rather than to the hook or materials.
• Why grading ostrich herl by length, taper and barb density — rather than just overall plume size — is critical to achieving consistent movement in large saltwater patterns.

Techniques & Gear Covered

The episode centers on hollow fleye construction — specifically the bucktail collar technique Bob Popovics developed and Taylor has refined over more than a decade, including his personal adaptation of palmering ostrich herl down a mono or shank base to create a mobile, feather-forward variant. Taylor details his Surf Candy–based neutral buoyancy modification, incorporating foam beneath the hard body to maintain a suspending presentation throughout the retrieve — not just the first few strips — which he argues better matches the behavior of bait sitting still in calm, low-turbulence water when paired with an intermediate fly line. He also covers his evolution of the Semper Fli, replacing time-consuming palmered feather fronts with commercially available fly tying brushes for consistent, production-speed results without sacrificing profile. On the tools and materials side, Taylor explains his preference for monofilament thread for virtually all saltwater work (with gel-spun for mounting eyes), walks through his grading process for both bucktail and ostrich herl, and advocates for brushable cyanoacrylate applied to the thread to more durably secure the final wraps. He references Regal as his favored vise, Tuffleye (a blue-light–cured resin with origins in dental applications) as his preferred coating for albie and Surf Candy patterns, and monofilament as the default thread for nearly all non-dry fly work.

Locations & Species

Taylor's saltwater fishing world centers on the Northeast coast — New Jersey beaches and jetty structure where he targets false albacore (albies) and striped bass. The neutral-buoyancy Surf Candy modification he developed addresses a specific condition: calm, glassy water where bait is suspended neutrally in the water column rather than being pushed and darting erratically, a situation that allows albies to scrutinize flies far more critically than in ripping current. The foam-infused body paired with an intermediate line creates the illusion of naturally suspended bait being dragged just below the surface — a presentation Taylor describes as reliably effective when albies appear finicky. Jetty fishing accounts for heavy fly loss in his program, which directly influences his bench work: efficient, repeatable tying at high quality is not just an aesthetic goal but a practical one.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhat is the "Christmas tree" principle and why has the hollow fleye remained relevant for decades?

Taylor borrows this framing directly from Bob Popovics: the hollow fleye's core construction — bucktail tied in parallel to the shank and then pushed back on itself in a reverse tie to form an umbrella shape — creates a foundational profile that can be dressed up or stripped down infinitely. In its simplest form it ties in under five minutes and catches fish for anything; at the other extreme it accommodates exotic feather work, articulations and brush-based enhancements while retaining the original profile logic. Taylor's own ostrich herl variant illustrates how elastic the platform is: by palmering ostrich around a mono or shank base — orienting the material perpendicular to the base rather than parallel — he achieved a different movement profile while staying true enough to the Christmas tree shape that Popovics immediately recognized the technique as sound. That openness to adaptation was always the point: a baseline any tier could take and make their own.

How do you select bucktail for hollow fleyes?

Look for fibers that are soft, slightly kinky or wavy rather than pin-straight, and of medium hollowness. Taylor recommends pulling material from the middle half to two-thirds of the tail, where hair has enough hollow structure to flare predictably but enough density to stay controlled. He warns that the softest, most hollow base fibers can be too erratic for general hollow collar work and are better reserved for specific profile applications near the front of a fly.

Why do false albacore seem to go finicky in calm, flat water?

Taylor's answer is that this behavior isn't true selectivity — it's a physics mismatch. In ripping current or choppy conditions, bait is pushed around and moves erratically; a fly stripped through that same water fits right in. In flat, glassy conditions, suspended bait is genuinely neutrally buoyant and barely moving, and albies can see that a standard fly doesn't replicate that suspension. His foam-infused body maintains the neutrally buoyant presentation throughout the retrieve rather than sinking progressively as trapped air escapes, which he argues is the key to the pattern's effectiveness in those conditions.

How should brushable cyanoacrylate be used correctly at the vise?

The standard approach — applying glue directly to the hook shank or finished materials — can stiffen fibers and make delicate collars unpredictable. Taylor applies brushable super glue to the thread itself, just before making final securing wraps, which locks the thread without affecting material movement or positioning. This is especially useful when controlling sparse bucktail or fine feathers where a traditional coat would ruin the texture and action of a finished collar.

Why does kinky or wavy bucktail produce a better hollow fleye than straight bucktail?

Taylor explains that kinky, wavy bucktail creates an illusion of greater bulk and size than the amount of material actually on the hook warrants. Just as straightening curly hair reveals how much longer it truly is, the kinks and curves in wavy bucktail compress into a shorter measured length — meaning the fibers occupy more visual space on the hook than pin-straight hair of the same count would. For hollow fleyes, where the goal is achieving profile and the illusion of size with the least possible material, that optical magnification effect is a direct advantage. Straight bucktail, by contrast, gives you exactly what it is and nothing more.

Sponsors

Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use ARTFLY20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.

Related Content

S6, Ep 144: The Chocklett Factory: Conservation, New Products and a Legacy Remembered

S8, Ep 14: Crafting Connections: Blane Chocklett on Fly Design and Conservation at Tie Fest

S6, Ep 91: Predator Flies and Sparkle Boats: Steve Maldonado's Journey

S7, Ep 66: Tales of a Fly Fishing Legend: Remembering Dave Whitlock

S6, Ep 132: Fly Tying and Destination Travel with Tim Flagler

Connect with Our Guest

Follow Jason on Instagram.

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Support the Show

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If you are in the industry and need help getting unstuck, learn more about our consulting options.

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Helpful Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction

09:42 Forums, Mentors and Growth

14:10 A Purposeful Tying Philosophy

19:13 Hollow Fleye Breakthrough

28:34 Natural Materials First

32:45 Bucktail and Ostrich Choices

38:09 Bench Tricks and More

49:24 Exotic Materials Obsession

Episode Overview

The Butcher Shop goes deep on one of the Great Lakes predator fly world's most distinctive patterns in this conversation with Eli Berant, the Michigan-based fly designer and founder of Great Lakes Fly. Eli is the creator of the Optimus Swine — a reverse foam head-embedded, side-kicking musky streamer that has been turning heads and producing fish since around 2009. In this episode, host Marvin Cash walks Eli through the full arc of the pattern: the lake musky problem it was designed to solve, the unconventional decision to reverse a foam popper head to create a slower fall and a pronounced glide-bait wiggle, the material choices that define the fly's profile and movement and the step-by-step construction logic from spinner bait hook to laser dub head.

The conversation covers the full Swine family — the original 8–9 inch version on a 6/0 Mustad, the scaled-down Swine Junior for river smallmouth and stripers, the fettuccine-foam Pot Belly Swine for subsurface river applications, and the articulated Maximus Swine and Maximus Swine Junior, which remain something of a "secret menu" offering. Eli also addresses color selection by region — from olive-and-pink for fired-up Tennessee muskies to the Wisconsin-proven Willen's Villain black-white-yellow combo and his own favorite Mardi Gras pattern — and breaks down his preferred line and leader systems for lake musky versus river smallmouth applications. Throughout, the discussion grounds fly design theory in direct, tactical fishing application.

Key Takeaways

• How reversing a foam popper head toward the rear of the hook creates a slower fall rate and induces the Optimus Swine's distinctive side-to-side glide-bait action.
• Why proportionality in bucktail application — specifically how much material per section and how many sections — is the most common failure point for tiers attempting the Swine for the first time.
• How to tune the Pot Belly Swine's fettuccine foam piece by removing individual strips to achieve neutral balance and proper swim orientation before fishing.
• Why a jerk-strip retrieve with a sinking line (350–450 grain tip) is the preferred delivery system for lake musky, allowing the sink tip to hold depth while the fly kicks side to side on each pull.
• When to dial back retrieve aggression and employ a stutter-strip or extended pause with the Swine Junior, particularly during cold-water conditions when bass are holding and waiting.
• Why sharing newly discovered synthetic fly tying materials openly — rather than hoarding them — is essential to keeping those materials in production and available to the broader tying community.

Techniques & Gear Covered

The Optimus Swine is designed around a jerk-strip retrieve that drives its foam-induced side-to-side action, and Eli breaks down exactly how to execute it — stripping two feet with the line hand in alternating pulls, roughly like ripping a bag open. For lake musky, he runs a 10-weight with a 350–450 grain sinking tip, paired with a short 3–4 foot leader from loop to fly — a butt section of 40-pound to wire, finished with cross-lock snaps for fast fly changes. River smallmouth and striper applications drop to a 7- or 8-weight with a 200–350 grain tip depending on conditions. Construction-specific details are substantial: Mustad 32608 spinner bait hook (6/0 for the original), Rainy's Mini Me medium foam popper head reversed and goop-set with silicone adhesive, synthetic yak hair blended with flash for the tail, grizzly saddle feathers as flanks, Magnum Flashabou, everyday bucktail applied in top-and-bottom sections, laser dub for the head, and 1/2-inch eyes pressed and held in a two-touch goop cure process. Anadromous Fly Company tungsten carbide scissors get a specific callout as Eli's go-to cutting tool for heavy production tying.

Locations & Species

The Optimus Swine was developed specifically for lake musky, with Lake Saint Clair in Michigan serving as the primary proving ground — a relatively snag-free fishery that allows anglers to fish sinking lines freely across the water column. The pattern's documented multi-species versatility extends to Great Lakes migratory species, pike, lake trout, stripers on the East Coast and river smallmouth, including Eli's personal use of the Swine Junior on Lake Saint Clair for targeting large smallmouth by eliminating the smaller fish. Color selection is explicitly regional in the episode: olive-and-pink for fired-up Tennessee fish, pink-and-chartreuse or the Willen's Villain black-white-yellow for Wisconsin tannic water, and Mardi Gras (pink, chartreuse, black head) as a broadly effective pattern.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredHow does the reversed foam popper head make the Optimus Swine swim differently than other musky flies?

Positioning the foam head toward the rear of the hook — rather than at the front — reduces the fly's sink rate compared to a traditional epoxy-head pattern and shifts the center of buoyancy rearward. This causes the fly to kick side to side with a pronounced glide-bait cadence on a jerk-strip retrieve, rather than simply pushing water or diving. The effect is amplified when fishing a sinking tip, which holds the running line low and forces the rear of the fly to tip upward and roll on each strip.

What are the most common mistakes tiers make when tying the Optimus Swine?

Eli identifies two primary failure points: applying bucktail in clumps that are too large, which destroys proportionality, and using too much laser dub in the head, which throws the silhouette out of balance. The fix for bucktail is learning to feel the correct bundle size — roughly the width of a toothpick at the pinch, the width of a popsicle stick at the ends — and building five top-and-bottom sections before reaching the laser dub head on the original Swine. Managing the laser dub means stacking it, pulling off loose fibers and removing material rather than adding more.

How do you tune the Pot Belly Swine to swim correctly for river applications?

Because the Pot Belly Swine uses fettuccine foam strips in place of the reversed popper head, Eli ties in more foam strips than needed — six to eight — and tells buyers they may need to remove one to four strips to get the fly to balance and swim true. The goal is first to eliminate any spin or tilt, then to dial in the side-to-side action. This is the same principle as Barry Reynolds's flash philosophy applied to buoyancy: put in more than you need because you can always remove it, but you can't add it once the fly is finished.

What line and leader setup does Eli prefer for lake musky with the Optimus Swine?

For open lake musky fishing on snag-light water, Eli runs a 10-weight with a Scientific Anglers sinking tip in the 350–450 grain range, specifically preferring striper-style lines with a long 26–28 foot tip section. Leaders are intentionally short — 3–4 feet total from loop to fly — built with a 2-foot 40-pound butt section going straight to wire, then a cross-lock snap at the fly. The short leader keeps the fly in the sink tip's depth zone and maximizes the kicking action on the jerk-strip retrieve.

How should retrieve style change when downsizing to the Swine Junior for smallmouth or stripers?

Moving to the smaller patterns calls for a less aggressive retrieve cadence overall, but Eli emphasizes breaking out of monotonous repetition — consciously varying the retrieve is as important as the base technique. Key adjustments include a stutter-strip (half-length pulls done twice in quick succession) and extended pauses, which become particularly effective in cold water when bass are holding and watching the fly. The foam piece in all Swine variants allows the fly to hang suspended during a pause without sinking, which is the primary trigger for following fish.

Sponsors

Thanks to TroutRoutes for sponsoring this episode. Use ARTFLY20 to get 20% off of your TroutRoutes Pro membership.

Related Content

S1, Ep 2: The T-Bone: A Deep Dive with Blane Chocklett - The Butcher Shop

BONUS: Shack Nasties and the Drunk & Disorderly: A Winter Chat with Tommy Lynch

BONUS: Crafting The Nut Job: A Deep Dive with Brendan Ruch

BONUS: A Deep Dive into the Swingin' D: Techniques and Tips with Mike Schultz

S6, Ep 124: Fly Tying with Chase Smith

Connect with Our Guest

Follow Eli on Instagram.

Follow the Show

Follow The Articulate Fly on Facebook, Instagram, Threads and YouTube.

Follow our Substack newsletter for episode updates, tips and resources.

Support the Show

Shop through our Amazon link to support the podcast.

Join our Patreon community to support the show.

If you are in the industry and need help getting unstuck, learn more about our consulting options.

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Helpful Episode Chapters

00:00 Introduction

03:53 The Design Journey Begins

08:09 Influences and Inspirations

12:44 Material Choices and Techniques

18:24 Adjustments and Improvements

21:21 Scaling Down for Other Species

25:04 Common Mistakes in Tying

30:50 The Evolution of the Swine

33:18 Color Variations and Popularity

37:40 Fishing Techniques for Lake Musky

42:28 Transitioning to Smaller Species

44:02 New Materials and Tools

Episode Overview

In this episode of The Articulate Fly, host Marvin Cash reconnects with Blane Chocklett — tier, guide and founder of The Chocklett Factory — for a wide-ranging conversation covering conservation, product launches and what's ahead for one of fly fishing's most recognized innovators. Blane offers a firsthand recap of Tie Fest, the ASGA-backed conservation fundraiser held at Carter Andrews' property, where proceeds are funding a five-year jack crevalle acoustic tagging research program. He reflects on the community of guides, brands and fly fishing legends who showed up in honor of figures like Lefty Kreh, Bob Popovics and Flip Pallot, and confirms the event will return in 2027.

The conversation then pivots to one of the most eagerly anticipated product releases from The Chocklett Factory: the commercially tied Feather Changer. Blane walks through the design history of this Game Changer platform variant — including the pivotal conversation with Bob Popovics that sparked the fly's development — and explains why natural feathers give the Feather Changer a swimming action and water column behavior that synthetic materials can't replicate. He also previews cicada patterns timed to summer emergences, along with new shrimp patterns rounding out the 2026 lineup. Blane closes with a look at his upcoming travel calendar, including a smallmouth bass filming project for Fly Fisherman magazine in Pennsylvania, a conservation visit with On the Fly Outfitters in Brunswick, Georgia and planned trips to Baja and northern Saskatchewan for northern pike.

Key Takeaways

• Why the Feather Changer occupies a unique position in the Game Changer platform by blending natural and synthetic materials to achieve a swimming action and water column depth that neither approach achieves on its own
• How a bathtub test and a conversation with Bob Popovics directly led to the development of the Feather Changer as a solution to buoyancy problems with deer body hair Game Changers
• Why the Feather Changer's profile versatility — mullet, sculpin, dace and beyond — makes it one of the most species-adaptable flies in the Game Changer lineup
• How The Chocklett Factory's 2026 product rollout (Feather Changers, cicadas, shrimp patterns) is timed around spring and summer fishing and cicada emergences across the country
• Why smallmouth bass deserve their place as a premier fly rod species and how decades of guiding them directly shaped many of the flies now central to the Game Changer platform
• Why ASGA's jack crevalle acoustic tagging research program represents the kind of targeted, funded conservation work the fly fishing community is uniquely positioned to support

Techniques & Gear Covered

The episode is primarily a product and conservation update rather than a technique-focused installment, but Blane provides substantive insight into the design logic behind the Feather Changer. He explains how natural feathers interact with laminar flow differently than synthetic materials — diverting water in a way that creates exceptional movement without bulk and allows the fly to settle into the water column at depths that buoyant materials like deer body hair cannot reach. The Feather Changer is discussed in the context of pre-spawn smallmouth bass fishing in Pennsylvania rivers, where its realistic swimming profile and soft landing characteristics are particularly relevant. Blane also previews cicada patterns designed for surface fishing during both annual and periodic hatches, and shrimp patterns aimed at the saltwater and flats side of his expanding lineup. Brand mentions include Yeti, Patagonia, Costa, Scientific Anglers, TFO and Nautilus in the conservation context, and Schultz Outfitters is cited as an example of a shop that has built extensively on the Feather Changer platform for Midwest smallmouth.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredWhat makes the Feather Changer different from other Game Changer platform flies?

The Feather Changer uses natural feathers instead of synthetics to exploit laminar flow around the fly's body, producing an exceptional swimming action that includes movement without movement. Unlike more buoyant Game Changers, feathers allow the fly to settle deeper in the water column without added weight, solving the buoyancy problem that came with earlier deer body hair variants. The result is a fly that holds a realistic silhouette, lands softly and triggers strikes across a wide range of species.

How did the Feather Changer come to exist?

Blane traced the fly's origin to a conversation with Bob Popovics after a trip to Arkansas where deer body hair Game Changers were proving too buoyant. Popovics suggested natural feathers as a solution — mentioning the Semper Fli — and Blane tied the fly immediately, tested it in a bathtub, filmed the result and sent the video back to Popovics. From that exchange, the Feather Changer was born, blending the tradition of natural feather flies with the modern articulated Game Changer platform.

What new Chocklett Factory products are coming in 2026?

The headline release is the commercially tied Feather Changer, now available through The Chocklett Factory's online shop and dealer network after sourcing and quality challenges were resolved. Cicada patterns timed to summer annual and periodic emergences are also in the pipeline, alongside shrimp patterns for saltwater applications. Blane describes 2026 as a major year for the brand across all product categories.

What is Tie Fest and what conservation cause does it support?

Tie Fest is an annual saltwater fly fishing and conservation fundraiser organized through ASGA (American Saltwater Guides Association) and hosted at Carter Andrews' property. The event gathers guides, brands, tiers and industry figures to raise money for targeted research initiatives — in this cycle, a five-year jack crevalle acoustic tagging program in which individual tags cost $500 each. The event honors the legacies of Lefty Kreh, Bob Popovics, Flip Pallot and others, and is supported by brands including Yeti, Patagonia, Costa, Scientific Anglers, TFO and Nautilus.

Why does Blane consider smallmouth bass one of the most important species in fly fishing?

Blane argues that smallmouth bass were formative for many of fly fishing's greatest innovators — Lefty Kreh, Dave Whitlock, Bob Clouser — and that more than 30 years of guiding them on mid-Atlantic rivers directly produced many of the Game Changer platform's foundational designs, including the Craw, the Feather Changer and the Jerk Changer. He sees the upcoming Fly Fisherman magazine film project as an overdue recognition of smallmouth's place as one of the premier fly rod species, particularly for anglers throughout the mid-Atlantic, Northeast and Midwest.

Related Content

S7, Ep 73 - The Chocklett Factory: Sneak Peek at New Products

S7, Ep 61 - The Chocklett Factory Unleashed: New Flies and Other Goodies with Blane Chocklett

S6, Ep 144 - The Chocklett Factory: Conservation, New Products and a Legacy Remembered

S6, Ep 101 - The Chocklett Factory: Fly Fishing Travels, Conservation and New Ventures

S7, Ep 42 - Celebrating Legacy and Conservation with The Chocklett Factory

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Episode Overview

In this Chocklett Factory episode of The Articulate Fly fly fishing podcast, host Marvin Cash sits down with legendary fly designer and guide Blane Chocklett for a wide-ranging conversation covering two central topics: the mechanics and design philosophy behind Chocklett's support disc and spreader dam system, and the upcoming Lefty Kreh's Tie Fest conservation event in Vero Beach, Florida. Blane explains how his support discs — available in round and oval profiles ranging from 6mm to over 20mm — create the water diversion that drives the serpentine, side-to-side swimming action that defines Game Changer articulated flies. Rather than relying solely on fiber tips to generate movement, the supports actively redirect water flow around the body of the fly, producing a realistic fish-like swimming motion that passive designs cannot replicate. Blane also walks through the practical tying advantages: faster construction, easier material distribution, built-in profile tapering and greater fly longevity. The second half of the conversation turns to Lefty Kreh's Tie Fest, a conservation-focused event benefiting the American Saltwater Guides Association (ASGA), set for March 21 in Vero Beach at Carter Andrews's property. Blane shares the vision behind the event — honoring legends like Lefty Kreh and Bob Popovics while cultivating the next generation of anglers — and previews an intimate lineup that includes Andy Mill, Rob Fordyce, Hillary Hutcheson, Carter Andrews, Chase Smith and Fletcher Sams, among others.

Key Takeaways

1. How water diversion around the body of an articulated fly — not just fiber-tip movement — produces a true serpentine swimming action that triggers more strikes.
2. Why Chocklett support discs in graduated sizes (6mm through 20mm+) allow tiers to build precise, tapered profiles for different baitfish silhouettes without excess material.
3. How to choose between round disc supports (cylindrical/sucker profiles) and oval supports (taller, narrower bunker or shad profiles) to match specific forage.
4. Why the Lefty Kreh's Tie Fest model — small, intimate, conservation-focused — delivers meaningful angler access to fly fishing legends that larger industry shows cannot replicate.
5. How supporting ASGA through events like Tie Fest funds the fisheries science that policymakers need to protect saltwater species populations long term.

Techniques & Gear Covered

The core technical discussion centers on Chocklett's support disc and spreader dam system as a mechanism for achieving active water diversion and realistic swimming action in articulated flies. Blane explains that while Bobby Popovics' reverse-tie bucktail approach relied on fiber tips for passive movement, inserting support discs into the body of a Beast-style or Game Changer fly forces water to divert around the structure, initiating true left-to-right serpentine motion. The system uses two disc geometries — round supports for cylindrical profiles (suckers) and oval supports for taller, narrower silhouettes (bunker, shad) — in graduated sizes from 6mm to over 20mm, allowing tiers to stair-step profile width from tail to shoulder for a natural taper. Practically, the supports eliminate the need to reverse-tie bucktail and guess fiber length, dramatically simplifying the tying process while also extending fly longevity by preventing bucktail collapsing and thinning out over time. Materials referenced include bucktail, synthetic fibers and TFO rods (Blane is a TFO brand ambassador).

Locations & Species

The episode's fishing-specific travel content focuses on the Alabama Gulf Coast, which Blane describes as a highly underrated saltwater destination where clear Florida-influenced water meets the nutrient influence of the Mississippi Delta. He fished this area out of FlyWay Charters with guide Sam (based near the Community Fly Supply shop), targeting redfish, black drum, tripletail, jack crevalle and sheepshead. The Lefty Kreh's Tie Fest event at Vero Beach, Florida, adds another saltwater context — the Indian River Lagoon and Treasure Coast area known for tarpon, snook and permit, ecosystems that ASGA's conservation work is specifically designed to protect. The episode's conservation framing extends to the broader health of saltwater species populations across coastal fisheries, with Blane connecting healthy fisheries to the long-term viability of saltwater fly fishing as both a sport and a guiding profession.

FAQ / Key Questions AnsweredHow do Chocklett support discs create a serpentine swimming action in articulated flies?

When a support disc is placed inside the body of an articulated fly, it forces water to divert around the structure rather than flowing straight through the fibers. That diversion initiates a side-to-side, serpentine movement that mimics the natural swimming motion of a baitfish — something fiber-tip movement alone cannot produce. The key mechanism is active water redirection, not passive fiber flutter.

What is the difference between round and oval Chocklett support discs?

Round supports create a cylindrical cross-section ideal for sucker or cigar-shaped baitfish profiles. Oval supports produce a taller, narrower shape suited to bunker, shad or other laterally-flattened forage. By selecting the appropriate geometry and stepping up through graduated sizes from tail to shoulder, tiers can build a precise taper that matches the specific baitfish they are trying to imitate.

How do support discs improve fly durability and ease of tying?

Traditional reverse-tie bucktail construction tends to collapse and thin out over time, degrading fly performance. Support discs maintain the shape and fiber position for the life of the fly. They also eliminate the need to reverse-tie and guess at fiber length, making even distribution around the hook much easier and faster — a meaningful benefit for tiers who don't spend hours at the bench every week.

What is Lefty Kreh's Tie Fest and why does it matter for fly fishing conservation?

Lefty Kreh's Tie Fest is an annual event — revived after Lefty Kreh's passing — held at Carter Andrews's property in Vero Beach, Florida, that combines a day-long outdoor festival with a benefit dinner. Proceeds support the American Saltwater Guides Association (ASGA), which funds fisheries science and advocacy needed to influence policy protecting saltwater species. Blane frames it as both a celebration of the sport's legends and an investment in its future.

What makes the Alabama Gulf Coast a worthwhile saltwater fly fishing destination?

The Alabama coastline sits at a confluence of clear, Florida-influenced water and the productive, nutrient-rich influence of the Mississippi Delta, producing diverse species opportunities in a relatively uncrowded setting. Target species include redfish, black drum, tripletail, jack crevalle and sheepshead across multiple seasons. Blane characterizes it as highly overlooked and a strong destination for anglers seeking variety outside of better-known Gulf and Atlantic coastal fisheries.

Related Content

S7, Ep 42 – Celebrating Legacy and Conservation with The Chocklett Factory

S7, Ep 61 – The Chocklett Factory Unleashed: New Flies and Other Goodies with Blane Chocklett

S7, Ep 73 – The Chocklett Factory: Sneak Peek at New Products

S6, Ep 144 – The Chocklett Factory: Conservation, New Products and a Legacy Remembered

S2, Ep 114 – All Things Game Changer with Blane Chocklett

Connect with Our Guest

Follow Blane on Facebook and Instagram.

Follow The Chocklett Factory on Instagram.

Follow the Show

Follow The Articulate Fly on Facebook, Instagram, Threads and YouTube.

Follow our Substack newsletter for episode updates, tips and resources.

Support the Show

Shop through our Amazon link to support the podcast.

Join our Patreon community to support the show.

If you are in the industry and need help getting unstuck, learn more about our consulting options.

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Subscribe to the podcast in your favorite podcast app.

Think our community is a good fit for your brand? Advertise with us.