A note from Kendra: In this conversation, Kate and I exchange a joke about going to prison for someone we love, and I have since been shown the harm that reaction causes people in communities affected by disproportionate and unfair policing. For that, I am genuinely sorry. Thank you for graciously leaving space for all of us to continue to learn and do better in our work of allyship.

Kate Bowler is here! If you’ve been around here for a while, you know we don’t have many guest interviews as regular episodes on this show. But today is a special day! Kate joins me to talk about ways to give yourself permission, life advice that we wish we could retire, and what she does when living in a hard season.

This podcast is hosted by Kendra Adachi and executive produced by Kendra Adachi, Jenna Fischer and Angela Kinsey.

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