Admissions Straight Talk

I recently saw an NPR clip about a highly innovative approach to medical education launching with this year’s entering class at the University of Vermont’s Larner COM. In a nutshell, the goal is to eliminate lectures. The head of this initiative, Dr. William Jeffries, is our guest today.

Dr. Jeffries is the Senior Associate Dean for Medical Education at University of Vermont’s Larner College of Medicine. He earned his PhD in Pharmacology from the University of the Sciences in Philadelphia and then went on to serve as Associate Dean of Creighton University. He arrived at UVM in 2009 and has served since then as the Senior Associate Dean for Medical Education. He was also on the board of the IASME, the International Association of Medical Science Educators, from 2008 – 2015. And he is the co-editor of the book, An Introduction to Medical Teaching, where he authored the chapter on lectures. Welcome!

Can you give us an overview of the three major levels of UVM’s curriculum? [1:55]

The first portion is Foundations – it’s geared towards establishing the scientific foundations of medicine. It’s 15 months long. Students learn basic science in a medical context. Next is the clerkship level – it’s about a year long. Students rotate among the traditional medical disciplines and get a first-hand look at the disciplines and healthcare for patients. They also have the option of taking an alternative Longitudinal Integrated Clerkship, where students are embedded in a primary care practice and manage a panel of patients for the whole year, and learn the disciplines through that.

The third level is Advanced Integration – it’s a combination of required and elective courses to prepare them for residency and their boards.

Is there clinical exposure during Foundations, and is there coursework during the clerkship portion? [4:20]

Yes and yes. There’s an integrated community preceptor experience. The first day that students see a patient is the first day of orientation.

What is active learning? [5:25]

It’s the process of putting the learner in a situation where they’re compelled to apply knowledge to solve problems. It’s often group oriented but not necessarily. For example: memorizing a map is passive learning; putting that knowledge to work by driving somewhere new is active learning.

You literally wrote the book on lectures in medical education. Why dump lectures? [6:30]

There’s nothing wrong with lectures as an information delivery unit – it’s just the difference between using a knife or a food processor to cut vegetables. Lectures aren’t the most efficient way to learn.

Our medical knowledge is growing rapidly. It’s impossible to tell students everything they need to learn. We need to focus on giving students the tools they need to be effective physicians. We know active learning is better for retention.

Can you give an example? How would it work, say, if you’re teaching the basics of pharmacology? [10:20]

In pharmacology, in medical education right now, the students have been driving a derivative approach – they want to know what drugs are on the test, which basically reduces all of pharmacology to a table. Which is helpful in categorizing drug action, but will be completely unrelatable in the future. A better way would be to have the students themselves create such a table from their own notes or notes you provide to them – and then use that table to solve problems about patients, drugs, etc.

Unless you apply knowledge and understand why it’s important, you’re not going to retain it.

The more we use an active learning approach,

Let’s learn about Wharton Lauder, and its joint MA/MBA and MA/JD programs for people who are passionate about international business.

Today’s guest is Kara Keenan Sweeney, Director of Admissions Marketing and Communications at the Lauder Institute at the University of Pennsylvania’s Wharton School and Penn Law School. Kara has an extensive background in graduate admissions, starting with her masters in higher ed administration at Columbia and moving on to admissions positions at INSEAD, U Penn, Penn State, and now at the Lauder Institute. Welcome!

Can you give us an overview of UPenn’s Lauder program? [1:25]

The Lauder Institute was founded by the family of Estee Lauder back in 1983. We had our first graduating class two years later. The institute offers a joint degree in International Studies with Wharton and Penn Law – Lauder students earn a MA in International Studies along with either an MBA or JD.

Each year we admit 70-75 students. The program starts in May. The majority of our students are MBA/MA students.

For Wharton Lauder students, how does it work? Do they take additional coursework? [2:55]

Yes – on average, they take two additional courses through Lauder each semester. If you’re doing Wharton Lauder, Lauder generally takes up most of your electives. There’s some research work as well.

But it’s not a double course load – generally about two extra courses a semester.

What’s new at Lauder? [4:20]

We adapted the curriculum to the changing landscape of business and international studies over the last decade or so. We moved the structure to a more regional focus instead of a language focus. We have six programs of concentration – five are regionally focused (the sixth is global). Students choose one of these areas of concentration and then choose a language (for example if you’re in the Latin America track you can choose Spanish or Portuguese).

We used to ask students for fluency in two languages other than English – now we ask for one language.

We’ve added a new core course on intercultural communication, for students to improve their communication skills in an international leadership context.

And there are now two required intercultural venture trips: these are one-week trips where students focus on a specific topic in a specific country. It’s a stretch experience for the students.

Do you find students focus on their home region? [9:00]

It depends. We have some students who plan to work in their home region, but choose a different language so they can work in other countries in the region (for example, a student from Brazil who wants to be able to work across Latin America).

We have heritage speakers in the program. We have students who grew up speaking English. There’s no typical profile, other than an international orientation.

Where do most Lauder alumni get jobs? [10:50]

We see a variety. Last year our students went to over 20 countries after graduation (the class was around 75 students). Most have international career objectives – for some, “international” means working in the US, since a lot of our students are from overseas.

Because our students are also MBA students, they also follow a typical MBA path – though that’s evolving itself. A lot of people are interested in entrepreneurship, social impact, microfinance.

Can you describe the critical elements of the Wharton Lauder or UPenn Lauder application?

Our guest today is an intern at Einstein Healthcare Network. He recently graduated from Philadelphia College of Osteopathic Medicine. He also has his own web site and podcast called The Happy Doc. Let’s learn more about Dr. Taylor Brana and how you too can be a happy doc.

Let’s talk to the Happy Doc!

Can you tell us a bit about yourself? [1:05]

I’m originally from California – I lived in the Bay Area until I was about 16, then moved to Las Vegas for a couple of years.

I applied to a bunch of schools. I’d competed in gymnastics since I was six – so I was able to get scholarships (both athletic and academic) to Temple. It was a crazy experience coming to the east coast!

How did you get involved with gymnastics? [2:15]

My family is Russian, and there are a lot of gymnasts in my family. My grandfather actually competed in the Soviet army as a gymnast and a boxer. My mom is a gymnast, my grandmother was a gymnast.

So my family plugged us into sports – it was important for us to succeed both academically and athletically.

I was a natural at gymnastics as a kid – I excelled right away. I got excited about it – I’m a competitive person.

How did you get from gymnastics to medicine? [3:50]

I’m not the traditional story, with doctors in my family. A sport like gymnastics is about training all the time – always trying to improve your skills. When I went to college, I wasn’t the healthiest person. I realized if I was going to perform at my best, I needed to understand how to be a healthy human being. So I studied nutrition, etc. I excelled academically.

I also found I loved teaching. The basis of being a doctor is being a teacher/leader.

What was the most difficult part of the med school application process for you? [5:55]

My adviser looked at my grades and said I was a good applicant, but she didn’t think I could necessarily get into the schools I was applying to. It was discouraging. I’m not sure I had the right advising early on.

Would it have helped if instead of saying you didn’t have a good chance, she’d have said you would have a better chance if you did X, Y, and Z? [7:20]

I think so.

Why did you choose osteopathy – or did it choose you? [9:24]

It was more an issue of location – I really liked Philly. It was a choice between California and Philadelphia.

I applied to both MD and DO schools. I had a lot of interviews. When I went to PCOM, I was blown away by the family feeling and culture. People are genuinely nice. After my interview, I was looking for a bus to go home, and a first year student offered me a ride – actually gave me a ride all the way home.

The osteopathic philosophy has become a part of my life.

Can you give an example? [11:10]

It’s all about mind-body-spirit; the holistic aspects of health; and hands-on treatment. The way you think can affect the way you behave.

Looking at the whole person is very important. As a resident I often see physicians really focused on symptoms—but if we don’t consider environmental factors, we’re not treating the whole issue.

And I’ve seen how touch can be important both for establishing trust and alleviating pain.

What did you like about PCOM?

Military and older student attending the UC Berkeley Haas Full-time MBA program. Let’s hear his story.

Our guest today, David Middleton, graduated with a degree in mechanical engineering from the US Coast Guard Academy in 2003, when many of his classmates were in middle school. He served in different capacities in the Coast Guard, most recently as Operations Officer and Chief Pilot, responsible for over 100 aviation personnel and the management of 6 helicopters protecting 585 miles of coastline.

And he’s a FT student at Haas about to begin the second year of his MBA program. David, welcome to Admission Straight Talk!

Can you give us some background? How did you come to join the Coast Guard? [1:35]

I grew up in San Diego. I used to tell people I didn’t want to leave San Diego, and I didn’t want to join the military.

During a weeklong orientation at the Coast Guard Academy, I realized what a great opportunity it was. Leaving San Diego for CT was a big change… But I decided if I could pursue aviation I would do that.

When I learned how small the Coast Guard is and what their mission is, I was really excited.

What motivated you to get an MBA? [3:30]

It was pretty work-driven. I’ve been an operator for a long time. I’ve been flying helicopters, and I’d been on a ship as an engineer for a while.

I don’t know if most folks really understand the military – I describe it as an up-or-out system. You’re really looking to the next rank to take on greater responsibilities.

I saw education as the way to be promotable. And looking beyond the Coast Guard, I saw the MBA as preparation for whenever I did transition out.

You’ve been a helicopter pilot and chief pilot – so you’ve already done a lot in a managerial role, correct? [4:35]

Yes. In LA I did public affairs. When I was stationed in Alaska, I did a lot of aviation safety, which was good. And when I found myself in San Francisco, I was the instructor pilot – I took on a lot of leadership when my boss (the chief pilot) left unexpectedly.

What did you find most difficult about the b-school application process? [5:50]

Because I was in the job I was in at the time – everything. For context, I was on the last year of my assignment. I put in for a program that the Coast Guard has to send you to grad school. I felt rushed because I didn’t get my approval until October – too late for Round 1 deadlines.

When you interviewed, what was the most memorable or difficult question you were asked? [7:35]

A memorable question was “Have you ever had to make a difficult decision?”

Because of my work experience, it was a good question for me. I could tell a story about a rescue I’d done. In my job you’re making life and death decisions.

You’re at Haas now. What are the best aspects of the program for you? [9:45]

What stood out to me when I was applying – and now I’m living it – is the culture and diversity. People read about it, but it’s palpable.

The culture aspect – people are nice. I was used to a tightknit culture in the military and I wasn’t sure if I’d find that, but I really have.

What could be improved? [11:05]

The thing that stands out: it was challenging space-wise to do group projects. I’m excited to start class this week because the new building is opening.

You mentioned the tight-knit collaborative culture in both the Coast Guard and Haas. What are some differences? [12:00]

For me, it’s the first time being a civilian again. Even though I’m still active duty,

How are you going to pay for grad school if you don’t get a scholarship? Loans. Let’s learn about Sallie Mae’s student loan options.

Our guest today is Charles Rocha, EVP and CMO of Sallie Mae. Charlie had over 20 years of experience at Bank of America, MBNA and NationsBank before joining Sallie Mae in 2009. He’s going to talk about how Sallie Mae can help you pay for your education. Welcome!

Can you provide an overview of Sallie Mae’s options for graduate students? [1:50]

We have a number of specific products for graduate students – med, dental, law, business, and other grad programs.

What distinguishes these different loan programs? [2:29]

In some places, the rates and terms are slightly different. And the repayment terms are different. For instance, for doctors we offer a 20-year term.

We offer both fixed and variable rates.

For doctors, does repayment start after residency? [3:20]

Doctors can defer repayment for at least three years post graduation, so you can complete residency. But it varies based on discipline – you can defer up to five years if you’re doing a fellowship. But if you’ve gone to business school, it’s six months.

For grad admissions, the focus is on getting very specific skills to advance their career. They may go into grad school the same way, but they come out very different, and that’s where we differentiate.

What makes Sallie Mae different from other loan options? [5:00]

The amount of time and energy we invest after graduation.

We have a lot of flexibility. We give students the option to make interest only payments during the first year after graduation when they’re in transition (such as moving to a new city or starting a new job).

We also have the option of forbearance – up to 12 months.

Some folks would rather have a lower payment for a longer period.

Does interest accrue during forbearance? [9:15]

Yes.

Is Sallie Mae affiliated with the US government? [9:35]

No. It was originally a government service. But we’re now a publicly traded bank – it’s just that all our lending is focused on the education industry.

There is virtually no underwriting in the government loan sector, but there is in the private sector.

What are your underwriting criteria? [11:20]

We look at credit history – have they handled credit responsibly. And we look at their overall debt composition.

We will consider you with a co-signer.

The application process only takes 10 minutes and you find out quickly if you’re approved (or approved with a co-signer).

So a college student is better off taking on some debt and establishing credit? [13:05]

Having good credit is important as soon as you graduate.

How much debt is too much? [13:40]

We look at: does the debt you’re bringing to the table look like too much, and how much will the grad program add?

What’s the application process? [14:25]

Everything can be done online at salliemae.com. There’s also a phone number if you prefer to apply over the phone.

The information we need is pretty straightforward – name, address, social security number, work history, etc. With that information (and your permission), we review your credit report and make a decision.

What advice would you give to someone planning ahead, to improve the likelihood they would qualify for a loan in the future? [15:55]

The first step is establishing credit and handling it responsib...

Tune in for an encore of one of our most popular 2017 podcast episodes, where Linda Abraham addresses one of the most pressing topics on applicants' minds: how to properly approach the diversity question.

Listen in as Linda answers your diversity-in-admissions questions, including:

1. Why is diversity so important?

2. How should I approach diversity?

3. What is the best thing to write about in my diversity essays?

And more!

For the show notes, check out the original blog post.

Related Links:

• Dimensions of Diversity Checklist

• Fitting In & Standing Out: The Paradox at the Heart of Admissions

• Approaching The Diversity Essay Question

• Overrepresented MBA Applicants and Business School Diversity

• Med School Admissions Advice for Nontraditional Applicants: The Experts Speak

• 5 Fatal Flaws to Avoid in Your Grad School Personal Statement 

Related Shows:

• Focus on Fit [Episode 162]

• Stand Out! A Critical Goal for Your Application [Episode 181]

• D.O.s for Diversity: Ashley’s Osteopathic Med School Journey

Subscribe:

                

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What’s it like to be a Harvard Business School student and Google Intern? Let’s find out in today’s podcast!

Our guest today is Shantanu Misra, currently a 2nd-year Harvard Business School MBA student who just completed a summer internship at Google and will serve this year as the product manager for the Harbus, the independent, non-profit news organization of Harvard Business School. 

A little background about Shantanu Misra. He graduated from IIT Kanpur in India with a BTech and M Tech in Civil Engineering focused on geoinformatics. He worked for BCG in Mumbai and Singapore until 2014. Then he made a fairly major switch and moved to Switzerland where he became the program manager for Gavi, the Vaccine Alliance. About one year ago, he started his MBA at Harvard.

Shantanu, welcome to Admission Straight Talk!

Can you give us a brief overview of your path to HBS? [1:45]

I did my undergrad in engineering – I learned a lot of tech skills, and then pivoted to more of a business role, because I was fascinated by the idea of trying out different industries and solving strategic problems. That’s what attracted me to BCG after undergrad. I got a lot of exposure to different industries, different geographies, and different types of problems. But like any consultant, I wasn’t owning the solutions – so I was attracted to the opportunity in Switzerland with Gavi.

The role I had there was very interesting. Living in a new country gave me space to reflect on my career, and that’s when I decided to do my MBA. And that brought me to Harvard Business School.

How did you like the shift from advising to, in your words, owning the solution? [3:20]

It’s a major shift. People asked me how I was adjusting to living in Switzerland, and I would say living in Switzerland was easy – adjusting to the job requirements was a little more tricky.

One difference is that as a consultant, you take for granted the buy-in of the partner organization – the machinery runs very fast. But when you’re in an operational role, you’re part of that machinery – you don’t have that senior leadership-driven mandate all the time.

Another big difference is the level of detail in talking about your solutions. As a consultant you work at a high level. But operationally, you need to be detailed and practical.

Why do you feel you need an MBA? [7:00]

I don’t think of an MBA as an investment in the next 10 years of my career – it’s an investment in the next 30,35, 40 years of my career, in terms of the community and resources I’ll gain. That for me was the biggest reason.

Also, I have interests in public health, public education, etc, and in the MBA I’ve been able to work with people who are interested in social enterprise.

What did you find most difficult in the application process? [8:48]

The most difficult thing by far is the essay.

The rest of the package is ready – you’ve done the jobs you’ve done, you have the grades you have, but the thing you can change is how you represent yourself.

There are a lot of people who have a similar educational background to mine, and probably similar grades. So I spent a lot of time thinking about how to differentiate myself.

It’s a high risk event, applying for an MBA – you only get one or two stabs at it.

Our guest today has a very unusual path to medical school. I’m going to let her tell her story with very little intro from me. All I’ll say now is she once upon a time had a career in finance, did her postbac at Columbia and attended Rutgers New Jersey Medical School where she earned her MD. She did a residency in pediatrics, also at Rutgers, and is now in a pediatric neurology fellowship at Children’s National Medical Center.

Let’s learn more about Dr. Deborah Horenstein.

Can you tell us a little about yourself – your background, where you’re from? [1:25]

I was born in Brooklyn and grew up in Long Island. I went to college at Northwestern and started out studying theater. I became more religious (I’m Jewish), and started observing the Sabbath. I decided that a career in theater wasn’t going to coincide with my religious practices, so I switched to communications, with a minor in economics; and then decided to study econ fully. I transferred to Barnard in NY and graduated with a degree in economics.

I moved to LA, worked in finance, got married and had kids.

How did you come to pursue a career in medicine? [2:45]

I was blessed with three daughters. My youngest daughter was very complicated medically, and I became almost a fulltime caregiver. Her illness encompassed 12 different specialties. Her primary condition, which was an immune dysfunction, was actually something they’d never seen before.

She got a lot of care at Children’s Hospital of Philadelphia. And she needed a bone marrow transplant, which we did at Duke.

She passed away after a lot of complications. She was eight. Her name was Ariella.

I decided to use my experience to pursue becoming a physician, so I could help other children and families.

What was the hardest part of getting back into the “student” saddle? [5:50]

Definitely taking exams! Throughout my daughter’s life, I was reading a lot, researching a lot – so studying wasn’t anything new. But taking exams was hard.

How did you handle it? [6:45]

Through a lot of prayer! I definitely studied a lot – I’m a disciplined person – I put in a lot of hard work. And I used self-talk, trusting that I knew the material.

Economics doesn’t have the same kind of time-breakers as science and medicine – previous exams for me were about writing essays. It’s definitely a big challenge. Whether it’s in postbac, med school, boards – it pushes you to the time limit. Part is studying and knowing it really well; part is calming your nerves; and part is trusting and having a belief in yourself.

What was the hardest part of the application process for you? [9:20]

I was limited in where I could apply – I had a family, so I needed to be able to commute. I basically had seven schools I could apply to. The postbac program at Columbia recommends (even for the very top students) applying to 20 schools, because of the sheer number of students applying.

One of the things I didn’t have information about – I wasn’t aware of how to contact schools after applying, to stay on their radar. Once I started doing that, I got three more interviews.

There is a certain reality to the number of applications they get – if you can stay on their radar it’s a benefit.

Our guest today is a newly minted internal medicine intern at NYU Langone. He just graduated from the Jefferson Medical College in Philadelphia and is starting his residency in Internal Medicine at Langone almost as we speak. He is also an accomplished artist, cartoonist, and writer who uses his “doodling” as a study tool. Welcome, Mike Natter!

Can you tell us a bit about yourself? [1:15]

I was born and raised on the Upper West Side of New York City. I did my undergrad at Skidmore College in upstate NY. At the time, I was geared towards the arts and humanities, so I chose a small liberal arts college.

I did a postbac premed program at Columbia, worked for a bit, and then went to med school at Jefferson Medical College (now called Sidney Kimmel Medical College). And I came home to begin my journey in residency at NYU.

How did you decide to pursue a career in medicine? [2:32]

I grew up much more inclined with the humanities – drawing, painting, history, writing – things that came naturally to me. Math and science were things that were quite daunting. I was told numerous times in school that math and science weren’t my strength – I was put in remedial classes. It wasn’t my thing.

I was diagnosed with Type-1 Diabetes at age nine. You get a window on this amazing biochemistry in your body – and it’s a big responsibility. It gave me an appreciation and sparked my interest. But I was still dealing with my fear of the basic sciences, so my interest in medicine seemed unattainable.

When I went to Skidmore, I was creating a lot of large scale figure drawings. My parents gently expressed a concern that I should add a second area of study in addition to art.

I started taking psych classes – and I didn’t really like it. Until I took a course on the brain. I found a mentor there who brought me into his lab – and I loved it. I was excelling in it.

I’d always needed to do medicine, but I was scared of it.

I finished undergrad with no premed classes – so I enrolled immediately in a postbac program at Columbia. It was such a different experience from my undergrad: a large class size, and the learning style was very different. The premedical sciences are very abstract. I also struggled with the cutthroat atmosphere – it was my first experience of grading on a curve.

I sent out a whole batch of applications, and I was collecting rejection after rejection. It was sobering, but also upsetting – I felt like med schools were flattening people into their GPA and MCATs. I was saddened by the process and becoming embittered by it.

I had been working on a comic book about a diabetic superhero – it was so fulfilling, but I’d left it off my applications.

I went to a med school fair and met admissions officers. I felt dismissed by most of them (they asked me my scores right away). But when I stopped at the Jefferson table, it was a different feeling. The admissions director treated me like an individual. She said, “Your numbers don’t bother me that much – what else do you do?”

Jefferson was my only MD interview. I went to Philadelphia and loved the campus immediately. I was grateful for the interview, and I got in the following year off the waitlist. I truly had a wonderful experience.

Have you always been an artist? [19:30]

I don’t remember a time when I didn’t draw.

I think with practice,

It gives me great pleasure to have for the first time on AST, Danni Young, Director of Recruiting at The Consortium for the Graduate Study of Management. Danni earned her bachelors degree from Lincoln University in Missouri and her MBA from Washington University in St. Louis, Missouri. FYI she loves cats. Welcome!

Let’s start with the basics. What is the Consortium for the Graduate Study of Management? [1:17]

We’re a stellar organization that’s been around since 1966. Our mission is to increase the representation of African Americans, Hispanic Americans, and Native Americans in business schools and corporate management.

We serve as a connector between students and schools, and with our corporate partners.

Today our network is made up of 19 partner schools across the US. We have 900 current students, 9000 alumni (in the US and abroad), and 78 corporate partners. And we’ve awarded $390 million in fellowship support over the last 51 years.

What role does the Consortium play at the application stage? [4:40]

We have a common application, so for prospective students, they have the ability to apply to up to six schools with one application. They submit everything to the Consortium and we forward the materials to the member schools.

Can anyone use the Consortium application? [3:30]

There are eligibility requirements.: Any US citizen who can demonstrate commitment to our mission – but you must have a four-year bachelors degree, and you must be applying to one of the member schools.

How do applicants show a commitment to the Consortium mission? [4:15]

We require a membership essay. They can talk about their experience as champions for diversity. There’s also a mission recommendation, where the recommender attests to their commitment to our mission.

Which schools are member schools? [5:00]

We have 19 member schools currently. The full list is on our site, but just to name a few: UCLA, UC Berkeley, USC, Cornell, Yale, Dartmouth, UNC, Michigan. Recently, Rice joined as our latest member.

Do you have to be a member to apply via CGSM? [6:10]

When you apply via CGSM, you’re applying for admission, Consortium membership, and fellowship opportunities as well.

Is membership automatic? [7:05]

No. It’s not automatic. We determine that based on the mission essay.

The admission application will still be considered, but you may not get the benefits of Consortium membership.

How much does it cost to apply through CGSM? [7:50]

We have a tiered application fee structure. The minimum is $150 for two schools. And the maximum you would pay is $300 for six schools. So you can save money and time.

Are this year’s essay questions available yet? [9:05]

The general essay questions are the same as last year’s. The member schools’ essays have now been updated. Our core questions are the same as last year.

What are the other elements of the application? [9:55]

Beyond essays – we ask applicants to provide their transcripts (from all schools). There are recommendations – three total (two professional and one mission recommendation). The applicant inputs the letter writer’s information and the writer gets an invitation to upload the letter.

We ask for your most recent GMAT or GRE score.

And finally, there’s the application fee.

The recommender only fills out one form,