The Eric Ries Show

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I sit down with Daniel Dines, the Founder and CEO of UiPath, a company that started in robotic process automation (RPA) and is now making a bold shift into agentic AI. Dubbed “the boss of bots” by Forbes, Daniel has led UiPath from its humble beginnings to a $6.65 billion company that’s reshaping the future of automation.

Daniel’s journey is anything but conventional. After working as an engineer on SQL at Microsoft, he felt a pull toward something more creative—building his own product. That decision led him back to Romania, where he founded the company that would eventually become UiPath.

In our conversation today, we talk about the following topics: 

• Why stepping out of your comfort zone is key to growth

• The Jack London book that changed Daniel’s life 

• The benefits of bootstrapping vs. raising big VC money

• Why letting go is the hard part of a pivot

• How failure can unlock unexpected opportunities

• A case for mixing work and life to build a strong company culture 

• Why empowering employees is good for business 

• What Daniel learned from UiPath’s journey to IPO 

• Daniel’s plans for his second stint as CEO

• Why Daniel is optimistic about the impact AI will have on the future of work

• And more!

—

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• Wilson Sonsini – Wilson Sonsini is the innovation economy’s law firm. ⁠Learn more⁠.

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—

Where to find Daniel Dines:

• LinkedIn: https://x.com/danieldines

• X: https://www.linkedin.com/in/danieldines/

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(03:11) Growing up in communist Romania

(10:00) The importance of breaking out of your comfort zone

(13:41) Joy as a sign you’re on the right path 

(15:27) The Jack London book that made Daniel an entrepreneur 

(16:40) The beginnings of UiPath

(18:50) Why writing code wasn’t enough for Daniel and why coding is creative 

(22:22) UiPath’s values 

(24:50) Why Daniel returned to Romania

(28:00) Advantages of bootstrapping 

(30:50) Pivoting to become a product company from outsourcing

(33:27) An early password management product that didn’t work out

(34:55) The difficult pivot that led to the product that is UiPath now

(39:10) How the early failures led to the big opportunity 

(41:37) Hitting product market fit 

(43:50) Why Daniel hired misfits, and the characteristics he looked for in hires

(48:32) How Daniel protected UiPath's values and why he plans to renew the commitment

(54:00) The importance of empowering employees at all levels to provide feedback

(57:47) UiPath’s journey to IPO

(1:01:30) Why Eric thinks he didn’t prepare Daniel psychologically for the difficulty of IPO

(1:03:46) Synthetic volatility’s human cost 

(1:07:01) Why Daniel stepped down as CEO and why he’s resuming CEO duties

(1:11:55) Daniel’s second stint as CEO: hiring people he likes and going all in on agentic AI

(1:18:20) The promise of open source

(1:19:24) Daniel’s thoughts on the future of work 

(1:24:36) Lightning round 

—

You can find the transcript and references at⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

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Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I’m joined by Alyssa Ravasio, CEO and Founder of Hipcamp. Hipcamp is the platform that has revolutionized camping, with a mission to “get more people outside.” By making it easier for people to find camping on public lands—and then expanding to include private lands—Hipcamp significantly increased the supply of camping spots, making the outdoors more accessible to all.

In our conversation, Alyssa shares how her childhood fostered a deep love of nature, and how missed opportunities ultimately led her to become a founder. We dive into Hipcamp’s mission and discuss how staying true to it has been key to the company’s success. We talk about the following: 

• How a rejection led Alyssa to create her own major, Digital Democracy

• The early experiences that shaped Alyssa’s respect for nature

• The problem Alyssa set out to solve when she started California Camping (now Hipcamp)

• Why Alyssa took a coding bootcamp and the early days of bootstrapping Hipcamp

• How Hipcamp expanded the supply of camping by opening up private lands

• Hipcamp’s many value-enforcing practices, including tying performance reviews to values

• The power of direct feedback, and why Hipcamp seeks diverse perspectives 

• The practice of treating the business as an ecosystem 

• And much more!

—

Brought to you by:

• Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠Save $1,000 today⁠.

• Wilson Sonsini – Wilson Sonsini is the innovation economy’s law firm. Learn more.

—

Where to find Alyssa Ravasio:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alyssa-ravasio-23114717/

• X: https://x.com/alyraz

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(02:28) Alyssa’s entrepreneurship journey

(03:40) Alyssa’s outdoorsy upbringing that fueled her desire to democratize outdoor access

(06:30) How film school rejection led Alyssa to design her own major at UCLA

(10:20) Alyssa’s philosophy of using technology for good

(13:40) Learnings from Alyssa’s first two startups

(16:05) How Alyssa prioritizes Hipcamp’s mission with her employees

(19:20) Hipcamp’s hiring process 

(20:24) How California Camping became Hipcamp

(21:47) The initial idea behind California Camping

(24:52) How Alyssa dealt with naysayers in the early days of building Hipcamp

(28:00) How solving a customer’s problem on Twitter drew Alyssa’s first investor

(31:22) The early days of bootstrapping Hipcamp

(36:40) The power of a shared vision 

(38:07) Overcoming scarcity in outdoor spaces by adding private lands

(42:15) Why the business model of Hipcamp is a win-win for all 

(47:10) Systems and cultural practices that keep Hipcamp aligned with its mission and values

(54:15) A case for bringing teams together in nature 

(56:50) The current state of Hipcamp

(59:42) How Hipcamp might scale impact with a fund in the future 

(1:03:15) The practice of treating the business like an ecosystem 

(1:10:14) Why a positive-impact business is also good business 

(1:12:41) Alyssa’s thoughts on AI, and how Hipcamp plans on utilizing it

(1:17:03) Lightning round

—

You can find the transcript and references at⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

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Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In today’s episode of The Eric Ries Show, I’m joined by Gagan Biyani, Co-Founder and CEO of Maven, a platform that’s redefining online education with cohort-based courses. Before Maven, Gagan co-founded Udemy, now one of the largest online education marketplaces, and Sprig, a meal delivery startup.

Gagan started his entrepreneurial journey at just 21, and along the way, he’s experienced both big wins and tough lessons. We get into what worked, what didn’t, and how those experiences shaped his approach to building companies today.

In our conversation today, we talk about the following:

• How a free truffle at Sprig revealed the pitfalls of MBA-style thinking

• Why Gagan has shifted his thinking to be less metric-obsessed

• The underestimated value of intuition in decision-making

• Maintaining company culture at scale—onboarding new hires while preserving core values

• What drives value in any marketplace

• Lessons from Gagan’s exit from Udemy—and how he rebuilt his friendship with his co-founder

• How to use AI to increase productivity and where it falls short

• An explanation of Gagan’s concept of ‘atomic unit’

• AI’s potential to transform education

• And more!

—

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• Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. Save $1,000 today.

• Gusto – Gusto is an easy payroll and benefits software built for small businesses. ⁠⁠Get 3 months free⁠⁠.

• Runway – The finance platform you don’t hate. Learn more.

—

Where to find Gagan Biyani:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/gaganbiyani/

• X: https://x.com/gaganbiyani

• Website: https://www.gaganbiyani.com/

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(03:06) MBA thinking and how taking away the free truffle impacted Sprig

(13:35) Different types of trust in different industries 

(19:19) How to preserve trust while balancing business costs

(26:21) How Maven’s internal processes, once ideal, needed to evolve with growth

(30:40) Why investing time in new hires is key to embedding company culture

(32:10) Gagan’s entrepreneurship journey

(35:00) The value of intuition 

(37:40) Early insights at Udemy that led to the shift toward video-recorded courses

(46:52) Thoughts on failure

(49:40) How to build a successful marketplace 

(54:42) Gagan’s exit from Udemy

(1:03:01) Why Gagan founded Maven and an explanation of cohort-based education 

(1:07:05) The difference between Maven and Udemy and how Maven is doing now

(1:13:12) Why AI is overhyped—but still very useful 

(1:16:02) The future of AI in education

(1:22:36) Lightning round

—

You can find the transcript and references at⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In today’s episode ofThe Eric Ries Show, I am joined by Luis von Ahn, CEO and co-founder of Duolingo. 

With Duolingo, his mission was simple: make language learning accessible to everyone—not to build a for-profit company. Fast forward to today, and Duolingo has grown into a $17 billion business with a reported 90% of the online daily active users in the language learning market. 

In our conversation today, we discuss the following topics: 

• How hiring an intern led to Duolingo’s viral mascot 

• Duolingo’s revenue strategy that helped their stock be up over 100% in the past year

• How only 10% of users pay but make about 30% of the revenue in the education app category

• The newly published Duolingo Handbook and its critical role within the company

• How turning learning into a game changed everything 

• Why Duolingo spent the first five years focusing on improving retention 

• Duolingo’s unique approach to experimentation and how to apply it 

• Why Duolingo isn’t focused on market investors but on building a 100-year company 

• And much more!

—

Brought to you by:

• Wilson Sonsini – Wilson Sonsini is the innovation economy’s law firm.Learn more.

—

Where to find Luis von Ahn:

• LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/luis-von-ahn-duolingo/

• X:https://x.com/luisvonahn

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube:⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(03:10) How Duolingo’s passive-aggressive mascot, Duo, became an internet sensation

(09:21) Why Luis took a chance on the Duo campaign—despite his doubts

(11:30) Take the long view: Duolingo’s principle to build a lasting brand

(12:52) Duolingo’s commitment to excellence 

(14:54) Luis’s journey to entrepreneurship 

(18:28) Luis’s MacArthur Fellowship “genius” award 

(20:13) The inspiration behind Duolingo’s mission and how they stay in alignment with it

(26:16) Early learnings that shaped Duolingo into a fun product 

(29:14) How Duolingo gained an edge over Rosetta Stone

(32:45) How a company with no revenue can be worth a billion dollars 

(33:10) The VC who pushed Luis and Severin to monetize 

(36:05) How Duolingo stays focused on long-term sustainability 

(40:12) A mistake Duolingo made by focusing on the quarter rather than long term 

(42:15) The importance of trust and “the cultural bank”

(44:11) Duo class shares and ways Duolingo resists hyper-monetization 

(46:30) A case for staying under-monetized 

(48:23) Why Duolingo wrote a handbook, and the process of creating it

(54:00) The cadence of evaluating the relevance of the handbook 

(55:01) Eric’s “two-way reviews” 

(58:34) An explanation of Duolingo’s “green machine” 

(1:01:42) Product reviews and a/b testing at Duolingo 

(1:06:32) Why Duolingo takes a stance against MVPs in their handbook

(1:10:07) How Duolingo’s v1 meets Eric’s definition of MVP

(1:11:45) Duolingo’s early strategy focused on retention 

(1:16:22) Duolingo’s testing philosophy 

(1:18:13) Lightning round

—

You can find the transcript and references at⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

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Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I sit down with Craig Newmark, the founder of Craigslist—one of the internet’s most influential platforms. Despite its massive impact, Craigslist has remained intentionally minimalist, resisting the hyper-monetization strategies common in tech.

Craig attributes his success to being in the right place at the right time, but his story reveals a deeper truth: a steadfast commitment to his values. We discuss how his moral compass shaped Craigslist, his approach to business sustainability, and his perspective on ethical entrepreneurship.

In this episode, we cover:

• The origins of Craigslist as a simple email newsletter

• Why Craig resisted aggressive monetization and focused on community impact

• The market research behind Craigslist’s minimal fees

• How Craigslist maintained its mission even after Craig stepped back from leadership

• Craig’s thoughts on AI, cybersecurity, and the future of journalism

• How Craig’s strong relationship with customers kept him aligned with his values

• Craig’s philanthropic work

• Craig’s advice for new founders

• And more!

—

Brought to you by:

Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Get $1,000 off⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

• Gusto – Gusto is an easy payroll and benefits software built for small businesses. ⁠Get 3 months free⁠.

Runway – The finance platform you don’t hate. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

—

Where to find Craig Newmark:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/craignewmark/

• X: https://x.com/craignewmark

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(03:06) The origins of Craigslist 

(12:20) Why Craig used email in the beginning

(14:03) Lessons from Sunday school that shaped Craig’s moral compass 

(15:34) How Craigslist promoted community 

(17:42) Craig’s resistance to the allure of maximum monetization

(19:44) Why Craigslist became a private business, rather than a non-profit 

(24:15) How monetization works at Craigslist 

(27:11) Why Craigslist doesn’t need to drive engagement the way social media sites do

(30:54) The size and scale of Craigslist

(31:47) Current threats in cybersecurity 

(33:44) How Craig became interested in cybersecurity 

(35:34) How Craigslist maintained mission alignment after Craig left management 

(40:54) Craig’s perspective on contentment and why he’s remained fulfilled

(42:25) Advice for aspiring world-changers

(47:56) Craig’s thoughts on AI 

(51:08) Craig’s philanthropic work with journalism 

(53:24) Problems in journalism today

(54:37) Craig’s involvement with Donors Choose

(57:14) Craig’s pigeon rescue work

(58:58) Advice for new founders 

(1:01:02) The importance of staying close to the customer

(1:05:03) The case for avoiding exploitation 

(1:07:16) Lightning round

—

You can find the transcript and references at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I’m joined by Amir Nathoo, Co-Founder and CEO of Outschool, an education platform offering live online classes for K-12 learners. Amir’s own childhood inspired Outschool—while he went to traditional schools, his parents always encouraged his self-driven coding projects at home.

Outschool is about empowering kids to take control of their learning and building a lifelong love for education. It’s a mission-driven company that’s impacting how we think about education and social change.

In today’s conversation, we explore the intersection of business and social good and why education needs disruption. We talk about the following topics: 

• Amir’s thoughts on AI’s role in education 

• How maximizing profit and benefiting society can go hand in hand

• The value of allowing children to pursue their interests 

• Why engagement is the number one metric at Outschool

• What Amir learned from the secular homeschool movement

• How traditional investors sometimes hold back disruption and why that’s a problem

• And more!

—

Brought to you by:

Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Get $1,000 off⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

—

Where to find Amir Nathoo:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amirnathoo/

• X: https://x.com/amirnathoo

• Website: https://amir.io/

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(02:58) Outschool’s launch at the height of the pandemic 

(03:38) What a fiscal sponsorship and Outschool’s relationship with the Edward Charles Foundation

(05:18) Why Amir is thinking of having kids on his board

(07:40) How the pandemic was a critical moment for Outschool to launch their non-profit 

(10:00) A case for tying for-profit with social missions 

(17:56) Why younger generations value purpose-driven brands

(20:27) Outschool’s mission-tied metrics and why Amir is against double bottom lines 

(23:10) Amir’s early experiences coding 

(24:50) How Amir came up with the idea of Outschool

(28:52) How secular homeschooling inspired Outschool’s direction

(31:22) Why engagement became Outschool’s biggest metric and guided their mission

(36:55) What Amir learned from homeschoolers’ dynamic education journeys 

(44:00) How systemic deficits are driving changes in education

(46:40) How Outschool supports diverse educational perspectives

(50:10) Outschool’s first value: stand with learner

(52:38) Outschool’s unique structure and how they keep employees tied to the mission

(54:45) The case for truth and open-mindedness in business leadership

(58:06) Eric’s bad experience working with an unscrupulous leader 

(1:02:00) Amir’s thoughts on disruption 

(1:05:08) The role of alignment in Outschool’s positive investor relationships

(1:08:31) The value of human-to-human interaction and AI’s role in education 

(1:12:50) Amir’s thoughts on using AI to write an essay

(1:13:41) Lightning round

—

You can find the transcript and references at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I’m joined by Emil Eifrem, Co-Founder and CEO of Neo4j, an open-source graph database. Neo4j enables organizations to unlock the business value of connections, influences, and relationships in data. 

In our conversation today, we talk about the following topics: 

• The origin story of Neo4j and why they chose open source

• Open source as a means of production vs. distribution

• How open source fosters trust and transparency

• The pros and cons of doing business in the US 

• Why Neo4j updated their values and changed their stance on military contracts 

• What a Leader’s Guide is and how it keeps companies tied to their mission 

• The challenges of implementing AI 

• An explanation of RAG information retrieval and how it relates to LLMs 

• And more! 

—

Brought to you by:

Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠⁠⁠⁠Get $1,000 off⁠⁠⁠⁠.

• Gusto – Gusto is an easy payroll and benefits software built for small businesses. Get 3 months free.

Runway – The finance platform you don’t hate. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

—

Where to find Emil Eifrem:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/emileifrem/

• X: https://x.com/emileifrem

—

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(01:42) How Eric and Emil got connected 

(07:35) The origin story of Neo4j

(13:38) Why Emil went with an open-source model

(20:25) The benefits of being open source as a means of distribution 

(25:07) Why Emil has no regrets about going open-source 

(26:50) How open source builds trust

(30:33) The difference in doing business in the US vs. Sweden 

(35:34) How Neo4j got to product market fit and early struggles

(38:30) Why Neo4j declined the GSA schedule and why it was a mistake 

(46:22) Emil’s thoughts on changing his position, reworking values, and recommitting 

(51:40) Eric’s advice to avoid mission drift: A leader’s guide, and a two-way review

(1:00:04) The challenge of implementing AI—and the possibility of massive opportunity 

(1:09:20) How Neo4j successfully implemented AI 

(1:11:55) An explanation of IR (information retrieval) and how it’s relevant to AI 

(1:22:44) What gives us trust in the AI system

—

You can find the transcript and references at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I’m joined by Iman Abuzeid, the co-founder and CEO of Incredible Health, a platform transforming how healthcare systems hire nurses.

After earning an MD, Iman pivoted to business and technology. She spent some time working in New York before enrolling at The Wharton School, where she earned her MBA. After graduating, she moved to Silicon Valley and worked as a product manager at AliveCor, where she met her future co-founder. Together, they launched Incredible Health, a company now valued at $1.65 billion.

In our conversation today, we talk about the following topics: 

• Why Iman chose a different way to apply her medical school training 

• The unique insights gained from NFX’s accelerator program 

• Incredible Health’s purpose and its downstream effects on quality of care

• The evolution of Incredible Health’s MVP

• The focus on profitability from day one

• How to commit to your values 

• The importance of vetting investors 

• How Incredible Health has implemented AI

• How Amazon’s single-threaded model inspires the way Incredible Health prioritizes

• And more! 

—

Brought to you by:

Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠⁠⁠Get $1,000 off⁠⁠⁠.

Runway – The finance platform you don’t hate. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

—

Where to find Iman Abuzeid: 

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/imanabuzeid/
• X: https://x.com/imanabuzeid

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Intro

(01:52) An overview of Incredible Health

(02:48) Why Iman started Incredible Health

(05:22) Why Iman went to medical school but decided not to practice clinical medicine

(06:42) How Iman got into software 

(08:01) Iman’s background and why she is drawn to entrepreneurship

(09:19) Why Roman and Iman left AliveCor to start their own company

(11:00) How the partners at NFX helped Roman and Iman transform their original vision

(15:55) James Joaquin's vision of "world positive" and how Incredible Health embodies it

(18:15) Balancing the lofty mission of quality care with financial goals

(20:20) The reasons for labor shortages in the healthcare industry

(22:20) The tools Incredible Health has to help nurses manage their careers

(23:18) What the MVP of Incredible Health looked like 

(26:00) Some statistics around the current size of Incredible Health

(26:43) The values that Iman leaned into to overcome many difficult obstacles 

(29:22) How Iman has created so much value with a small team 

(31:49) Early decisions made that led to high impact and high growth 

(33:34) The world positive term sheet and how Incredible Health clarified its values

(36:51) The three ways Incredible Health implements values 

(38:30) Eric’s culture bank and leader’s guide 

(39:50) Anecdotes from Incredible Health that illustrate customer obsession, speed, and 

(43:41) How the pandemic impacted Incredible Health

(46:25) How Incredible Health upholds values and ensures accountability

(49:00) Protecting the culture from outside sources

(52:38) The future of product strategy and growth strategy at Incredible Health

(55:21) Learnings from implementing AI

(57:45) Building and retaining trust on both sides of the marketplace

(1:02:23) The importance of neutrality with all employers 

(1:04:25) Prioritization and community standards 

(1:08:15) The company as a whole vs. individual contribution 

(1:11:24) Lightning round 

You can find the transcript and references at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

In this episode of The Eric Ries Show, I’m joined by Siqi Chen, a four-time founder and the CEO and CFO of his latest venture, Runway. Runway offers a modern, user-friendly platform for financial modeling, headcount planning, and departmental budgeting—proudly branding itself as “the finance platform your team doesn’t hate.” With its distinctive marketing and brand-building approach, Runway has garnered significant attention. (Full disclosure: I’m an investor in the company.)

Siqi and I discuss his journey from building some of the most viral social games in Silicon Valley to founding Runway. We also delve into the challenges faced by technical founders, the art of viewing a business as a product, and how Siqi has sharpened his strategic thinking. Other key topics include:

• Lessons from founding Serious Business

• Critiques of Zynga’s strategy and the story of selling to them

• Practical advice for building trust

• Insights into Leaders in Tech and Stanford’s GSB program

• The importance of crafting clear, universally understood company values

• An overview of Runway’s platform, mission, and values

• A fresh take on the fallacy of work-life balance

• And so much more!

—

Brought to you by:

Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠⁠Get $1,000 off⁠⁠.

—

Where to find Siqi Chen:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/siqic/

• X: https://x.com/blader/

• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/blader/

• Facebook:  https://www.facebook.com/founder/

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Meet Siqi Chen

(02:30) How Siqi came up with the idea for Mafia and the early years of gaming on Facebook

(05:10) The early investors in Mafia

(05:36) Siqi’s meeting with Keith Rabois and Max Levchin

(08:15) How Siqi was influenced by the Lean Startup approach

(11:04) How quickly Siqi’s career took off after moving to San Francisco 

(11:48) Founding Serious Business and creating Friends for Sale

(14:20) How Serious Business raised $5 million

(16:20) Why Serious Business sold to Zynga 

(17:20) The importance of prioritizing the business as much as the product

(19:11) Siqi’s learnings and advice for new founders 

(23:25) What Siqi learned working at Zynga

(27:18) Siqi’s time running product 

(29:20) Criticisms of Zynga and how they lost Eric’s trust

(33:42) The importance of trust and maintaining vision and mission

(39:15) An overview of Runway 

(44:38) What inspired Siqi to create Runway

(50:43) What Siqi learned from user interviews

(52:07) An example of time wasting inside a company

(53:24) The values at Runway and why they changed 

(58:35) Why you should write reflective values after having a high-performance team

(1:00:40) How Leaders in Tech shaped Siqi’s thoughts on values and building trust

(1:03:13) How open feedback builds trust

(1:08:20) The purpose of Runway

(1:11:34) Siqi’s struggles with strategy planning 

(1:13:31) A top down approach to entrepreneurship and why it’s not common

(1:16:38) The importance of employees understanding their contributions and impact 

(1:18:55) How Runway leverages AI 

(1:22:12) Runway’s dramatic launch with a timed lock

(1:23:04) How Runway communicates value to customers 

(1:24:54) Runway’s process for brand building and high-quality design 

(1:28:40) Lightning round

You can find the transcript and references at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.

Rodney Brooks has spent his entire life at the intersection of robotics, computers, and AI. When the Roomba vacuum cleaner launched in 2002, his company, iRobot, brought all three into millions of people’s homes.

iRobot had already succeeded with robots for space exploration, mine detection, search missions, and military applications. However, after the Roomba came out, it went public with a valuation of $600 million. By then, Rodney had been working on AI and robots for decades alongside the original creators of AI at Stanford and MIT. On today’s episode, we discuss:

—

Brought to you by:

Vanta – Automate compliance, manage risk, and prove trust—continuously. ⁠Get $1,000 off⁠.

Runway – The finance platform you don’t hate. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Learn more⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

—

Where to find Rodney Brooks:

• Website: https://people.csail.mit.edu/brooks/ 

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rodney-brooks-1a137517 

• Bluesky: https://bsky.app/profile/rodneyabrooks.bsky.social 

• X: https://x.com/rodneyabrooks

Where to find Eric:

• Newsletter: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericries.carrd.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• Podcast: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

• YouTube: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.youtube.com/@theericriesshow⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

—

In This Episode We Cover:

(00:00) Welcome to the Eric Ries Show

(03:00) Taking iRobot public

(04:33) The change in company culture from private to public

(06:14) Rodney’s upbringing in Australia and early experiments with computers, robots, and mathematics

(7:19) The era of the computer operator

(9:37) Rodney’s arrival at Stanford in 1977 and move to MIT, at the dawn of AI

(11:05) His relationships with the creators of AI

(12:15) What innovators of AI and general intelligence thought they were creating at the time

(13:17) Rodney’s first AI startup, Lucid

(14:52) What Rodney learned about building startups from the experience

(18:31) Starting Light Robot, the space exploration company that eventually became iRobot

(21:29) The fourteen business models on the road to success, including toys

(26:03) The pivot to vacuums

(29:04) Learning about the minutiae of mass production

(34:43) Rodney’s thoughts on the relationship between consumers and the people who make goods

(38:08) Making robots that don’t take away human agency

(40:57) Building a trustworthy robotics company

(43:56) Balancing low-cost and reliable products

(47:00) RobustAI, Rodney’s new company

(51:54) The demand and need for warehouse robots

(53:39) Building robots that work with people rather than against them

(58:20) Talking to warehouse workers for insight into building robots

(59:20) Building startups with a high degree of difficulty

(1:05:29) The advantages of ambition

(1:08:03) Predicting the patterns of technology

(1:11:23) The role of luck in entrepreneurship

(1:12:30) Rodney’s thoughts on the current hype around AI and machine learning

(1:15:34) Rodney’s advice for today’s builders

(1:16:28) Lightning round

You can find the transcript and references at ⁠⁠⁠⁠https://www.ericriesshow.com/⁠⁠⁠

—

Production and marketing by ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://penname.co/⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠.

Eric may be an investor in the companies discussed.