How do we build resilient systems? How do we allow for transformation? How do we encourage adaptation? How does this apply to both to ecosystems and human systems? And how we use this to better understand and tackle the climate crisis?

These are questions Professor Graeme Cumming answers on today’s episode. Graeme is the Director of the Arc Center of Excellence coral reef studies at James Cook University in Australia. An ecologist by training, his research increasingly focuses on socio-ecological functions, problems and resilience in systems.

He explains what dung beetles can teach us about political division, why resilience is not enough on its own, and ultimately why we cannot use ecological systems as an exact map for understanding the complexity of human systems.

* Listen on Apple or Spotify

* Watch on Youtube

* Read the interview transcript

* Bonus video out on Monday

© Rachel Donald

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