Aircraft maintenance technicians keep every plane in the sky — and half are about to retire. John Goglia, former NTSB board member, on what's at stake for aviation safety.

United Airlines alone has 14,000 mechanics. Within five years, roughly half will be eligible for retirement. That's 7,000 highly skilled aircraft maintenance technicians — gone. The pipeline to replace them is dangerously thin, and the average airline mechanic today is approaching 60 years old. The workforce shortage that began after 9/11 never fully recovered — and what happens next could push maintenance work out of the country entirely.

John Goglia spent decades on the hangar floor before being appointed to the National Transportation Safety Board by the President of the United States and confirmed by the U.S. Senate. He's the founder of the Aerospace Maintenance Competition (AMC) — the largest hands-on competition for aviation maintenance students in the world — and president of PAMA, the Professional Aviation Maintenance Association.

If you work with your hands, are considering aviation maintenance as a career, or lead a workforce in the trades, this conversation reveals what the most underrated skilled trade in America is facing — and why right now is the best time in decades to enter the field.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – The Workforce Time Bomb: United Airlines is set to lose 7,000 mechanics in five years — John breaks down why the shortage that started after 9/11 never fully recovered and what happens if the pipeline doesn't fill.

(00:49) – When the System Fails: From LaGuardia to Washington D.C., John explains how aviation safety culture has shifted from blaming individuals to exposing the systemic failures behind accidents.

(04:38) – 300 Souls and a 20-Minute Clock: What real pressure looks like for an aircraft maintenance technician signing off on a full plane — customer service yelling, pilots watching, and a countdown ticking.

(12:12) – Career Paths and Women in Aviation: The first 30-90 days on the shop floor, why women represent only 2.8% of aviation mechanics, and how the AMC has helped over 150 women land jobs in the field.

(19:10) – Mentors Who Cut Your Safety Wire: John's defining mentors in New York City, how that tough culture shaped him, and how he applies it to a new generation — including what kept him grounded after joining the NTSB.

(22:46) – The Challenge Coin and the Competition: The story behind the AMC challenge coin, what it means to the students who earn it, and why organic mentorship is breaking out across hangar floors without anyone being asked.

Key Takeaways

The aviation maintenance workforce crisis is more urgent than most people realize — with the average airline mechanic approaching age 60, a wave of retirements could push maintenance work overseas if the pipeline isn't rebuilt now.

Aviation safety culture has fundamentally shifted from blaming the individual to examining the system — the LaGuardia and D.C. crashes both reveal how management decisions, staffing, and institutional failures set workers up to make mistakes.

An A&P (aircraft and powerplant) certificate opens doors far beyond airlines — Burlington Northern Railroad, Disney World, Six Flags, and the drone industry all actively recruit A&P-certified mechanics because their foundational skills in hydraulics, electronics, and pneumatics are universally valuable.

Mentorship in aviation maintenance is still largely informal and peer-driven — and closing that gap is exactly what John Goglia is working on through the Aerospace Maintenance Competition, PAMA, and a new podcast built specifically for the next generation of mechanics.

About the Guest

John Goglia is a former member of the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), appointed by the President of the United States and confirmed by the U.S. Senate. He began his career as a line mechanic in New York City, working at Allegheny Airlines (later US Air), and spent decades on the hangar floor before rising to become one of the nation's most recognized aviation safety authorities.

John is the founder of the Aerospace Maintenance Competition (AMC), the world's largest hands-on skills competition for aviation maintenance students, drawing teams from across the country and attracting recruiters from United, American, Southwest, Alaska, and Delta. He serves as president of PAMA (Professional Aviation Maintenance Association) and hosts the Flight Safety Detectives podcast.

Keywords

aircraft maintenance technician, aviation mechanic, A&P mechanic, aviation workforce shortage, aviation safety, NTSB, aerospace maintenance, aviation career, airline mechanic, aircraft inspector, John Goglia, Aerospace Maintenance Competition, PAMA, Professional Aviation Maintenance Association, skilled trades careers, aviation training, trades workforce shortage, women in aviation, mentorship in trades, hands-on careers

RESOURCE LINKS

John Goglia on LinkedIn: [Add URL]

Aerospace Maintenance Competition: amc.aero

PAMA (Professional Aviation Maintenance Association): [Add URL]

Contact John directly: 703-597-4502

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Glenda Rahn, Director of Workforce Development at Merit Ontario, reveals why skilled trades companies lose new apprentices in the first 30 days — and what to do about it.

Every contractor says the same thing: "We can't find people." But Glenda Rahn has seen something different on the ground — and it's not a recruitment problem. It's a retention problem. Companies bring in new hires who are excited on day one and then fail to give them what they need to stay: clear expectations, a real mentor, and a reason to belong.

Glenda is the Director of Workforce Development at Merit Ontario, where she works directly with construction contractors and apprentices across Ontario to fix the workforce pipeline from the inside out. She's spent years doing individual coaching calls with candidates, building mentorship frameworks, and having hard conversations with employers about what they're doing wrong — and what actually works.

If you're a contractor struggling to keep new hires, a young person trying to break into the trades, or an industry leader who wants to understand Gen Z on the jobsite, this episode is packed with practical insight you can put to work today.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – The Real Problem Is Retention: Most companies focus on recruitment, but Glenda says the real workforce crisis is what happens after someone gets hired.

(01:45) – Onboarding Breakdown: The first 30 days are make-or-break — here's why new apprentices walk out the back door before they ever hit the 60-day mark.

(03:10) – What Good Mentorship Actually Looks Like: It's not just having a senior person nearby — it's emotional intelligence, clear communication, and the willingness to share knowledge on purpose.

(05:45) – Gen Z vs. Older Generations: Andrew and Glenda dig into whether Gen Z has changed the game, or whether the industry just hasn't caught up to how this generation works.

(12:45) – The Experience Catch-22: Companies say they need people but require 3–5 years of experience. Glenda shares what new entrants like Troy can actually do to break through.

(19:45) – What Contractors Get Completely Wrong About Gen Z: The "lazy" label isn't accurate — and the contractors who believe it are the ones struggling most with retention right now.

Key Takeaways

The workforce shortage is a retention problem first — most companies lose new apprentices within 30 days because onboarding is broken, expectations are unclear, and no one is taking real ownership of mentorship.

A good mentor needs emotional intelligence, not just technical skill — knowing each person by name, checking in during the first 60 to 90 days, and creating a genuine sense of belonging is what separates high-retention companies from those that can't hold anyone.

Gen Z's work ethic hasn't disappeared — it's showing up differently. They're hustling online, building side projects, and demanding purpose and a clear path forward. Contractors who take the time to understand that will keep them; those who don't will keep losing them.

New entrants trying to break into the trades need to stop relying on Indeed and start pounding the pavement — call companies directly, ask who hires entry-level apprentices, volunteer with organizations like Habitat for Humanity to build a track record, and treat networking like 50% of your career depends on it, because it does.

About the Guest

Glenda Rahn is the Director of Workforce Development at Merit Ontario, a leading open-shop contractors association supporting construction employers across Ontario. With a background in apprenticeship programming, career services, and youth workforce development, Glenda works at the intersection of employer needs and candidate readiness — helping companies build better hiring, onboarding, and mentorship practices that actually retain people.

At Merit Ontario, Glenda is developing a group sponsor apprenticeship program that is already achieving 88% retention and on-time completion rates — a result that proves the workforce pipeline can be fixed when the right systems are in place.

Keywords

skilled trades retention, apprentice onboarding, workforce development, trades mentorship, Gen Z in the trades, construction workforce, apprenticeship program, entry-level apprentice, skilled trades career, construction industry retention, workforce pipeline, plumber apprentice, construction contractor, trade school, journeyman mentor, Glenda Rahn, Merit Ontario, Andrew Brown, Lost Art of the Skilled Trades

RESOURCE LINKS

Glenda Rahn on LinkedIn: https://ca.linkedin.com/in/glenda-rahn-99964089

Merit Ontario Website: https://www.meritontario.com

SUPPORT THE SHOW

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Aircraft maintenance technician Bret Oestreich on signing off 250 lives every night shift — and why aviation's most essential trade stays hidden.

Every time you board a plane, someone signed their name to a document saying that aircraft is airworthy. That person is an Aircraft Maintenance Technician — and most passengers never see them, never think about them, and never know they exist. Bret Oestreich, National President of AMFA (Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association), has spent decades inside this world. He started on C-130s in the Air Force, earned his A&P license and pilot's license simultaneously, and worked his way from general aviation to American Airlines to Southwest Airlines before leading one of the most important independent unions in aviation.

AMFA represents over 7,500 AMTs across the United States and Canada — and Bret is sounding the alarm: the pipeline of new technicians is not keeping up with retirements, only 8% of military veterans with relevant experience are transitioning into civilian aviation maintenance, and women represent just 2.8% of the AMT workforce. Meanwhile, the job demands more than most people realize — technical knowledge, soft skills, and the integrity to do the right thing at 3am when nobody's watching.

If you're a young person who's never heard of this career, a veteran unsure how to translate your skills, or anyone who wants to understand what it actually takes to keep planes flying — this episode is for you.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – The Invisible Workforce: Why aircraft maintenance technicians are the most essential people on the tarmac that nobody ever sees — and why that invisibility is the industry's biggest recruitment problem.

(01:00) – Soft Skills vs. Tech Skills: What Bret says new AMTs are most unprepared for, why Gen Z's lack of hands-on mechanical experience is a real challenge, and why humility matters more than technical knowledge on day one.

(04:35) – The Visibility Problem: How AMFA is trying to reach younger generations through grade school events, aviation days, and votech programs — and why you can't wait until high school to plant the seed.

(09:15) – Bret's Career Story: From working on rusted leaf springs in Minnesota to C-130s in the Air Force, then general aviation, American Airlines, and Southwest — how Bret built a career no one told him was possible.

(12:41) – The Military-to-AMT Pipeline: Why only 8% of vets with aviation maintenance experience transition into civilian AMT roles, what the SkillBridge program is doing to help, and why earning the A&P license requires planning two years before separation — not six months.

(30:08) – Knowledge, Skill, Integrity: What it's actually like to sign off on a commercial aircraft at 3am under pressure from the airline, and why AMFA's three-word code is the only thing standing between corner-cutting and catastrophe.

Key Takeaways

Aircraft maintenance technicians are invisible by design — passengers see pilots and flight attendants, but AMTs work overnight while planes are grounded, which is exactly why awareness campaigns have to start in grade school, not high school.

Only 8% of military veterans with aviation maintenance experience transition into civilian AMT careers — largely because no one tells them how, and the A&P licensing process requires proactive planning at least two years before leaving the military.

When AMTs are surveyed about what they want from employers, pay ranks first — but quality of life, scheduling flexibility, and culture follow close behind, and many workers say they'll accept less pay for more respect and control over their schedule.

AMFA's guiding principle — knowledge, skill, integrity — means doing the job right even when the airline is pushing for a faster turnaround and no one is watching, because the person who signs off on that aircraft is personally accountable for every passenger on board.

About the Guest

Bret Oestreich is the National President of AMFA, the Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association — the only independent craft union in North America exclusively representing aircraft maintenance technicians. AMFA represents approximately 5,500 AMTs at U.S. carriers including Southwest Airlines, Alaska Airlines, Horizon Airlines, Spirit, and Sun Country, and recently expanded into Canada with over 2,000 members at carriers including WestJet and Jazz.

Bret's career as an AMT began in the U.S. Air Force, where he worked on C-130 cargo and special operations aircraft as both a crew chief and technician. He later earned his Airframe and Powerplant (A&P) license and private pilot certificate simultaneously before moving into general aviation and commercial aviation at American Airlines and Southwest Airlines. Under his leadership, AMFA has grown from 4,000 to 7,500+ members and made history as the only trade union certified for aircraft maintenance engineers in Canada.

Keywords

aircraft maintenance technician, AMT career, aviation maintenance, airframe and powerplant license, A&P license, aircraft mechanic, aviation workforce shortage, AMFA, Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association, Bret Oestreich, SkillBridge program, military to civilian transition, skilled trades aviation, aviation mechanic salary, Gen Z skilled trades, votech aviation, aviation industry careers, aircraft mechanic jobs, aviation apprenticeship, Andrew Brown, The Lost Art of the Skilled Trades

RESOURCE LINKS

Bret Oestreich on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bret-oestreich-ba41b550

AMFA National Website: https://www.amfanational.org

AMFA Delivers: https://amfadelivers.org

SUPPORT THE SHOW

If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

Liam McComas is 25, works in construction, and believes Gen Z owes it to themselves—and the trades—to earn trust before expecting it.

Most content about Gen Z in the workforce falls into one of two camps: either the younger generation doesn't want to work, or companies need to change everything to keep them around. Liam McComas rejects both. At 25 and two years into his career as a project engineer at Neumann Brothers in Des Moines, Iowa, he's made a choice most people his age won't: the responsibility for earning trust on the job site belongs to the younger generation first.

Liam grew up playing football from third grade through college at the University of Northern Iowa, trained by old-school, hard-nosed coaches who taught him that if you don't know the play, that's on you. That foundation—control what you can control, be coachable, show up prepared—is exactly what he carries onto the job site every day.

If you're a young tradesman, apprentice, or project engineer trying to figure out how to earn respect faster, or if you lead a team and want to understand what separates the ones who make it from the ones who quit, this episode is for you.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – Introduction & Guest Background: Liam McComas joins the show fresh off a conversation at the Master Builders of Iowa conference, where his perspective on Gen Z accountability turned heads in the room.

(04:00) – How Athletics Built the Foundation: Liam explains how football under hard-nosed coaches taught him the single mindset that transfers directly to the trades: control what you can control, or it controls you.

(09:00) – What Gen Z Gets Wrong About Earning Trust: Younger workers want results now—but tradesmen can see through the ones who talk more than they deliver, and the credibility gap opens fast.

(15:00) – How to Take Work Off Your PM's Plate: The practical moves Liam made in year one—meeting minutes, submittals, file systems, being ready for the conversation before anyone asks—and why that earns trust faster than anything else.

(22:00) – The Musco Lighting Story: How running closeout on a major commercial project in his first year—hundreds of submittals, warranties, product data—taught Liam what it actually means to earn a senior PM's confidence.

(29:00) – Instant Gratification vs. Delayed Gratification: Why the "I did one good thing, where's my respect?" mindset is the fastest way to lose the room—and what Liam tells himself when the recognition doesn't come.

Key Takeaways

Tradesmen can't be fooled—if you're the talkative one who doesn't do the work, they'll see through you immediately, and you'll lose credibility before you've even had a chance to build it.

Earning trust starts with one question: what can I do to take work off my PM's plate? Be prepared before you're asked, not after—that's what separates the ones who get trusted with more from the ones who stall out.

Instant gratification is the single biggest threat to a young tradesman's career—you will not get a pat on the back every time you hang conduit, and expecting one is a sign you're not ready for what the trades actually demand.

If you're starting tomorrow: show up, know you were hired for a reason, ask questions freely, and understand that the foreman who speaks bluntly to you today had someone speak twice as bluntly to them—it's not personal, it's the trades.

About the Guest

Liam McComas is a Project Engineer at Neumann Brothers, a commercial construction and historic restoration firm based in Des Moines, Iowa. He studied Construction Management at the University of Northern Iowa, where he also played football for four and a half years. Two years into his career, he's already led complex project closeouts and earned a reputation for being exactly the kind of young professional the trades need more of.

Liam brings an athlete's accountability to the job site—owning mistakes, staying prepared, and building trust through consistent action rather than words. He met Andrew at the Master Builders of Iowa conference, where his take on Gen Z responsibility in the workforce sparked a conversation that resonated far beyond the room.

Keywords

Gen Z in the trades, earning trust on the job site, skilled trades career, construction career advice, young tradesman, project engineer construction, trades workforce, coachability in construction, skilled trades workforce, generational gap in construction, construction onboarding, trades mentorship, Liam McComas, Neumann Brothers, Andrew Brown, Lost Art of the Skilled Trades, Master Builders of Iowa, workforce development, delayed gratification, Gen Z work ethic, trades accountability

RESOURCE LINKS

Liam McComas on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/liam-mccomas/

Liam McComas on Instagram: @liam_mccomas

Neumann Brothers Website: https://www.neumannbros.com/

SUPPORT THE SHOW

If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

Aircraft maintenance technician Evie Garces climbed from Aviation High School to VP at American Airlines — now she's recruiting the next generation.

A mother chaperoning a hangar tour at American Airlines started to cry. Her son wasn't "college material," she said. She thought military was his only option — until she walked into that hangar and discovered the A&P license. That moment is why Evie Garces spends her weekends, evenings, and every spare hour making sure more families know this career exists.

Evita "Evie" Garces is Vice President of Line Maintenance at American Airlines, where she oversees the airworthiness of more than 1,000 aircraft and leads 10,000 aviation maintenance technicians across the country. She is the first woman to hold this role at American Airlines — and the first woman named as American's FAA-certificated Director of Maintenance. She grew up in New York City with no aviation background, discovered the field at 13 through a high school catalog, and spent 27 years building her career from the floor up.

This episode is for anyone who works with their hands, anyone looking for a trade career that pays six figures without a four-year degree, and every parent who's never heard of an A&P license. Evie breaks down exactly how to get in, what it takes to stay, and why the people who sign off your flight are the most important workers you've never heard of.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – Introduction: Evie explains her role overseeing maintenance for a 300-destination airline and what it means to depend on A&P mechanics worldwide.

(01:44) – Origin Story: How a 13-year-old girl from New York City found a high school catalog, saw the words "airframe and powerplant," and chose a path that would define her life — without any aviation background at all.

(05:38) – The A&P Certification: The three-phase FAA testing process — written, oral, and practical — and the real reasons students make it through the curriculum but never get licensed.

(08:56) – Night Shifts and High Stakes: What it actually feels like to work the overnight shift, sign off an aircraft carrying hundreds of passengers, and carry the weight of that responsibility every night.

(13:00) – From Floor to VP: The mentor at LaGuardia who nominated Evie for a managing director role in Chicago at 27 without her ever applying — and what she had to learn fast when she got the job.

(19:50) – Making More Evies: Why engaging parents and PTAs — not just students — is the missing piece in aviation's workforce pipeline, and the story of a mother who cried in the hangar when she realized her son had options.

Key Takeaways

An A&P license costs $40–50K and can be earned in under two years — and aviation maintenance technicians at major airlines start at six figures, no four-year degree required.

Women make up less than 3% of aircraft maintenance technicians, and Evie argues that lasting change requires women to first reach positions of power — you can't lift others until you've climbed high enough to reach them.

A mentor nominated Evie for a managing director role in Chicago at 27 without her ever applying for the job — the right person believing in you before you believe in yourself can define your entire career trajectory.

The hardest part of becoming an aviation maintenance technician isn't the job — it's surviving the certification process. Once hired at a major airline, the failure rate drops dramatically. The A&P is the real filter.

About the Guest

Evita "Evie" Garces is Vice President of Line Maintenance at American Airlines, where she oversees the airworthiness of more than 1,000 aircraft and manages 10,000 aviation maintenance technicians. She is the first woman to hold this role at American Airlines and the first woman named as American's FAA-certificated Director of Maintenance. Evie holds an MBA from Northwestern University and spent 27 years building her career from aviation maintenance technician at JFK International to the executive suite.

Evie founded FACES (Female AMTs Connecting for Empowerment and Support) at American Airlines to recruit, connect, and mentor women in aviation maintenance. She serves on the board of a Dallas charter school and regularly opens American's hangars to students, Girl Scout troops, and families who have never heard of the A&P career path — because a single high school catalog changed her life, and she believes one conversation can do the same for someone else.

Keywords

aircraft maintenance technician, A&P mechanic, aviation maintenance, AMT career, airframe and powerplant license, skilled trades careers, aviation careers, trade school vs college, FAA certification, six figure trade jobs, aviation maintenance salary, Evie Garces, Evita Garces, American Airlines, FACES American Airlines, Women in Aviation, AWAM, Aviation High School New York, aircraft mechanic, MRO, line maintenance, aviation workforce, skilled trades workforce

RESOURCE LINKS

• Evie Garces on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/evita-garces-98917b10/
• American Airlines: americanairlines.com
• Women in Aviation International: wai.org
• AWAM (Association for Women in Aviation Maintenance): awam.org

SUPPORT THE SHOW

If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

Rob Holmes co-founded ForgeNow to solve America's skilled trades shortage — producing apprentice-level HVAC, electrical, and plumbing technicians in just 6 weeks.

The average plumber in Texas is 54 years old. The average electrician is 60. Within 10 years, 50% of today's tradespeople will be on social security. And nobody's talking about it. Rob Holmes is. His answer is ForgeNow — a military-style trades training school in Dallas that runs a full-time, hands-on program Monday through Friday, 7 a.m. to 3:30 p.m., and graduates technicians ready to work at apprentice level in six weeks. Starting wage: $25 an hour. Graduation rate: 91% — versus 23% at community colleges.

Rob is the Co-Founder and President of ForgeNow. A West Point graduate and Army veteran, he built ForgeNow on one simple principle borrowed from the military: train how you fight. Over 1,700 graduates have been placed with 250+ employers across 39 states. ForgeNow is a Department of Defense SkillBridge partner and GI Bill-eligible program — and it's now developing specialized electrical training pipelines for the data center boom happening across Texas.

If you know a young person stuck in the gig economy, considering a trade, or trying to avoid $100K in student debt, this episode is the conversation they need to hear. Trades workers, workforce educators, contractors, and parents — this one's for you.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – Introduction: Andrew sets up the ForgeNow model — 6 weeks, $25/hour starting wage, and a 91% graduation rate — then welcomes co-founder Rob Holmes.

(01:34) – The 6-Week Military Training Model: Rob explains how ForgeNow borrowed the military's full-time, immersive, hands-on format to condense two years of on-the-job training into six weeks.

(05:26) – Why ForgeNow Exists: Two foundational assumptions — the bloom is off the rose for college, and legacy trade paths aren't keeping up with contractor demand — and why on-the-job training creates dangerous attrition risks.

(11:03) – 91% vs. 23%: How ForgeNow's short, intense format produces a 91% graduation rate compared to 23% at community colleges, and why the 9% who don't finish almost never fail academically.

(15:09) – Veterans, SkillBridge & Who Thrives: How ForgeNow became one of the largest DoD SkillBridge providers in the country, why 1,000 of 1,700 graduates have been military, and what qualities predict success for non-military candidates.

(24:01) – The Demographic Time Bomb: The average electrician in Texas is 60, 50% of tradespeople hit Social Security in 10 years, and 75% of contractors are for sale — why Rob says young people entering the trades now have no competition for 30 to 40 years, and why "get a trade first" is the best insurance policy anyone can carry.

Key Takeaways

ForgeNow's military-style training model produces apprentice-level technicians in 6 weeks by going full-time, Monday through Friday, 7 a.m. to 3:30 p.m. — the same format and discipline employers expect on day one.

ForgeNow graduates start at an average wage of $25 per hour ($50,000/year) and commonly earn raises at 6 and 12 months — compared to $12/hour for an untrained helper with no clear path forward.

50% of today's skilled tradespeople will be on social security within 10 years, and 75% of contractors are for sale — meaning young people who enter the trades now face almost no competition for the next 30 to 40 years.

The trades are AI-proof, debt-free, and portable — and Rob makes the case that getting a trade first is the best insurance policy a young person can carry, even if college is still in the plan.

About the Guest

Rob Holmes is the Co-Founder and President of ForgeNow, a trades training school headquartered in Dallas, Texas. A graduate of West Point and a U.S. Army veteran, Rob built ForgeNow on the belief that the military's model of full-time, immersive, hands-on training is the most effective way to launch a trades career. Since its first class in 2020, ForgeNow has trained over 1,700 graduates and placed them with more than 250 employers across 39 states.

ForgeNow offers 6-week programs in HVAC, electrical wiring, plumbing, and facilities maintenance. It is a Department of Defense SkillBridge partner and GI Bill-eligible program. Rob and his team are also developing specialized electrical training pipelines to meet explosive demand in the data center sector.

Keywords

skilled trades training, trade school, HVAC training, electrician training, plumbing training, trades workforce, apprenticeship, workforce development, vocational training, career change, trades career, Rob Holmes, ForgeNow, Forge Now, SkillBridge program, GI Bill trades, data center electrician, trades shortage, workforce gap, skilled trades jobs, facilities maintenance, military trades training

RESOURCE LINKS

Rob Holmes on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rob-holmes-554953/

ForgeNow Website: https://forgenow.edu

DoD SkillBridge Program: https://skillbridge.osd.mil

SUPPORT THE SHOW

If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.

Aviation maintenance is booming — and Boeing's Jennifer Radtke says the mechanic shortage now outpaces the pilot shortage for the first time in history.

710,000 aviation technicians will be needed over the next 20 years. Airlines are already experiencing delays from maintenance staffing gaps — and that number is only going to grow. Yet most young people still have no idea this career path exists, what it pays, or how far it can take them. Jennifer Radtke has spent 32 years in aviation, starting as a mechanic and working her way to Functional Chief Engineer at Boeing — a role she didn't even know existed when she started. Her message is simple: the trades are not a fallback. In aviation, they're a launchpad.

Jennifer Radtke is a Director and Functional Chief Engineer for Product Support Engineering at Boeing. With 32 years in the aviation industry — starting on the wrench-turning side of the business — she now leads technical workforce development, mentorship programs, and the engineering pipeline for one of the largest aerospace companies in the world.

If you're in the trades, considering aviation maintenance, or working to build the next generation of skilled workers, this episode is for you. You'll walk away with a clear picture of what this career actually pays, what it can become, and exactly how to navigate it from day one.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – Systems, Safety, and What Makes a Plane Actually Fly: Jennifer explains why aviation maintenance is less about individual parts and more about systems thinking — and why the mechanics who maintain those systems are the unsung backbone of every flight.

(04:00) – Embracing the Suck: What It's Really Like Under Pressure: New aviation mechanics face intense scrutiny with every maintenance delay — Jennifer shares what it takes to build the thick skin required to perform under pressure while keeping safety and integrity at the forefront.

(09:00) – The Mentorship Strategy That Changed Her Career: Jennifer breaks down her approach to mentorship — why she maintains multiple mentors at different levels, asks each of them the same question independently, and never shares their answers with each other.

(16:00) – From a Michigan Garage to Boeing: Why She Chose Aviation: Jennifer grew up in an Italian family in Michigan where everyone worked on cars — she chose aviation specifically because she didn't want to do what everyone else was doing, and a movie called Iron Eagle didn't hurt.

(21:00) – 710,000 Technicians: The Aviation Shortage Crisis Nobody Is Talking About: For the first time in history, the aviation mechanic shortage outpaces the pilot shortage — Jennifer unpacks what 710,000 unfilled technician roles over the next 20 years actually means for flights, airlines, and the industry at large.

(27:00) – From Mechanic to Executive: How Far Can This Career Go?: Jennifer walks through Boeing's technical fellowship pathway — a track that takes you from A&P mechanic all the way to a senior executive role without ever having to manage people, if you don't want to.

Key Takeaways

The aviation mechanic shortage has officially surpassed the pilot shortage — Boeing projects 710,000 technicians will be needed globally over the next 20 years, making this one of the most in-demand skilled trades careers available today.

Mentorship in aviation maintenance works best when you have multiple mentors across different levels — Jennifer's approach is to ask each mentor the same question independently, synthesize the input yourself, and own the final decision without trading their perspectives with each other.

Aviation maintenance careers are not a ceiling — Boeing's technical fellowship program allows a mechanic to advance all the way to a senior executive role through technical expertise alone, with compensation that rivals pilot salaries as the shortage deepens.

The number one mistake Jennifer sees in the next generation of aviation workers is not asking questions out of fear of looking uninformed — removing the fear of failure and asking early is how you save time, build credibility, and accelerate your career from day one.

About the Guest

Jennifer Radtke is a Director and Functional Chief Engineer for Product Support Engineering at Boeing, with 32 years in the aviation industry. She started her career as a licensed mechanic working the flight line before moving into maintenance engineering, technical leadership, and ultimately a functional chief role at one of the world's most recognized aerospace companies.

Jennifer is a leading voice on the aviation technician shortage, next-generation workforce development, and the mentorship practices that help tradespeople build long, fulfilling careers in aviation. She spoke at the AMC Championships, where this episode was recorded live.

Keywords

aviation maintenance careers, aircraft mechanic, aviation mechanic shortage, Boeing careers, aviation technician, A&P certification, airframe and powerplant, skilled trades workforce, mechanic shortage, career pathways in aviation, technical fellowship Boeing, Jennifer Radtke, Boeing, predictive maintenance, next generation trades workers, aviation maintenance technician

RESOURCE LINKS

Jennifer Radtke on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jennifer-radtke-56bb29210

Boeing Careers Website: https://www.boeing.com/careers

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The U.S. needs 320,000 more welders by 2029 — and data centers are accelerating the shortage. UA Training Specialist Bob Derby joins Andrew Brown.

There's a program most people in the trades have never heard of: the UA Welder Finishing School. It takes pipe welders with existing skills — from trade schools, non-union shops, or plant work — and gets them UA-certified and dispatched to a job in 8 weeks or less. At no cost to the individual. Meanwhile, data centers are creating a surge in piping and welding work that shows no sign of slowing. The labor market is wide open — and the UA wants to fill it.

Bob Derby is a UA Training Specialist with nearly 30 years in the United Association of Journeymen and Apprentices of the Plumbing and Pipefitting Industry. He came up through the apprenticeship as a pipe welder, earned his certified welding inspector credentials, became an instructor, and eventually trained UA members across the country as a regional and national instructor. He now leads workforce development efforts and helped build the UA Welder Finishing School program.

If you're a pipe welder working non-union and wondering whether the UA is an option — or a young person trying to figure out how to get in, what to earn, and how far you can go — this episode lays it out clearly and honestly.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – The 320K Welder Shortage: Bob opens with the scale of the workforce gap and explains why the UA is uniquely positioned to solve it — and why now is one of the best times ever to be entering the piping trades.

(05:00) – How to Get Into the UA: The application process starts at UANet.org — no connections required. Bob explains what the interview actually looks like, what sets candidates apart, and what happens if you don't get in the first time.

(12:00) – Wages, Benefits & the 5-Year Apprenticeship: Apprentices typically start at $20–25/hour with healthcare, pension, and 401k contributions from day one — and skilled journeymen can retire with $1.5–2M in their 401k.

(19:00) – Mentorship: The People Who Shape a Career: Bob shares how a gruff journeyman named Al — who didn't want him around — became one of the most important mentors of his life, and what that story reveals about how apprenticeship actually works.

(26:00) – Career Ladder Beyond the Journeyman Card: From foreman to instructor, certified welding inspector, training coordinator, and multi-craft superintendent — Bob traces a career path that started in a town of 643 people and led to teaching UA members across the country.

(35:00) – Data Centers, Prefab Trends & the Welder Finishing School: The data center boom is driving massive demand for pipe welders right now. Bob explains how prefabrication is changing the trade — and breaks down the UA Welder Finishing School, a program that gets experienced pipe welders UA-certified and on a job site in 8 weeks or less.

Key Takeaways

You don't need to know anyone to get into the UA — start at UANet.org, find your local union, and apply. If you don't make it the first time, the door stays open and the local will tell you exactly where you fell short.

UA apprentices start at $20–25/hour with full benefits, pension credits, and 401k contributions from day one — and those who start young can retire with $1.5–2M in their 401k, depending on their local and contract.

We can train aptitude, but we can't train attitude — the most important things an apprentice brings to the interview and the job site are humility and eagerness to learn, not prior experience.

The UA Welder Finishing School is a free, 8-week-or-less program for pipe welders with existing skills who want to get UA-certified and dispatched — including graduates of trade schools like Kentucky Welding Institute who come in test-ready and are often working within two or three weeks.

About the Guest

Bob Derby is a UA Training Specialist with the United Association of Journeymen and Apprentices of the Plumbing and Pipefitting Industry. With nearly 30 years in the UA, he came up through the apprenticeship as a pipe welder, earned his Certified Welding Inspector credentials, became an instructor and training coordinator at his local union, and has taught regional and national courses — including the UA's Authorized Testing Representative and Certified Welding Inspector prep programs — to members across the country.

Bob currently leads workforce development initiatives including the UA Welder Finishing School, a program designed to bring skilled pipe welders from outside the union into UA membership and into the workforce quickly. He is passionate about making the UA's career opportunities visible to the next generation of tradespeople.

Keywords

pipe welding career, UA union welding, pipe welder jobs, welding workforce shortage, united association, UA apprenticeship, journeyman welder, pipe fitter career, welder finishing school, UA certification, ASME welding, apprenticeship application, certified welding inspector, Bob Derby, United Association of Plumbers and Pipefitters, Kentucky Welding Institute, Local 577, UA Training Specialist, pipe fitting career, HVAC trades, plumbing career, data center construction, skilled trades career, welding shortage, Gen Z trades

RESOURCE LINKS

Bob Derby on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/robert-derby/

United Association Website: https://ua.org/

Find Your Local Union: https://uanet.org/

Kentucky Welding Institute: https://kwi.us/

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Aircraft maintenance technician careers start at $75K and climb past six figures — but a 40,000-person shortage is threatening aviation. Rob Cush of AMFA joins Andrew Brown.

By 2028, the aviation industry is expected to hit peak retirements — and the average aircraft maintenance technician is already 56 or 57 years old. The wave is coming. At the same time, new A&P graduates are being poached between school and their first job by oil and gas, because a $500–$1,000 testing cost creates a 60–120 day gap that other industries are happy to fill. The pipeline is leaking at every stage.

Rob Cush is the Director of Government Affairs at AMFA (Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association) and an aircraft maintenance controller at Southwest Airlines. He's spent decades on the floor turning wrenches — and now he takes that firsthand experience directly to Capitol Hill, advocating for workforce funding, veteran transition programs, and pathways to bring more young people and women into aviation maintenance.

If you're a trade-minded person looking for a career that pays well, offers real advancement, and keeps planes in the sky — or if you work in workforce development and want to understand what aviation maintenance needs right now — this episode is for you.

IN THIS EPISODE

(00:00) – The 40,000 Technician Crisis: Rob breaks down the scale of the aircraft maintenance shortage and the retirement wave hitting peak in 2028.

(05:00) – Why Gen Z Is Choosing Oil & Gas: Work-life balance is beating pay — how airlines are rethinking day shift access to compete for new graduates.

(12:00) – The Testing Bottleneck Nobody Talks About: The $500–$1,000 cost of DME oral and practical exams is creating a 60–120 day gap where other industries poach new A&P graduates before they get licensed.

(20:00) – Veterans and Women: The Untapped Pipeline: Only 8.3% of military AMTs continue in civilian aviation, and only 2.8% of technicians are female — and in both cases, awareness is the biggest barrier.

(30:00) – Building the Pipeline Earlier: From Choose Aerospace high school programs to military SkillBridge partnerships, how AMFA is reaching future technicians before they choose a different path.

(38:00) – Career Ladder and Mentorship: Rob's journey from apprentice to Capitol Hill — and why passing on tribal knowledge before the retirement wave hits is the most urgent challenge in the industry.

Key Takeaways

The aircraft maintenance industry is facing a shortage of 40,000 technicians by 2028, driven by a retirement wave among a workforce whose average age is already 56–57.

New A&P graduates are being lost in the gap between finishing school and getting licensed — a $500–$1,000 DME testing cost creates a 60–120 day window where oil and gas steps in and takes them.

Only 8.3% of military veterans with aviation maintenance experience continue into civilian AMT roles — and the primary reason is that most of them didn't know the pathway existed.

Aircraft maintenance careers are far from a dead end: from line mechanic to maintenance control, inspection, management, or government affairs, the ladder is long — and Rob Cush is proof of how far it can go.

About the Guest

Rob Cush is the Director of Government Affairs at AMFA (Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association) and an aircraft maintenance controller at Southwest Airlines. He entered the industry through the Southwest apprenticeship program in 1996, spent 11 years as a line mechanic, and has spent the last two decades in maintenance control. AMFA represents approximately 6,600 technicians across Southwest, Alaska, Hawaiian, Spirit, Sun Country, WestJet, Jazz, and other carriers in the US and Canada.

Rob leads AMFA's advocacy on Capitol Hill, where he helped secure $20 million for aircraft maintenance training in the 2024 FAA reauthorization bill, works to improve veteran transition pathways, and is building awareness programs to bring more women and young people into the A&P pipeline.

Keywords

aircraft maintenance technician, A&P mechanic, aviation workforce shortage, aircraft mechanic career, AMT shortage, A&P license, 147 school, DME testing, oral and practical exam, A&P school, aviation apprenticeship, aircraft maintenance training, aviation career pathway, avionics, Rob Cush, AMFA, Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association, Southwest Airlines, Choose Aerospace, FAA reauthorization 2024, military to civilian aviation, women in aviation, skilled trades career, Gen Z trades

RESOURCE LINKS

Rob Cush on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/rob-cush-55b1a936/

AMFA National Website: https://www.amfanational.org/

SUPPORT THE SHOW

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What are employers actually looking for in the next generation of tradespeople? According to Serenity Satterfield, it’s not just technical skill. It’s confidence, communication, professionalism, and the ability to step up before you feel fully ready.

That is what SkillsUSA is building.

Serenity Satterfield is the SkillsUSA National High School President, and her own story shows why the organization matters. She went from a small chapter in San Bernardino, California, to advocating for career and technical education on Capitol Hill and serving in national office — all because she kept saying yes to opportunities that pushed her outside her comfort zone.

Through competitions, leadership development, community service, and a framework that blends personal, workplace, and technical skills, SkillsUSA is preparing students for far more than a first job. It is helping shape the kind of young professionals employers actually want to hire.

This conversation is for employers looking for talent, students exploring the skilled trades, and educators who want to understand how leadership, soft skills, and technical training come together in one of the country’s most influential workforce development organizations.

(00:00) – From Small Bubble to National Office

Serenity shares how one decision to get uncomfortable took her from a small chapter in California to national leadership and advocacy on Capitol Hill.

(01:45) – What SkillsUSA Actually Builds

Serenity breaks down how SkillsUSA develops students through competitions, community service, and leadership development — not just technical training.

(04:15) – The Soft Skills Employers Notice First

Why handshakes, eye contact, confidence, and professionalism stand out so clearly in SkillsUSA students and matter so much in the real workforce.

(08:06) – Where Companies Find Their Next Superstar

Andrew explains why employers looking for welders, plumbers, carpenters, and other trades talent should be paying attention to SkillsUSA competitions.

(13:03) – SkillsUSA Goes Bigger Than Atlanta

How WorldSkills turns career and technical education into a global stage — and why students chase the chance to represent their country.

(15:21) – Say Yes Before You Feel Ready

Serenity reflects on fear, confidence, and what happens when students choose growth before certainty.

Employers are not just hiring for technical ability: they are looking for communication, professionalism, initiative, and confidence — and SkillsUSA is intentionally building those traits into student development.

SkillsUSA works because it combines technical training with leadership practice: competitions, community service, and real responsibility give students a chance to apply what they learn instead of just hearing about it.

The skilled trades pipeline is full of talent when people know where to look: from welding and carpentry to electrical, plumbing, and media, SkillsUSA creates visible pathways into real careers.

Confidence grows after the decision, not before it: Serenity’s journey shows that many of the biggest opportunities come after saying yes while still feeling nervous.

Serenity Satterfield is the SkillsUSA National High School President, representing one of the largest student-led workforce development organizations in the United States. Through her leadership and advocacy, she promotes career and technical education, workforce readiness, and leadership development across the skilled trades.

Her journey began in a smaller chapter in San Bernardino, California, before growing into state leadership, national office, and advocacy work in Washington, D.C. Today, she speaks about the power of saying yes to growth, building confidence through discomfort, and creating stronger pathways for students entering the workforce.

SkillsUSA, skilled trades, career and technical education, workforce development, soft skills, leadership development, student success, trades careers, workforce pipeline, welding, carpentry, HVAC, electricians, plumbers, construction, WorldSkills, Serenity Satterfield, Andrew Brown

Serenity Satterfield on LinkedIn:https://www.linkedin.com/in/serenity-saterfield-692222323/

SkillsUSA Website: https://www.skillsusa.org/

If you found value in this episode, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts and share it with someone who needs to hear it. Your support helps us keep telling the stories of the skilled trades.