The Marcel Podcast

By Marcel SchwantesBusiness Management

The Marcel Podcast episodes

February 23, 2023Marcel Schwantes & Robb Holman: What It REALLY Means To Value Your People
Show Notes:
“Valuing your people…what exactly does it mean?” [7:16] Valuing your people is more than just a raise or promotion, or mutual respect. Marcel asks Rob what it really means, sparking a discussion that goes deeper than the value of our title but is built on our humanity, relationships, and trust.
“How would you rate your self-worth (your value), if you were stripped of everything you know?” [8:25] Rob proposes a hypothetical situation for the listeners in a challenge to rate themselves just as their unique self, the way a young child might. We are much more than our titles, of leader, co-worker, brother, sister, etc. We have a lot of value to give and leaders need to dig deep beyond the surface to value their employees with relationships.
“One of the tenants I see people failing in to truly value people is….they have to listen to them RECEPTIVELY” [11:44] Too often as Marcel reminds us, we speak more than we listen. Rob and Marcel discuss listening receptively as a way to build trust and community with our teams.
“You have to be able to reach out to people and get to know them on a personal level, to build that trust for them to feel valued.” [14:15] It all comes back to relationships, Marcel explains how only when you make the effort to get to know your people can all of the other tenants of leadership come into play.
“When you get to where people trust each other in the workplace…it brings people together to do great work.” [15:50] Trust and value go hand in hand. In order to value your people, you have to trust them and they have to trust you. This is the hallmark of Marcel and Rob's conversation: building trust is essential in valuing your people, and there are limitless benefits from this culture in the workplace.
“You don’t want to micromanage but you do want to be present with your people, especially when it counts.” [25:50] To round out the show, Marcel and Rob take a question from the “Mailbag” from Javier, a listener in L.A. who asks how to balance employer autonomy and leadership presence. Marcel and Rob walk this line and talk about what really matters when it comes to being present as a leader.

Mentioned in this episode:
Robb Holman
Marcel Schwantes
Send Marcel a text message!
28 min
February 16, 2023 Amy Gallo: Getting Along: How to Work with Anyone (Even Difficult People)
This episode is brought to you by Businessolver. Since 1998, Businessolver has delivered market-changing benefits technology, and services supported by an intrinsic responsiveness to client needs. The company creates client programs that maximize benefits program investment, minimize risk exposure, and engage employees with easy-to-use solutions and communication tools to assist them in making wise and cost-efficient benefits selections. Founded by HR professionals, Business solver's unwavering service-oriented culture and secure SaaS platform provide measurable success in its mission to provide complete client delight.

Clean Up Your Side of the Street
When it comes to workplace relationships, Amy shares foundational tips that will apply to working with all of the archetypes. Raise your self-awareness, get the big picture, and ask yourself, “How can I make sure my thoughts, actions, and behaviors are aligned with my values and goals in my relationships” [15:12] Be cognizant of how you can be inviting or triggering behavior of the “difficult people” you may face at work.

The Archetypes
In this episode, Amy and Marcel cover three archetypes:

The Passive Aggressive Peer
When working with a co-worker demonstrating passive-aggressive behavior, consider “What is the underlying message?”. [21:36] Oftentimes passive aggressive behaviors come from a place of fear, insecurity, or desire to avoid conflict. Frame conversations and interactions in a way that may open up their true thoughts or message and invite a safe place.

The Pessimist
Working with a pessimist co-worker can create a negative fog in the workplace. It’s important to validate their feelings, find a place for their “risk assessment”, and especially set forth a practice that invites positivity and support. “If you set boundaries against extreme pessimists, that dark cloud over their head might change.” [30:35] They might not become ultra-positive with these practices but their self-awareness might rise and they can heavily affect future interactions and the environment.

The Know-it-all
When it comes to the American workplace, “we tend to value confidence over competence”. [35:00] This is how incompetent, narcissistic individuals often come into leadership positions. Hold your ground and pocket some phrases to protect your voice and knowledge when it comes to meetings. Invite in peer support if your own voice isn’t doing the trick.

Protect Yourself
“Sometimes we put in our best effort, and the behavior just doesn’t change, then it’s a matter of protecting yourself.” [41:27] Amy has some great tips for keeping yourself and your position safe: Document everything so that should you need to escalate the situation you have the details. Don’t dwell, make sure these difficult people aren’t all you’re thinking about. Limit interactions, you don’t have to spend too much work time with these people outside of direct work. Keep some phrases handy so you can keep the conversations moving peacefully.

Mentioned in this episode:
Women at Work
Amy E. Gallo
Getting Along: How to Work with Anyone (Even Difficult People)
Amy Gallo @amyegallo on Twitter
Amy Gallo on LinkedIn
Amy Gallo (@amyegallo) on Instagram
Send Marcel a text message!
52 min
February 09, 2023 Lisa Anna Palmer: Light A Fire In Their Hearts
Lisa Anna Palmer is an author, speaker, and leadership coach. She is the author of "Light a Fire in Their Hearts: How to Inspire and Lead Teams to Phenomenal Success." With over 20 years of experience in leadership, Palmer helps organizations and individuals improve their leadership skills and achieve their goals. Through her writing and speaking, she emphasizes the importance of servant leadership and inspiring and empowering teams.

Show-Notes:

The Effects of Poor Leadership on Health
“Let’s look at each other as human beings, let’s connect at that level” [10:00] Lisa Anna Palmer talks about the ability to unleash potential when we treat our employees with respect and dignity. It’s better for everyone, even ourselves as leaders. But what happens when we don’t? Marcel and Lisa connect on their major health scares that brought them to servant leadership practice and they discuss staggering risks associated with poor leadership like increased risks in cardiovascular health.

Once a Bad leader, Always a Bad Leader?
“Leadership is hard, it's a higher aspiration role to take on” [18:22] Marcel positions that leadership isn't for everyone, especially those with no desire to grow and change. As Lisa breaks it down with the age-old saying, when there’s a will there's a way. When leaders put conscious thought into their leadership and are open to change, accepting feedback and seeing it as an opportunity for growth, they can begin to positively affect the lives of their staff.

Misconceptions of Servant Leadership
“Servant leadership is about being the best version of yourself and to be of service to others” [22:39] To be a servant leader is not a martyr, Lisa explains what servant leadership is and how really loving yourself and being your best self and then turning that same love and acceptance outward can be the best example. Marcel and Lisa discuss some common misconceptions of servant leadership, like being completely selfless, only considering others' needs, and abandoning your needs and wants. These are not a part of servant leadership at all!

Is Servant Leadership Still Relevant?
Marcel claims some are reporting the ‘death’ of servant leadership as Gen Z moves into new positions and remote working becomes more prevalent. But Lisa explains just why Servant Leadership is here to stay, “The element of treating people like human beings is going to stay forever” [32:24]. Going virtual is not an excuse, because even digital tone and connection are important. There are ways to make an impact and embrace Servant Leadership in this new context.

Mentioned in this episode:
Light Your Leadership Inc.
Light a Fire in Their Hearts: The Truth About Leadership: Palmer, Lisa Anna
Lisa Anna Palmer on LinkedIn
Send Marcel a text message!
44 min
February 02, 2023 Rae Shanahan: The Businessolver Way
This episode is brought to you by Businessolver. Since 1998, Businessolver has delivered market-changing benefits technology and services supported by an intrinsic responsiveness to client needs. The company creates client programs that maximize benefits program investment, minimize risk exposure, and engage employees with easy-to-use solutions and communication tools to assist them in making wise and cost-efficient benefits selections. Founded by HR professionals, Businessolver's unwavering service-oriented culture and secure SaaS platform provide measurable success in its mission to provide complete client delight.

Show-Notes:

Leaders, the “Coach” in Business
“Empathy is about understanding people and where they need to be met” [5:04] Rae Shanahan, CSO of Businessolver, opens the interview with Marcel sharing a great analogy of leadership and coaching. Coaches don’t practice with the team and leave them during the game when it really counts, and neither do good empathic leaders. They are there with support, understanding, and motivation through every step of the way.

Chief Empathy Officer
“Every layer within the organization needs to focus on empathy” [18:32] Empathy is important at every level, including at the top with our CEOs. Rae explains the traditional saying of treating others how you want to be treated and instead looking at it through the lens of everyone's unique situations.

Empathy and Psychological Safety
“You cannot have a fear-based environment and foster empathy and the heart of leadership” [22:58] “Blue Sparkle” is an initiative that Rae began 10 years ago at Businessolver, where employees share positivity from work or their personal life each day. Marcel connects this to Amy Edmondson’s work in psychological safety, and how it is truly needed for effective empathy.

Financial Impact of Empathy
“Grow our business, delight our clients” [31:50] This statement is part of the mission at Businessolver. Rae explains how this simply can’t be possible without the culture they’ve created with their employees. When employees feel delighted and supported at work they will do the same for the clients and in turn, grow the business. Marcel reminds listeners, this isn’t just empathy for empathy's sake, it’s the right thing to do and has an important impact on your business.

Mentioned in this episode:
Businessolver
Workplace Empathy | Businessolver
Rae Shanahan - Chief Strategy Officer - Businessolver on LinkedIn
[email protected]
Send Marcel a text message!
40 min
January 26, 2023Marcel Schwantes & Robb Holman: Shared Leadership and Humility
Culture of Shared Leadership
“The reason so many managers fail is often attributed to the idea that if they share their leadership with others they will lose their power or authority” [1:33] Shared leadership is an impactful way to develop shared trust but leaders are often held back by a fear of failure or weak perception, and as Robb and Marcel say, that can be scary. When you’re focused on a top-down leadership structure, you’re going to get low performance from your worker bees, who are not empowered to grow and shine. To create this shared leadership culture, leaders need to release that fear and believe in their people.

What do you have to learn?
“Look at your team, as small or as large as they may be, and spend time in reflection looking at the strengths of each team member.”[6:20] Robb encourages leaders to look at every meeting with the lens of not what you have to give but instead what you have to learn. When leaders realize the powerful skill sets and gifts they have, they will be surprised and encouraged. Remember this is why you hired these people because they have talents and skills that can serve you, you just need to submit and speak encouragement into them.

The Mailbag
Samantha from El Paso wrote in, “I am about to get promoted to manager. I’ve been an individual contributor for the last 5 years. Now I find myself having to manage the people I used to work with, my peers and former co-workers. Any advice?” [12:55]
Robb shares an example from the start of his professional basketball career, and relates to Samantha in how entering new moments can come with feelings of hesitancy, and anxiety. He encourages her to enter with ease and be ready to serve those around her. Marcel encourages her that she deserves this job because obviously, her superiors have seen something in her. He reminds her and any new leader to come in confident and with initiative. Take the first meeting to set expectations, things will change and your team needs to know what that will look like but additionally, as a leader you’re there to support them, let them know you’re here to look after them, and build them up as well.
Humble Leaders
Continuing in his series of providing a sneak peek of his book manuscript, Marcel has been sharing the 7 practical principles of love in action. The focus of today: Humility.
“Humble leaders achieve greatness without arrogance, they shift from ego to humility which can drastically alter your advantage.” [26:23] So what are three ways humble leaders get this done?
They Give Others Credit
They Speak Their Truth
They Are Teachable
Mentioned in this episode:
Robb Holman
Marcel Schwantes | Professional Profile | LinkedIn
Marcel Schwantes
Send Marcel a text message!
33 min
January 19, 2023 Christina Maslach: The Burnout Challenge
Christina Maslach is the foremost expert and pioneer of research on job burnout. She is an American Social Psychology and professor emerita at UC-Berkeley, she also is the creator of the Maslach Burnout Inventory (MBI). Christina joins host Marcel Schwantes to discuss the book, The Burnout Challenge, which she co-authored. She provides a working definition for workplace burnout, which plays a big part in the 3 dimensions of the 6 job mismatches. As she explains these mismatches she also encourages ways to pivot from these chronic stressors, and help leaders become engaged.

The Burnout Challenge
As Marcel Schwantez and Christina Maslach dive into their discussion, The Burnout Challenge they talk about the real target of the book, “The way human beings function, depends on a relationship between the person and their environment.”[6:52] Christina comments on how too often people focus on just one part of that relationship, the person but what about the role the environment plays? How do we improve the relationship between the job and the people working? She then lays the groundwork for their discussion with a definition for Burnout in the workplace, a response to chronic job stressors that haven't been well managed. In this case, chronic is a very important word because these stressors become too frequent to cope with on a normal basis.

Job Mismatches
Christina overviews the 6 mismatches at work that lead to burnout: work overload, lack of control, insufficient reward, breakdown of community, absence of fairness, and conflicting values. “These are the chronic job stressors, that are there all the time, that are annoying, that are hurtful, that get in the way, that are obstacles…that if you just didn't have them, you could get your job done and feel good about it.”[23:57] These are as she refers to as pebbles in the shoe, small but not trivial things that have a large impact on your ability to do your job.

The Three C’s
Collaborate, Customize, and Commit are the “Three C’s” Christina shares that leaders of organizations and their teams need to work on to move past and pivot away from the mismatches. She emphasizes the need to make it a we, not an I, and focus on bringing everyone to the table to come to a solution that does not have to be perfect, but can be better. Too often leaders and higher-ups are adding and adding more to their teams' plates but Christina says we need to rethink, redesign, and come up with something different but doable. “You have to do subtraction if you’re going to do addition in order to keep a relatively good balance between people and the job” [42:06]

Be an Engaged Leader
“People are capable of really good things…we ought to be able to figure out how to help more of that happen on a regular basis” [52:18] Christina makes an analogy about a beautiful flower plant on her deck, she could have paid a lot of money for it but that means nothing if she puts it in a broken pot, with bad soil, and gives it no water or sunlight…those are not the conditions for it to thrive. The same goes for leaders and their employees, they have to work to provide them with conditions that will help them thrive which is a major part of their role. She encourages leaders to be engaged, walk the floor, get to know their people and their needs so that they can be a part of the collaborative voice to help make things better.

Mentioned in this episode:
The Burnout Challenge
[email protected]
Christina Maslach | UC Psych
Marcel Schwantes on LinkedIn
Send Marcel a text message!
1 hr 4 min
January 12, 2023 Marcel Schwantes: A Belief in Something Larger, Kindness in Leadership

A Team Who Believes
“Do we have a vision that is anchored in purpose and is somewhat tangible, that is larger than any member of the team and the team in its entirety”? [7:39] Inspired by the recent NFL tragedy and ongoing medical recovery of Damar Hamlin, Rob and Marcel draw a comparison to the feeling of believing in something larger. As players, coaches, and spectators banded together to pray to someone higher regardless of religious beliefs, it speaks to the fact that leaders have the power and the obligation to create this feeling of belief within their teams and the positive impact it will have.

Believing in Potential
“The essence of leadership is being able to care for one another, develop their skills, meet their needs…but what if you added an extension to that and began to see the potential in each person.” [10:32] Marcel extends this idea of belief in something greater than yourself, as a belief in the potential of those surrounding you. He calls it a mindset of trust, and an extension of trust and faith as a gift!

Mail Bag
In this co-host segment, Marcel and Rob answer a question that has been sent in by a listener. John asked in relation to a new leadership position, how can he connect in the first week. “Spend that first week asking more questions than trying to give answers”[14:55], Rob drives home the point that even though as a leader has a lot to offer, they should take it easy and remain the ‘student’. Marcel goes further with some advice for specific questions to ask: What are your strengths? What are your interests? How can I help support you and set you up for success? If you want to send in your questions, you can visit Marcel’s website for the information!

A Culture of Kindness
“A study by the University of California at CocaCola’s Madrid site, researchers there found that workers who were the receivers of kindness reported experiencing 10 times more prosocial behaviors than the control group...examples of prosocial behaviors include activities such as empathy, altruism, sharing, cooperation, self-sacrifice, and helpfulness.” [23:11] Marcel quotes this study and explains how great it is to receive kindness, but that the givers of kindness have an even more durable effect, including great life and job satisfaction.

Cyclical Kindness
“Kindness, when you encourage it as a corporate value and norm, it creates virtuous cycles within teams benefiting recipients and givers alike, but especially the organization as a whole.” [24:58] When one random act of kindness is initiated in an organization it creates a cycle that continuously benefits the team and even the company. This is a reference from the manuscript of Marcel’s book in the works!

Mentioned in this episode:
Robb Holman
Marcel Schwantes on LinkedIn
Marcel Schwantes
Send Marcel a text message!
28 min
January 05, 2023 Marcel Schwantes: More Patience in the New Year
“Patience can be one of the hardest traits to master personally and professionally because of the intense pressure put on leaders to generate quick and effective results.” [00:55] Marcel introduces one of the important traits of a leader who leads with love, a focal point of what he has planned for his book in the works.

How often are you slowing down to work through a problem or get to a decison? Marcel comments on this common problem that is truly a lack of patience. “Faster isn't always better. When times get stressful, it can be easy to rush through things, like decision-making. Making quick decisions may remove the problem short-term, but has the potential to create an even bigger issue down the road.” [1:29]

It’s not all talk, Marcel has research and science to back up the power of patience. “In one 2012 study published in the Journal of Positive Psychology, researchers found that patient people made more progress toward their goals and were more satisfied when they achieved them, especially if those goals were difficult, compared with less patient people.” [2:56]

What does a patient leader look like? like? What type of qualities do they have? Marcel explains what it means to be a patient leader and the clear edge they get from that patience. “People who exercise patience, plain and simple, have self-control....their conduct is steady, rational, and manageable. In conflict situations, they seek to understand first before being understood; they listen more than they speak, giving them a clear edge in communicating and diffusing someone else's anger.” [3:20]

Mentioned in this episode:
An examination of patience and well-being
Four Reasons to Cultivate Patience
Marcel Schwantes | Professional Profile | LinkedIn
Marcel Schwantes
Send Marcel a text message!
5 min
December 29, 2022 Dr. Richard Winters: You’re the Leader, Now What?
Marcel discusses with guest and author of You're the Leader, Now What?, Dr. Richard Winters, how leaders need to invite the discovery of other perspectives.

Overplaying Expertise
In chapter 1 of his book, You're the Leader, Now What?, Dr. Richard Winters calls out leaders as having a decision-making flaw, we overplay our expertise and at times wrongly let that guide our actions. Dr. Winters shares stories from his personal and professional life that lean into solving this blind spot. "Look for these moments where we're uncomfortable, those moments where we feel others are being mean to us are oftentimes the moments where maybe we're not being the best way we can to them." [16:00]

The Need to Be Right
Who doesn't like to be right? Dr. Winters nails it with this description, "I like to feel like I'm adding something to the world, and I like to have a sense that my expertise matters, my experience matters." [17:28] In chapter 3 of Dr. Winters' book he talks about getting off the dancefloor and stepping up to the balcony. He explains this metaphor as removing yourself from your reflexive 'in the moment' input and rising above to the balcony where you can see other perspectives and understand more than you might right away. Not only can leaders step up to the balcony but they can bring others up to see a wider perspective.

Burnout and Wellbeing
"I think it's important to think things from multiple levels as opposed to just us or just the boss."[26:48] When it comes to burnout, Dr. Winters explains that it comes down to three levels. Organizational, in which you look at the organization you're working with... do they respect you and your time? Interpersonal, in which you look at how you interact with each other, do you have a voice and positive relationships? And lastly, which most people tend to start with…Individual, in which you look at how you're taking care of your personal well-being. He also shares the acronym from Carol Riff's Psychological Well-being research...PAGERS.
Purpose - A sense that the organization is aligned with our purpose, values, and mission.
Autonomy - A sense that what we say is being heard.
Growth - A sense that we're in a place to get better.
Environmental Mastery - A sense that we have the resources we need.
Relationships - A sense that our relationships are overall positive.
Self-acceptance - A sense of acceptance of our decisions, forgiving poor decisions.

Engagement
In chapter 5, Dr. Winters lists key drivers of engagement for leadership: Develop, recognize, inform, value, engage, respect, and supervise. He shares a statistic that shows just how much these drivers matter in which for every one-point change, the burnout rate went down 9% "Just some small incremental change in the ability to engage with someone from a personal growth perspective or to help them feel safe about having conversations… Just one incremental point of change can have a huge effect on individuals and organizations." [32:17]

Fears and Worries
Addressing fears and worries is an important part of decision-making. "If you're not listening to the fears and worries while you are trying to figure out the solution to the problem, your strategy is going to be shot." [35:17] One great thing about fears and worries, Dr. Winters explains they can be the motivation and energy to cause everyone to come together to work toward the right solution. Many times this can be a fear of vulnerability, but leaders can invoke the strategies of engagement to bring people together and bring the fears and worries to light for the benefit of the organization.

Mentioned in this episode:
Send Marcel a text message!
44 min
December 22, 2022 Heather Hanson Wickman: The Evolved Executive
Marcel Schwantes and guest, Heather Hanson Wickman, are aligned on their messages of how practical love works to serve people well and help organizations to thrive and profit. They expand on the principles of “love in action” through the guest’s compelling 2018 book, The Evolved Executive, whose sub-title inspired the creation of the Love in Action podcast.

Show-Notes:

Optimism Vs. Pessimism; Is there room for both?
So often leaders and individuals feel the only way to present feelings is in the form of optimism. But are they honoring their real, true feelings? Cohost Robb Holman, references the Harvard Health article, An Outlook Better Than Optimism?, and discusses the importance of being aware of your feelings and mindset especially when grief or pessimistic associated feelings are necessary. “We need to acknowledge and embrace how we really feel and in the midst of that there is beauty, there’s intimacy, power.” [5:18]

Suffering
Heather shares the very real and painful elements of her own suffering, and the point in which the tension became too much, something had to give. Marcel points out that many people believe since the pandemic suffering has decreased with an increased level of equity and awareness. And while the work landscape has changed and shifted, Heather believes the suffering has not decreased but rather changed and presented in different ways. “Care, Candor, Connection, and Change…I don’t think these have really shifted based on the pandemic, if anything when we think about connection maybe we’re even at a place that’s worse.” [28:18]

The Evolved Executive
The title of Heather Hanson Wickman’s book is The Evolved Executive but who is the Evolved Executive? “An Evolved Executive is the individual that really draws into the idea of servant leadership, that we are here are as stewards of the people that are working for us and the organization that we’re a part of” [30:00] Heather defines this person with this scientific definition but also an as she says “artistic definition”, in which there is the idea where the individual as a deep drive to continue to look inward and constantly change and be better.

Operating from love NOT fear
“Fear is really allusive in terms of the ways in which it shows up at work… the hoarding of information, the secrecy, the gossip… those are the things that get in the way of us stepping into the space of love”[32:04] Heather’s top signs of fear in the workplace are Gossip, Secrecy, Not Speaking the Truth, and ‘Yes Boss’. Most of the time people aren't even aware they are doing these things, these are just the way they’ve been taught. Moving to a space of love starts with a place of deep self-awareness as a leader in how you are creating or allowing fear in the workplace.

Deeper Level of Consciousness
Deeper Consciousness, it’s not metaphysical mumbo-jumbo. Heather explains that as someone (like an ‘Evolved Executive’) who is evolving, raising their awareness, and constantly looking at how they are serving others will naturally expand into their consciousness.“We are all mirroring and magnifying different parts of who we are…as we raise our awareness we begin to see differently.” [44:31]

Mentioned in this episode:
Robb Holman
An outlook better than optimism? - Harvard Health
Untethered
Heather Hanson Wickman on LinkedIn
[email protected]
Send Marcel a text message!
57 min