This week, Sean and James start discussing Tara Brach’s Radical Acceptance. They zero in about how the feeling of unworthiness hinders us from enjoying the sacred pause. Our hosts discuss why we over and under compensate and why we judge ourselves. 

Key Takeaways:

• Our society is designed to encourage comparison and competition, instead of focusing on improving yourself.
• It’s a challenge to stay true to yourself when you keep comparing yourself to others. 
• Staying true to yourself is more important than fitting it.

Do not benchmark your success against other people’s success

Sean [00:06:23]: What we end up doing is we start looking at other people to try to define success for us. And it's like, “Oh, well, this person went and got their MBA, and they look successful. So maybe I should get my MBA. Well, I got my freaking MBA.” And I still don't feel successful, you know? “Oh, that person has that title. Oh, you know, let me go get that title.” And it's like, you still don't feel successful. So that’s something you have to find for yourself.

Stay true to yourself

James [00:09:52]: I think the more that you try to fit into a group, the more you become someone else. And sometimes, once that mask is removed, for some reason, you don't feel like you fit in because you're not being true to yourself.

Forget your own path, so you don’t have to live within other people’s standards

James [00:23:23]: If you don't decide on your own what you want to grow to be, you will just float through life, leaning towards what other people expect you to become. And that's when it becomes more difficult to be yourself, to be comfortable with yourself.

• Tara Brach’s Radical Acceptance
• Greenlights Matthew McConaughey's memoir

In this week's episode, we start with our host’s startup stories. James and Sean talk about their college life at the University of Michigan and Michigan State University and how their working journey started. From Sean’s multi-million automotive accessory business to James’ taking a breather in Vietnam.

The two jump back into where they left off from last week’s session on self-worth. Finally, they tackle struggles with trying to find value within our everyday lives. Listen until the end as they start the weekly discussion on Tara Brach’s book! Check the link down below.

• There’s no need to have others validate and acknowledge your struggles.
• Don’t allow guilt to prevent you from ending toxic relationships. 
• Let the people around you help you with your struggles.

Do not let guilt prevent you from leaving toxic relationships

James [00:15:59]: I had a lot of toxic relationships, and it took me a while to understand that I have to let this go. And yeah, it wouldn't have happened with really just having to sit down and figure out why I was like this and almost accept that it was okay to be like this. I think that was a big problem too. And then going back to the shame you feel ashamed and that is, it's just like guilt.

Let your loved ones and friends help you

Sean [00:19:54]: I don't think that's fair, either. Like, dude, people can handle it. And I think people want to handle it because it gives them a sense of contribution, it actually makes them feel stronger too. I feel like I am able to help you.

Sean Li on Twitter: @heymrli

James Park on Twitter: @jswpark 

James Park Official Website

James Park email: [email protected]

• Tara Brach’s Radical Acceptance
• Reid Hoffman’s The Startup of You

Sean and James share a little backstory on their friendship and how this podcast was born. Then our hosts share their experiences of dealing with and managing depression. Sean discusses the changes in his life and the different perspectives on happiness and personal value. Listen to him and James discuss how their definition of success has evolved over the years. 

• When one person talks about their struggles, it inspires others to do the same.
• You can find success by finding value in what you do. Success isn't all about climbing corporate ladders or chasing financial gains.
• Despite the financial value business or work brings, finding your personal value isn't always determined by your income.

Why Sean and James started the podcast

Sean [00:13:05]: I think having these conversations, recording it, sharing with people openly; the other I hope for anybody listening, that might be going through something similar, just might be, you know, a stage in their life is that we remove the stigma of talking about it.

A different way to define success

James [00:28:26]: I think, it just took me 15 years to find out that I don't want to climb the corporate ladder just for the sake of climbing that ladder. I don't want to climb that just for the salary. I don't want to climb it just for the title. I want to climb it for very different reasons. I want to be part of a company for very different things. And that's just what I'm understanding right now. And yeah, maybe I do climb the ladder later on, but it will be for very different reasons.

Happiness, battling depression, and going out of your comfort zone

James [00:29:27]: I don't know who says this, but I really think happiness is created by, like how purpose is not found. It's built. Your own happiness is built, and you have to find out and take the second to go in that direction. And a lot of people who might be depressed are depressed because you almost feel like you have no faith that you can get out of this. And you are repeating the same things, even though you want to get out. You're stuck in a loop of doing the same thing over and over again because that's what feels comfortable. But you got to go towards uncomfortable to get out of that.

Sean Li on Twitter: @heymrli

James Park on Twitter: @jswpark 

James Park Official Website

James Park Email: [email protected]

This week, our hosts talk about struggles with reintegrating into the workplace. As Sean's family dynamic changes, he realizes his definition of success has changed drastically. While priorities and lifestyle change, he struggles to understand how to pursue work without sacrificing his family life. Listen as James offers a different way to look at our relationship with money and his astute advice on defining success. 

• Struggles lessen when you realize your priorities in life. Having a profound understanding will help you rethink your goals and define how you view success.
• When your priorities change, your expectations of yourself should also change. Sometimes, the struggle comes from unrealistic expectations we set for ourselves.
• We often have an unhealthy relationship with money. We tend to associate work with income. In reality. Work like research, development, and learning really equate to money, yet these contribute to growth and planning.
• The lack of focus and doing so many things at the same time limits your chance to fail. Failures allow you to learn and pivot. 

The unhealthy relationship between work and money

James [00:13:56]: Maybe, this all stems from having, why don't we try to say it? Our relationship with work, for us, is how we grow up. It is defined by, is linked to income. And in a world where you need income to do whatever you do. For that source of money becomes work until you're in a place where you have enough money, not to worry about having to make more money. And so, maybe, a lot of us put worth or like our self-worth on how much we make. When we think about how much progress we are making or how much impact we're making, it's tied to money, and it's tied to having to always do something for money. Maybe that's an unhealthy relationship.

The lack of focus lessens the chance for learning and doing a deep dive

Sean [00:20:26]: It just made me realize, I mean, this is hindsight bias, obviously. But I think the mistake I've been making is that there's been this overarching fear that, like, we don't have enough time and because we don’t have enough time, we can just run one experiment at a time. We need to be running like five, ten (10). And that causes (a) lack of focus and (b) you can't go deep. Right? And, I don't get much learning, actually. When we fail because when one experiment fails, I have four others I need to manage and run. It's like, I don't really have time to figure out what happened with the first experiment.

In this week's episode, our hosts discuss the aspects that impact their limitations, whether they're building habits, testing new approaches, or realizing the things that drive them forward. Listen to Sean as he shares about his therapy, processing your thoughts externally, the two-week rule, and their reflections on how our culture and systems shape how we see our goals. 

• Having a culture of instant gratification affects how we look at our life's timelines and goals.  
• Our education system and culture seem to be designed so that you’re always supposed to have a timeline and move to the next level.
• There are projects where the 2-week rule, diving right into it, is applicable, and there are ones where we’re meant to start small—building a healthy lifestyle.

How instant gratification is affecting our perception of life’s timelines

Sean [00:12:57]: But in many ways, I've noticed I'm also very impatient, and in some of these stem from how I know I've very terrible consumption habits. Like, if I want something, get it now. I don't know that. It's like builds from our, society and culture, and materialism today. It's like Amazon one day. Like, dude, I can't imagine what life is like without one-day shipping.

Prioritizing health helps in becoming better leaders

James [00:15:03]: What we are trying to do is to get to somewhere else because we’re unsatisfied with where we are now. That's only trained through school; through this education system of how we are trained to learn. It's like we learn this stuff to get good grades to go to the next thing. And it's just like pushing, always, to the next thing, get done with grade school, get done with college. Get done with finding a job and getting a promotion. It's always like the next thing. And somewhere in that whole mess of things, we've forgotten what it's like to actually enjoy and be satisfied with where we are now.

The two-week rule

Sean [00:23:06]: So the two-week rule, how does this work? You basically just do something. You start something. But you just f****** go hard for two weeks. You go hard for two weeks and give it a real shot. You'll know very quickly whether or not you want to continue doing this, and not because you're a failure. This is the emotional aspect of the first two weeks, and this is very important, that after all, you can do anything, you can make any kind of change, embrace any kind of routine for two weeks.

One Hundred Years of Solitude

The Courage to be Happy

How to Use the Two-Week Rule to Become Remarkably Successful (and Optimize your Bucket List)

The show celebrates its 25th episode this week. We have shared struggles and challenges with you for the past six months. Sean and James talk about re-evaluating their priorities and revisiting their purpose. Taking a medical leave allowed both hosts to focus on what is important. Listen to their discussion about excessive freedom and lack of limitations on their current work setups.

• Start small on problems you want to solve, and focus on the kind of work that gives you the most satisfaction.
•  Don’t neglect your health. Make sure you’re strong mentally, emotionally, and physically. Take therapy if you need one. Hire a coach if it can help make you healthier.
• Try a different approach and give yourself a time limit to try out the things you always want to do. If it doesn’t work, move on to other things.

A different approach to finding purpose in life: focus on one problem first

James [00:10:48]: So, my takeaway from this is that a lot of times, we all look for purpose because we want it to be such a big part of our lives. But it begins with a tiny thing— a tiny task that you can repeatedly do, and then it becomes your purpose.

Prioritizing health helps in becoming better leaders

Sean [00:20:26]: I became a workaholic because I felt like, as a CEO, I needed to set the example, which is: to be hardworking, be diligent, and think ahead. Push yourself to grow and all these things, but at the same time, part of our culture is mental health and being healthy; taking care of yourself. And, I am the last person doing that… We implemented a wellness plan for everybody where we pay for a personal coach, a dietician, and a coach. I think it's twice, at least twice a week, for every team member.

Help find your purpose faster: give yourself a timeline

James [00:32:09]: Start to ask yourself, “What do I want a little bit more? In the next 30 days, what can I do”? And I think that shortened timeline puts you in a different mental place to go into action and put yourself into movement.

Love, Death & Robots

In this week's episode, our hosts discuss both physical and emotional struggles. Having been recently diagnosed with Bell's Palsy, Sean discusses how he is adapting physically and emotionally to the condition. He and James discuss the guilt of not working, taking a break, and how hobbies can help you take better care of yourself.

• The hardest part of working post-pandemic is letting go of the guilt when taking a break. Our work-from-home set-up has become so integrated that it is now hard to separate work from life.
• Intangible works affect us. Thinking about what we’re going to do next also adds up to the stress.
• You can unwind by staying curious outside of work and exploring new interests. This allows your brain to focus on something else, including the things that stress you. 
• Be intentional about rest. Put aside time for taking a break, so your brain can disconnect. 

Work and personal lives are blurred by our pandemic work habits 

Sean [00:09:52]: Feeling offended when someone questions why you can't take a break, right? Like something is definitely off-balance. So when I started actually like digging into it a little bit and questioning myself, or reflecting on that, I realize, you know, a lot of it had to do with, I think just, the nature of the pandemic. I started both ventures and clever during the pandemic and built my work habits all around that. And my work habits said the ball just to be working all the time because,  well, I'm at home. I wake up, go to my desk, and that is work. There is no separation of anything between work and life.

Hobbies and interests outside of work help you disconnect and de-stress

James [00:11:28]: I've gone through this idea that the way we can unwind is actually by staying curious. And that's why hobbies, I think, are extremely important. Just because having a hobby, having something to learn outside of work, gives your mind a way to disconnect from a big part of what it does all day. But at the same time, still, be able to grow and still be able to cognitively be improving and working on itself. It sounds weird to say that you have to go learn something to give your mind a break, but I feel like one of the ways to disconnect them.

Intentionally set aside time for taking a break

Sean [00:13:06]: And the crazy thing is, I have to be intentional about planning those things back into myself. It takes a lot of work to hang out, to plan a day, and then like, ‘Let's try somewhere’. Right? To be intentional about making time to hang out with friends.

Learn about Bell’s Palsy

After 6 months, Sean and James took a two-week break to travel to South America. They talk about their experiences and new things they discovered after not traveling outside the country for two years. Listen to how they navigated difficult conversations with their team. 

Key Takeaways:

As they come back from their two-week break, they need to face new challenges and mainly have to ask tough questions that will decide and drive their future. According to a recent survey, more than 80% of workers fear difficult conversations at work. Sean and James share some tips on how to handle these conversations:

• Tackling problems that may be crucial in the survival and success of the team.
• Filtering and finding out highly specific audiences you want to reach. 
• Letting go of people to build a company that can thrive and maintain trust as you do so. 

Episode Quotes:

How having difficult discussions now can help teams survive and succeed

Sean [00:07:47]: I'm really proud that's as a young company, we were able to, not only be decisive but, be aligned on making this difficult decision early on versus dragging it out, to later. Like deferring it and saying, ‘Well, let's deal with it later’. And it's like, ‘No, let's have this difficult conversation now, as early as possible. So, that we can give ourselves and the team the best chance for success and survival. Survival then success.

How being uncomfortably specific will help you find the right path

James [00:11:26]: You have to be really, uncomfortably specific, and that's when you find product-market fit. The way that you're talking about Clever FM just reminded me about even my writing and just how uncomfortably specific you need to be first; to find out whether you're on the right path or not, and all the different ways that you write or all the different things that you write about. You're just looking for a fit between what you like to do, what you like to write about, and what the audience actually wants to hear and what they get out of it.

How letting go of some people to move forward can be handled with great care

Sean [00:13:12]: When these decisions happen, and they're finalized, first communicate it with your internal team, the team that's staying behind so that they're not shocked. And then the following day then communicate it with the people who are unfortunately leaving. Then do an all-hands meeting afterward with the remaining team. The day before it was all individual conversations and then having all hands and communicate: what are we doing, why are we doing this, what it looks like going forward? Explaining that yes, there is some trust that has been broken; that eroded from this experience and there's a lot of trust-building that we have to do again. To build that trust back up with a team because it’s a huge shock to the company, in many ways.

Show Links:

James’ Twitter thread on writing process

The show will mark its 6-month milestone in one week. Similar to the hosts' willingness to record every week, they share their stories of perseverance. James talks about signing up for the Ship 30 for 30 program, and Sean shares his journey on creating video content following the same format. Listen to how these commitments overcome the learning curve. Listen in on this conversation as the hosts discuss asking the right questions, learning how to decline certain requests, and developing a plan. Get some insider info on how the hosts feel about weddings and wedding traditions!

James and Sean discuss the role of feedback and commitment to beat the learning curve.

• Doing something constantly helps you beat the learning curve.
• Accountability is important in following through with your commitments.
• Trying things you've always wanted to do helps you figure out if you really want it.
• Making time to strategize is equally important as implementing current strategies.

How does doing something consistently help you beat the learning curve?

Sean [00:09:21]: I only thought about it from a persistence perspective. It taught me that if I just continued doing something every single day, I'll get better. But as to why and how I was getting better, I didn't really think about it until just now. And then I was okay putting out like this amazing piece of work the first day, the first 10 days, the first 20 days. But then, as you're slowly starting to put the repetitions in solar tilt, learning an instrument, there's this hockey stick curve of growth. And there's like, “boom”. All of a sudden, you're putting out really cool stuff.

How accountability helps you follow through to your commitment

Sean [00:10:11]: I think accountability helps, ‘cause at that time, my buddy, who is like a professional YouTuber now, was the one that inspired me and pushed me to do it. And he was my accountability buddy on that because he was doing one every single day.

Trying things you've always wanted to do helps you figure out if you really want it

James [00:19:50]: I think even doing that video challenge, what you pushed yourself to do is something different. You took action. And you realize after a certain amount of time that, “Hey, I really like this, but this isn't it for me”. I don't want to make this a professional career, and I’m not saying that everything that you do has to become some kind of profession, but it really depends on where you want this to go.

Making time to strategize is equally important as implementing current strategies

James [00:26:08]: So it's just this constant tussle. Do we stay the course or do we quote-unquote pivot or adapt? But if you adapt too much and pivot too much, then you're completely distracted. And so it's, just this constant, emotional roller coaster balance of life. What should we be doing right now? Should we be adapting, tweaking, or should it be staying on course? Honestly, nobody can give you that answer, except for yourself. And you have no time to figure it out sometimes, but you have to make time for it at the same time.

• Sean’s first Youtube video
• Sean trying to use fancy shots in his videos
• Sean helping his trainer: Glute Squad and Beach Cargo
• Behind-the-scene (BTS) videos
• Farnam Street: First Principles
• Ship 30 for 30
• How many words should books and novels have?

Feeling overwhelmed with your startup? You’re not alone. In this episode, Sean and James talk about the challenges of running a business or pursuing goals— from having rough weeks to getting stuck in negative cycles of procrastination. They open up about how these stressors can make everything seem impossible at times, but venting out helps them process their thoughts. They also talked about simple steps on getting back on track: building a support system that keeps them accountable during tough times and being around people to generate positive energy.

It's normal to feel frustrated, anxious, and even depressed when we're pursuing our goals. But don't let those feelings linger for too long, as they will only hold you back from making progress. Taking steps forward can be challenging at first, but if you work on yourself every day, success is within your reach. Don't let negative emotions hold you back from becoming a better version of yourself — a wiser, more responsible, and more mature individual who can pursue passions without fear or self-doubt.

• Venting out can release stress and emotions that we feel pent-up inside. It helps us clear our clouded minds, which in turn gives us a better perspective on life's challenges.
• Surrounding yourself with people can help produce positive energy. Find your community, whether it’s online or in-person; these people can lift youtube during tough times.
• Procrastinating can actually serve as an opportunity for us to make the right choice. When we put off tasks and projects because they make us feel anxious or overwhelmed with worry over what could go wrong - this gives our brain time needed in order to gather all relevant information before deciding on how best to move forward.

Release the Past, Plan For The Future, and Live In the Present Moment

James [00:04:41]: This present moment is the only time that we truly exist, and yet our minds switch from either being in the past or hoping for a better future, almost just instantly, and it mixes it. And that's what the present really is. And so, our way of being in the present is trying to release the past and not think so much about the future and being able to do things right now. Making an impact now and staying in the present and enjoying what so many people have said enjoying the process, trusting the process. And I realized like that phrase is all about being in the moment, using the time now to plan for a future that you would like to be at, but not identifying so much with it that you feel incomplete without being there. 

Procrastinating Can Be Viewed As A “Thinking Time” To Help You Make The Right Decisions

Sean [00:09:41]: Procrastination time and time again has proven to me that it's giving me a space to think something through. Especially if things are not working, we shouldn't just jump to the next thing. Like we need to think it through as to like potentially why it does not work and how should we change course if this is not working. And that does, from a productivity standpoint, lead to what feels like procrastination when it's like, why don't we just fucking call it “thinking time”. 

Going Through Low Moments Makes Us More Appreciative of Our Wins

Sean [00:45:58]: Procrastination is not bad. Just like depression, depression is not bad. The reality is that you can't experience the highs if you don't have the lows. 

The Power of Now: A Guide to Spiritual Enlightenment by Eckhart Tolle 

The Present: The Gift That Makes You Happier and More Successful at Work and in Life by Spencer Johnson M.D. 

The Cold Start Problem: How to Start and Scale Network Effects

by Andrew Chen