This week, we kick off Halloween month with the 1996 cult classic, ‘The Craft’. Dive into the Halloween spirit with this movie that combines teenage angst with witchcraft.

Craig shares his long-time love for the film, while Todd discusses his first impressions after watching. Listen as we explore the memorable performances by Robin Tunney, Fairuza Balk, and Neve Campbell, discuss the film’s strong feminist themes, and highlight the unforgettable 90s soundtrack.

Tune in for an in-depth discussion of the movie’s impacts and legacy. Don’t miss it! And Happy Spooky Season, listeners!

Episode 460, 2 Guys and a Chainsaw Horror Movie Review Podcast

Todd: Hello and welcome to another episode of Two Guys and a Chainsaw. I’m Todd.

Craig; And I’m Craig.

Todd: Well, we’re starting our Halloween month, about a week late this year, but I think that, uh, we couldn’t have done it much better than with a movie that I think have evokes a bit of the Halloween spirit deals with teenagers and witches and witchy stuff felt like Halloween to me.

Anyway, we’re doing 1996 as The Craft, which I know is a movie that you’ve been wanting to do for ages, Uhhuh, and a movie that, believe it or not, I had never seen until now. 

Craig: Yeah, 

Todd: I, I do not like, I cannot believe it. It’s wild. This came out the same year as Scream, right? Yep. And it stars a couple of the same people.

It’s got NPH Campbell and Skeet Ulrich in it. Mm-hmm. I believe they had a bet or going to see which one would do better at the box office. But, uh, either way it worked out pretty well for those two, didn’t it? 

Craig: Yeah. That was a funny story, I guess. She won, I guess she bet on Scream and his punishment was like he had to stand in Times Square or in some big public space in a chicken suit and like talk about, I don’t know, something super random like World War II trivia or something like that.

Yeah, I don’t know. I just found that story so funny because like the end of the story was like, and forever after he had an affinity for mascots and makes regular contributions to like the Mascots Association of America. That’s a real rich person thing to do, isn’t it? It’s 

Todd: funny. That could, that story is could be totally made up, but I like it.

I love it too, nonetheless. It’s funny. Yeah. This movie was definitely evoking nineties vibes for me. Totally From, man, 

Craig: are you kidding me? Are you kidding me? Like watching it again yesterday. This is the nineties of the nineties movies. The cast is, is crazy. Robin Tuni, who, and maybe I should specify late nineties, like this is, yeah, the era of my high school days, late high school and you know Robin Tuni, who is the star of this movie, all just.

Immediately prior to this starting Empire Records, which was another huge movie for me, like, oh yeah, I loved that movie. Fara Balk is in this movie. And I have always loved her since the time that she was a little girl. Mm-hmm. And I kind of felt like I grew up with her. And at this point in time, she was the person that I so badly wanted to be.

She was just you. Like, I’m gonna do what I want to do and I’m gonna be who I wanna be kind of person, both in real life and in this movie. And I loved that. Like you said, Skee, Dorich, nev Campbell, Brecken Meyer, Christine Taylor, like the most nineties. And like these were all huge people that you were seeing in these teen movies all the time.

Right. And to see them all together in this movie, and Christine Taylor playing against Type, which I loved. Ugh, strap yourself in because Craig’s gonna love all over this movie. Yeah. I was real, like, I knew going in, I couldn’t believe that we hadn’t done it already. And I knew going in that it was one of my favorite movies, but I hadn’t watched it in a while.

I mean, it hadn’t been that long. I put an on every once in a while, but as we say often, it had been a long time since I had sat down and put it on from beginning to end and, and watched it closely with a, a more critical eye. And I just loved every second of it. Like there’s, there’s not a part about it that I thought was boring or poorly executed.

I think it’s beautifully shot. I think that it’s wonderfully acted. I the soundtrack blows my mind like, oh man, this soundtrack is so good. And. I say that as somebody who, as a teenager, I was a junior in high school when this came out, so as a junior and senior I had the soundtrack on CD and listened to it ad nauseum.

It is so good. Hmm. I also had the theater poster for this movie on my wall all through college. It was the only theater poster that I had, but all through college I had I, I love this movie. 

Todd: It sounds like it was 

Craig: a shaping influence for your adult, your early adult life. I think that there was something that I liked about these young women who had been kind of pushed aside.

Reclaiming their power. Yeah. I, I think there was something about that that was really appealing to me, and I thought that they were all interesting and unique and I was rooting for them. Mm. I just, I, 

Todd: I really liked it. Yeah. There is a very strong, you know, you could say feminist message behind this movie where you’re right.

Like, we have so many of these team comedies where women are the dumb blonde and women are, you know, the, the victims of pranks and things, and are sometimes just side characters cast for, for jokes or for laughs or, you know, you know how it is with women in, in film. This, like you said, these women are strong, they’re powerful from the very get go the moment you meet them.

You know, these women are taking control of their lives at a time when they’re teenagers and they’re very confused. You know, it, teen years are tough for all of us. They really are. They’re filled with emotions and there’s lots of social dynamics you have to navigate at school. You know, you’re nervous about relationships and about things like that.

And I think one of the really cool things about this movie that really does set it apart from a lot of other films, especially at this time, is that it really tackles that head on and, and you never feel like these women are villains. They’re doing the best they can. They’re, they’re trying with the resources that they’ve come up with to get this power and things get out of control.

But in a way, I sort of feel sorry for all of them by the end of the movie, you know? Yeah. Can’t really blame them for what they’re doing. And I can’t really say that even in the moment that they would be able to go like, this is wrong. We should stop. You know? There comes that point in the film where it happens and one of the characters does just sort of plow through and go overboard anyway, you know, so that becomes, I guess you could say the defacto villain.

But even in that, I felt sympathy for that character. So it’s good. It’s not as this, it’s just different. And I like that about the movie. 

Craig: Yeah. The power corrupts is, you know, one of the most universal themes. Yes. Of all time. And that’s great. I, I also would agree that this is a very feminist movie, but it’s my favorite kind of feminist piece in that it’s not preachy, like, like Right.

That doesn’t feel like the, that doesn’t feel like the point of the movie. Correct. It just is like these are strong women with agency. Yes. It’s not some big message about feminism. It’s just women. Are strong, you know, like Yeah. It’s not a message movie. Exactly. I agree. Yeah, I mean, I don’t even know where to start.

I took so many notes. Okay. So it’s written by Peter Ardi, co-written with the director, Andrew Fleming. Peter Ardi wrote Flatliners, which I also liked, and I can see some similarities, I think. Yes. Just a little bit in tone. Yes. 

Todd: Tonally, it’s very similar to Flat Liners. You know what I like about it? And I think the same thing we did Flat Liners a while ago.

The Flat Liners is sort of a matter of fact, movie uhhuh. Things just happen and you watch them happen. It’s not like a big deal is necessarily made of any of it, or you know, you have these moments of drama, but they feel very natural almost like all of this could be happening in real life. There aren’t like cliche moments.

There aren’t like these right soliloquy or these kind of big moments really for any character necessarily. It just feels like a movie that’s playing out like real life would play out, and I felt that way about Flatliners. I feel similarly about this. 

Craig: It’s directed by Andrew Fleming, who right now is most famous for directing Emily in Paris, which is very successful, hugely successful.

I’ve never seen it. All I’ve heard about it is that it’s awful, but wildly popular. Now, again, I, I can’t make any judgment because I haven’t seen it. Maybe I would really like it too. I don’t know. But I was looking back further in his career and he did a movie before this called Threesome, which. Was like a sexual awakening for me.

Do you remember that movie with Laura Flynn Boyle and one of God, no. I don’t feel like me. One of the Baldwin brothers and another famous guy from the nineties, I can’t think of his name. And the whole premise was like, it was three friends, a straight guy, a gay guy, and a straight girl, and they just kind of got entered.

Twined and they were mm-hmm. It was, it was a love triangle kind of thing. And then at the end they had the titular threesome and Oh boy,

good times. Uh, yeah, they, because the one guy was straight, so like, they were like, I, I’m sure it was very tastefully shot, but the way that I remember it is that they were all naked and they were like sandwiching, Laura Flynn Boyle and the gay one, his hands started to creep to Steven Baldwin’s. Butt, but then he like retreated, like, I shouldn’t do this.

And then Stephen Baldwin grabbed his hand and put it firmly on his ass. Oh boy.

Todd: Craig entered a new plane of existence at that day. 

Craig: Yeah. He also did a really funny movie called Dick with, uh, Kirsten Dunt and Michelle Williams. Uh, right. And it was about the, it was about the Watergate scandal, but from the perspective of these two teenage girls who inadvertently exposed to the whole thing, it was very funny.

I remember liking it a lot. He 

Todd: also did Bad Dreams, uh, his first film, which we did earlier this year. Oh, I don’t, what, what was it? I don’t remember. That was the one. Oh, the woman who’s put in the mental, in the hospital and uh, okay. It’s got The Nightmare on Elm Street. Rip off. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. We, we thought it was kind of fun, but also pretty silly.

Craig: I liked it. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. But again, this movie for me, just, I don’t know why, but it. Is virtually perfect and folks out there, I’m not suggesting that it’s necessarily like it should be added to the National Film Institute Registry or anything. Like, I’m not saying it’s an a, like a perfect movie, just, it just works so well for me.

Yeah, and it’s not a Halloween movie and that it’s not set at Halloween, but from the very beginning it feels halloweeny, you know? Right. You’re seeing crystal balls and potions and candles and a pentagram and these three girls sitting around all these candles chanting, now is the time. This is the hour.

Ours is the magic, ours is the power over and over again, and it cuts into a tight closeup on Farah Ba, who we later learned is named Nancy, and then it just cuts. To clouds in the sky and this great Our Lady Peace cover of the Beatles tomorrow. Never knows. Oh God, I, I’m, I’m, I’m gonna keep mentioning these songs because I could sing every one of them.

’cause I really did. I You couldn’t wear CDs out, but if you could, I would have. I listened to it so much. And the cast list comes up, and then we meet our main character Sarah, who’s played by Robin. Honey, I was surprised to find out that Angelina Jolie and Alicia Silverstone were considered for this role.

Yeah. These types of trivia facts always shock me because I was like, how could Angelina Jolie or Alicia Silverstone being in this movie, they’re grownups. 

Todd: And then I’m like, wait, 

Craig: this movie 

Todd: came out 30 years ago. Yeah. They were hog back then. I mean, Alicia Silverstone of course. Was this Oh yeah, this was, well clueless was a little before this, right?

93 or something like that. I don’t, no, no. I think it would’ve been closer to this time. I’m not sure. 4 95. She was in the Aerosmith videos. Yeah, she looks a lot like Robin Tni, honestly. Uh, 

Craig: kind of. 

Todd: Oh, come on. 

Craig: And Angelina Jolie. You know, I don’t remember when Gia came out. I think her big break was 

Todd: hackers, right.

Craig: Well, yeah, hackers would’ve been, I’m trying, the girl interrupted, she won the Oscar for, and I feel like that’s what really set her career on fire. But anyway, whatever. Side note. Anyway, Sarah is moving to Los Angeles with her family and it’s not really important except for that. It comes up later on the way.

There’s a big snake motif in the cab on the way to her house. She sees a huge snake in a tree, and then while they’re moving into their house, a creepy homeless man like walks through the front door right behind her and doesn’t threaten her physically, but like offers her a snake and scares her. So the dad.

Runs are off. I have the whole plot here. I I the outline completely don’t shut. Yeah. I do like, because like I said, there’s not a part that I didn’t like and it moves quickly. There’s, there’s a point, I don’t remember where it is in my note, but there’s a point where I’m like, we’re only 15 minutes in and so much has happened, or something like that.

Todd: We do end up learning about these three girls. That’s, uh, what, Bonnie, Nancy and Rochelle. 

Craig: Right? Because she, Sarah, Sarah goes to a Catholic school and she doesn’t have an immediately good experience, but we are introduced to these three girls. The girls that you just mentioned. 

Todd: Yeah. And they’re like, um, sort of your, I don’t know that, you know, they would, you might say outcast girls.

They’re the click who is getting a little goth. Well, particularly Nancy, Nancy’s the Za Ball character. Each of them have a problem, you know, kind of a, a problem with the movie focuses around Nancy lives in this trailer. Her stepfather is abusive, and, uh, she’s got a very unstable home life. Bonnie has these burn scars.

How did, did we ever hear how she got them? It’s not important. 

Craig: I don’t think so. I think it just said she was burned when she was a kid. So she’s got burns over large part of her body, her back, and her shoulder and upper arms. 

Todd: And interestingly enough, they don’t show up until she has no shirt on. It’s not like she’s got a big burn scar on her face.

You know, that’s like, 

Craig: no, but she’s insecure about it, of course. And Rochelle’s thing is that she’s black. I, I think that there was a cut scene where we find out that she’s actually the only. Black girl in this Catholic private school, which I’m sure would be challenging before they cast Rachel. True, who is of course a black actress.

That wasn’t going to be the thing it was gonna be that she had an eating disorder, but when they cast Rachel True, who was 29 when they filled this playing a teenager. Funny. Right. The oldest, they changed it and I, I think that she was initially a little bit uncomfortable with that, but ultimately I think that she was really happy with it and glad that they did it.

And, you know, giving them each kind of like a unique problem. I suppose one could call that cliche, you could certainly call it a Hollywood cliche. Yeah. That these girls are outcast when they’re all gorgeous, right. Like they’re, they’re all gorgeous. I mean, FARA balk is a type for sure. Like if you’re not into, if into Goth girls, you’re not gonna be into her.

But if you are, she’s. Stunning. Right. Just gorgeous. In the beginning of the movie, they do their best to ugly up Bonnie Nev Campbell, like they make her look like she doesn’t shower. Like her hair is all greasy and stringy and she plays it very mousy. And of course then they have their glow ups later. And like, oh surprise, you took her glasses off and took down her ponytail and she’s gorgeous.

Like Right. It’s definitely a Hollywood cliche, but, but the difference is less stark here. Well, true. And I think that these actresses pull it off. Oh yeah. I just think that it’s well done in the hands of actresses who weren’t. Talented. I think it could have been very cliched and just another not great teen horror movie, but I just think there’s a, a lot of, and again, that’s not to say that on their own, any one of them is amazing.

Right. I just feel like this came together really well. It’s just really well casted and, and 

Todd: like I said earlier, kind of when we were talking about, you know, the, the, the tone of the movie, everyone in this movie kind of has their moment, but I’m not sure anyone really outs, shines the other. It definitely revolves around Sarah of course.

And so she’s the eyes, you know, of the audience of what we’re, what we’re seeing. But aside from that, I felt that it was just really, it, it dealt with them in a very balanced way. Obviously Nancy is sort of the leader. She’s the energy, I think, behind this group because she’s the most. Gregarious, and I dunno, she’s maybe the one with the biggest chip on her shoulder, at least obviously outwardly rebelling teens, when they’re going through stress, they all deal with it in a different way.

Some people withdraw, some people really get into activities and friend groups, and some people you know, are like, I’m gonna do everything my parents don’t want me to do. They’re gonna dye their hair and they’re gonna pierce everything they can pierce and they’re gonna do whatever they can to quote unquote rebel because they’re reacting to this, uh, trauma, this difficult part in their life.

And so you see that played out, I think, in these four characters, really in a very realistic way. I thought that wasn’t overblown, it wasn’t overdone, it wasn’t overdramatized, it just felt like my high school. You know? Yeah, it really did. Right. And that’s a strength of the movie. And, uh, like you said, the, the characters play it really well, and they all feel very realistic and feel very balanced.

And I also like the, their relationship with each other. I do too. I think it’s interesting that these three characters, you know, when we meet up with them, they are clearly turning to witchcraft to help them. We don’t really know why. We just know that they’re, they’ve gotten into it and that’s good enough.

Yeah. 

Craig: And oh my God, it was the nineties. Like I, I’m sure that this movie sparked a lot of interest in wca, probably. But my God, even before this movie, like, oh yeah. I was like buying stick incense and burning it in my room and like mm-hmm. People had like crystals and stuff, like, I don’t know, it was a really weird time, perfect timing for this movie.

I think Robin t is the star of the movie, but I think that Fara Balk steals it, and, and she has. More dynamic to play, to be fair. But I just really like her. I’ve always been a fan of hers, like I said. And what you were saying was, you know, she’s the leader and she comes across as very tough and aggressive.

But I think you’re right in your assessment that that’s kind of out of necessity. You know, she comes from this really volatile environment where she lives in a trailer with her drunk mother. And you said abusive stepfather? I don’t know. He leers at her and, and there’s a point in the movie where he’s physically aggressive with the mother, but just all around it seems like her.

Situation is such that she has to be tough. She doesn’t have any choice. Right. You know, even with, with the goth thing, I think that that’s armor. You know 

Todd: what I do, you know what I mean? Oh, of course. Yeah. That’s, I mean, that’s kinda what I was saying, like this is, this is a way to protect yourself mm-hmm.

From the world. And you’re the CEUs, it’s your own door. I don’t know. Right? No, no. Yes. I have a really good way of putting this, but yeah, you’re just, uh, yeah, you’re protecting yourself. That’s, that’s very common. 

Craig: Mm-hmm. And I, I think that you could argue that ultimately Nancy is the one who is the most insecure, but she hides that, um, by being so aggressive.

Anyway, there’s also these three jerks. Chris is the leader of their group, played by Skeet Ulrich. Then there’s Mitt played by Brecken Meyer, who I’ve always, he’s so funny. And he’s, he’s little and short, so he’s rarely, if ever, gonna be a leading man. He’s always gonna be. Kind of a character player, but he’s great.

He was, he’s in this, he was in, he was the fun skateboarder in Clueless, and he is been in tons and tons of stuff, especially around that time, but he’s still working. He was in a really good episode of Black Mirror in the last couple of years. He played an astronaut, you should check that out. It was really good.

Hmm. And then there’s Trey played by a guy named Nathaniel Marston, who I didn’t recognize, but, so I went to his IMDB page and found that he passed away in 2015. He didn’t do a lot more acting. He got into production, but that was unfortunate. Yeah. Passed young. I don’t, I don’t know why, but Bonnie read in the Almanac that something good was gonna be coming today.

So she thinks it might be their fourth. They need four. I don’t know for witchy reasons to like call the corners like north, south, east and west or whatever. Later that same day, she’s in a class with Sarah and she sees Sarah balance a pencil on its lead on her desk. Make it spin. So she’s pretty confident that that’s gonna be their fourth.

I 

Todd: mean, it’s a pretty obvious thing. I’m, I’m surprised that Sarah herself is like, oh, this is just a little parlor trick I do. 

Craig: Well, she, she says later she can do things, but she doesn’t really know how, and she doesn’t really have control of it. Right. And it’s suggested later also that while these girls, the other three girls are studying witchcraft and maybe potentially can do.

Some things. It’s really Sarah that has natural power. Right. And I, and I think that we’re meant to get that she inherited that from her deceased mother, who, there’s a picture of her deceased mother that features prominently throughout the movie. Well, 

Todd: it’s pretty much told to her by the proprietor of that occult shop that, that they start frequenting later in the movie.

Uh, she tells her she inherited it from her mother, which made me think, how did she know? 

Craig: Well, I, I think she just says, you’re a natural witch. Maybe you got it from your mother. Ah, okay. I, I, I read that in the shooting script. It was made more evident that the other three girls really don’t have any power at all.

It was just when they brought Sarah in, they were kind of able to. Leach off of her power. 

Todd: Hmm. 

Craig: Which I think still 

Todd: reads, I think, yeah. 

Craig: I think it, it reads to me, but even though Bonnie thinks, oh, she’s here. This girl is gonna be our fourth, Nancy is I think, threatened from the beginning. Mm-hmm. And she doesn’t want to bring somebody else in.

Particularly somebody who potentially has power and could usurp her spot as the leader. So she initially rejects her, but they turn it around. But not before Chris starts flirting with Sarah. Oh shit. It’s the bitches of Eastwick. 

Clip: What? Whatever you do, stay away from them. Why? Well, you see the one on the right, she’s a major slut.

I mean, I don’t know from experience or anything, but the one in the middle, she’s got these burn scars all over her body. I haven’t seen them, but friends of mine have. Anyway. They’re No, nevermind. What? What? They’re witches. 

Craig: Witches. 

Clip: Well, that’s what people say, 

Craig: you know? He’s being very charming, so I can understand why she’s char by him.

And he’s like, you can come watch me at football practice if you want. And she’s like, okay, well we’ll see. And then she totally goes, right. That’s when the three girls approach her. They introduce themselves, and Nancy warns Sarah about Chris. She says he spreads disease. I know from personal experience he’s a jerk.

The only thing that bothers me about this movie, and it doesn’t really bother me because I think it is real to life. Chris is a jerk. Yeah. And Sarah can never get that through her big stupid head. He’s, he’s mean to her. I don’t know. We’ll, we’ll get into that more, I guess. The girls invite Sarah to go shopping at this occult shop, and on the way there, Nancy notices that Sarah has.

Suicide scars on her wrist. Interestingly enough, Robin Honey also had suicide scars on her wrist in the movie she had done immediately prior to this Empire Records. Oh. Which I hadn’t remembered. I just read about it. But they go to this occult shop, which we’ll come back to multiple times. And there’s this shop lady, I don’t know if she has a name.

I don’t know the actress’s name, but there’s this shop lady, the other girls are just kind of looking around and like shoplifting and stuff. But the shop lady kind of takes interest in Sarah right away. She tells her that she should buy this book and it’s the craft and uh, talks to her about candles and energy and all kinds of thing.

So it seems like maybe she gets a vibe off of Sarah from the beginning, but, but that’s just the beginning. Yeah. As they’re leaving, they’re walking down the street. This is all in Los Angeles and they seem to be in a kind of not great part of Los Angeles. There’s a lot of homeless and prostitutes and, and not good stuff.

And that snake guy. From before shows up and confronts Sarah again. And when I say snake guy, I mean he’s holding a snake like a little snake. He says, I had a dream about you. He’s talking to Sarah and kinda like not chasing her, but following her down the street. And she’s obviously uncomfortable and trying to get away, and he’s shouting behind her, I had a dream about you.

In my dream, you were dead. Dead. And Sarah runs across the street and he follows, and all at once, all four of our witches turn and look at him and the camera makes it very clear that this is happening. And he gets brutally hit and run over by a truck, right? Like he doesn’t just get hit by the truck, he gets hit by the truck.

We see that. Then it cuts to a shot under the truck where he, his head gets run over. It’s really striking. I mean, I thought it looked fantastic. You know, again, I’ve seen this movie so many times, but I watched movies, we’ve talked about this before. I watched them differently. When I’m preparing to talk about them for the show.

Right. I’m, I’m watching ’em closely. You know, I’m, I’m, I’m really looking at things that we can talk about, and I, I thought it looked fantastic. You know, sometimes when I’m watching movies for Pleasure, I’m like, oh, wow, that cinematography is really great. But not usually, usually I’m just watching the movie, 

Todd: right?

Yeah. But this, 

Craig: it looks fantastic, but they all get really excited and run off to like some, I don’t know, chic hobo encampment where they sit down and talk for a second and they’re like, you know, this, this must be it. We’ve got the power. And Nancy, she starts talking about Menal. It’s, it’s spelled M-A-N-O-N.

But the, it sounds like this. A mano, they pronounce it strangely. 

Clip: You guys, maybe he’ll really listen Now, who? Manno. Oh, what’s that? That’s like, God, no man invented God. This is older than that. Do. Do you guys wish that the devil, it’s like God and the devil. I mean, it’s everything. It’s, it’s the trees, it’s the ground, it’s the rocks, it’s the moon, it’s everything.

It’s nature. Yeah. If God and the devil were playing football, manel would be the stadium that they played on. It would be the sun that shone down on them. 

Craig: It’s all very connected to like nature and energy and, and you know, it’s not difficult to wrap your head around. It’s just kind of like a divine, all powerful natural thing.

But he says, or she says. He fixes you, he takes all the bad stuff about you and makes it all better again. And Sarah says Nothing makes everything all better. And she gets up and walks away and one of the girls is like, where are you going? She’s like, you guys are kind of freaking me out. She leaves and goes and hangs out with Chris.

Yeah. And there’s a great jewel song, uh, in the background of this. Yes. Todd, I’m serious. You know, and everybody listening, go to Spotify, go to iTunes, wherever you get your music and download the soundtrack. Especially if you were a teenager in the nineties and you were into those like indie alternative radio stations.

So many great and, and Jewel was certainly not Indie alternative, but this is not, I don’t think that this is a song that she released on any of her albums. I think it was just for the soundtrack, and it’s a great song, and I don’t think it’s in the movie, but. In the middle of it, on the soundtrack, there’s a rap moment where, where Jewel wraps.

No way she wraps. Oh God. It, I, it may be a little bit of a stretch to call it a wrap, but. It sounds like, it sounds like a wrap to me. I mean, I could do it for you. Do it, Greg. Do it. She goes excited to hear who we will become. Gonna lay out in the water, go back to where I’m from and it goes on, it goes on more than 

Todd: that.

Oh, thanks. That keeps me from getting flagged for copyright violation on YouTube. You, you just sing it so I don’t have to 

Craig: cut it in. And again, I don’t think the rap is in the movie, but the, the, it’s, it’s great. The whole soundtrack is so good. Chris says, let’s go back to my house. Nobody’s there. And she says, no, she’s not rude about it or anything.

They’ve only hung out once. Yeah. And he’s like, okay, cool, whatever. But the very next day she goes to school, to immediately find out that he has been spreading rumors about her. Not only that they did in fact have sex, but that she was the worst he’d ever had, or something like that. Yeah. He’s a dick. 

Todd: He’s a dick.

And then he just totally just trashes her. He’s not even angling like, this guy’s not even smart about it. He’s not playing the long game with this girl. Suddenly now he’s like, yeah, forget about you. It’s just nuts. I know it’s frustrating. Yeah. I guess, 

Craig: you know, not necessarily unrealistic, especially in high school, 

Todd: but you’re right, it is a bit much, I mean, it’s just to get us to the, it’s the catalyst to draw her closer to the girls.

Yes. Because now the girls are, right now they can bond and do their 

Craig: thing, which is literally what they do. Right, right. And we, we now get this montage of the things that you already alluded to, the reasons all of their problems, and Rochelle is facing racism. Christine Taylor. Who I have always liked. I, she’s, I thought she was hilarious when she played Marsha Brady.

I, I’ve always liked her. I still like her and she plays her beautiful blonde, stereotypically popular character in this, but she’s horribly racist. And I don’t know what, how I felt about it at the time, but in hindsight, I’m almost surprised how far they went with this. She’s just blatant. She, she’s not subtly, yeah, it’s not subtle.

Right. It’s not subtle. It’s outright like she just bullies her. In general, Rochelle is a diver and Christine Taylor, Laura is, you know, always messing with her when she’s trying to dive or whatever. But then in the locker room, you know, they’re getting ready. Laura’s brushing her hair and she goes, oh, gross.

There’s a pubic hair in my brush. Oh wait, that’s just one of Rochelle’s little nappy hairs. And yeah, Rochelle confronts her and is like, why are you doing this to me? Like, what did I ever do to you? Laura says, do you really wanna know? And she’s like, yes, Laura, I really want to know. And she says, I don’t like Negros.

Sorry. I know, right. 

Todd: One could also almost argue that this is maybe a bit too far. Like you said, just like how Skeet o’s character is just like so immediate and blatantly dickish to this girl. There’s no subtlety about this either, and I don’t know, it, it’s, it’s a bit much, I guess it gets its, I think it’s a really, 

Craig: I think it’s really, really clever in the writing because they establish those two characters as vile.

Like these are just vile people that we hate. Yeah. And we are very much on the side of the girls like, yeah, these are bad people. They deserve to get what’s coming to them. That’s true. I think that that’s an excellent setup. For later when they do get it, for us to go through the same emotional journey that the girls go through.

That yeah, these people may have been bad and they may have been done thing, they may have done bad things, but they’re still human and that doesn’t necessarily mean that they deserve to suffer to the extent that they ultimately do. Right, right. They’re set up to be so bad so that we are supposed to have this catharsis of empathy later in the movie.

Yeah. I think 

Todd: you’re probably right about that. So it works. It comes across as a bit much in the moment, but you’re right, it, it does work emotionally as the movie goes on. 

Craig: As you already said, Bonnie’s got scars. She’s going for these treatments. Her doc, her doctor is Brenda Song, who was the narrator of Desperate Housewives, and it’s a needle therapy.

Now, I have no idea if this is an actual scientific thing, but it looks miserable. It, you know, yeah, it’s a needle. I would say a tattoo needle because it works in that way, possibly pokes. It’s constantly poking, but it’s not a tattoo Needle. Tattoo needles are fine. This looks like a pretty big needle, and it’s going into scar tissue, which I can’t imagine.

How painful that would be. And yeah. You know, we’re shown how painful it is because Nev Campbell screams in agony while this is happening. Sarah’s still dealing with the trauma of losing her mom. And, well, her mom died, uh, in childbirth, but she’s having flashbacks to her suicide. We see Nancy’s trashy trailer trip life, and then they decide to go on a field trip together.

Mm-hmm. And I don’t mean a school field trip, they skip school to go on a trip to a literal field. Yes. And they take a bus and a Juliana Hatfield song called Witches Song plays in the background. It’s so good. And they get off the bus. And this is kind of the iconic scene from the movie. One of, at least I remember it was in the trailer, at least that’s how I remember it.

They get off the bus and the bus driver stops them and says. Hey girls, be careful. There’s lots of weirdos out there. And Farah Bull looks at ’em and says, we are the weirdos, Mister. So good. It’s funny. And then they, then they do their witchy stuff. They call the corners, you know, each of them has a direction.

Robin Honey is north. I don’t remember what the other ones are. And they make wishes they wish for what they want. Rochelle wants to be loved, or I don’t remember, but she says something about Laura. Sarah asks to love herself more and to be loved more by others like Chris. And she’s like, I know you guys.

It’s super lame. They’re all like, okay, whatever. Bonnie wants to be beautiful inside and out. And when it comes to Nancy, she just says that she wants all the power of Menno. Yeah. And after that, all of these butterflies. Appear and they take that as a sign that they have been heard, and apparently they have, because immediately after that, things start to change.

Todd: Yeah. And, and again, when we’re talking about sort of the normal realistic aspect of this movie, I kind of like the fact that this isn’t this huge dramatic, like, you know, the, the clouds get dark and wind starts to whip around and you know, you know something is really happening. You really feel like they were probably teenagers in my high school who were doing this.

Sitting out in a field, having their own little ritual from some book they read or whatnot, and then a butterfly lands on one of their shoulders and they take it as a sign, and then the movie goes on very matter of factly, as these things start to happen. And I really liked that understated aspect of this part anyway, of the movie.

It, it really, I don’t know. The movie felt very breezy for me in a way for a while, you know? Yeah. I just liked that about, it was just fresh and unique and it 

Craig: kept me engaged. I agree entirely. That’s what I like it. It just keeps moving. It doesn’t drag at any point. Mm-hmm. And at this point, things start to go well for them.

Chris starts acting like a puppy dog around. I mean, it, I mean, it, it could only be the result of the a spell, the way that he’s acting. 

Todd: Oh, yeah. He’s kind of out of it. You know, there are moments where like, his buddies are like, razzing him and he kind of stares at them, like he hears what they’re saying, but he doesn’t understand what they’re saying.

And he is a little confused and he just turns back to carrying their books. You know, it just, it’s funny in a way. I mean, he’s the most clear. And the, the one girl who was, uh, Laura, I guess who was teasing Bonnie, she starts losing her hair. Oh, Rochelle, sorry. Her hair starts falling 

Craig: out. 

Todd: Right? 

Craig: Mm-hmm.

Bonnie’s treatment is a complete success. Like 

Todd: complete and utter 

Craig: uhhuh just 

Todd: wipe the scars away. 

Craig: Yep. They’re just totally gone. She’s a medical miracle. And also throughout this, there’s also just, I, I have a montage of them having fun because they are like, they’re just, yeah, they’re hanging out together, they’re having slumber parties, they’re laughing at one of the slumber parties.

They play light as a feather, stiff as a board, and it works. And they’re all like blown away. And it’s at this part that the movie feels so fun and like I wanna be friends with them, like mm-hmm. I wanna hang out with them and have magical powers. And have slumber parties and. Do fun stuff. And you know, because Bonnie’s treatment has been a complete success.

She changes overnight. She’s super confident. She’s wearing super sexy clothes. They all, over the course of the movie, they start out very dowdy. And over the course of the movie, as they reclaim their power, their look starts to become much more chic. They’ve all got their own individual styles, but they all start to become more chic.

Initially, Nancy’s upset because it doesn’t seem like her spell is working, but then in their trailer, her stepdad starts roughing up her mom and she screams at him and all the lights explode. And the stepdad has a heart attack and dies, and they find out that they’re getting a life insurance payout or a pension payout of $175,000.

Mm-hmm. And they’re so excited, and I’m excited for them. As a grownup in 2025, right? That’s not gonna go very far, you 

Todd: guys. No, I was thinking the same thing. I was a little judgmental of how they chose to spend their 175,000. Well, I 

Craig: saw that today it would be worth just a little bit less than twice that.

So somewhere around 350,000, which, you know, if I won $350,000, I’d scream and, and be excited too, but I’m not necessarily sure that it would get them this huge. Penthouse. Right. That they now get, that the girls visit them in. This was a part that I had never really considered before. But again, watching the movie closely, they go to visit Nancy’s new apartment and the mom is there and the mom is super, super happy and like Is is so, so happy to be showing off her new place, which is really nice.

Jukebox. It’s ridiculous night. Yep. And her jukebox that plays only Connie Francis, welcome to our Connie Francis tribute episode. Connie Francis passed away just a few months ago. Oh no. Yeah. But I think that this scene is interesting because their wishes are coming true and they’re all so happy about it.

And they visit Nancy and this is typical. The mom kinda wants to hang out with them or whatever, and Nancy’s like, no, mom lame. Leave us alone or whatever. Watching it this time, I was thinking, I think that this is our first hint at a major theme of this movie, that magic or, or power and money. Do not ensure happiness.

Mm. The mom has gotten what she wanted, everything she’s always wanted, including a jukebox that plays only Connie Francis. But she’s not happy, right? Yeah, she’s She’s still a drunk. She’s still alone. Yeah. It’s true. This is, again, only the half point at Nancy’s house. They, they learn and we learn about glamors, which are just magic.

Tricks basically where you can change the appearance of things and Sarah turns her eyes brown and then turns her hair, blonde, cosmetic type stuff. We’re at the halfway point now. This is where things turn, Chris becomes, it’s not immediate that you can tell, but it, it doesn’t take very long to realize that Chris is becoming dangerously infatuated and they go back to the magic shop and Sarah asks the lady how to undo a spell and she says, you can’t undo a spell.

It just has to run its course. There’s talk about black magic and white magic, and the shop lady says that there’s, there is neither white or black magic. Life just keeps a balance. But be careful because whatever you send out, you get back times three. Yeah. Obviously foreshadowing obviously. A warning, 

Todd: but Right, right.

And Nancy’s only half paying attention to this because she’s interested in this book that talks about Inca invocation of the spirit, I think, and tries to buy it. And of course the shop lady’s like, no, this is way too powerful for you. And she’s like, look, lady, you’re gonna sell it to me or not. She’s like, well, that’ll be 25 bucks.

So she does like, now, again, speaking of foreshadowing, it’s all contained within this scene, right? The, your choices, the things that you’re doing are going to have consequences. And Nancy doesn’t care and she just wants to take it up another level. And that’s exactly what they do. They go to the beach.

Mm-hmm. And they each bring an item. It’s funny how this is never explained to us, right? It’s not like they read the book and we see have this scene where they’re preparing. And so one person brings a bird, one person brings a snake. I can’t remember who all brings it. And I thought, okay, that’s interesting.

But nothing is said about it. It’s just part of this ritual that we just take in. And that’s fine with me. I like a little bit of mystery, but I guess there was a practicing Wiccan on set that they used as a consultant to make sure that everything was fairly accurate in these, these like spiritual type things.

They used actual chants and words from Uhhuh, from books and things like that. Although man, Manon or whatever, Manan is not an actual deity. 

Craig: No. They intentionally made up a deity so as not to offend. Anyone, they weren’t making jokes at the expense of, yeah, people who practice witchcraft. You know, I think they were presenting it in a respectful way.

There were rumors at the time that Za Balk was actually a Wiccan and she was not. She was interested in the occult. She bought an occult shop during the filming of this just because she came across it and you know, working on this and it was available and she bought it and she ran it for a very long time.

Todd: Yeah, it’s interesting, isn’t it? 

Craig: Yeah. She was just interested in that stuff. But yeah, they did have actual advisors on, and this scene is really cool. Like there are reasons. I hadn’t really thought about it before, but each of them has a different little animal. And Rochelle’s is a fish. Well, she’s a swimmer and a diver.

Bonnie’s is a butterfly. She wants to be beautiful. Sarah’s is a love bird. She is pining after Chris or whatever. And Nancy’s is a snake, which guess is about like rebirth, but also power. Right. And that’s not something that 17-year-old me would’ve paid any attention to, but I still kind of liked, I could at least make the association, oh, they each have their own symbol or spirit animal or, or whatever, right?

But when they do this big ritual invoking the spirit or whatever, it’s late at night on the beach and there’s a big storm rolling in, and they call the corners like they always do. But then Nancy does this thing where she invokes the spirit and she says, Manon fill me. And she gets struck by lightning and I guess they fall asleep.

The next thing we know it’s morning. And it seems, it seems like they’re waking up and they’re all there except Nancy. And they kinda look around for her and she is. Out on the sea, walking on water. Yeah, she’s Jesus at this point. She’s powerful. Obviously she’s powerful, but she’s also. Crazy. Yes. From this point forward, like she’s acting crazy and far balk can act crazy.

It’s great. Yeah. But she’s like, he blessed me. I can feel him running through my veins. And there are all these beach sharks, and she’s like, these are my gifts. I’m your daughter now. Ah.

But this is when Sarah starts to realize that things have gone too far, and she tries to talk to them about it. Bo, you know, they’re all being reckless. Bonnie who used to be nice, is now all narcissistic and bitchy, and she warns them that they’re throwing things out of balance and that it’s going to come back on them.

And she, Nancy and Sarah argue, and it’s, it’s a power struggle. And you can tell that Nancy is trying to establish dominance like it’s my way or the highway. So if you don’t like it. You can go. And at this point Sarah’s like, I don’t necessarily want to go, but she’s separates herself from them a little bit.

And, and Chris is stalking her, but she agrees to go to dinner with him and he doesn’t take her to dinner. He takes her out on a side road and, and they park and she tries to talk to him. But he’s not even, he’s not even paying attention to her. He’s not even there. No. He is not even there. And he’s like, and he even says something like, I, I, I don’t know what I think.

I can’t think all I can do is feel. And when she again, rejects him, he tries to rape her. Yeah. But she gets away and she tells the girls, and Nancy wants to find him immediately. Yeah. And she marches into this big, rich. Popular Kid party marches in, like she owns the place and there’s a Space Hog song playing behind her and it’s 

Todd: Good.

Space Hog. Space Hog. I forgot about those guys. They had like a song at one time and I was really liked them and I thought, oh, these guys are gonna going to do great things. 

Craig: It’s a great song. It’s called the Who? It. And she finds Chris and takes him upstairs and tries to seduce him as herself, but he rejects her, so she glamors herself to look like Sarah, and, oh, gods him.

I 

Todd: guess I gets real close to it. Think so. I guess it. It pretty much happened. I, they, well, the girls end up following her there and they walk in. 

Craig: Yeah. So there, there’s also a moment at the party where Laura approaches Rochelle in a friendly way. And again, we feel sorry for her. You know, Rochelle, I, we, we skipped a part where Rochelle had.

Seen Laura sitting on the floor in the shower crying with her hair falling out, and she says, what did I do to deserve this? And you can tell Rochelle is second guessing. Yeah. What she’s done. But yeah, Sarah walks in on Nancy and Chris and Nancy rages at Chris. You’re just jealous. 

Clip: Jealous. Jealous. You don’t even exist to me.

You don’t even exist. You are nothing. You are shit. You don’t exist. The only way you know how to treat women is by treating them like a horse when you are the whore and that’s gonna stop. Do you understand? You understand what I’m saying?

I’m sorry. He is sorry. Oh, he, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry.

Craig: And she floats towards him. You just see the tips of her boots scraping along the carpet, the force of her rage. Forces him out through the window and he falls from the second or third story and is dead. Yeah. And, and, and Sarah feels bad, like she feels responsible for this. Mm-hmm. And in some ways she is.

And she realizes that. So she tries to bind Nancy, she does a binding spell, but it doesn’t work. The girls start tormenting her in her dreams. Like they’re, they’re flying into her room and, and taunting her. And eventually they confront her in the bathroom. And Nancy says, Sarah’s like people are dead. Two, two men are dead.

And Nancy says. Well, they deserved it. These girls have obviously been completely corrupted by their power. Yep. And again, like I said, that’s a universal theme and and especially teenagers. Can you imagine having that kind of power as a teenager? 

Todd: Oh God. It’s like that Twilight Zone episode of the little kid.

Yeah. Who can make things happen with his brain. Yeah. Mm. 

Craig: Who cares about consequence? You’re getting what you want. And they threaten her. And Nancy says, you know, in the old days if a witch betrayed her coven, they would kill her. And then she just walks away and it’s like, bye. So Sarah goes to the shop lady for help, and the shop lady takes her to this mysterious back room and says, right, listen.

Which is bigger than the shop itself. 

Todd: Yeah. 

Craig: And it’s all 

Todd: mystical and flowy and. It solved a question for me though, because every time we pop into one of these shops and there are a million candles lit, I’m like, I just picture myself, does this shop owner come in and individually light each and every one of these candles every day and just leave them going?

But then there’s a moment in this movie where she lights one candle and all the rest of ’em come up, and I’m like, oh. So that’s how that 

Craig: works. Convenience. She tells her that she’s a natural witch and that she needs to invoke the spirit, and Sarah’s like, I can’t. She’s like, yes, you can. But Nancy interrupts this by making it seem like the first part of the, the front half of the shop explodes.

And the effects I think, are pretty good in most places. Yeah, in most places there’s part, the part where she does the glamor, where she changes her hair color. There’s something off about that. It’s very. Nineties morphing technology. Yeah. Other than that, it looks pretty good. She runs home and nobody’s there, and Nancy calls and says, turn on the tv, and a plane has crashed.

And she’s like, yeah, your parents were on that plane. And then the whole house is filled with snakes, spiders, lizards, and bugs. Now, Sarah had said earlier that when she was a kid, she used to have these nightmares or hallucinations where she was surrounded by snakes or something. Right. And Nancy had overheard, but they didn’t make anything of it at the time.

But now Nancy’s using this against her. So there’s a whole scene of her running around, you know, with snakes all over her and bugs and rats and all kinds of stuff. But ultimately, Nancy. Pops in and says, gotcha. And it, it was all just a glamor. It all disappears. 

Clip: Right. 

Craig: But she says, if I were as pathetic as you, I would’ve killed myself ages ago.

You should get on with it. And Sarah, you know, goes downstairs and the whole coven is there, and they tell her this is the end. You know, you killed Chris, and now you have to die. And they all float right up in the air. They’re full on powers. Yeah. Right. And they start chanting, now is the end. Let her go in peace.

And they throw down a suicide note in her handwriting that just says, I killed Chris, I’m sorry, with her signature. And Nancy slashes her Sarah’s wrists. And Sarah says it. Sarah says, it’s not real. And Nancy says, then why are you still bleeding? Like she really did cut her wrist. 

Clip: Yeah. 

Craig: So Sarah runs up to her room where she pleads for help.

Starts invoking the spirit, but she’s alm, she’s about to die. She’s bleeding out, she’s about to die. When either she sees or it actually happens that the picture of her mother animates. Mm-hmm. And the voice of her mother says, reach inside yourself. And she does. She starts chanting again downstairs. The girls are just waiting and Nancy’s like, go check and see what’s going on.

So Rochelle and Bonnie go up there, but. Sarah is still kind of recuperating. She casts a glamor to make them see themselves in the mirror. Hideous, Rochelle is, her hair is all falling out and Bonnie’s whole face is covered in those burn scars. And when they see that, Bonnie says, not again, and grabs Rochelle, and they just get the fuck outta there.

They just leave. They’re the smart ones, 

Todd: right?

Craig: Okay. So Sarah’s scars heel up and Nancy, after the other girls run out, she’s like, where are you going? And you can tell that she’s. A little nervous. So she goes up and she’s like, Sarah, what’s going on? And there’s a great mirror effect where through a BA has her back to the mirror. And so we’re seeing her back and the reflection, but then it changes and Sarah turns around and steps out of the mirror and grabs her and scares her.

Yeah. Sarah’s got full on powers at this point. Yeah. She can like app operate and move around and do some stuff. Yeah. She can do all kinds stuff and all kinds of stuff. She says to Nancy, yeah, I talked to Manon and he told me to tell you that you’re in deep shit. And so then she does a, she, she makes bugs crawl all over Nancy and, and turns Nancy’s finger and hair into snakes, which freaks Nancy out and she falls over on her back and then Sarah lets it all disappear.

And she says, relax. It’s only magic now who’s pathetic. And Nancy is like. I’m, I’m really sorry. Um, it just all went too far and like it’s obviously fake and Sarah obviously knows that and Sarah starts that binding spell again. Like, I bind you, Nancy, I bind you from causing harm to yourself or, or to others and to yourself.

And Nancy keeps saying, wait, wait, wait. And eventually she pulls out from where, I don’t know, a huge dagger and holds it way above her head and screams and, and attacks Sarah. And they fight like in the air Yeah. Against the wall. And papers are flying everywhere. It’s pretty awesome. And, you know, it’s easy to figure out how this was done.

The, the set had to have been rotated 90 degrees. Yeah. So where it looks like they’re up against the wall floating in the air, I’m sure they’re just lying on the floor and, you know, things are flying at them through the doorway behind them. You know, things were just being dumped on them. But it looks great.

And they fight, and it ends with a giant dresser like flying towards them. And Nancy gets outta the way right at the last second and it smashes Sarah into the wall. But when Nancy moves the dresser away, it’s just Sarah’s clothes there. Nancy goes to stab the clothes, but Sarah like comes back outta the floor, back into her clothes and kicks Nancy against the wall.

Like a Across the room? Yeah. Into a mirror. And Nancy’s, uh, out and, and, and she continues to bind her. 

Clip: Yeah. 

Craig: Cut to the next, I guess, or a new sunny day. I think that Sarah and her parents are moving again. It looks like maybe. I don’t know. Who cares? It doesn’t matter. The Bonnie and Rochelle come to visit Sarah and they’re trying to be all nice, and they’re like, you know, we’re sorry for her.

And she’s like, trying to kill me. And they’re like, yeah, and, and they’re like, we were just wondering if you still had any powers. ’cause we don’t. And she’s like, Hmm, no, I don’t know, whatever. And she’s like, well, they’re like, if you ever wanna, you know, just hang out or call the coroners or whatever, just let us know.

And she’s like, yeah, hold your breath until I call. And they turn around and one of them’s like, she probably doesn’t have any powers anyway. And Sarah turns around like. Fire starter or something. The wind blows in her hair and she’s got this intense look on her face. And clouds roll in and lightning strikes a branch right above Bonnie and Rochelle and falls and all those lands on them.

And Sarah says, be careful. You wouldn’t want to end up like Nancy. And then it cuts to Nancy strapped to a gurney in an institution. She’s got scratches all over her face. And she is out of her mind. Yes. And she’s like, uh, I can fly. I can fly, I fly, can fly. I’m flying. And she’s like, he gave me the power.

And the nurse says, he gave you something baby, but it wasn’t the power. And, and the end is just her alone writhing on this bed. Insane saying, I, I can fly. I’m flying, I’m flying. But even in this moment. I felt bad for her. Yeah, me too. I really did. She came from a bad life. She was given some power and autonomy and she took it way too far, but she, I don’t think she was a bad person.

Clip: Yeah. 

Craig: And I’m, I’m sad that this is how she ended up, I mean, she did try to kill her friend, right? Yeah. I mean, I mean, I, I’m, I’m not, yeah. I’m not justifying or, you know, no. Yeah. The things that she did. But you’re right. It is 

Todd: sad. She’s a teenager. Right. You know, she’s a teenager and this is. I always feel bad about, you know, when teenagers do life altering things in teenager movies.

’cause Well, I mean that’s, I guess that’s what’s happens in real life too. Sure. But you, you just know they’re just not, they’re just not there yet. They’re not adults, you know, they can’t, you, you want every teenager to have a second and a third chance to get older and to mature a bit, you know? Have the right mind.

Craig: Well, and I mean, you know, she’s not dead, so we don’t know what happens after this. 

Todd: Maybe she’ll become sane again, but it seems like maybe she still has Manan in her. Who knows. 

Craig: Maybe, but I mean, so does Sarah. For all we know. I don’t know. And I, 

Todd: I don’t know. I didn’t think Sarah had Manan in her. I felt like Sarah was just channeling her inner power that her mother, but I 

Craig: don’t think Manan is either good or bad.

Todd: Good or bad. 

Craig: You’re right, 

Todd: you’re right. That was established 

Craig: and, and there is a sequel that came out, I don’t know, within the last five years, and I only recently saw it, and I went in expecting it to be bad. I, I was excited to see it, but I was like, I’m gonna have zero expectations. I’m sure it’s gonna be bad.

I’m just gonna try to enjoy it for what it is. Uhhuh, it wasn’t bad. It wasn’t bad. Really. No, it wasn’t bad. I actually liked it quite a bit. It’s not as good as this movie, and it’s a lot more woke than this movie. Like, oh, okay. The feminism and there’s, there’s a lot of L-G-B-T-Q stuff in it, and it’s a little more on the nose with its messaging about those things.

Mm-hmm. But I think that’s par for the course these days. I, but I actually did enjoy it. And so if, if you are a fan of this movie. It’s not as good. It is not as good as this movie, but it’s not bad. I had a good time with it. Oh, well that’s interesting. 

Todd: I I would’ve assumed it was bad. Yeah, me too. Because they were trying to make a sequel for a while.

I think they were gonna do like a direct video something, and it just never felt, never came together. Yeah. With Nancy Uhhuh. Yeah. I, uh, I love this movie. I thought it was great. It was just really nice and fun and I mean, I can’t really find fault with it, honestly, at all. It just a solid, solid performances, solid movie.

There’s nothing super fancy about the cinematography or anything like that. In fact, it is shot just like all these nineties movies were, you know, with perfect lighting in every scene. And it did take me back, you know, you’re right. The soundtrack, the music, it really worked, it really took me back as well, just to that scream era that set off all of these.

It’s, it’s kind of funny how these movies kind of came around at the same time and scream really set off this whole slasher self-aware bit. And this movie, although it was critically not. I think the reviews were kind of mixed. Roger Ebert was, I don’t know what Roger Ebert’s problem is sometimes, you know how much I love him.

Mm-hmm. But he gave this movie two stars and he was just kind of cynically critical about it. Like, it should have been like this instead of like this. And I thought that felt a little unfair. People loved it. I mean, I think it may, it grossed 55 million on a $15 million budget. It was a success. 

Craig: Yeah. 

Todd: Just 

Craig: a couple years later, charmed totally ripped it off.

Like Charmed is such a huge ripoff to the point that the theme song for Charmed is one of the prominent songs, the same version, the same cover of one of the prominent songs from this movie. Oh my God. It’s such an obvious, yeah. And, and I’m sure you read too, like the, the guy who wrote this or, or the director one or the other, shopped a, a script around for a series of the craft.

Mm. And, and one of the places that he shopped, it was wherever. That show Charmed got produced wherever. Yeah, wherever it got produced. Robin t said it was such a blatant ripoff that for years and years people would approach her and say how much they loved her and charmed. Oh God. Well, I’m glad that we finally got around to doing it because honestly, it’s among my favorite movies Scream.

Obviously did much better and and sparked an entire franchise that is still running strong. If I were put in a room and forced to choose between the two, I think I would pick this one. Mm. I think I just enjoy it more and, and maybe I just feel that way today because it’s so fresh in my mind. I like Scream two and Scream is funnier.

Clip: Yeah. 

Craig: Well, 

Todd: Scream’s got a gimmick. It’s kind of this meta horror movie. It’s, and it’s a slasher with a mystery, you know, it’s a very different kind of film. This is a straightforward story that’s told well, so, uh, they’re different movies, but they have a lot of the same aesthetic to them, the same actors, very late nineties.

Well, I enjoyed it and thank you Craig, for bringing it up to kick off our Halloween season. As always, we have more Halloween type movies coming for you these next few weeks. We hope you guys are getting ready. The best way, you know how I know I, I’m in the States right now. I visited Spirit Halloween just yesterday.

Nice. And that’s always a fun little ritual for me. It blows me away, especially because I could be gone for, for, you know, I’m overseas obviously, most of my life these days, and then I come back to the States and it feels like I’ve, I’ve missed out on a few things and, uh, I’m always amazed at how. After a couple years, it seems like Spirit Halloween has more and more complex animatronics that you can buy for like hundreds of dollars.

Oh yeah. They’re just sitting out there and I just love activating every single one of them and seeing what happens. It’s, it’s really pretty nuts. I miss having a house with a yard. In a garage where I can just do things up and scare, trick, or treaters. Uh, so I hope you guys are getting ready for that in the best way you can.

How about you, Craig? Are you doing anything for Halloween this year? 

Craig: I have been so busy with work that I haven’t had a second to think about it, but, uh, I’m, I’m excited. For the month I’ve been watch, I have been watching some new horror movies, so that’s been fun. Well, we’ve got 

Todd: a lot planned for you. Uh, if you, uh, subscribe to our Patreon, you’ll get a little bit more.

We’re gonna throw up some additional content there this month, some Halloween oriented stuff. All you need to do is go to patreon.com/chainsaw podcast for just five bucks a month. You get access to that, you get access to Mini sos. We post unedited versions of this phone call with a little bit more personal stories with us, and the beginning and the end and all the stuff that I cut out that just is, is too hot for Prod Top.

You can also go to our website and, uh, stream all of our entire back catalog. That’s chainsaw hor.com. Leave us a message there and we will play it back on air. You just click talk to us and you can record a quick message. And we love hearing from you guys. We got a couple of those coming up this month as well.

Until next time, I am Todd. And I’m Craig with Two Guys and a Chainsaw.